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  • Seattle WR coach on Nashville radio this am

    This is a long and somewhat rambling post so don't read it and then tear me a new ass for posting it. I was physically sick for a week. I didn't want to read or even discuss the game, but after hearing an interview with Seattle WR coach Kippy Brown this morning, I thought I would try to get some stuff off my chest. I also want to try and articulate some of my thoughts on the game without so much emotion involved.


    I put 49% of the blame on the players because they are grown ass men, and should never be that flat and void of energy in a game with so much at stake. I include my boy 18 in that statement too. Although, we'll never know how he would have played given a clean pocket, receivers with a little more toughness, and a coaching staff with the ability to reach between their legs and check to see if they are in fact MEN. But nonetheless, he was as flat as the rest of the team. I put 51% blame on the coaches for being who they are- dumbfounded on the sideline, barely having a pulse, indecisive, 1-7 on challenges this year, overpaid, under motivating, "insert the adjective of your choice" 's

    Ok, on to the interview I heard this morning. Doug Mathews is a former UT coach and friend of Peyton's, but didn't coach him at UT. Mathews has a show every Sunday AM, and this morning he had Kippy Brown on. Kippy coached with Pete Carroll and shared an office with him for 3 years when they coached the Jets in the late 80's and early 90's. Kippy has coached for about 7 different NFL teams, and is considered one of the better WR coaches in the game. Pete Carroll asked Kippy to come to Seattle, and coach receivers. This was going to be his last year and he was going to retire after, but Kippy said that he was going to coach at least one more year because Seattle has such a different approach to how they coach their players. They compete at everything they do. They are the only team he has coached for, or ever heard of that goes 1's vs 1's in practice once the season starts. It's no secret that Pete Carroll is the best motivator in the game. I didn't have to hear Kippy say it to know he was. I know what you're thinking, these are grown ass men, you shouldn't have to get up for the Super Bowl. All that rah rah mess, is bull$hit. I'm pissed too, and I was in a state of depression for a week.

    That game was doomed from the minute Drunk ass Joe Namath botched the coin toss, and Ramirez snapped the ball too early or whatever the hell happened. Hell, it wouldn't surprise me if that was on #18. But Denver ran into a buzz saw, and I've always said that the SB is a game about which team handles the magnitude of the moment, and seizes the momentum. We all saw which team did that. But it was interesting to hear him talk about how the chemistry on this team worked out to be the perfect storm that was everything Denver was not, and could expose them. You can just tell by looking at how Carroll behaves on the sideline. Yea he's sleazy and smug, and he's not schematic genius. He just motivates his guys to play hard. Things are changing in the NFL, and he's the type of guy to take advantage of it. They have several free agents, and I don't think all of them will be as effective in other systems. But just listening to him talk about how much he loved coaching in that organization, and how the players loved playing for Pete Carroll, made the outcome of the SB make a little more sense. Having said that, I'm still furious as to how a team could come out that flat. Seattle didn't have a coach or player that had ever been in a Super Bowl I don't think, but they were not intimidated by the moment. Seattle was good. I will say great, but Denver made them look a lot better than they are, but in the current configuration Denver exists, Seattle would beat them 2 out of 3 times on a neutral field. But I don't think it would be the utter humiliation we say on February 2nd.

    Stop hear of you don't want to read my thoughts on the game.

    I said this after the Colts game and got absolutely roasted for it. If Peyton didn't play like an MVP for the rest of the season, they will limp into the playoffs and be one and done. But he did. This team is not championship caliber in all three phases of the game, and coaching. They were too injured, had a weak pass rush, the special teams were terrible, and there are no leaders on the defense. They don't fly around the field and gang tackle, and they lost the only real cover corner they had with CH. Von Miller was an empty uniform, and they actually played better when he went down.

    But the biggest thing was coaching, IMO. I'm not talking about X's and O's, I'm talking about guys taking their helmets off to argue and jaw, guys stepping out of bounds and fumbling the ball while doing it, veterans fielding punts inside the 5 yard line. Guys spinning the ball after a catch right in the refs face. Going 1-7 on challenges. Burning TO's because you don't have the right personnel on the field. Fumbles in the red zone. Fumbling while trying to get YAC. CONTINUING TO CARRY THE BALL LIKE A LOAF OF BREAD. All those little things by themselves don't amount to much, but over the course of a season they'd are very revealing, and the greatest season by a QB in the history of the game covered up a lot of those sores. Sure, somebody had to catch all those TD's but all the things I mentioned above didn't kill them against the teams they were playing. All it was going to take was a defense that could get to Peyton, muscle the WR's when the officials start swallowing their whistles in the playoffs, and stop the run. The defense was not going to be able to keep them in the game if more than one of these things happened, and in the SB, Seattle hit the trifecta. Add to that, a coaching staff that must have taken the two weeks after the AFCCG off, and you have the nightmare that was SB 48.

    You can put all the blame on #18 you want, and by God he'll shoulder it, but I've said it on here before- I watched the entire Colts organization for 13 years, and sit on the sidelines when things got sideways, expecting Peyton to bail them out. Sure the first int was a terrible throw, but did anyone else notice that Julius never looked around for the pass until it was behind him? On top of 18's bad throw, Juius wasn't looking for the ball, so I'm not convinced he ran the correct route. But whatever. Sure, Peyton missed some open receivers, but we don't see what he sees. Our cozy little pocket is not collapsing when we are watching on TV. Peyton didn't just forget how to read defenses in the SB! Something was off, mainly a tremendous inside pass rush IMO, and a secondary that admitted after the game that the Denver had ripped them off to what plays and routes were coming based on the sets,a nd down and distance. That's on Peyton and Gase.

    Without Peyton, this team was barely a playoff team, that's not a revelation- especially with all the injuries. It's also not news to anyone here, that John Fox is never, EVER, going to motivate a team to play over their heads on a consistent basis. As fans we want to blame the coaches when we lose, but in this case I think it's appropriate to blame him for the teams lack of energy, and at least two decisions he made in the game. I'm not blaming the coaching for what they did or didn't do in the two weeks leading up to the SB. I think the atmosphere , and climate that the team takes on over the course of a season is the head coaches responsibility. Believe it or not, professional athletes aren't self motivated. That's a myth. Just like Seattle's practice of 1's vs 1's in practice creates an atmosphere of competition. Say what you want about risking injury, but Seattle had a full roster for the SB. The Broncos defense played over their heads for two games in the playoffs, but were exposed for what they really were against Seattle. When it was 22-0 I thought if the defense could make a stop, and they could score and make it 22-7, they had a chance, but when John Fox decided to pooch kick it screwed up the coverage lanes. The HC and ST coach should know that your coverage teams weren't use to having to actually go down and tackle someone because playing at attitude your kicker was blasting it into the cheap seats. Then we started to see the obligatory drops and fumbles by the WR's. It was just a crazy day where nothing went right, but Peyton shouldn't be asked to carry the team against good teams in the playoffs, and I'm sure his teammates weren't expecting him to serve up a pick that early in the game either. But that's not an excuse to be shell shocked and turtle up in the fetal position? There has never been a QB in the modern era NOT named Doug Williams to just carry a team through the playoffs and into the Super Bowl. Peyton was clutch against NE, and against SD, but at some point the rest of the team needs to feel free to show up. In the playoffs it takes a team effort, and for all three phases of the game to at least show up. I've never seen what transpired in a championship game of that magnitude where the favorite fell apart like that, and unless major changes are made it will be more of the same. The offense will be fine if the line is not decimated by injuries again, but no QB can be expected to carry a team like 18 did this year.

    The special teams must improve, and they need to figure out how they are going to fix the defense. That was pitiful.

    Again, sorry for the long post. I also went back and repaired some grammar and usage issues
    Last edited by ram40ut; 02-17-2014, 12:44 AM.

  • #2
    Long post is long.

    The one thing I'll say, in response to your long post, is that I think Elway is the perfect guy to help Peyton avoid what happened for all those years in Indianapolis. He won't, as you say, expect Peyton to bail things out when they get sideways. He knows what it's like to be the guy carrying the team; and he knows what it's like to finally get the help necessary to put the team over the top.

    I'm still far from convinced that John Fox is the guy to get us there. We're going to roll the dice with him, it would seem. I hope it's not a gamble that we end up regretting.

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    • #3
      I agree with your overall assessment (Peyton can't do it all on his own), but the defense did enough in the first half of the Superbowl to hold down the fort while the offense was burning down. After the safety, they held them to 3, then again held them to 3 (too many 3rd downs converted on those drives, so I'm not saying they were perfect, but did "enough") When it was 8-0 I thought - if our offense can just get something going here it we have a chance to get back into the game. Then the pick-6.

      That said, I spend the bulk of our FA $ and draft choices mostly on defense. Both S positions are a need (Rahim is solid, but I'd rather he be solid depth). MLB is a need, DE is a need (Mincy was okay stopgap, I'd bring him back and we have a couple of guys McCray and Q to develop), CB is probably a need depending on how Harris rehabs and if we can resign DRC.

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      • #4
        Good post ram, agree with a lot of it. One major disagreement I have is your "empty uniform" comment about Von. Even though he didn't put up the sack numbers like last year, and perhaps wasn't quite as quick and explosive, he was probably still our best defensive player when he was out there.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by ColoradoDarin View Post
          ...but the defense did enough in the first half of the Superbowl to hold down the fort while the offense was burning down...
          While I understand the reasoning, I don't fully agree. Yes, the D held them to FG's on their first two possessions. But they gave up too many yards, first downs, and time on those possessions. Needed to get off the field, and getting Manning and the O back on it, and they couldn't do it. That said, the O deserves even more blame for the loss.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by TonyR View Post
            Good post ram, agree with a lot of it. One major disagreement I have is your "empty uniform" comment about Von. Even though he didn't put up the sack numbers like last year, and perhaps wasn't quite as quick and explosive, he was probably still our best defensive player when he was out there.
            Agree with this. Also relevant was the lack of a strong running game. Elway knows he couldn't do it without TD. Moreno and Ball were not good enough this year to take the pressure off of peyton.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Sly_Eli View Post
              Also relevant was the lack of a strong running game.
              Agree, although I think the O-line and the scheme are more the issues than the backs.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by TonyR View Post
                Good post ram, agree with a lot of it. One major disagreement I have is your "empty uniform" comment about Von. Even though he didn't put up the sack numbers like last year, and perhaps wasn't quite as quick and explosive, he was probably still our best defensive player when he was out there.
                Yeah, but we need him to be more than our best defensive player. He should be playing like a top-5 defensive player in the league. I don't know if it was the distractions, or the weight gain/conditioning, or whatever. He was clearly a different player last year.

                Whatever it was, I hope it was a wake-up call.

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                • #9
                  Very nice rant.

                  IIRC, on the first INT, Peyton rushed that throw. He felt pressure on both edges, then took two steps forward, threw awkwardly, and threw it too early and without planting his feet. JT wasn't looking because he just came out of his break and the throw was too early and inaccurate.

                  I have to go along with DRC and other guys that said, "They wanted it more than we did." None of that Elway BS saying no, they just outplayed us (which is really saying the same thing but in a disingenuous sort of way). Or Fox, with a sick-looking smile on his face saying "Not too shabby."

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by TonyR View Post
                    While I understand the reasoning, I don't fully agree. Yes, the D held them to FG's on their first two possessions. But they gave up too many yards, first downs, and time on those possessions. Needed to get off the field, and getting Manning and the O back on it, and they couldn't do it. That said, the O deserves even more blame for the loss.
                    ?

                    Quote myself in reply...

                    (too many 3rd downs converted on those drives, so I'm not saying they were perfect, but did "enough")

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by TonyR View Post
                      Good post ram, agree with a lot of it. One major disagreement I have is your "empty uniform" comment about Von. Even though he didn't put up the sack numbers like last year, and perhaps wasn't quite as quick and explosive, he was probably still our best defensive player when he was out there.
                      Well, I don't know about that. Von has one dimension where he impacts the game - pass rush. He wasn't having much impact passrushing-wise. JDR said it, and Von confirmed it himself.

                      I guess we'll just have to wait til next year and see if this team, all of them from Elway on down, has the mental toughness to come out (and finish out) kicking ass and win the Lombardi.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by ColoradoDarin View Post
                        Quote myself in reply...
                        Yes, lol, I guess we pretty much agree. I think I just reacted to the "defense did enough" part because I just don't think they did.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by TonyR View Post
                          While I understand the reasoning, I don't fully agree. Yes, the D held them to FG's on their first two possessions. But they gave up too many yards, first downs, and time on those possessions. Needed to get off the field, and getting Manning and the O back on it, and they couldn't do it. That said, the O deserves even more blame for the loss.
                          Yeah, the D hung in the game, but they gave up some big yardage plays which was a problem all year. The O never hung in at all. You'd think with all that time on the sideline to settle down and get their **** together they'd come out prepared on the next series. But no, series after series they looked like the team that played Seattle in the preseason.

                          I try to put myself in Elway's shoes - he was pissed about the Seattle preseason ass-kicking, then it happens AGAIN in the Big Game, pretty much the same scenario. Elway has to be thinking where do I start at to get some backbone in this team.

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                          • #14
                            John fox doesn't motivate the players. It's simple.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by TonyR View Post
                              Yes, lol, I guess we pretty much agree. I think I just reacted to the "defense did enough" part because I just don't think they did.
                              Yeah, it's just 2 sides of the same coin. It would have been much better had they forced a 3 and out after the safety punt.

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