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View Poll Results: Which QB had it harder in 2010
Tebow had it harder 19 52.78%
Kyle had it harder 17 47.22%
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Old 12-30-2010, 01:39 PM   #1
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Default Orton or Tebow Who Had it Harder in 2010

I'm only asking because I can't believe anyone wouldn't see this clearly as one sided. So poll pending. Anyways...

Which QB was placed in a more difficult situation this season:

Tim Tebow-
No actual headcoach,
McCoy calling his plays and designing the game plan
His rookie year as a "project" QB
Knowshon injured both his games
First game was on the road in one of the most hostile environments in pro sports against one of the NFLs top defenses
The entire sports media analyzing every millimeter of your throwing motion and many believing you're an H Back, TE, FB at the NFL level

Or

Kyle Orton-
Being a veteran in your second year in the system
Josh McDaniels calling your plays and designing your gameplan
Fan pressure and a 1st round quarterback behind you on the depth chart
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Old 12-30-2010, 01:39 PM   #2
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The fans who had to watch Orton.
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Old 12-30-2010, 01:44 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by TheReverend View Post
No actual headcoach,
McCoy calling his plays and designing the game plan
His rookie year as a "project" QB
Knowshon injured both his games
First game was on the road in one of the most hostile environments in pro sports against one of the NFLs top defenses
The entire sports media analyzing every millimeter of your throwing motion and many believing you're an H Back, TE, FB at the NFL level
Fans that have insanely elevated expectations
A fragmented locker room
Quote:
Kyle Orton
Being a veteran in your second year in the system
Josh McDaniels calling your plays and designing your gameplan
Fan pressure and a 1st round quarterback behind you on the depth chart
fans still pissed about the Cutler trade
Identified with a highly disliked head coach
Injuries

Last edited by lostknight; 12-30-2010 at 01:47 PM..
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Old 12-30-2010, 01:46 PM   #4
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Well, Orton had to follow Cutler while Tebow had to follow Orton.

But I think I agree with orangeandblue above for the real answer.
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Old 12-30-2010, 01:50 PM   #5
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Tebow had it harder.

Orton had everything served up to him on a silver platter and shat the bed.

Even the lack of run game was an opportunity to rack up stats. If he had been more clutch, people wouldn't have blamed him for losing shootouts, 38-31.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:13 PM   #6
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Tebow. He sat the bench for our sins.

In all seriousness though:
Tebow's first start was against one of the best defenses we have faced all year.

Orton "lived up" all four of our games against the NFC West, easily the worst division in football (against whom he was 1-3).

Orton actually has had a healthy Knowshon Moreno for the majority of his starts this year.

Tebow is working with a bunch of veteran players and a coaching staff that know the end is near. Orton was playing with these same guys when they still had hope.

The single biggest positive in coaching, McDaniels' game planning, has done Tebow absolutely no good. The one time Orton didn't have it we lost to the Cardinals in a landslide drubbing.

Tebow is a marked man in the NFL. Ray Lewis has commented about wanting to take shots at him. All the vets want to hit the rook with the top selling jersey.

Tebow's first start was basically a game time decision and he's only had two weeks of first team practice reps. Orton had all pre-season and almost all the first team reps up until he went down.

Orton's backup was a current year rookie who supposedly needed several years to develop. Tebow's backup is a former 1st rounder who has started over a dozen games.

I could go on, but I think the point is pretty clear. Its also painfully obvious. Rookies have it harder. QBs thrust into the spotlight mid-season have it harder. Guys who face stronger teams have it harder. Therefore Tebow has had it harder. Plain and simple.

If the rest of the team wasn't in such complete disarray or even if McCoy would have taken the handcuffs off at some point Tebow would have carried us to a win over the Raiders in Oakland. With Orton they shoved it up our pooper at home.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:25 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Drek View Post
Tebow. He sat the bench for our sins.

In all seriousness though:
Tebow's first start was against one of the best defenses we have faced all year.

Orton "lived up" all four of our games against the NFC West, easily the worst division in football (against whom he was 1-3).

Orton actually has had a healthy Knowshon Moreno for the majority of his starts this year.

Tebow is working with a bunch of veteran players and a coaching staff that know the end is near. Orton was playing with these same guys when they still had hope.

The single biggest positive in coaching, McDaniels' game planning, has done Tebow absolutely no good. The one time Orton didn't have it we lost to the Cardinals in a landslide drubbing.

Tebow is a marked man in the NFL. Ray Lewis has commented about wanting to take shots at him. All the vets want to hit the rook with the top selling jersey.

Tebow's first start was basically a game time decision and he's only had two weeks of first team practice reps. Orton had all pre-season and almost all the first team reps up until he went down.

Orton's backup was a current year rookie who supposedly needed several years to develop. Tebow's backup is a former 1st rounder who has started over a dozen games.

I could go on, but I think the point is pretty clear. Its also painfully obvious. Rookies have it harder. QBs thrust into the spotlight mid-season have it harder. Guys who face stronger teams have it harder. Therefore Tebow has had it harder. Plain and simple.

If the rest of the team wasn't in such complete disarray or even if McCoy would have taken the handcuffs off at some point Tebow would have carried us to a win over the Raiders in Oakland. With Orton they shoved it up our pooper at home.
Color me impressed with your vision in this situation, at least.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:28 PM   #8
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I'd have to say Orton. He is an o.k. QB...but, he's not an elite QB. Fans and expectations in Denver of our QB are high! He had pretty good numbers, but couldn'd carry the team and had to have felt immense pressure. Then, after losing a 10-6 game in KC...where he played his absolute worst all season...his coach gets canned. He must have felt somewhat responsible for McD getting the axe. Then he had to start thinking about himself and asking himself...what does this mean for me. The answer of course is/was...his days are numbered. So, then he goes to AZ with all that on his mind...and lays another egg. Then his season is over and he is told that Tebow will be starting the rest of the season.

Yeah, Orton definitely had it harder (IMO).

Tebow really didn't have alot of pressure put on him. The critics thought that he was a project and that it would be 2-3yrs before he saw the field anyway. All Tebow had to do was sit back and work hard, learn and be ready. Then his oppurtunity came and he took the bull by the horns.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:29 PM   #9
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Tebow.

Last year Orton obtained long term benefits from being on the same roster as Hillis and gained inspiration and long lasting adrenaline from that. Tebow was not afforded a similar luxury.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:30 PM   #10
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Orton had to play with Mcdipshyt calling the plays
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:31 PM   #11
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It's tough for any Bronco QB not named Elway.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:34 PM   #12
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Orton had it harder because he has less talent than Tebow, Thats like saying who was the better leading lady in the batman movies, the hot assed ms. cruise or the melty faced gylennhol(sp?)
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:34 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Hamrob View Post
I'd have to say Orton. He is an o.k. QB...but, he's not an elite QB. Fans and expectations in Denver of our QB are high! He had pretty good numbers, but couldn'd carry the team and had to have felt immense pressure. Then, after losing a 10-6 game in KC...where he played his absolute worst all season...his coach gets canned. He must have felt somewhat responsible for McD getting the axe. Then he had to start thinking about himself and asking himself...what does this mean for me. The answer of course is/was...his days are numbered. So, then he goes to AZ with all that on his mind...and lays another egg. Then his season is over and he is told that Tebow will be starting the rest of the season.

Yeah, Orton definitely had it harder (IMO).

Tebow really didn't have alot of pressure put on him. The critics thought that he was a project and that it would be 2-3yrs before he saw the field anyway. All Tebow had to do was sit back and work hard, learn and be ready. Then his oppurtunity came and he took the bull by the horns.
This is completely untrue. By the time Orton was done not performing, the fan base was teetering on the verge of absolute apathy. Tebow had enormous pressure. If he would have failed, that would have been just one more reason for the fans to turn their backs on the team and the season. Not only that, but Tebow was auditioning to remain a Bronco as a rookie in his first three games and the possibility of drafting Andrew Luck looming. This season has been a runaway train of negativity with enormous momentum behind it. Tebow has almost been able to turn that around both in terms of results on the field and also in terms of fan morale.

In fact, Tebow has probably been up against it more than any Denver rookie in recent memory.

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Old 12-30-2010, 02:36 PM   #14
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Tebow.

Last year Orton obtained long term benefits from being on the same roster as Hillis and gained inspiration and long lasting adrenaline from that. Tebow was not afforded a similar luxury.
I call bull**** on this one. Everyone knows Hillis got all his power from playing within the same athletic conference as Tebow.

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Color me impressed with your vision in this situation, at least.
You can take solace in the fact that it really is a painfully obvious choice.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:44 PM   #15
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I call bull**** on this one. Everyone knows Hillis got all his power from playing within the same athletic conference as Tebow.

It's hard not to wonder what it would have been like with BOTH of them on this team. That much power might have compelled the other 31 teams to file an anti-trust suit against Denver due to the inherent unfairness of playing against Tebow and Hillis and the monopoly Denver would have had over things like wins. On the other hand, that much concentrated power would have been dangerous. For one thing, even Taco's vaunted cloud server might not survive both of them, it would be simply too much....kind of like crossing the streams, except worse.
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:47 PM   #16
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Orton had it harder because he has less talent than Tebow, Thats like saying who was the better leading lady in the batman movies, the hot assed ms. cruise or the melty faced gylennhol(sp?)
Well, if you are using talent as your analogy you have it exactly backwards. I would watch Maggie Gyllenhaal in any role in any movie over Katie Holmes. And she's not bad to look at either (did you see Secretary?)

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Old 12-30-2010, 02:53 PM   #17
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You can take solace in the fact that it really is a painfully obvious choice.
Disagree. Tebow had greatly muted expectations in place when he became the starter. Read the posts prior to his first start for proof. No one expected him to win or even play great, they just hoped he wouldn't be a complete flop and give us hope for the future. Then look at the euphoria after the Oakland game. We had a season low in yardage and first downs, Tebow had two completions downfield and two good runs, and the fan base was largely in ecstasy. Anyone who wasn't quite convinced was attacked. In the meantime, Orton could throw 300 yards and 3 TDs and no turnovers with no running game and a heinous defense, but people would heap the blame on him. There were people ready to run Orton out of town from day one and who never gave him a fair shake. Even those who didn't like the Tebow selection were willing to take a wait and see approach with him (TailgateNut is the only counter-example on the board i can think of).
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Old 12-30-2010, 02:53 PM   #18
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Well, if you are using talent as your analogy you have it exactly backwards. I would watch Maggie Gyllenhaal in any role in any movie over Katie Holmes. And she's not bad to look at either (did you see Secretary?)

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Old 12-30-2010, 02:55 PM   #19
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Disagree. Tebow had greatly muted expectations in place when he became the starter. Read the posts prior to his first start for proof. No one expected him to win or even play great, they just hoped he wouldn't be a complete flop and give us hope for the future. Then look at the euphoria after the Oakland game. We had a season low in yardage and first downs, Tebow had two completions downfield and two good runs, and the fan base was largely in ecstasy. Anyone who wasn't quite convinced was attacked. In the meantime, Orton could throw 300 yards and 3 TDs and no turnovers with no running game and a heinous defense, but people would heap the blame on him. There were people ready to run Orton out of town from day one and who never gave him a fair shake. Even those who didn't like the Tebow selection were willing to take a wait and see approach with him (TailgateNut is the only counter-example on the board i can think of).
A lot of Ortons yards were meaningless. They came in garbage time.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:08 PM   #20
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A lot of Ortons yards were meaningless. They came in garbage time.
Most of Orton's best stats came in games in which we had a reasonable chance to win (Indy game, St.Louis as two examples). Look at the blowout losses....Orton's stats were terrible (Oakland, Baltimore as two examples).
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:10 PM   #21
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Most of Orton's best stats came in games in which we had a reasonable chance to win (Indy game, St.Louis as two examples). Look at the blowout losses....Orton's stats were terrible (Oakland, Baltimore as two examples).
St Louis is an excellent example of how Orton's stats came in garbage time.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:16 PM   #22
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I'm only asking because I can't believe anyone wouldn't see this clearly as one sided. So poll pending. Anyways...

Which QB was placed in a more difficult situation this season:

Tim Tebow-
No actual headcoach,
McCoy calling his plays and designing the game plan
His rookie year as a "project" QB
Knowshon injured both his games
First game was on the road in one of the most hostile environments in pro sports against one of the NFLs top defenses
The entire sports media analyzing every millimeter of your throwing motion and many believing you're an H Back, TE, FB at the NFL level

Or

Kyle Orton-
Being a veteran in your second year in the system
Josh McDaniels calling your plays and designing your gameplan
Fan pressure and a 1st round quarterback behind you on the depth chart
You're kind of leading the witness a little much here, counselor. Although I know this comes from trying to win your argument in a previous thread.

I think Tebow has a somewhat more difficult task, although your conclusion should probably be tempered a little bit at this point. Here are some counterpoints:

-Tebow has the advantage that there was very little tape on him as a professional in this offense. Kyle had that advantage for about six games last year.
-Tebow also racked up must of his action against the worst passing defense in the league, and McCoy called a pretty good game this week.
-Orton was clearly hurt the last two games he played. His accuracy was all over the place, and whatever faults he may have (excessive cement foot/fetal position syndrome), his accuracy is usually pretty good.
-Orton had no running game at all and a makeshift oline for about half of the season.


Tebow looks pretty good so far, and he is fun as heck to watch and cheer for. He has only played in two games, though. It is a small sample. A good sample so far, but small none the less. I've seen enough that I think we'd be stupid not to move on with him as our starter next year. I wish Kyle well, thank him for his effort and the draft pick he'll net us when we trade his ass.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:20 PM   #23
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Disagree. Tebow had greatly muted expectations in place when he became the starter. Read the posts prior to his first start for proof. No one expected him to win or even play great, they just hoped he wouldn't be a complete flop and give us hope for the future. Then look at the euphoria after the Oakland game. We had a season low in yardage and first downs, Tebow had two completions downfield and two good runs, and the fan base was largely in ecstasy. Anyone who wasn't quite convinced was attacked. In the meantime, Orton could throw 300 yards and 3 TDs and no turnovers with no running game and a heinous defense, but people would heap the blame on him. There were people ready to run Orton out of town from day one and who never gave him a fair shake. Even those who didn't like the Tebow selection were willing to take a wait and see approach with him (TailgateNut is the only counter-example on the board i can think of).
You are ONCE AGAIN missing the discussion (along several other people, who quite frankly aren't that bright).

We're talking about who had it harder, not who had higher fan expectations.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:23 PM   #24
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rent "The Gift" and get back to me.
I've seen the important part of "The Gift," and it was about 30 seconds of that movie. Nice, but I have been to the internets, so there's plenty of that kind of stuff to look at. Is any of the rest of it worth watching? I do like Sam Raimi movies.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:57 PM   #25
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Disagree. Tebow had greatly muted expectations in place when he became the starter. Read the posts prior to his first start for proof. No one expected him to win or even play great, they just hoped he wouldn't be a complete flop and give us hope for the future. Then look at the euphoria after the Oakland game. We had a season low in yardage and first downs, Tebow had two completions downfield and two good runs, and the fan base was largely in ecstasy. Anyone who wasn't quite convinced was attacked. In the meantime, Orton could throw 300 yards and 3 TDs and no turnovers with no running game and a heinous defense, but people would heap the blame on him. There were people ready to run Orton out of town from day one and who never gave him a fair shake. Even those who didn't like the Tebow selection were willing to take a wait and see approach with him (TailgateNut is the only counter-example on the board i can think of).
Who cares about fan opinion? Dude plays football and on the football field he's had a rougher road to sled than what Orton had. Even harder than what Orton faced to start last season.
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