Midterm grades - The Orange Mane

gyldenlove · 11-01-2010, 11:57 AM

Midterm grades for the entire roster. My system is quite easy:

A, above reasonable expectations for that player/position
B, acceptable
C, did not meet expectations
O, not enough material to judge on

QB:
Orton (A): Definitely surpassed expectations stat wise, has cooled off significantly and had a lot of problems on 3rd down and in the red zone, but it is not part of the real problem.
Quinn and Tebow (O): Not much to say, Tebow is a gimmick player and Quinn is a clipboard holder.

RB:
Moreno (B): Between his injury and the lousy run blocking he has not met expectations, but he is the best RB on the team by some distance and the only one who should have continued employment into 2011 if and when that season starts.
Maroney (C): He runs more yards lateraly than he does forwards or backwards, he has a nasty habbit of stopping just before he gets hit thereby never falling forward and in general tends to cost himself 1 or 2 yard at the end of almost every run. He is a non-factor on passing plays as he can't block or catch.
Buckhalter (C): The best blocker, but has slowed down since last year and looks like he is at the end of his rope.

FB:
Larsen (A): He has caught the ball and in the limited play time he has recieved he improved the run game, benefits from very low expectations.

TE:
Graham (B): Is a nonfactor in the passing game, is almost always the 7th blocker or completely irrelevant as a catcher. Has not been a difference maker in the run game.
Gronkowski (B): A blocking TE who sees limited play time but has done what could be expected really.
Quinn (C): Has been surpassed by Gronkowski and his only hope of ever playing again for this team is Graham not resigning and the team not drafting or signing a TE with any form of pass catching ability.

WR:
Lloyd (A): Probably the biggest performer on the entire team, leads the league in yards, yards per game and recieving 1st downs and is 2nd among the leaders in yards per catch.
Gaffney (B): Has met reasonable expectations but has not lived up to the season ending he had last year, is getting spelled by Thomas and looks like the likely candidate to be replaced by Thomas.
Royal (A): Picked up his game from his disappointing 2009 season, has looked at home in the slot and is currently our best yards after catch guy by a huge margin. Injury has limited him somewhat or he would have better total stats than Gaffney.
Thomas (A): In limited time has managed to make a difference both positively and negatively. Sat out all offseason and came from a simplified tripple option should not have contributed much at all. Costly fumbles mar what is a solid rookie campaign.
Decker (O): Not enough play time to evaluate, has done some good things on special teams.
Willis (O): Game day inactive.

OL:
Clady (B): The only offensive lineman who has kept up an acceptable level. Has not lived up to his rookie season, but with the injury that wasn't really expected.
Harris (C): Between injury and getting replaced with Beadles this is about as below expectations as it gets. He was slotted to be one of the top RTs in the league, but is now one of the top bench warmers in the league.
Kuper (C): Has not met his level at all, has given up more pressures and sacks than in the previous 2 years combined, consistently fails to get to movement in the run game. Struggles could be due to Walton and instability at RT, but difficult to say.
Walton (C): He is a rookie, but I think it is fair to say that being the worst starting center in the league gets you a C regardless. Gets no pressure in the run game at all, and gets walked backwards in pass blocking. The botched snap at the end of the Jets game seals the deal.
Beadles (B): Is getting better as a RT, still not good enough in run blocking, but the pass blocking is not to obad.
Hochstein (C): This guy should never actually be on the field, I believe the only reason he plays is because Daniels is the alternative.
Daniels (C): I would really like to invent a grade worse than C for Daniels, but it wouldn't be fair.
Olsen and Clark (O).

Chris · 11-01-2010, 11:57 AM

Doggcow · 11-01-2010, 12:04 PM

I did this last night, and this afternoon.

Houshyamama · 11-01-2010, 12:05 PM

have lots, want more

That One Guy · 11-01-2010, 12:06 PM

Yes, Please.

BlaK-Argentina · 11-01-2010, 12:10 PM

I wouldn't give Thomas an A but the rest is pretty much spot on.

Sir_Robin · 11-01-2010, 12:14 PM

Last night and lol at Blak who obviously didn't get any.

Popps · 11-01-2010, 12:14 PM

Cool thread. I think you should revise it to include D's and F's, just to keep it easier to follow... but a fun concept.

Also would be fun to see some guys like Vaughn graded. I think he's been a great pick-up for the ST's.

Oh, and I also like sex.

Popps · 11-01-2010, 12:15 PM

Oh, never mind. I'm assuming defensive grades are coming.

baja · 11-01-2010, 12:19 PM

what does Tebow have to do with sex?

Chris · 11-01-2010, 12:19 PM

I'd give Royal a B. I've given Moreno a C+.

gyldenlove · 11-01-2010, 12:43 PM

I do apologize for the thread title, I meant to edit it but lagged out and forgot.

gyldenlove · 11-01-2010, 01:15 PM

S:
Brian Dawkins (A): I am going to have to give him an A despite the injury, he is clearly the best safety we have and important to the defense as a whole.
Renaldo Hill (C): He is the biggest disappointment for me, I am not sure if it is Martindales system or what, but he plays very far back now and as a result is never close to making a play, the only chances he has had to make plays he has blown like the PI against the Jets.
Mcbath (O): Not a big enough sample to judge, has looked good in limited play and I think he should start next year if he can be healthy.
Bruton (O/A): Not much play time on defense, but solid on special teams, forced a fumble on a squib kick.

CB:
Bailey (A): Still the man, even with injuries he is a very good CB.
Goodman (B): I am giving him a pass on his play against the 49ers because he was clearly still hobbling and should never have played. This is a borderline A, but he has not played enough to deserve an A in my book.
Cox (A): Has had his ups and downs, but even in his downs he has been better than Al Smith was last year and in his ups he has been very good. Only disappointment was his failure as kick returner.
Jones (C): I think even I could complete a pass against him, he is awful, he is nowhere near the reciever to prevent completions and his tackling is not too hot either. Why we kept this guy I don't know.
Thompson (O/B): Has shown flashes in very limited time and should play over Jones, is good special teams as well.
Vaughn (O/A): Hasn't played defense at all I believe, but is our best special teamer hands down. He has made crucial tackles on returns, he has recovered fumbles and he is always the first gunner down the field.

LB:
DJ Williams (A): The linebacking group without Ayers and Dumervil begins and ends with Williams, he leads the team in sacks, tackles and pretty much everything else defensive. He still has a few odd moments, but he is overall playing very solid football this year and right now maybe the only defender who can look himself in the mirror.
Haggan (B): He just does not have the speed to stop the run to the outside or cover tight ends or backs. He is solid against the run and one of the reason our run defense on inside runs is not getting gouged to hell like our run defense to the outside.
Ayers (A): He was the best defender until he went down, he is head and shoulders above where he was last year against the run and pass, with his injury our pass rush died.
Hunter (A): Low expectations help him get an A, but he has really been better than we could hope, although he is very far from being Dumervil or Ayers. He does get a bit of pass rush from time to time and is generally responsible when we play a standard 3-4, when we switch to the 4-3 he often gets outmuscled and loses contain however.
Woodyard (O/B): We do miss him on special teams and in pass defense, but his body of work is not quite substantial enough for a defensive grade. I do think getting him back will help our nickel defense a lot.
Mays (O): Like Woodyard not enough work, and is too similar in playstyle and strengths to Haggan to see much time except on special teams where has had his good and bad days.
Moss (C): I really thought if for no other reason than the money he would finally show something. Moss hasn't used his speed at all and is definitely not strong enough to play the game the way Ayers does.
Alexander (O)

DL:
Williams (B): Tubbo is decent against the run, but he is nowhere near the force he used to be and creates no pass rush at all and is frequently blocked by just the center.
Mcbean (C): Has not looked good and lost his starting gig to Vickerson, did okay against the 49ers and may have turned a corner, but too early to tell. For now though he has been disappointing.
Bannan (C): Doesn't hold up well enough against the run and doesn't get in lanes often enough, may have benefited from playing with superior players in Baltimore more than we hoped.
Fields (B): Unfortunately he is the same type that Williams is, decent against the run but with no pass rush ability and easily single blocked too often.
Thomas (A): The only player who has truly exceeded expectations on the defensive front, he is no super man but he does create plays from time to time and has been earning increased play time.
Vickerson (B): Was a late addition who grabbed a starting spot with Mcbean struggling, has been decent but doesn't have the look of a longtime solution. I worry the play of the defensive front may be tied in with the overall defensive scheme which has changed from last year and seems to be not working well.

colonelbeef · 11-01-2010, 01:18 PM

too many A's and B's for a team averaging 19.2 ppg and 67.2 rushing yards per game with a 2-6 record.

Pony Boy · 11-01-2010, 01:33 PM

Don't you think if you're grading a QB that games won and points scored should factor in?

Broncosfreak_56 · 11-01-2010, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pony Boy

Don't you think if you're grading a QB that games won and points scored should factor in?

What more do you want/expect Orton to do? He is getting knocked around all day by our sieve offensive line and still averaging 300 yards. And there is only so much you can do without a run game.

Pony Boy · 11-01-2010, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Broncosfreak_56

What more do you want/expect Orton to do? He is getting knocked around all day by our sieve offensive line and still averaging 300 yards. And there is only so much you can do without a run game.

I expect him to find ways to win football games and to covert 300 yd passing games into points scored. We don't need a show pony we need a work horse.

gyldenlove · 11-01-2010, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pony Boy

I expect him to find ways to win football games and to covert 300 yd passing games into points scored. We don't need a show pony we need a work horse.

I grade the QB no different than any other position, I don't expect the QB to win games, I expect the team to win games. The only positional grade that would be affected by win-loss record would be head coach.

This frankly stupid idea that the QB is somehow responsible for winning and losing is one of the things that is wrong with football fans. Was it really the QB that got Chicago to the super bowl? Was it really Mark Sanchez who got the Jets to the AFC championship last year? Some times you have a QB who is so good he can win games the other parts of the team doesn't lose, but right now there isn't a single such QB in the league. Is Philip Rivers not a better QB than Mark Sanchez or Matt Cassel? by your logic the fact that Jets and Chiefs have won more games than the Chargers make Cassel and Sanchez better than Rivers, which I think most people will agree is laughable.

Goobzilla · 11-01-2010, 02:16 PM

Dawkins is a C for me. I think the end of the road is near. I still can't believe him & Champ stood there and watched Crabtree catch that wounded duck.

bendog · 11-01-2010, 02:19 PM

They're 2-6 and getting worse. Nobody gets a passing grade. Troy "canadian league" Smith had a higher passer rating than Orton!

Oakland NEVER BEAT DEN AT HOME LIKE THAT. NEVER. Not even in the dark days.

http://www.pro-football-reference.co...6711050den.htm

http://www.pro-football-reference.co...6811100den.htm

http://www.pro-football-reference.co...6910120den.htm

http://www.pro-football-reference.co...7010110rai.htm

And KC's coming to put a beat down on. Christ this sucks.

Swedish Extrovert · 11-01-2010, 02:20 PM

I'd give Walton a D and Maroney an F.

lostknight · 11-01-2010, 02:31 PM

Wow. A awful lot of good grades for a epic amount of fail.

bendog · 11-01-2010, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lostknight

Wow. A awful lot of good grades for a epic amount of fail.

it's a curve (-;

Broncosfreak_56 · 11-01-2010, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lostknight

Wow. A awful lot of good grades for a epic amount of fail.

You didn't read the grading system, did you. There are only A, B, and Cs. Its not like in school.

Pony Boy · 11-01-2010, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gyldenlove

I grade the QB no different than any other position, I don't expect the QB to win games, I expect the team to win games. The only positional grade that would be affected by win-loss record would be head coach.

This frankly stupid idea that the QB is somehow responsible for winning and losing is one of the things that is wrong with football fans. Was it really the QB that got Chicago to the super bowl? Was it really Mark Sanchez who got the Jets to the AFC championship last year? Some times you have a QB who is so good he can win games the other parts of the team doesn't lose, but right now there isn't a single such QB in the league. Is Philip Rivers not a better QB than Mark Sanchez or Matt Cassel? by your logic the fact that Jets and Chiefs have won more games than the Chargers make Cassel and Sanchez better than Rivers, which I think most people will agree is laughable.

Well, you could do a whole thread on the "it" factor and what it is but for years people have tried to figure out what separates the good NFL quarterbacks from the great ones. Physical talent is a must have of course but it goes much deeper than that, and the conclusions usually end up in some variation of the "it" factor. Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Brett Favre and Phillip Rivers have it. I don't see "it" in Kyle Orton.......

11-01-2010, 11:57 AM	#1
gyldenlove Ring of Famer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: London, ON Posts: 10,134 Adopt-a-Bronco: Spencer Larsen	Midterm grades Midterm grades for the entire roster. My system is quite easy: A, above reasonable expectations for that player/position B, acceptable C, did not meet expectations O, not enough material to judge on QB: Orton (A): Definitely surpassed expectations stat wise, has cooled off significantly and had a lot of problems on 3rd down and in the red zone, but it is not part of the real problem. Quinn and Tebow (O): Not much to say, Tebow is a gimmick player and Quinn is a clipboard holder. RB: Moreno (B): Between his injury and the lousy run blocking he has not met expectations, but he is the best RB on the team by some distance and the only one who should have continued employment into 2011 if and when that season starts. Maroney (C): He runs more yards lateraly than he does forwards or backwards, he has a nasty habbit of stopping just before he gets hit thereby never falling forward and in general tends to cost himself 1 or 2 yard at the end of almost every run. He is a non-factor on passing plays as he can't block or catch. Buckhalter (C): The best blocker, but has slowed down since last year and looks like he is at the end of his rope. FB: Larsen (A): He has caught the ball and in the limited play time he has recieved he improved the run game, benefits from very low expectations. TE: Graham (B): Is a nonfactor in the passing game, is almost always the 7th blocker or completely irrelevant as a catcher. Has not been a difference maker in the run game. Gronkowski (B): A blocking TE who sees limited play time but has done what could be expected really. Quinn (C): Has been surpassed by Gronkowski and his only hope of ever playing again for this team is Graham not resigning and the team not drafting or signing a TE with any form of pass catching ability. WR: Lloyd (A): Probably the biggest performer on the entire team, leads the league in yards, yards per game and recieving 1st downs and is 2nd among the leaders in yards per catch. Gaffney (B): Has met reasonable expectations but has not lived up to the season ending he had last year, is getting spelled by Thomas and looks like the likely candidate to be replaced by Thomas. Royal (A): Picked up his game from his disappointing 2009 season, has looked at home in the slot and is currently our best yards after catch guy by a huge margin. Injury has limited him somewhat or he would have better total stats than Gaffney. Thomas (A): In limited time has managed to make a difference both positively and negatively. Sat out all offseason and came from a simplified tripple option should not have contributed much at all. Costly fumbles mar what is a solid rookie campaign. Decker (O): Not enough play time to evaluate, has done some good things on special teams. Willis (O): Game day inactive. OL: Clady (B): The only offensive lineman who has kept up an acceptable level. Has not lived up to his rookie season, but with the injury that wasn't really expected. Harris (C): Between injury and getting replaced with Beadles this is about as below expectations as it gets. He was slotted to be one of the top RTs in the league, but is now one of the top bench warmers in the league. Kuper (C): Has not met his level at all, has given up more pressures and sacks than in the previous 2 years combined, consistently fails to get to movement in the run game. Struggles could be due to Walton and instability at RT, but difficult to say. Walton (C): He is a rookie, but I think it is fair to say that being the worst starting center in the league gets you a C regardless. Gets no pressure in the run game at all, and gets walked backwards in pass blocking. The botched snap at the end of the Jets game seals the deal. Beadles (B): Is getting better as a RT, still not good enough in run blocking, but the pass blocking is not to obad. Hochstein (C): This guy should never actually be on the field, I believe the only reason he plays is because Daniels is the alternative. Daniels (C): I would really like to invent a grade worse than C for Daniels, but it wouldn't be fair. Olsen and Clark (O). Last edited by gyldenlove; 11-01-2010 at 12:41 PM..

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11-01-2010, 11:57 AM	#2
Chris Millenium Scrooge McDuck Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 7,541 Adopt-a-Bronco: OrlandoFranklin	sex.

11-01-2010, 12:04 PM	#3
Doggcow Rebel Laughs At Unbelievers Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,340 Adopt-a-Bronco: Von Miller	I did this last night, and this afternoon.

11-01-2010, 12:05 PM	#4
Houshyamama I Make The Weather Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: San Diego Posts: 3,914 Adopt-a-Bronco: Brock Osweiler	have lots, want more

11-01-2010, 12:06 PM	#5
That One Guy Producer of Nonsense Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Sun and Beachville Posts: 14,042 Adopt-a-Bronco: None	Yes, Please.

11-01-2010, 12:10 PM	#6
BlaK-Argentina Pampita says... ... support your team! Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Mar del Plata, Argentina. Posts: 5,174 Adopt-a-Bronco: Eddie Royal	I wouldn't give Thomas an A but the rest is pretty much spot on.

11-01-2010, 12:14 PM	#7
Sir_Robin Veteran Armor Soiler Bravely taking to his feet... Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Camelot Posts: 405	Last night and lol at Blak who obviously didn't get any.

11-01-2010, 12:14 PM	#8
Popps TEAM FIRST. Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 29,792	Cool thread. I think you should revise it to include D's and F's, just to keep it easier to follow... but a fun concept. Also would be fun to see some guys like Vaughn graded. I think he's been a great pick-up for the ST's. Oh, and I also like sex.

11-01-2010, 12:15 PM	#9
Popps TEAM FIRST. Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 29,792	Oh, never mind. I'm assuming defensive grades are coming.

11-01-2010, 12:19 PM	#10
baja It is what it Is. Pay attention. Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: in a bunker Posts: 54,372 Adopt-a-Bronco: Julius Thomas	what does Tebow have to do with sex?

11-01-2010, 12:43 PM	#12
gyldenlove Ring of Famer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: London, ON Posts: 10,134 Adopt-a-Bronco: Spencer Larsen	I do apologize for the thread title, I meant to edit it but lagged out and forgot.

11-01-2010, 01:15 PM	#13
gyldenlove Ring of Famer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: London, ON Posts: 10,134 Adopt-a-Bronco: Spencer Larsen	S: Brian Dawkins (A): I am going to have to give him an A despite the injury, he is clearly the best safety we have and important to the defense as a whole. Renaldo Hill (C): He is the biggest disappointment for me, I am not sure if it is Martindales system or what, but he plays very far back now and as a result is never close to making a play, the only chances he has had to make plays he has blown like the PI against the Jets. Mcbath (O): Not a big enough sample to judge, has looked good in limited play and I think he should start next year if he can be healthy. Bruton (O/A): Not much play time on defense, but solid on special teams, forced a fumble on a squib kick. CB: Bailey (A): Still the man, even with injuries he is a very good CB. Goodman (B): I am giving him a pass on his play against the 49ers because he was clearly still hobbling and should never have played. This is a borderline A, but he has not played enough to deserve an A in my book. Cox (A): Has had his ups and downs, but even in his downs he has been better than Al Smith was last year and in his ups he has been very good. Only disappointment was his failure as kick returner. Jones (C): I think even I could complete a pass against him, he is awful, he is nowhere near the reciever to prevent completions and his tackling is not too hot either. Why we kept this guy I don't know. Thompson (O/B): Has shown flashes in very limited time and should play over Jones, is good special teams as well. Vaughn (O/A): Hasn't played defense at all I believe, but is our best special teamer hands down. He has made crucial tackles on returns, he has recovered fumbles and he is always the first gunner down the field. LB: DJ Williams (A): The linebacking group without Ayers and Dumervil begins and ends with Williams, he leads the team in sacks, tackles and pretty much everything else defensive. He still has a few odd moments, but he is overall playing very solid football this year and right now maybe the only defender who can look himself in the mirror. Haggan (B): He just does not have the speed to stop the run to the outside or cover tight ends or backs. He is solid against the run and one of the reason our run defense on inside runs is not getting gouged to hell like our run defense to the outside. Ayers (A): He was the best defender until he went down, he is head and shoulders above where he was last year against the run and pass, with his injury our pass rush died. Hunter (A): Low expectations help him get an A, but he has really been better than we could hope, although he is very far from being Dumervil or Ayers. He does get a bit of pass rush from time to time and is generally responsible when we play a standard 3-4, when we switch to the 4-3 he often gets outmuscled and loses contain however. Woodyard (O/B): We do miss him on special teams and in pass defense, but his body of work is not quite substantial enough for a defensive grade. I do think getting him back will help our nickel defense a lot. Mays (O): Like Woodyard not enough work, and is too similar in playstyle and strengths to Haggan to see much time except on special teams where has had his good and bad days. Moss (C): I really thought if for no other reason than the money he would finally show something. Moss hasn't used his speed at all and is definitely not strong enough to play the game the way Ayers does. Alexander (O) DL: Williams (B): Tubbo is decent against the run, but he is nowhere near the force he used to be and creates no pass rush at all and is frequently blocked by just the center. Mcbean (C): Has not looked good and lost his starting gig to Vickerson, did okay against the 49ers and may have turned a corner, but too early to tell. For now though he has been disappointing. Bannan (C): Doesn't hold up well enough against the run and doesn't get in lanes often enough, may have benefited from playing with superior players in Baltimore more than we hoped. Fields (B): Unfortunately he is the same type that Williams is, decent against the run but with no pass rush ability and easily single blocked too often. Thomas (A): The only player who has truly exceeded expectations on the defensive front, he is no super man but he does create plays from time to time and has been earning increased play time. Vickerson (B): Was a late addition who grabbed a starting spot with Mcbean struggling, has been decent but doesn't have the look of a longtime solution. I worry the play of the defensive front may be tied in with the overall defensive scheme which has changed from last year and seems to be not working well.

11-01-2010, 01:18 PM	#14
colonelbeef Lets be friend Elway is the new Jerry West Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: New York, NY Posts: 3,860 Adopt-a-Bronco: Derek Wolfe	too many A's and B's for a team averaging 19.2 ppg and 67.2 rushing yards per game with a 2-6 record.

11-01-2010, 01:33 PM	#15
Pony Boy "Whoa Nellie" Rub some dirt on it Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 6,379 Adopt-a-Bronco: mellon head	Don't you think if you're grading a QB that games won and points scored should factor in?

11-01-2010, 02:16 PM	#19
Goobzilla Lights Out B*h! BA-ZING!!** Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Wellington Posts: 6,530 Adopt-a-Bronco: Mitch Erickson	Dawkins is a C for me. I think the end of the road is near. I still can't believe him & Champ stood there and watched Crabtree catch that wounded duck.

11-01-2010, 02:19 PM	#20
bendog Marginally Continent David Bowens, he'd be an upgrade Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Folsom Prison Posts: 19,935 Adopt-a-Bronco: David Bowens	They're 2-6 and getting worse. Nobody gets a passing grade. Troy "canadian league" Smith had a higher passer rating than Orton! Oakland NEVER BEAT DEN AT HOME LIKE THAT. NEVER. Not even in the dark days. http://www.pro-football-reference.co...6711050den.htm http://www.pro-football-reference.co...6811100den.htm http://www.pro-football-reference.co...6910120den.htm http://www.pro-football-reference.co...7010110rai.htm And KC's coming to put a beat down on. Christ this sucks.

11-01-2010, 02:20 PM	#21
Swedish Extrovert President of the Universe Formerly known as mightysmurf Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Highlands Ranch Posts: 15,118 Adopt-a-Bronco: Joel Dreesen	I'd give Walton a D and Maroney an F.

11-01-2010, 02:31 PM	#22
lostknight In The Arena ohwaitwtf Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,362 Adopt-a-Bronco: Tim Tebow	Wow. A awful lot of good grades for a epic amount of fail.