The Orange Mane -  a Denver Broncos Fan Community  

Go Back   The Orange Mane - a Denver Broncos Fan Community > Orange Mane Discussion > Orange Mane Central Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Chat Room Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-14-2010, 10:31 PM   #1
ZachKC
For The Glory Of The City
 
ZachKC's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 9,852

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Eddie Kennison
Default Champ Bailey has ceded the floor

Champ Bailey has ceded the floor

A new wave of CBs -- Jammer, Flowers and even Cromartie -- are emerging as elite


Joyner By KC Joyner



It was 29 years ago this week that the NFL saw one of the most notable regular-season games in league history. Bill Walsh's San Francisco 49ers, a team that had won 10 games in the previous three seasons combined, were hosting a Dallas Cowboys squad that had played in back-to-back conference championship games the previous two years.

Very few -- if any -- experts gave San Francisco a chance at winning the game, but they did more than post a victory. Their 45-14 shellacking of the Cowboys proved to Walsh's players that they were capable of beating any team in the league.

It also stands out because it was one of the quietest changing-of-the-guard moments in league history; no one saw that this game was the launching pad for one of the most famed dynasties in football history.

It comes to mind now because we might be seeing a similar quiet changing of the guard this season in the realm of AFC Pro Bowl cornerbacks. That may come as a surprise, since last year's AFC Pro Bowl cornerback trio -- Darrelle Revis, Nnamdi Asomugha and Champ Bailey -- could lay a claim to being maybe the most talented coverage triumvirate ever.

As true as that last statement might be when referring to the whole of their careers, there are multiple metric reasons that show these three aren't playing to the caliber of their reputations. In addition, there are three other AFC cornerbacks whose high level of performance could end up vaulting them over any one, or even all, of the aforementioned all-stars.

Let's begin by looking at Bailey. He was recently in the news because his contract-extension talks with the Broncos hit a standstill. The two sides were said to be close to making a deal before the Broncos stepped back and decided to resume talks later.

Bailey has said he is disappointed in the team for doing this, but the Broncos have every right to be just as disappointed in his play this year. Bailey has given up 199 yards on the 21 passes thrown his way through five games. That equates to a 9.5 yards-per-attempt (YPA) mark. To put that into perspective, a YPA of 9 or more yards at season's end will normally place a player in the bottom one-third of the league in that category.

In the AFC West, Asomugha and Bailey are giving way to Flowers and Jammer.

This is probably why Denver's brain trust is holding back on the long-term extension; they want to see if this is an anomaly or the beginning of the downside of his career.


Asomugha is known as a player who isn't thrown at (his 25 targets in 2009 set the target qualifying floor for cornerbacks), but his problem is that his YPA on those aerials is quite high. Over the past 21 games, Asomugha has given up 339 yards on 37 passes directed his way. That calculates to a 9.2 YPA, which is, as noted above, quite unacceptable.


Revis gets something of a pass because his hamstring injury is why his play is off the mark this year, but it is worth noting that if he doesn't get back to his 2009 form before season's end, he will have only notched one truly dominant year in four NFL campaigns. That is not to say he will not return to form in 2011, but rather to note that Revis Island hasn't always been a barren stretch of land for opposing offenses.

Now let's move onto the cornerbacks who look to be ready to dethrone these coverage kings.

Let's start with Brandon Flowers. His 2010 coverage numbers have been simply phenomenal thus far. Flowers has been targeted 31 times and has allowed only 81 yards on those throws. That equals a ridiculously low 2.6 YPA, a number that is a full yard less than the eye-popping 3.6 YPA Revis posted last year. If he maintains anything close to this pace for the rest of the season, he should be a front-runner for both the Pro Bowl and All-Pro awards.

Next up is Quentin Jammer. Jammer isn't typically thought of as an elite cornerback, but he was one of only nine cornerbacks to finish in the top 30 in YPA in both 2008 and 2009. His 5.2 YPA thus far in 2010 is better than he posted in either of those two seasons, so he looks to be on pace to equal or better his ranking this year.

Last up is Antonio Cromartie. The reason he makes this list is that he has taken Revis' place as the crux of the Jets' defense. Rex Ryan funnels as many passes as he can through his best cornerback, and if that player can't hold up, Ryan's defense can collapse.

Cromartie's 7.2 YPA certainly is a drop-off from Revis' 3.6 total last season, but it has been achieved on 47 targets. Prorate that over a 16-game season and it would equal 150 targets. To put that into perspective, the highest target total any cornerback saw in 2009 was 102.

Cromartie is on pace to top that mark by about 50 percent, yet his YPA is still holding up. That is a more than adequate reason to consider him a strong contender for a Pro Bowl nomination.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/insid...26id%3d5681251
ZachKC is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 10-14-2010, 10:51 PM   #2
BroncoDoug
Ring of Famer
 
BroncoDoug's Avatar
 
R.I.P. D-Will and D-Nash

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Moline, IL
Posts: 2,833

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Von Miller
Default

Was here a sell on drugs this week or something?
BroncoDoug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 10:52 PM   #3
ZachKC
For The Glory Of The City
 
ZachKC's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 9,852

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Eddie Kennison
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by McBronco_Doug View Post
Was here a sell on drugs this week or something?
What?
ZachKC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 10:53 PM   #4
BlaK-Argentina
Pampita says...
 
BlaK-Argentina's Avatar
 
... support your team!

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Villa La Angostura
Posts: 5,104
Default

Champ is playing at an All-Pro level, yet again.
BlaK-Argentina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 10:56 PM   #5
UberBroncoMan
Your Local Nostradamus
 
UberBroncoMan's Avatar
 
Wut

Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 7,999

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Nathaniel Irvig
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZachKC View Post
By KC Joyner
UberBroncoMan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 10:59 PM   #6
Rulon Velvet Jones
You're not really here.
 
Rulon Velvet Jones's Avatar
 
Tight Butthole

Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 6,683

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Rent-A-DC
Default

As though anyone would prefer to have Flowers or Jammer on their team instead of Asomugha or Bailey.

Get out of here with that Flowers-Revis mess. What a crock of crap.
Rulon Velvet Jones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:02 PM   #7
ZachKC
For The Glory Of The City
 
ZachKC's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 9,852

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Eddie Kennison
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by McRulon McVelvet McJones View Post
As though anyone would prefer to have Flowers or Jammer on their team instead of Asomugha or Bailey.

Get out of here with that Flowers-Revis mess. What a crock of crap.
Bailey? Absolutely. A young up and coming talent compared to Bailey who is starting to decline?

Funny you were talking about building a franchise in another thread. Anyone building a franchise wouldn't hesitate a second before choosing Flowers over Bailey.
ZachKC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:06 PM   #8
Zoobie
Love Machine
 
Zoobie's Avatar
 
The John Fox trot

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Portland,OR
Posts: 461

Adopt-a-Bronco:
David Bruton
Default

My eyes>Stats. Having said that, I think Flowers is becoming a phenomenal corner.
Zoobie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:08 PM   #9
ZachKC
For The Glory Of The City
 
ZachKC's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 9,852

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Eddie Kennison
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoobie View Post
My eyes>Stats. Having said that, I think Flowers is becoming a phenomenal corner.
I have absolutely nothing bad to say about Bailey...awesome guy...awesome player. I do think he is losing a step or two.
ZachKC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:10 PM   #10
broncocalijohn
Famer of Rings
 
broncocalijohn's Avatar
 
I said Do It!

Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Lake Forest, Orange County, Calif.
Posts: 22,421

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Simon Fletcher
Default

What is great about Brandon Flowers is that not only does he play great defense but his solo album with the hit Crossfire is burning up the charts.
broncocalijohn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:12 PM   #11
ZachKC
For The Glory Of The City
 
ZachKC's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 9,852

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Eddie Kennison
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by broncocalijohn View Post
What is great about Brandon Flowers is that not only does he play great defense but his solo album with the hit Crossfire is burning up the charts.
Wah?

Hahaha,

ZachKC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:16 PM   #12
Los Broncos
Broncos Country
 
Los Broncos's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Eastern Utah
Posts: 18,738

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Ryan Clady
Default

So Champ will be traded most likely?
Los Broncos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:31 PM   #13
OBF1
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Orlando, Florida
Posts: 15,652

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Marvin Austin
Default

This message is hidden because ZachKC is on your ignore list.
OBF1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:35 PM   #14
ZachKC
For The Glory Of The City
 
ZachKC's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 9,852

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Eddie Kennison
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBF1 View Post
This message is hidden because ZachKC is on your ignore list.
Ha, some can dish it out but not take it.
ZachKC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:46 PM   #15
Champagne Powder
Seasoned Veteran
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 313

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZachKC View Post
I have absolutely nothing bad to say about Bailey...awesome guy...awesome player. I do think he is losing a step or two.
Obviously you do have something bad to say.

Why don't you stand firm on one point rather than being wishy washy?
Champagne Powder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2010, 11:47 PM   #16
ZachKC
For The Glory Of The City
 
ZachKC's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 9,852

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Eddie Kennison
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Champagne Powder View Post
Obviously you do have something bad to say.

Why don't you stand firm on one point rather than being wishy washy?
I don't see it as a criticism. Just seems like reality. The guy is getting older.
ZachKC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 12:11 AM   #17
footstepsfrom#27
helmet to helmet hitter
 
footstepsfrom#27's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Arlington, TX
Posts: 16,144

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Joe Mays
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZachKC View Post
Bailey? Absolutely. A young up and coming talent compared to Bailey who is starting to decline?

Funny you were talking about building a franchise in another thread. Anyone building a franchise wouldn't hesitate a second before choosing Flowers over Bailey.
Hogwash.

Maybe because of age alone, but Champ is and has been both THE elite CB in the game and a legitimate HOF player. It remains to be seen what any of these other dudes are and whether they are flash in the pan types or not, and I suspect playing behind Denver's front 7 neither would impress like Bailey does.
footstepsfrom#27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 12:13 AM   #18
footstepsfrom#27
helmet to helmet hitter
 
footstepsfrom#27's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Arlington, TX
Posts: 16,144

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Joe Mays
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZachKC View Post
I don't see it as a criticism. Just seems like reality. The guy is getting older.
I've been hearing that for several years...32 is not old for an NFL CB...it's a player's prime in fact.
footstepsfrom#27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 12:13 AM   #19
Champagne Powder
Seasoned Veteran
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 313

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZachKC View Post
I don't see it as a criticism. Just seems like reality. The guy is getting older.
A guy with so called eroding skills should be criticized.

It's wrong to just assume a player is losing just going solely off his DOB. You have to give me more than he's old.

K.C. Joyner may have a valid point, but I still think Bailey has shown to be worthy of being a top 5-7 cornerback in football.

Going by McDaniels' defensive philosophy, our defensive backs are being asked to eliminate all big passing plays. McDaniels wants to force opponents into a drive where they have to convert multiple set of downs in order to score and have to rely on short-to-intermediate pass completions to do so.

Bailey last year did not give up a touchdown reception and our pass defense only allowed one 100-yard receiver the whole season.

It's no secret that Bailey will give up a first down reception here and there, but his job is not to blanket and shutdown receivers in our scheme. He's being asked to eliminate the big passing play at all costs, which makes him more vulnerable to surrendering a 15-yard pass at times.

But ask Reggie Wayne and Anquan Boldin if they had it easy going against Champ this year. I still think he is playing exceptionally well despite the article you posted.
Champagne Powder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 12:30 AM   #20
ZachKC
For The Glory Of The City
 
ZachKC's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 9,852

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Eddie Kennison
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Champagne Powder View Post

K.C. Joyner may have a valid point, but I still think Bailey has shown to be worthy of being a top 5-7 cornerback in football.
I don't disagree.
ZachKC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 01:25 AM   #21
Zoobie
Love Machine
 
Zoobie's Avatar
 
The John Fox trot

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Portland,OR
Posts: 461

Adopt-a-Bronco:
David Bruton
Default

It's all relative honestly. Revis plays on one of the best defenses in the NFL, if he didn't I doubt he'd be getting the hype(overhype) that he does. Champ has a much larger body of work, and plays at an elite level regardless of the talent around him. Again, I hate seeing stupid stats like this because you have no clue what other factors were at play. When they say he was a target, what do they mean? Are we talking in 1v1 man coverage? Was he making up for someone else by covering their zone for them, only to be a step behind? Is that his fault? There is way too much that goes into it. I like to see players pass the eye test, and one great season isn't enough for me to crown Revis as some godsend to the defensive backfield. Of course, all we'll hear all year is how his hammy hurts as he gets burned by a 35 year old man.
Zoobie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 02:13 AM   #22
Blueflame
Miss Congeniality
 
Blueflame's Avatar
 
Welcome to Peyton's Place

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: in my cups... lol
Posts: 33,738

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Randy Gradishar
Default

The only decent team the Chefs have beaten is the Chargers. The Raiders did that too. Just sayin'.

You can't seriously be bragging about CB play in wins over the Browns and 9'ers, can you?
Blueflame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 02:23 AM   #23
The Joker
Ring of Famer
 
The Joker's Avatar
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 3,283

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

I like Flowers, he's been a very good player for a while now.

He has the potential to be elite, but you can't crown him based on what we've seen so far this year. The rain shut down the Charger offense, and the 49ers and Browns passing games are pathetic. Clearly Flowers had a good day against Indy, and if he keeps consistently playing like that against that quality of opposition he'll get his dues and rightfully so.

The inclusion of Jammer in this article is downright bizarre btw. He's been a very good CB for a long time, but he's 31 now and it's hard to imagine he's going to all of a sudden take a massive leap forward and become an elite player in the league.

As for Cromartie, he's always had insane talent. He just has holes in his game as well and will get beaten as often as he makes the big play. The Jets defense is perfect for him, he'll still give up some plays but that front seven will give him plenty of chance to make more than enough to compensate.
The Joker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 02:46 AM   #24
Bob's your Information Minister
Chiefs > Broncos
 

Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 26,145

Adopt-a-Bronco:
CHRIS KUPER!!!
Default

Flowers was near the top of the league in passes defensed and stop rate a year ago.

He's a ****ing stud.

And he tackles incredibly well. Did I mention he had 5 picks last season with NO pass rush?

By the way, the 49ers have the 11th ranked passing attack, hardly dog****.
Bob's your Information Minister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 02:53 AM   #25
eddie mac
Ireland's No1 Bronco
 
eddie mac's Avatar
 
Eddie Mac 87 gone but never forgott

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: IRELAND
Posts: 16,850

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Rod Smith
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZachKC View Post
I have absolutely nothing bad to say about Bailey...awesome guy...awesome player. I do think he is losing a step or two.
Maybe just maybe he has to cover WR a little longer than your awesome duo. People seem to forget that the Broncos pass rush is officially in the tank with Doom on the sidelines and now Ayers.

Jammer seems to find it a little easier to cover with Phillips putting opposing QB's on their ass, same for Cromartie with Ellis and Taylor helping him out and Hali dominating for KC. Broncos have 5 total sacks in the season and god knows how far behind the league they are with total QB pressures. Their DB's should be applauded for keeping passing attacks at an average level.

See the problem for me with some analysts is that they never look at the bigger picture.

BTW this isn't a knock on Carr or Flowers who IMO are stars of the future and maybe even now in this league.

Last edited by eddie mac; 10-15-2010 at 02:55 AM..
eddie mac is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:21 PM.


Denver Broncos