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Official 2019 Orange Mane Mock Draft DISCUSSION Thread

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  • I would ask how MED knows about Gaines, but Med...it's Med.

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    • Originally posted by IndelibleScribe View Post
      I would ask how MED knows about Gaines, but Med...it's Med.
      I have had my eye on Gaines since I did the Byron Murphy tape. He was a major badass on tape for me and I have him much higher than most. Powers and Gaines were both BPA for the colts not overall.

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      • Originally posted by Mediator12 View Post

        I have had my eye on Gaines since I did the Byron Murphy tape. He was a major badass on tape for me and I have him much higher than most. Powers and Gaines were both BPA for the colts not overall.
        I don't give a **** about Powers. You didn't have to take Gaines.

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        • Originally posted by Mediator12 View Post

          I have had my eye on Gaines since I did the Byron Murphy tape. He was a major badass on tape for me and I have him much higher than most. Powers and Gaines were both BPA for the colts not overall.
          I had Gaines late 4, early 5 before he killed his pro Day

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          • Originally posted by jebures View Post

            I had Gaines late 4, early 5 before he killed his pro Day
            So I was ****ed either way...damn bastards. Stop checking into prospects!

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            • With the 200th overall selection in the 2019 Orange Mane NFL Mock Draft,
              the LA CHARGERS select:

              CB MONTRE HARTAGE, NORTHWESTERN
              Montre Hartage is not rated on my Top 300 Big Board



              CB MONTRE HARTAGE NORTHWESTERN

              Duke (2018): Playing LCB. Mostly press man coverage, some zone and off man sprinkled in. Off man outside early, not getting tested. Will play press man in the slot. Slot, press man, short crossing route, WR had a couple steps, ball swatted at line. Zone, inside slant, 10 yard gain, able to make tackle. Slot, press man, missed his jam and WR got a free release to the outside up the seam, had several steps on a Go route but QB checked it down. Daniel Jones man…ugh. Off man, slot, inside slant, solid jam at the five yard mark, QB went elsewhere. Press man, slot, roasted on a quick inside slant for a 5 yard TD. Hartage needs to start jamming people, he’s not quick enough to just give free release. Off man, slot, out route by the TE, awesome break on the ball and able to swat noodle arm’s throw down. Press man, slot, TE just roasted him on a straight seam route for 20 yards. Once again, no jam or any type of physical play to slow down the route by Hartage. They need to back him up and play off man or zone, this isn’t working. Press man, intermediate slant route, got away with a total bear hug on the break, QB went elsewhere. Press man, slot, corner route, Hartage literally grabbed the WR with both hands around the waste and held him up once he beat him vertically on the release, ball overthrown, no flag, WR incredulous. Replays showed a really bad missed PI call. Off man, hitch route, five yard gain. Press man, Go route, strong two handed jam, where the hell has that been all game, it’s late in the 3rd quarter and that’s his first jam. WR struggled to get into his route, he was primary read, Jones had to pull the ball down and go elsewhere. Need more of that from Hartage. Not going to get it, Jones got hurt, backup QB barely through the rest of the game. In the run game and screen game, Hartage did not try to get off blocks and participate whatsoever. Looks a little bit like a finesse CB, especially with the lack of physical press play. Athleticism is solid, but it’s not good enough to run straight up with WRs. He spent most of this game in press giving WRs a free release and getting burned. Thought he looked better in his limited off man and zone reps.

              Nebraska (2018); Playing RCB. Pres man, Go route, nice physical hip pocket coverage, pinched WR Stanley to the sideline, QB went elsewhere. Press man, Go route, same thing, solid physical coverage on Morgan, pinched him to the sideline, ball overthrown. These two are about the same speed, Hartage might be a little faster, but Morgan is getting zero separation. Off man, hitch route, 5 yard gain. Swing pass to RB, Hartage charged up and chopped him down with a nice open field tackle. Press man, no jam, post route, 25 yard gain, WR Morgan just shielded him with his body and QB put the ball right on him, thought Hartage had good coverage. Nice job firing up from zone drop to trip up QB on scramble, if he didn’t make that tackle, could have been a big gain. Solid clean up tackle on RB on long inside run. Hartage does a good job of making tackles as long as he doesn’t have to get off a block to do so. I think it’s more an issue of needing to learn some counters as opposed to not wanting to be physical. Solid job reading designed QB sweep, able to zip around the WR’s block, charge up and push QB out of bounds for a loss. Solid tape by Hartage, Nebraska got up pretty big at one point and just ran the ball a ton, that conservative play calling eventually led to their defeat. Hartage got beat on the one post route but otherwise he owned Morgan’s soul. Once Nebraska’s top receiving threat was erased they sort of became one-dimensional. I think Hartage had a lot to do with this comeback win.

              Notre Dame (2018): Playing LCB. Has a smooth transition out of his back pedal into bursting forward, I like that aspect of his game. Off man, 15 yard out route, completely school by Boykin there, just a sharp route, Hartage was worried about the deep ball. Swing pass to RB, Hartage not about to get off the TE block. Solid tackle on QB on scramble to tackle him a yard short and force a punt. Or not, they went for it and converted. Boykin drove him back twenty yards blocking on running play. Toss sweep, Hartage able to make solid wrap up tackle after 5 yard gain. Whiffed tackle on QB on scramble, Book just put a little shake n bake on him and Hartage did a header. Press man, corner slant double move by Boykin, Hartage with good coverage on the play, pass overthrown and incomplete. Boykin ran right through the jam attempt, but I thought Hartage did a great job sticking in his hip pocket through the double move. Press bail, out route, excellent transition and able to chop out the ball at catch point. Hartage starting to grow on me. Press man, Go route, solid jam on Boykin to slow him and then pinched his route to slow him further, ball overthrown. That was some excellent coverage 1v1 against a good WR. Hartage is probably winning the head to head so far through the first half. Press man, comeback route on sideline, ball knocked down at line, but it looked like Hartage was in the hip pocket of the WR on the route. Still needs to work on his jam, he misses way too often, sometimes he’s just juked, other times the WR chops his arms. Zone coverage, bit up a little on the out route, slot WR did a corner behind him for the TD, Hartage almost able to recover and get back far enough to swat the ball but not quite. Press man, corner route, 30 yard gain by TE. That was a little too easy, Hartage looked asleep. Press bail, comeback route, hip pocket coverage, pass incomplete. Off man, inside slant, 10 yard gain. Really impressed with Hartage overall this game, he flashed legit shut down skills at times. He’s still a finesse CB, but I thought he showed good athleticism, excellent transition ability and quickness, and good ball awareness. Would say even with the one TD to Boykin, he still probably had the slight edge in this game.


              TLDR:
              Overall, Hartage is mostly a finesse coverage CB with above average, not great speed, but plus quickness and transition ability. He’s mostly a liability in the run game but mainly because he struggles getting off blocks as opposed to not being willing to stick his head in there on tackles. He does that just fine when he isn’t blocked. Legit shutdown ability, can erase or greatly limit #1 WRs. Should go relatively high in the draft.


              Note/Explanation: 4.7 40 is a silver bullet to a CB and I didn't see Hartage as a guy that would be overly effective at safety. Tape grade was 2nd-3rd round. Pro Day time helps some, but 4.6 is still mostly a deal breaker for a finesse coverage CB. I'd probably at least rank him in the 6th-7th though with a 4.6, his tape warrants that.

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              • This is how my board of 2250 look. Each have this info
                Attached Files

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                • With the 201st overall selection in the 2019 Orange Mane NFL Mock Draft,


                  the CLEVELAND BROWNS select:

                  WR JAKOBI MEYERS, NC STATE


                  Jakobi Meyers is not ranked on my Top 300 Big Board


                  WR JAKOBI MEYERS NC STATE

                  Boston College (2018): Playing slot WR only. Slot, zone coverage, inside slant, knocked around a little by the jam but made catch and about to pick up 5 yards. Slot, press man, out route, 5 yard gain. Kind of a stock guy, runs his routes a little bit like a big RB might, a lot of wiggle, not very fluid. Decent job blocking on off tackle run. Superb drive block on designed QB run, took the CB and shoved him well out of the lane. Slot, off man, dig route, 10 yard gain. Doesn’t appear to have a lot of speed and elusiveness after the catch, more of a power type runner. Slot, press man, Go route, awesome leaping high point grab over the top of the midget CB Torres for 30 yards. Swing pass in flat, no gain. Slot, off man, dig route, 10 yard gain. Slot, off man, out route, 10 yard gain on contested catch. Did a good job shielding the DB with his body and making a basket type catch on the play. Slot, press man, out route, 5 yard TD. Did a nice job getting his head around and his hands up as soon as he rolled off the jam. Consistently a good blocker, one of the better blocking WRs in the draft. Slot, press man, inside slant, 15 yard gain. This entire game for Meyers has been basically short routes, perfect throws from the QB, get tackled. Announcers just said tenth catch, they all have looked the same. He’s the bologna sandwich of WRs. Liked his blocking in this game, that was impressive. His hands looked good. Routes were okay, he tried to show off some fancy footwork at certain points on his breaks, mostly just looked dumb doing it. Fairly certain he actually did the riverdance before a breaking into his slant route.

                  FSU (2018): Playing slot WR only. Slot, zone coverage, out route, five yard gain, big hit on the catch, held on. Speed and quickness looks below average. He’s mostly just a stocky, sure handed horizontal route chain mover. Effective block on WR screen, could have held it longer. Lateral pass, had the TE wide open and overthrew him. Scramble drill, unable to make diving catch on sideline, CB had blanket coverage on him the entire time. Meyers pretty much has to win on his break or he’s not going to get separation, very marginal athlete. Slot, caught deflected pass, powered through about four tacklers for a 15 yard gain. Nice awareness, nice hands, nice toughness and effort. Slot screen, able to get to the edge and up the sideline for 30 yards. He got in open space and was running full speed, he’s not fast, it’s below average at best. Slot, zone, out route, 10 yard gain. That was barely even challenged. Slot, zone, out route, 15 yard gain. DB tried to jump the route and QB lofted it over him right to Meyers on the sideline. Slot, zone, deep corner route, 30 yard gain. Finley is just putting the ball right in his lap every time. Slot, off man, out route, unable to dig out a low throw on sliding catch attempt. Slot, off man, inside slant, nice contested catch for 5 yards in a lot of traffic. I think Meyers is pretty fearless when going for the ball. Slot, press man, quick out route, 5 yard TD. Just great ball placement by the QB on that one. There’s no way this guy is an NFL prospect without Finley putting the ball on him almost every time, he can’t separate and doesn’t have NFL athleticism, does have NFL hands, and with an accurate QB, that’s all you need at times. Slot, press man, out route, 10 yard gain. Didn’t play most of the 4th in his blowout win. The tapes tend to bleed together, it’s all ten yard or shorter horizontal routes, Meyers gets open on his breaks for a second, Finley puts the ball right on him, profit. All I’m seeing in a limited athlete, somewhat big bodied possession WR with vacuum hands and a relatively limited catch radius. Not a bad thing to have on your team, not sure you need to draft it.

                  Texas AM (2018): Playing slot WR only. Slot, off man, inside slant, 5 yard gain. Slot, off man, curl route, QB went elsewhere. Wanted to highlight that route because Meyers pushed off like crazy on his break and had good separation, this is something he does do fairly often. He does not win with athleticism. Ever. Slot, off man, out route, tried to do some elusive looking spins and circles after the catch, they did not work at all. Slot, press man, out route, 5 yard gain. Made that catch with the CB draped all over him, knows how to shield with his body and still catch the ball. NC State mostly got destroyed in this game. Meyers continued to block mostly effectively, he had some lackadaisical blocks in the run game at times as well. This was his worst statistical game of the season, they fell behind and needed big plays, that’s not his forte. He’s pretty much just an extension of the running game since they didn’t have a dynamic RB.



                  TLDR:
                  Overall, Meyers is a stocky, slow, thick bodied slot WR with vacuum hands and a fearless nature. He’s one of the better blocking WRs in this draft as well. The issue is that he doesn’t really do vertical routes, is more of a short to intermediate horizontal chain moving type that’s going to be extremely reliant on a QB being ultra-accurate while also being fearless enough to keep throwing to a WR that looks covered all the time. He’s not a bad player, not sure he’s an NFL player though.

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                  • Lenovo, good choice.

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                    • Originally posted by IndelibleScribe View Post
                      Lenovo, good choice.
                      It was cheap and works fine for what I use it for.

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                      • Originally posted by jebures View Post

                        It was cheap and works fine for what I use it for.
                        I love Lenovo. They are damn good computers and last a long time.

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                        • With the 202nd overall selection in the 2019 Orange Mane NFL Mock Draft,


                          the INDIANAPOLIS COLTS select:

                          DT GREG GAINES, WASHINGTON

                          Greg Gaines is #140 on my Top 300 Big Board



                          DT GREG GAINES WASHINGTON

                          Auburn (2018); Playing all three DL positions in a 34 defense. Runs like a big waddling duck. Decent burst and speed for how big and round he is, relatively active guy, will chase and dive. Bull rush on RG for a pressure. Able to cut inside the RT on redirect and flush the QB from the pocket. Stack and shed on LG, stuffed RB at the line. Played that perfectly. Plays with good leverage and lean, very low to the ground. Stacked up LG, RB ran up his back and was tackled. Drove the OC back on 3rd and 1, wrapped up the RB when he tried to go up the middle. OC walled him off on the next play when they essentially ran the same thing but this time got a nice gain out of it. Stack and shed on LG, stuffed RB. Stack and shed on LG, helped stuff RB. It’s a broken record, but Gaines is very difficult to run at. Playing a lot of 34 NT. Stacked up LG and OC double team, once he gets in his stance in that low lean with his legs shot back, it’s tough to move him an inch. Really aggressive bull rush on the RT, blocked for a while, Gaines kept working as the QB held the ball too long, eventually got free and put heavy pressure on Stidham. Stacked up OC and RG double team. Chased the QB on a scramble to the sideline, mostly stayed in pace with him and was able to put a big hit on him down the field at the sideline. Nice effort play and good finish, caused a fumble but it went out of bounds. Twist up front, nice little closing burst to put pressure on the QB. Stack and shed double of the LT and LG, able to tackle RB for minimal gain. Powered through the inside shoulder of the LG for a pressure, showed a decent first step in quickly getting to that inside gap. Bull rush on the OC for a pressure. Thought this was good tape. Looks like a natural NT, but has plus movement and agility for that position. Effort is excellent. Reminds me of Kyle Williams of the Bills who just retired. Vastly similar players.

                          Utah G2 (2018): Playing all DL position in a 34 defense. Washington doing their shenanigans when they put the NT out wide like an OLB and have him rush. They’ve done that with Shelton and Qualls in the past as well. It’s not a reflection on the versatility of the player, it’s just something they do from time to time. Dipped under the LG and shot into the backfield , no impact on play. Outside spin to disengage and redirect pass rush. Swim move on OC for a QB pressure that helped lead to a sack by teammate. Has flashed an outside spin, inside spin, and rip move as ways he disengages from initial block. Pretty relentless with pass rush, keeps working it until the whistle. Stacked up the LT trying to angle block him, RB ran right into him and was tackled for minimal gain. Stack and shed on LT, stuffed run. Stack and shed on LT, read the inside run, spun inside and met the RB as he started to enter the hole, tackled for minimal gain. Everything about that play was excellent. Stacked up the RG, RT combo blocked him, but really had no effective, shed the RG and stuffed the off tackle run. Stunted around the LG, able to dive and grab RBs leg on inside run to limit him to a one yard gain. Really good in short yardage, he can get extremely low and drive OL into the backfield to clog up the RB. Stack and shed on RG, completely blew up the running play, RB plowed into the RG and got tackled for a loss. Beat the OC up the A gap, just quick jump off the snap, for a QB pressure. Effort pressure that led to INT, just kept working through multiple blockers, QB held the ball a long time, eventually Gaines got right in his face and he had to throw it, ball was picked off. Solid effort reading and trying to disrupt and chase a screen play. Doesn’t run well enough to really get outside and get to those types of plays, but he tries. He’s a very stout NT that makes plays in the passing game from time to time mostly through relentless effort more than any type of athletic gift. That being said, he’s not a slug, he shows some quickness and burst off the snap, he has the ability to redirect and change directions. He’s probably a two down player in the NFL, but he might surprise and offer more than that.

                          Ohio State (2018): Playing all DL positions in a 34 defense. Stack and shed on OC, helped stuff RB for no gain. Outside spin on the LT to redirect and chase the QB to the sideline and deliver a hit to knock him out of bounds. Fairly athletic play that time. Beat the OC for a pressure, gave him a stab step to his right and then Gaines quickly shifted and sliced to the left and around him. Stacked up the LG, reached out with one hand while falling back to tackle him for short gain. Stacked up the OC, tried to reach out and grab the RB with one arm, but the RB spun away from him. Beat the OC by just working his way around him, fell down, QB scrambled backwards right by him, Gaines popped right back up and started chasing him. All of that was good. The bad was that he was exceptionally slower than Haskins racing to the sideline and up the field. LG tried to down block him, that doesn’t really work, Gaines is too strong and just flowed down the line and stuffed the RB for minimal gain. Stacked up the LT and LG double team, forced them back and the RB rammed into them, teammates able to tackle him for minimal gain. Swim move on the OC for a QB pressure. Able to get by him with a swim move twice in a row. That’s a wrap on this game. I wouldn’t say he struggled, but he was blocked a bit more often than the other two games. His lack of running speed and athleticism showed up a couple times as well.



                          TLDR:
                          He has decent burst in a short area straight ahead, and his initial burst of the line can be decent at times. He just works best in a confined space, QBs and probably anyone with speed can easily get around him. He’s extremely stout, but he’s better than the rock type NTs because he actively sheds blocks, moves, and makes tackles on the RB. I like him as a 43 NT, I still think he’s only a two down player, but he’s not a complete zero in the passing game, he can shoot a gap or beat an OL with strength or his swim or spin move. I also still like the comparison to Kyle Williams. Good chance Gaines plays in the league for ten years as part of a DL rotation. Seems like a safe, though not sexy at all, selection for a team trying to make their DL more stout. One area of concern is he has the Pop Eye syndrome with big arms but those suckers are short, maybe not even 30 inches and the threshold for DTs is around 33. So, size and length measurements are going to be a big deal for him (Arms 31 inches, short, but not obscenely short like I was worried about). On tape, he’s a rock solid, if limited, NT option that should go on Day 3.

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                          • Jesse Burkett? Ooofta. Was not even on my radar for UDFA. Did I miss something?

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                            • Originally posted by jebures View Post

                              It was cheap and works fine for what I use it for.
                              I have a UDFA grade on Lenovo, to me those processor speeds are undraftable.

                              Comment


                              • He's on my to-do list since he participated in the Shrine game. That's the type of guy I'm doing right now. Had him, Falcinelli, and Linder scheduled for next Thursday. No opinion on him yet.

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