Schlereth rips Shanahan...

[jhns]

Originally Posted by Requiem

The only thing that saved his ass was riding out two Super Bowl wins that happened well over a decade ago.

That and going to the playoffs a lot. Oh, and that AFCCG. Oh yeah, and winning more than all but 4 franchises in his time here. Then, of course, there is the doing better post HOF QB than most franchises through history...

If you throw all that out, he was only here because of those SBs.

[BroncoInferno]

Originally Posted by jhns

I think Shanahan has a problem with personnel and needs to have the right personnel guys around him. He was drafting a LOT better in his last few years here after he found the Goodmans and gave them more power.

That being said. He still improved the team in his first year there. It is dumb to question him while he improves the team. If the team doesn't continue to improve next season, then would be the time to question him. How can you claim he is doing a bad job as they are getting better? It doesn't make sense at all.

Judging improvement goes beyond wins and losses. That's part of the equation, certainly, but I'd hardly call going from 4 to 6 wins proof that the team is going in the right direction. They lost 5 of their last 6 games, so it seems to me like it's tough to argue that they improved all that much. Also, it's hard to look at the QB situation and feel confident about the teams future prospects. Also, the defense got worse this season, allowing 2 more points per game. He only has one pick in the first 4 rounds of the draft to address their myriad of problems. He almost has to use the 1st rounder on a QB of the future. He does that, then there isn't much he can do to improve the defense, or the talent surrounding that QB. If he doesn't address QB in the draft, he probably has to go with Grossman as his QB, because he doesn't have the draft picks needed to trade for someone like Kolb. He's going to have to come up with a helluva personnel plan to have much chance of improving the team for next season. Judging by his recent history as a personnel man, it's hard to have confidence that he'll be able to cook up anything substantial.

[Mile High Shack]

Originally Posted by jhns

That and going to the playoffs a lot. Oh, and that AFCCG. Oh yeah, and winning more than all but 4 franchises in his time here. Then, of course, there is the doing better post HOF QB than most franchises through history...

If you throw all that out, he was only here because of those SBs.

he won one playoff game w/o Elway

[Taco John]

Bruce Allen is the personnel man in Washington. According to what I've heard, he and Snyder forced McNabb's extension on Shanahan despite Shanahan's protests.

[HAT]

Originally Posted by BroncoInferno

Judging improvement goes beyond wins and losses. That's part of the equation, certainly, but I'd hardly call going from 4 to 6 wins proof that the team is going in the right direction. They lost 5 of their last 6 games, so it seems to me like it's tough to argue that they improved all that much. Also, it's hard to look at the QB situation and feel confident about the teams future prospects. Also, the defense got worse this season, allowing 2 more points per game. He only has one pick in the first 4 rounds of the draft to address their myriad of problems. He almost has to use the 1st rounder on a QB of the future. He does that, then there isn't much he can do to improve the defense, or the talent surrounding that QB. If he doesn't address QB in the draft, he probably has to go with Grossman as his QB, because he doesn't have the draft picks needed to trade for someone like Kolb. He's going to have to come up with a helluva personnel plan to have much chance of improving the team for next season. Judging by his recent history as a personnel man, it's hard to have confidence that he'll be able to cook up anything substantial.

So you're saying a Shanny coached team got worse in the 2nd half of the season? Who knew

I almost wish they had the ammo to trade for Kolb. Can you imagine the lulz of that? (And, yes, I realize you said 'a guy like Kolb')

[bpc]

Any surprise resident shanahan hater popps showed up to post this? He's been in hiding ever since his idol mcd got thrown the **** out of town and only comes back to smear former broncos. A cowardly act by a desperate man.

[BroncoInferno]

Originally Posted by Taco John

Bruce Allen is the personnel man in Washington. According to what I've heard, he and Snyder forced McNabb's extension on Shanahan despite Shanahan's protests.

The extension they gave him is pretty much worthless:

http://dc.sbnation.com/2010/7/1/1548...-extension-nfl

The Redskins have reportedly agreed on a five-year, $78 million extension with Donovan McNabb, with $40 million guaranteed.However, the Redskins would only owe $3.75 million if they cut him after the season.

It was Shanny's call to trade 2nd and 3rd picks for a guy who is clearly washed up.

[strafen]

Originally Posted by bpc

Any surprise resident shanahan hater popps showed up to post this? He's been in hiding ever since his idol mcd got thrown the **** out of town and only comes back to smear former broncos. A cowardly act by a desperate man.

That's poops for ya'.
He'd figures by pulling this stunt we're going to forget what McD left us with.
Popps has got nothing to say lately. That's what hppens when homerism gets in the way of reason.

[Popps]

Originally Posted by Mile High Shack

he won one playoff game w/o Elway

Yep. Will always be a big fan of Shanny's, but he just lost his way after those initial great years. I'm just glad we've moved on. Hopefully we'll give our next coach a chance to really gut this team and finish a rebuilding process.

[TheProfessor]

Originally Posted by Popps

Yep. Will always be a big fan of Shanny's, but he just lost his way after those initial great years. I'm just glad we've moved on. Hopefully we'll give our next coach a chance to really gut this team and finish a rebuilding process.

McDaniels already gutted this team...It was the building process he wasn't so good at.

[Popps]

Originally Posted by TheProfessor

McDaniels already gutted this team...It was the building process he wasn't so good at.

As long as our next coach gets a real chance to rebuild this team, I'll be happy. We just can't get into the Raiders musical coaches nonsense.

[TheReverend]

Originally Posted by HAT

So you're saying a Shanny coached team got worse in the 2nd half of the season? Who knew

I almost wish they had the ammo to trade for Kolb. Can you imagine the lulz of that? (And, yes, I realize you said 'a guy like Kolb')

Trying to get an early jump on your complete wrongness quota for 2011?

Post superbowls: As far as those "second half collapses go", Denver is 44-33 in the first half 99-08, and 46-35 in the second half 99-08.

[HTML] Record Offense Defense
W L Total PPG PYPG RYPG TO PPG PYG RYG TO
Q1: 25 14 39 23.21 213.67 136.72 1.59 19.67 200.15 104.49 1.64
Q2: 19 19 38 21.87 236.87 131.97 1.79 21.61 201.08 113.00 1.39
Q3: 20 14 34 24.15 220.88 121.09 1.53 21.71 231.79 85.91 2.47
Q4: 26 21 47 23.55 221.32 151.17 1.68 21.77 199.17 122.04 1.55
Total: 90 68 158 23.19 223.08 136.51 1.65 21.20 206.89 107.76 1.73
[/HTML]

[baja]

Originally Posted by TheProfessor

McDaniels already gutted this team...It was the building process he wasn't so good at.

I think he has left us with some pretty good players.

[HAT]

Context, Rev, context. We are talking about the current Shanahan. Not the good one from the 90's.

And as for my 'complete wrongness'.....You really haven't figured it out in the past 2 years? Really??

[frerottenextelway]

Why does this team need to be gutted?

[baja]

Originally Posted by HAT

Context, Rev, context. We are talking about the current Shanahan. Not the good one from the 90's.

And as for my 'complete wrongness'.....You really haven't figured it out in the past 2 years? Really??

I bet his MOS was sniper seeing as how he likes to hide in the bushes and take pot shots at people at large.

Rev. tries to say something really clever and cutting thinking he is showing everyone how clever he is. I bet he steams up that mirror he admires himself in to the point of rusting the frame.

[TheProfessor]

Originally Posted by baja

I think he has left us with some pretty good players.

Who?

Defense is literally devoid of talent... with the exception of DJ and Champ (both from the previous FO)

As for the offense our best players are still the Shanny hold overs (Clady & Harris & Kuper) as for the rest of the "talent"

Cutler >Tebow
Marshall > DT
Hillis > Knowshon
Weigmann > Walton

The only real find that was strictly McDaniels was Lloyd and though I am extremely impressed with his season, lets see him do it for the 2nd time in his career.

McKidd and the job he did will go down in history as being one of the quickest most inefficient "rebuilds" ever.

[Agamemnon]

I saw all this coming when Washington hired the guy. I think he's illustrated beyond a shadow of a doubt why it was time for him to go. Unfortunately we did a terrible job of replacing him.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by TheProfessor

Who?

Defense is literally devoid of talent... with the exception of DJ and Champ (both from the previous FO)

As for the offense our best players are still the Shanny hold overs (Clady & Harris & Kuper) as for the rest of the "talent"

Cutler >Tebow
Marshall > DT
Hillis > Knowshon
Weigmann > Walton

The only real find that was strictly McDaniels was Lloyd and though I am extremely impressed with his season, lets see him do it for the 2nd time in his career.

McKidd and the job he did will go down in history as being one of the quickest most inefficient "rebuilds" ever.

You're comparing three rookies to established players. Not sure how you think that makes any sense. And Tebow as a rookie >>>> Cutler as a rookie...

[Tombstone RJ]

Originally Posted by TheProfessor

Who?

Defense is literally devoid of talent... with the exception of DJ and Champ (both from the previous FO)

As for the offense our best players are still the Shanny hold overs (Clady & Harris & Kuper) as for the rest of the "talent"

Cutler >Tebow
Marshall > DT
Hillis > Knowshon
Weigmann > Walton

The only real find that was strictly McDaniels was Lloyd and though I am extremely impressed with his season, lets see him do it for the 2nd time in his career.

McKidd and the job he did will go down in history as being one of the quickest most inefficient "rebuilds" ever.

Orton + Tebow + Quinn = to Cutler and maybe > than Cutler
DT + Decker > Marshall (and safer and way less $)
Moreno > Hillis (behind this oline)
Weigmann > Walton (but Walton is a rookie)

It's all in how you look at things. I'm of the opinion this team has about as much talent, give or take, as the team McD inherited. It's all just a matter of personal opinion...

[TheProfessor]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

You're comparing three rookies to established players. Not sure how you think that makes any sense. And Tebow as a rookie >>>> Cutler as a rookie...

If I we were playing in the NCAA I would agree with you. Unfortunately were not.

and before the rest of the torches come out, I like Tebow, hell cheering for the kid is like watching a rocky movie play out in front of me. But he is no where near the talent level of JC. Not for the pro-game at least.

You don't build a team by shipping out all the pro-bowl types and replace them with rookies who have "upside".

Like it or not, McKidd and the job he did are certifiable disasters.

[Popps]

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ

It's all in how you look at things. I'm of the opinion this team has about as much talent, give or take, as the team McD inherited. It's all just a matter of personal opinion...

Yup.

Which is why we have to commit to our next coach for more than a season and change. I hope Bowlen takes his time with this decision, and we don't start dumping coaches every time things look rough.

[Popps]

Originally Posted by TheProfessor

Who?

Defense is literally devoid of talent... with the exception of DJ and Champ (both from the previous FO)

As for the offense our best players are still the Shanny hold overs (Clady & Harris & Kuper) as for the rest of the "talent"

Cutler >Tebow
Marshall > DT
Hillis > Knowshon
Weigmann > Walton

The only real find that was strictly McDaniels was Lloyd and though I am extremely impressed with his season, lets see him do it for the 2nd time in his career.

McKidd and the job he did will go down in history as being one of the quickest most inefficient "rebuilds" ever.

Cutler >Tebow/Orton - Jury is out, at best. Cuter has been between bad and average in two seasons as a Bear.

Marshall < Lloyd - Why wouldn't you make the correct comparison here?

Hillis > Knowshon - Jury is out, long-term. Hillis had a nice start as a starter in Cleveland, then finished 11th in rushing. Given proper blocking, Moreno is just as effective. But, I'll agree here because Moreno can't stay healthy.... but can Hillis? Thus far, neither have proven capable.


Weigmann > Walton - Walton is a rookie and may well be a long-term future starter. We had to make moves with these aging linemen at some point. Weigmann squeezed out one more season than most thought he would. But, that's hardly a ****-up, so much as it is moving towards the future.

[TheProfessor]

Originally Posted by Popps

Cutler >Tebow/Orton - Jury is out, at best. Cuter has been between bad and average in two seasons as a Bear.

I understand why, as a bronco fan, you would want to believe this. Unfortunately you and some others here are in the minority with that opinion. I doubt you could get even 1 general manager that would take Orton/tebow over Cutler

Marshall < Lloyd - Why wouldn't you make the correct comparison here?

Because Lloyd was already here when Brandon was here. DT (IMO) was picked to replace the size/speed combo that we lost when BM was traded.

Hillis > Knowshon - Jury is out, long-term. Hillis had a nice start as a starter in Cleveland, then finished 11th in rushing. Given proper blocking, Moreno is just as effective. But, I'll agree here because Moreno can't stay healthy.... but can Hillis? Thus far, neither have proven capable.

Again, I can see how a bronco fan would like to pretend this is the case. But Knowshon has proven absolutely nothing in his 2 years here. Hillis on the other hand was our leading rusher 1 year and made a strong case for the pro-bowl this season.

Weigmann > Walton - Walton is a rookie and may well be a long-term future starter. We had to make moves with these aging linemen at some point. Weigmann squeezed out one more season than most thought he would. But, that's hardly a ****-up, so much as it is moving towards the future.

Walton is crap... can he improve? Maybe, but as of today the kid is complete crap.

Too many people here are trying to convince themselves that what they saw this season isn't real. Josh McDaniels was an absolute disaster, why are people spending their time pretending he wasn't?

[chawknz]

I like Stink a lot, despite him having to remind me that he has had 20+ surgeries every day. I always enjoy hearing his insight and what he had to say about Shanahan was interesting to read. Thanks!

I can't help but giggle now that I am reminded of some of the draft picks.