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Old 05-13-2013, 05:36 PM   #1501
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so i'm not a book reader, obv, but why do the wildlings wanna invade the south? is their goal just to invade and post up, making that they're new home? north of the wall is really crappy, but i guess i'm just not understanding their end game here. as jon snow said, they don't really stand any real chance invading the kingdom.
They're trying to get away from the things that keep killing them.
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Old 05-13-2013, 05:40 PM   #1502
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i get the white walkers... it's just been said they've tried invading a bunch of times before... unsuccessfully

didn't know if they had any new info/tactics that were supposed to work this time around, or if they're just playing it by ear.

i guess "winter is coming" is a good enough reason, haha
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Old 05-13-2013, 05:42 PM   #1503
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so i'm not a book reader, obv, but why do the wildlings wanna invade the south? is their goal just to invade and post up, making that their new home? north of the wall is really crappy, but i guess i'm just not understanding their end game here. as jon snow said, they don't really stand any real chance invading the kingdom.
Like MagicHef said. They are trying to get away from the White Walkers.

(The past invasions were just attempted land grabs, but they were a long time ago.)
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Old 05-13-2013, 05:45 PM   #1504
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i get the white walkers... it's just been said they've tried invading a bunch of times before... unsuccessfully

didn't know if they had any new info/tactics that were supposed to work this time around, or if they're just playing it by ear.

i guess "winter is coming" is a good enough reason, haha
They recognize that their options are getting across the wall or dying. Therefore, they are trying to get across the wall.
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Old 05-13-2013, 06:58 PM   #1505
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GRRM did a nice job with this episode. Tons of foreshadowing (though mostly only perceptible to book readers) and nods to the books.

If you haven't read the books, this'll be an episode you'll enjoy more the second time around I think.
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Old 05-13-2013, 07:47 PM   #1506
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GRRM did a nice job with this episode. Tons of foreshadowing (though mostly only perceptible to book readers) and nods to the books.

If you haven't read the books, this'll be an episode you'll enjoy more the second time around I think.
I haven't seen the last two episodes, but I'm caught up on the books. I don't get why everyone is so down on the Theon storyline. Considering this is only the first half of book three, it seems as if there is still plenty of time to allow his story to fade out and have the viewers (who haven't read the books) think he's dead. They could leave him out of next season entirely and bring him back for season five without losing much. Will that happen? Doubtful, but I think it's a bit too soon to be jumping to conclusions, particularly when this series has done such a fine job so far of adapting a story which most people probably thought would be difficult to do and impossible to do well.
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Old 05-13-2013, 07:52 PM   #1507
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I haven't seen the last two episodes, but I'm caught up on the books. I don't get why everyone is so down on the Theon storyline. Considering this is only the first half of book three, it seems as if there is still plenty of time to allow his story to fade out and have the viewers (who haven't read the books) think he's dead. They could leave him out of next season entirely and bring him back for season five without losing much. Will that happen? Doubtful, but I think it's a bit too soon to be jumping to conclusions, particularly when this series has done such a fine job so far of adapting a story which most people probably thought would be difficult to do and impossible to do well.
True, he's worthless until Moat Cailin.
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Old 05-14-2013, 04:53 AM   #1508
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The Wildings have a few things going for them this time around that they probably didn't in past attempts:

1. Giants
2. A seriously diminished Nightwatch. (Even more diminished after the battle against the walkers and the subsequent mutiny at Craster's Keep.)
3. Westeros still in a state of civil war.
4. A long winter is presumably on its way and these folks are more adapted to that kind of environment.
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Old 05-14-2013, 07:46 AM   #1509
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The Wildings have a few things going for them this time around that they probably didn't in past attempts:

1. Giants
2. A seriously diminished Nightwatch. (Even more diminished after the battle against the walkers and the subsequent mutiny at Craster's Keep.)
3. Westeros still in a state of civil war.
4. A long winter is presumably on its way and these folks are more adapted to that kind of environment.
if I remember correctly Giants, the presence of walkers, and winter/fertile land have always been apart of Wildlings unified assaults. Many of them date back to the age of heros, with the likes of Brandon the Builder, and (insert Stark here). The Dragons seem to be the key to Magic, and they have only been gone 200 years at this point in the story. I can't remember when the most recent Wildling raid took place, but I can almost guerentee that the previous 5 involved the factors you mentioned; minus the recent events of course.
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Old 05-14-2013, 07:49 AM   #1510
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I haven't seen the last two episodes, but I'm caught up on the books. I don't get why everyone is so down on the Theon storyline. Considering this is only the first half of book three, it seems as if there is still plenty of time to allow his story to fade out and have the viewers (who haven't read the books) think he's dead. They could leave him out of next season entirely and bring him back for season five without losing much. Will that happen? Doubtful, but I think it's a bit too soon to be jumping to conclusions, particularly when this series has done such a fine job so far of adapting a story which most people probably thought would be difficult to do and impossible to do well.
Coincidentally, that's when it started to get redundant and needlessly tedious.
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Old 05-14-2013, 07:54 AM   #1511
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if I remember correctly Giants, the presence of walkers, and winter/fertile land have always been apart of Wildlings unified assaults. Many of them date back to the age of heros, with the likes of Brandon the Builder, and (insert Stark here). The Dragons seem to be the key to Magic, and they have only been gone 200 years at this point in the story. I can't remember when the most recent Wildling raid took place, but I can almost guerentee that the previous 5 involved the factors you mentioned; minus the recent events of course.
White Walkers haven't been seen in 8,000 years. That is the new factor.
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Old 05-14-2013, 08:02 AM   #1512
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White Walkers haven't been seen in 8,000 years. That is the new factor.
Well ****, at least we know they had Giants.
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Old 05-14-2013, 08:10 AM   #1513
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So... Jeyne (or at least her counterpart on the show) is definitely pregnant. This was a point of much speculation because it is never spelled out in the books, and could have big consequences for the story going forward.
Not sure how I feel about this. It is a widely accepted theory that she is pregnant in the book and ran off. If she doesn't die at the Red Wedding and ends up pregnant in the book, we are potentially seeing a massive spoiler for the upcoming books.

Otherwise I enjoyed the episode. I don't mind the torture scenes (how else do we get Reek?) but the sex scene was definitely GRRM'esque and didn't need to be so long.

Stars of the episode were Jaime, Dany, and Tywin imo.
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Old 05-14-2013, 09:14 AM   #1514
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Maybe we won't see Theon/Reek or Ramsay again until season 5. That would be nice.
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Old 05-14-2013, 09:14 AM   #1515
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Huge spoiler! Don't press play unless you want to see how Tywin end up.

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Old 05-14-2013, 09:23 AM   #1516
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Well ****, at least we know they had Giants.
Not sure where you're getting that.

King Beyond the Wall Joramun supposedly woke the giants with a horn about 8,000 yrs ago, but he wasn't really involved in an invasion of Westeros. On the contrary, he joined up with the Starks to bring down the Night's King.


About 3000 years ago, Kings beyond the Wall Gendel and Gorne invaded, but that was accomplished by digging under the Wall. (Storm of Swords, Chapter 26) No mention of giants.


About 184 AL Raymun Redbeard led an invasion, accomplished by sending a raiding party to climb the wall and send down ropes & ladders. (Clash of Kings, ch 23, DoD chap 7). Again, no mention of giants.

I can't find any reference to the other times the Wildlings supposedly invaded.

We do know that Wildlings have occasionally interacted with giants before Mance united everyone, but I can't find anything that says they raided the south together and it seems pretty unlikely give the methods referenced. (Very hard to lift a mammoth up over the wall or to dig a tunnel big enough for it.)
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Old 05-14-2013, 09:25 AM   #1517
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Not sure how I feel about this. It is a widely accepted theory that she is pregnant in the book and ran off. If she doesn't die at the Red Wedding and ends up pregnant in the book, we are potentially seeing a massive spoiler for the upcoming books.

Otherwise I enjoyed the episode. I don't mind the torture scenes (how else do we get Reek?) but the sex scene was definitely GRRM'esque and didn't need to be so long.

Stars of the episode were Jaime, Dany, and Tywin imo.
Either way it's a spoiler since we should know pretty definitively that she's pregnant or not based on the direction they go.

I think its a good thing. They SHOULD be giving viewers that have read the books new content to enjoy. What difference does it make if we read the spoiler in book 6/7 or see it now? In fact, now we get to debate whether it's real or not. Kinda makes it more fun.
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Old 05-14-2013, 09:30 AM   #1518
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Not sure how I feel about this. It is a widely accepted theory that she is pregnant in the book and ran off. If she doesn't die at the Red Wedding and ends up pregnant in the book, we are potentially seeing a massive spoiler for the upcoming books.

...
I recently came across speculation concerning a gigantic spoiler involving all of this. Most of the time, when I read theories about this or that, I kind of shrug and say hmmn ... maybe ... maybe not ... and move on. The theory I'm talking about here, however, is extraordinarily well-developed but it would involve such a huge spoiler that I don't even want to post it on the thread. If it's correct, we'll know by season's end.

People who want to get spoiled are welcome to PM me and I'll send the link.
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Old 05-14-2013, 09:34 AM   #1519
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People who want to get spoiled are welcome to PM me and I'll send the link.
I just shot you off one, I would love to read about it.
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Old 05-14-2013, 10:50 AM   #1520
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Its not the R+L=J or anything like that is it?
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Old 05-14-2013, 11:07 AM   #1521
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it was a great episode. When Brianne says, "Sir Jamie" the acting IMO was top notch and you could see how much it meant to him in his eyes.

People told me Jamie Lannister had a great story arch and we are starting to see it. He's regaining himself. It's obvious its the dad of the family who screwed all the kids up.
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Old 05-14-2013, 11:48 AM   #1522
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it was a great episode. When Brianne says, "Sir Jamie" the acting IMO was top notch and you could see how much it meant to him in his eyes.

People told me Jamie Lannister had a great story arch and we are starting to see it. He's regaining himself. It's obvious its the dad of the family who screwed all the kids up.
Everyone (and me) in this thread is currently nerd raging over that
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Old 05-14-2013, 12:59 PM   #1523
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Either way it's a spoiler since we should know pretty definitively that she's pregnant or not based on the direction they go.

I think its a good thing. They SHOULD be giving viewers that have read the books new content to enjoy. What difference does it make if we read the spoiler in book 6/7 or see it now? In fact, now we get to debate whether it's real or not. Kinda makes it more fun.
There's a theory that she's basically Jeyne and Sybell Spicer rolled into one, and she's aSPOILER: ( spy working for the Lannisters. I hadn't noticed, but apparently she's writing letters nearly every time she's on screen. In that case, she may be lying about being pregnant. )
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Old 05-14-2013, 01:02 PM   #1524
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I watched the episode again last night, and I have to say that it ranks pretty high in my favorite episodes. GRRM really packed in a lot of meaning in this one. There's a lot of emotion and character development/revealation in it. Arya saying that her one true god is death. Sansa and Maergery's discussion - and Sansa still so naive. Osha's tale of her husband - which is amazing coming straight from GRRM. "Ser" Jaime. The boy king and the pimp hand. Tyrion pleading with Shae. Clyburn and Jaime's discussion. Robb and Talisa. This episode was chock full of character development and revelations.
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Old 05-14-2013, 01:18 PM   #1525
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Everyone (and me) in this thread is currently nerd raging over that
Did this happen in the book? If not, it was a good change especially in light of their interactions later in the series.
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