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Old 06-13-2011, 05:31 PM   #1
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Default Elway and Tebow ... something in common (kind of)?

Pulled out my Elway DVD from HOF Week in '04 ... 'In His Own Words,' 'Sports Century,' all those shows.

Noticed something - was reminded of something: The Elway Tap. Honestly, John tapped just before 80-plus percent of his throws, and never ever tapped and then pumped ... every tap was followed by a release. When he started in the league there was talk that the tap would telegraph his throws. I recall some Chargers DB claiming it was so.

Tebow of course has the roundhouse ... they're kind of similar. Both telegraph to some degree, though it's not clear how much the roundhouse works against TT. This comparison provides some possible mitigatioh, plus he's a lefty, maybe he'll be okay. Obviously he's light years away from any serious comparison, but on this point it's something to think about.
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Old 06-13-2011, 05:47 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by BroncoBuff View Post
Pulled out my Elway DVD from HOF Week in '04 ... 'In His Own Words,' 'Sports Century,' all those shows.

Noticed something - was reminded of something: The Elway Tap. Honestly, John tapped just before 80-plus percent of his throws, and never ever tapped and then pumped ... every tap was followed by a release. When he started in the league there was talk that the tap would telegraph his throws. I recall some Chargers DB claiming it was so.

Tebow of course has the roundhouse ... they're kind of similar. Both telegraph to some degree, though it's not clear how much the roundhouse works against TT. This comparison provides some possible mitigatioh, plus he's a lefty, maybe he'll be okay. Obviously he's light years away from any serious comparison, but on this point it's something to think about.
I think there is a pretty big difference between tapping a ball before you chuck it and the big wind up. It's not uncommon for a QB to tap the ball before he goes into his release motion.
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Old 06-13-2011, 06:05 PM   #3
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Yeah, Elway tapped it...but, then in an instant...it was out of there.

Tebow, has a long windup that takes seconds to launch. He has got to work on that. Guys are in the backfield on most plays...you can't keep the ball where they can get it.

As for Elway...defenses saw him tap the ball...and then the ball was past them. Funny ****!

Cutler was closer to Tebow. Cutler likes to hold it down by his waste and bring it up to his should before throwing it. Takes about as long as Tebow to actually get it out.
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Old 06-13-2011, 06:18 PM   #4
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Yeah, Elway tapped it...but, then in an instant...it was out of there.

Tebow, has a long windup that takes seconds to launch. He has got to work on that. Guys are in the backfield on most plays...you can't keep the ball where they can get it.

As for Elway...defenses saw him tap the ball...and then the ball was past them. Funny ****!

Cutler was closer to Tebow. Cutler likes to hold it down by his waste and bring it up to his should before throwing it. Takes about as long as Tebow to actually get it out.
supposedly that is something Tebow has been working on all offseason. taking direct snaps and dropping back, while also holding the ball higher which in turn shortens his throwing motion by basically getting rid of the windup. the windup was a necessary throwing motion from him holding the ball so low, if he can get his arm higher after the snap that will shorten his delivery motion a lot.

i am not too worried about Tim's throwing motion. my main concern is how will the altered throwing motion affect accuracy and velocity or if it will at all.
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Old 06-13-2011, 06:19 PM   #5
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Pulled out my Elway DVD from HOF Week in '04 ... 'In His Own Words,' 'Sports Century,' all those shows.

Noticed something - was reminded of something: The Elway Tap. Honestly, John tapped just before 80-plus percent of his throws, and never ever tapped and then pumped ... every tap was followed by a release. When he started in the league there was talk that the tap would telegraph his throws. I recall some Chargers DB claiming it was so.

Tebow of course has the roundhouse ... they're kind of similar. Both telegraph to some degree, though it's not clear how much the roundhouse works against TT. This comparison provides some possible mitigatioh, plus he's a lefty, maybe he'll be okay. Obviously he's light years away from any serious comparison, but on this point it's something to think about.
I think you're right on -- not just with regard to Elway, but with all quarterbacks. It's why Tebow's release looks so slow, but he gets the job done.

Many, many quarterbacks have some muscular action that amounts to a mental windup. Elway and Steve Young patted the ball. Others do a chicken hop with the feet. But lots of them have something they do that takes time before the ball is launched.

Tebow's throwing arm loops back slowly, but the rest of his body (and feet) are pretty quiet. He's planted, doesn't do anything but take it back and then throw it.

His total release is not slower than many quarterbacks who have other quirks.
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Old 06-13-2011, 06:20 PM   #6
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I think there is a pretty big difference between tapping a ball before you chuck it and the big wind up. It's not uncommon for a QB to tap the ball before he goes into his release motion.
There's really not. Experts often say the "tap" or pat has to go. It genuinely affects the total time of release if it's something you have to do every time before releasing the ball.
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Old 06-13-2011, 06:29 PM   #7
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thowing motion for me is totally overrated. look at RIvers, that dude has one of the strangest throwing motiions i have ever seen, but you can't argue the results the guy is getting.
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Old 06-13-2011, 06:30 PM   #8
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The tap is a fraction of the roundhouse, yes ... but there's the inverse telegraph too. John's pump-fake was ineffective, in that he never ever tapped before he pumped. If he tap, he threw, seemed like 100% of the time. If Tebow can roundhouse and pump - hold the ball - then it's dis-information if you will, he can use it as an asset.

Personally, I don't think the roundhouse matters much at all. Things are moving so fast out there, and very often the DBs are watching for the ball, not the windup hence ("BALL BALL BALL!" from the sidelines). Plus he's a lefty ... even if they are looking, their instincts have them looking sideways.
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Old 06-13-2011, 06:31 PM   #9
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I think the roundhouse helps the O-linemen time their arms into the air a lot more than the DBs breaking on the ball.
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Old 06-13-2011, 06:34 PM   #10
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The tap is a fraction of the roundhouse, yes ... but there's the inverse telegraph too. John's pump-fake was ineffective, in that he never ever tapped before he pumped. If he tap, he threw, seemed like 100% of the time. If Tebow can roundhouse and pump - hold the ball - then it's dis-information if you will, he can use it as an asset.

Personally, I don't think the roundhouse matters much at all. Things are moving so fast out there, and very often the DBs are watching for the ball, not the windup hence ("BALL BALL BALL!" from the sidelines). Plus he's a lefty ... even if they are looking, their instincts have them looking sideways.
I bet Drew Brees could have a sign on his helmet that turns blue when he will throw and red when he fakes and he would still put up really solid numbers, the way the rules are now and with the accuracy of many of these quarterbacks the ball has to be thrown poorly or the reciever has to make a mistake to give the DB a chance.
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Old 06-13-2011, 06:47 PM   #11
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Elway has tapped plenty while Tebow has never tapped anything.
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Old 06-13-2011, 07:02 PM   #12
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It's all perception. Tebow is able to deliver the ball down the field just fine.
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Old 06-13-2011, 07:06 PM   #13
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Rivers and Kosar both have/had wierd throwing motions and it didn't hamper them
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Old 06-13-2011, 07:10 PM   #14
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Steve Sewell had a funky throwing motion.
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Old 06-13-2011, 07:17 PM   #15
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Someone kick me in the balls for reading this thread.
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Old 06-13-2011, 07:44 PM   #16
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Someone kick me in the balls for smelling like perfume
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Old 06-13-2011, 07:55 PM   #17
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This wind-up sucks pretty bad:
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Old 06-13-2011, 08:31 PM   #18
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Someone kick me in the balls for reading this thread.
Allow me ....
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Old 06-13-2011, 09:28 PM   #19
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huh.....i was hoping this was another racist thread
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Old 06-13-2011, 11:14 PM   #20
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huh.....i was hoping this was another racist thread
You mean like "Eric Decker reminds me of Eddie McCaffrey?" That nonsense?

Not on your life, not me bub.

In honor of our friend Khan and his tireless efforts to rid the NFL of racial stereotypes:



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Old 06-13-2011, 11:15 PM   #21
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Elway has tapped plenty while Tebow has never tapped anything.
Bwhaaaa!!!
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Old 06-13-2011, 11:21 PM   #22
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I always bring up Elway whenever someone says "GOD! SO AND SO SHOULD STOP PATTING THE BALL!"

"Elway patted the ball, dude. Maybe your QB just sucks."

Trent Green also patted the ball quite a bit.
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Old 06-13-2011, 11:22 PM   #23
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Someone kick me in the balls for reading this thread.
No ****....25K post rule?
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Old 06-13-2011, 11:46 PM   #24
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No ****....25K post rule?
Hater.
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