The Orange Mane -  a Denver Broncos Fan Community  

Go Back   The Orange Mane - a Denver Broncos Fan Community > Orange Mane Discussion > Orange Mane Central Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Chat Room Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-15-2010, 04:07 AM   #1
The MVPlaya
Denver Broncos
 
The MVPlaya's Avatar
 
out with the old, IN WITH THE NEW

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,383
Default "Slippery slope for a 'Hoodie"

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/comme...=howard/100414

Slippery slope for a 'Hoodie' wannabe
Denver coach Josh McDaniels is following the Bill Belichick template, without the wins

Howard By Johnette Howard
Special to ESPN.com
Archive

Well, that oughta show Brandon Marshall.

[+] EnlargeJosh McDaniel
Doug Pensinger/Getty ImagesJosh McDaniels was overjoyed at Brandon Marshall's game-winning catch against the Cowboys in October. The joy didn't last.

Here's the bottom line on the All-Diva wideout's denouement in Denver after he tested the authority of hard-line Broncos coach Josh McDaniels until their differences became untenable: Despite making an admirable 101 catches last season, Marshall was suspended, maligned, accused of exaggerating an injury and ultimately benched by McDaniels for Denver's regular-season finale against Kansas City, a game the Broncos had to win to salvage a playoff spot and didn't, thereby finishing off a horrible late-season swoon that Marshall now won't have to talk about when he reports to training camp this July.

Because he was just traded.

To the fast-improving Miami Dolphins. And handed a four-year, $47.5 million contract that makes him the highest-paid receiver in NFL history.

McDaniels had better be right about this. There's really nothing more complicated to handicapping this trade -- and probably McDaniels' future in Denver -- than that.

McDaniels will get away with trading quarterback Jay Cutler and Marshall, the All-Pro duo that was supposed to blossom into Denver's version of Brady-to-Moss that McDaniels worked with in New England as long as it works.

McDaniels is even right to argue that the 2010 and 2011 second-round picks Denver got for Marshall are a pretty good deal in the current market, considering that Pittsburgh got only a fifth-round pick from the Jets for its star wideout, Santonio Holmes, and Baltimore coughed up only third- and fourth-round picks to Arizona for Anquan Boldin.

The snag is that all the talk in Denver now about "someday" is a hard sell. Marshall is better than Boldin, Holmes or anyone Denver is likely to get in the draft. And Cutler, erratic as he was for Chicago last season, is still better right now than Kyle Orton or Brady Quinn, the replacement quarterbacks McDaniels has traded for since he and Cutler had their falling-out in March 2009.

Cutler was sent to the Bears a month later for Orton and three draft picks (two of them first-rounders). McDaniels and Marshall began their jousting in training camp. Before long, McDaniels had a tense relationship with tight end Tony Scheffler, whom McDaniels also benched for that must-win regular-season finale against Kansas City.

Brandon Marshall
Doug Pensinger/Getty ImagesMarshall caught 25 TD passes in four years for the Broncos. Does the addition-by-subtraction thinking really apply in his case?

That's a lot of falling-outs for anyone, especially a 33-year-old rookie NFL head coach whose team started fast last season but faded to a miserable 2-6 down the stretch, a swoon Broncos followers still dwell on in places such as FireJoshMcDanielsNow.com, a Web site that bills itself as "A Denver Broncos blog to keep an eye on new coach Josh McDaniels, who presided over a terrible first season that ended in a monumental collapse."

To quote a few posts: "What the hell is going on out there? Another Bill Belichick Clone Control Freak Strikes Again. What does Belichick Wannabe Moronic Control Freak Josh McDaniels Do?

"Hoodie Wannabe."

The wannabe charge comes up a lot.

See, McDaniels' challenge in Denver isn't just that he's peddling a long-term plan to a rabid football town yearning for short-term results. And his problem isn't just failing to get along with elite players, or having to sell the Broncos' rabid fan base (and perhaps even significant segments of his own locker room by now) on the idea that the slew of draft picks the Broncos have amassed in next week's draft is going to pay off, or the premise that a passing attack of Quinn-to-A Player to Be Named Later will turn out better than 10 years of Cutler-to-Marshall would have.

McDaniels has that Hoodie Problem, too.

Until he wins games like his Patriots mentor, Bill Belichick, McDaniels will continue to fight the wannabe rap. And he's not the first guy.

If you haven't noticed, the jury is still out on whether the Belichick formula works for anyone not named Belichick. The first three Belichick assistants who left the Patriots after their Super Bowl runs all flopped in their first head-coaching jobs -- Romeo Crennel with the Browns, Charlie Weis at Notre Dame, and Eric Mangini (first with the Jets, then again in his brutal first season in Cleveland).

Of the three, Mangini was the one who most devoutly copied Belichick's Kremlin-like approach (even after their downright Oedipal clash that turned into Spygate). He also wound up the most despised by his own organization. Weis was a close second.

But maybe all four Belichick disciples -- McDaniels included -- would have been smart to recognize that Belichick's formula didn't even work for Belichick at his first head-coaching stop.

[+] EnlargeBrandon Marshall and Josh McDaniels
Larry French/Getty ImagesMore often than not, Marshall and McDaniels had trouble seeing eye to eye.

Now, you could argue that's because Belichick didn't have Brady then. Or you could say what Belichick says: Mistakes were made. The moral might be that it's hard to demand the sort of respect and fealty from players that Belichick does before you have won like he has.

McDaniels has styled himself as a hard-liner, too -- which is another hard sell considering he looks more like a baby-faced coxswain for Harvard Eight than the head of a half-billion-dollar operation. Still, it's hard to ignore that Belichick seems to treat McDaniels differently from the other head coaches he has spun off. Mangini might as well be dead to Belichick now. When Crennel and Weis were cut loose from their jobs within the past year, Belichick didn't take his former coordinators back into the Patriots' fold.

Yet when McDaniels and the Broncos knocked off New England in Denver early last season -- a nail-biting win that sent McDaniels galloping and fist-pumping around the stadium with that copycat hoodie of his flapping in the breeze -- Belichick wasn't hacked off at all.

He actually made a point of going to the Broncos locker room and finding McDaniels to personally congratulate him.

Belichick seems to see something different, maybe even great, in McDaniels. Someday -- there's that word again -- maybe the rest of us will see it, too.

Johnette Howard is a contributing columnist to ESPN.com and the author of "The Rivals: Chris Evert vs. Martina Navratilova, Their Epic Duels and Extraordinary Friendship." She can be reached at jphinbox@yahoo.com.




Please blow up her email and show some dignity as Broncos fans...

jphinbox@yahoo.com
The MVPlaya is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 04-15-2010, 04:16 AM   #2
eddie mac
Ireland's No1 Bronco
 
eddie mac's Avatar
 
Eddie Mac 87 gone but never forgott

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: IRELAND
Posts: 16,621

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Rod Smith
Default

Oh another ****ing female football analyst.

Stick to the first 4 letters love.
eddie mac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 04:21 AM   #3
Bronco Rob
Ring of Famer
 
Bronco Rob's Avatar
 
The Alpha & The Omega

Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,746

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Kush & Irsay
Default

Oh No!

Disney sports has an has an opinion.....


"Losers live in the past. Winners learn from the past and enjoy working in the present toward the future.


Stick that in yer pipe an smoke it.....


/thread
Bronco Rob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 04:26 AM   #4
The MVPlaya
Denver Broncos
 
The MVPlaya's Avatar
 
out with the old, IN WITH THE NEW

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,383
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronco Rob View Post
Oh No!

Disney sports has an has an opinion.....


"Losers live in the past. Winners learn from the past and enjoy working in the present toward the future.


Stick that in yer pipe an smoke it.....


/thread
Still bitter about how I exposed your ass as being an idiot?

As far as your quote that has absolutely nothing to do with this thread, the article, or anything related to what's going on presently (thus proving you aren't exactly the sharpest knife in the set)...

I had a very similar sentence in post 2 hours ago.

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthr...61#post2805961

Quote:
Originally Posted by The MVPlaya
Moving forward... it's about progression.
One step ahead of you, son.
The MVPlaya is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 04:52 AM   #5
chrisp
Friend of the unsung
 
chrisp's Avatar
 
Not into the football......yet

Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: London UK
Posts: 1,326

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Danny Trevathan
Default

You see, much as it has become an article of faith within the media to the point where its considered unquestionable, I just don't buy this "mcD is copying Belichick" line...

What I see is players questioning a young coach's authority and forcing him into public confrontations. Every time i see and hear Josh in the media he comes accross as passionate and determined, but open and approachable at the same time - i just don't see the tyrant that everybody talks about.

Perhaps becuase he is so high-pitched and babyfaced everybody takes umbrage with him excercising the basic minimum level of authority and control that a head coach is expected to maintain?

What - is he not allowed to discipline players untill he's won a superbowl?

Should he have said to Cutler "You are above trading and it was wrong of me to even have contemplated a trade - I'll make that statement public if you want."?

Should he have said to Marshall "You want a new contract? OK, never mind your off-field issues and the fact that you're a restricted free-agent, have as much money as you want - and take a practice off if you feel like it."?

Some people looked at McDaniels and thought that was exactly how he would have responded. They expected to be able to push the guy around and that is what's forced him to stand firm. But standing firm doesn't sit well with the public image of the kid coach in the hoodie. So now he's got this reputation as a mini-hitler.....

I think you'll find that NO head coach in the league would have been able to make the concessions to Cutler et al he was asked to and still maintain his authority and do his job. the head coach has to be in charge - its not a funtion of McDaniels psyche or Belichicks style, its a function of the job of a head coach in the national football league. If players choose to question that they must be faced down, and if they can't be tamed they must be shipped. That's the only way that McDaniels will ensure that it is HIS vision for the team which is implemented, and not his vision watered down by the demands of high-profile players..
chrisp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 04:53 AM   #6
watermock
"Hoodie Jr"
 
watermock's Avatar
 
"Hug me!"

Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Hot Springs, Ouachitah
Posts: 76,813
Default

The biatch is wrong, because, ya know, the biatch is allways wrong.

How amusing,.
watermock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 04:58 AM   #7
watermock
"Hoodie Jr"
 
watermock's Avatar
 
"Hug me!"

Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Hot Springs, Ouachitah
Posts: 76,813
Default

Quote:
"Hoodie Wannabe."
watermock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 04:58 AM   #8
ColoradoDarin
Not Too Shabby Poster
 
ColoradoDarin's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: St Augustine, FL
Posts: 7,427

Adopt-a-Bronco:
T J Ward
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisp View Post
You see, much as it has become an article of faith within the media to the point where its considered unquestionable, I just don't buy this "mcD is copying Belichick" line...

What I see is players questioning a young coach's authority and forcing him into public confrontations. Every time i see and hear Josh in the media he comes accross as passionate and determined, but open and approachable at the same time - i just don't see the tyrant that everybody talks about.

Perhaps becuase he is so high-pitched and babyfaced everybody takes umbrage with him excercising the basic minimum level of authority and control that a head coach is expected to maintain?

What - is he not allowed to discipline players untill he's won a superbowl?

Should he have said to Cutler "You are above trading and it was wrong of me to even have contemplated a trade - I'll make that statement public if you want."?

Should he have said to Marshall "You want a new contract? OK, never mind your off-field issues and the fact that you're a restricted free-agent, have as much money as you want - and take a practice off if you feel like it."?

Some people looked at McDaniels and thought that was exactly how he would have responded. They expected to be able to push the guy around and that is what's forced him to stand firm. But standing firm doesn't sit well with the public image of the kid coach in the hoodie. So now he's got this reputation as a mini-hitler.....

I think you'll find that NO head coach in the league would have been able to make the concessions to Cutler et al he was asked to and still maintain his authority and do his job. the head coach has to be in charge - its not a funtion of McDaniels psyche or Belichicks style, its a function of the job of a head coach in the national football league. If players choose to question that they must be faced down, and if they can't be tamed they must be shipped. That's the only way that McDaniels will ensure that it is HIS vision for the team which is implemented, and not his vision watered down by the demands of high-profile players..
This.

ALL this.
ColoradoDarin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 05:03 AM   #9
watermock
"Hoodie Jr"
 
watermock's Avatar
 
"Hug me!"

Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Hot Springs, Ouachitah
Posts: 76,813
Default

[QUOTE][ think you'll find that NO head coach in the league would have been able to make the concessions to Cutler et al he was asked to and still maintain his authority and do his job. the head coach has to be in charge - its not a funtion of McDaniels psyche or Belichicks style, its a function of the job of a head coach in the national football league. If players choose to question that they must be faced down, and if they can't be tamed they must be shipped. That's the only way that McDaniels will ensure that it is HIS vision for the team which is implemented, and not his vision watered down by the demands of high-profile players..

/QUOTE]

How amusing.
watermock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 05:06 AM   #10
TheReverend
www.PatrickTurley.org
 
TheReverend's Avatar
 
Not. Too. Shabby.

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 36,603

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Mike Shanahan
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by eddie mac View Post
Oh another ****ing female football analyst.

Stick to the first 4 letters love.
At first I was like, "foot"? Then my eyes widened and I lol'd.
TheReverend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 05:07 AM   #11
chrisp
Friend of the unsung
 
chrisp's Avatar
 
Not into the football......yet

Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: London UK
Posts: 1,326

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Danny Trevathan
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by watermock View Post
How amusing.
Wow - such searing insight. I'm really chastened by your wisdom in the face of my ill-thought-out ramblings....





(DAMMIT where's that sarcasm smilie.......?)
chrisp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 05:14 AM   #12
Dedhed
Ring of Famer
 
Dedhed's Avatar
 
Fare thee well

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Earth
Posts: 10,160

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Q Smith
Default

I don't get the "someday" take. In his first year we saw zero drop-off in wins and losses in the transition from Shanahan, so I'm not sure how you make the argument that the fans are going to have to struggle through a torturous period to get to someday.

Someday has already arrived, and the present and future look pretty bright. "Someday" would be better used to describe Shanahan's last 10 years in Denver. "Someday we'll get back to the playoffs and make a SB run."
Dedhed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 05:32 AM   #13
dbfan21
Broncos Fan in Florida
 
dbfan21's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 2,174

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Pat Bowlen
Default

Did you see her picture on ESPN? Good Lord! It's a dude with a wig on. Where the heck do they find these people?
dbfan21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 05:38 AM   #14
TotallyScrewed
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,637
Default

You're right. Someday has arrived. No more excuses. Improve over 8-8. No more total collapses allowed.

The past is past and the future looms large.

A head coach has got to be in charge, no doubt. A head coach has got to be smart and at this level...one mistake can break you. We won't know until the year plays out but McD and Bowlen have set this year up to be a huge turning point. There's no room for "steady as she goes"..."a couple of minor tweeks here and there". They've made their "locker room adjustment" and it had better pay dividends.
TotallyScrewed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 05:39 AM   #15
watermock
"Hoodie Jr"
 
watermock's Avatar
 
"Hug me!"

Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Hot Springs, Ouachitah
Posts: 76,813
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbfan21 View Post
Did you see her picture on ESPN? Good Lord! It's a dude with a wig on. Where the heck do they find these people?

Jesus.


You bought it?

This team is so ****ed up noone knows up from down.

That is a FACT.
watermock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 05:40 AM   #16
LRtagger
Ring of Famer
 
LRtagger's Avatar
 
You know noothin

Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,723

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

LRtagger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 06:12 AM   #17
DenverBrit
Just hanging out.
 
DenverBrit's Avatar
 
Got a breath mint??

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,304

Adopt-a-Bronco:
The Team
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LRtagger View Post
Johnette Howard is a contributing columnist to ESPN.com and the author of "The Rivals: Chris Evert vs. Martina Navratilova, Their Epic Duels and Extraordinary Friendship."

She should stick to 'Romance novels.'
DenverBrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 06:14 AM   #18
Man-Goblin
Giving You The Business
 
Man-Goblin's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Huntersville, NC
Posts: 5,957

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Mister Cobble
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LRtagger View Post
That's a man, baby!!!
Man-Goblin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 06:19 AM   #19
scorpio
Cubicle Pimp
 
scorpio's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,500
Default

I'm 12 and what is a b**** slam
scorpio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 06:48 AM   #20
NYC Bronco
Solid Starter
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 152

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheReverend View Post
At first I was like, "foot"? Then my eyes widened and I lol'd.

same here
NYC Bronco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 06:52 AM   #21
Gob
Solid Starter
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 151

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisp View Post
You see, much as it has become an article of faith within the media to the point where its considered unquestionable, I just don't buy this "mcD is copying Belichick" line...

What I see is players questioning a young coach's authority and forcing him into public confrontations. Every time i see and hear Josh in the media he comes accross as passionate and determined, but open and approachable at the same time - i just don't see the tyrant that everybody talks about.

Perhaps becuase he is so high-pitched and babyfaced everybody takes umbrage with him excercising the basic minimum level of authority and control that a head coach is expected to maintain?

What - is he not allowed to discipline players untill he's won a superbowl?

Should he have said to Cutler "You are above trading and it was wrong of me to even have contemplated a trade - I'll make that statement public if you want."?

Should he have said to Marshall "You want a new contract? OK, never mind your off-field issues and the fact that you're a restricted free-agent, have as much money as you want - and take a practice off if you feel like it."?

Some people looked at McDaniels and thought that was exactly how he would have responded. They expected to be able to push the guy around and that is what's forced him to stand firm. But standing firm doesn't sit well with the public image of the kid coach in the hoodie. So now he's got this reputation as a mini-hitler.....

I think you'll find that NO head coach in the league would have been able to make the concessions to Cutler et al he was asked to and still maintain his authority and do his job. the head coach has to be in charge - its not a funtion of McDaniels psyche or Belichicks style, its a function of the job of a head coach in the national football league. If players choose to question that they must be faced down, and if they can't be tamed they must be shipped. That's the only way that McDaniels will ensure that it is HIS vision for the team which is implemented, and not his vision watered down by the demands of high-profile players..
Personally, I would rather think he is copying the Patriots (the only real experience he has, and he needs to draw on all the experience he can get right now) rather then he is too young/ high pitched/ babyfaced that players have a hard time respecting him and these situations will repeat for years. All the best leaders are respected, but the best ones command that respect rather then demand it and constantly having to fight for it.
Gob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 06:55 AM   #22
Steve Sewell
Oh Tyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!!
 
Steve Sewell's Avatar
 
Patrick and Ty's pimp

Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,620

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Reggie Rivers
Default

That article was hilarious. She's like the female version of Rick Reilly.

You know...the writer that doesn't know anything about a topic but need to **** out a story quick?
Steve Sewell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 06:57 AM   #23
cmhargrove
Is this thing on???
 
cmhargrove's Avatar
 
Travis Henry's love child...

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 6,711

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Peyton Hillis
Default

Out of Bill Belichiks first six seasons as a head coach - he only had one season with a winning record.

If I can Wiki that in ten seconds, shouldn't a "journalist" be able to?
cmhargrove is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 07:11 AM   #24
Rohirrim
Partisan
 
Rohirrim's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Twixt Hell & Highwater
Posts: 53,949

Adopt-a-Bronco:
CJ Anderson
Default

Coaches with QBs named Montana become "Innovators." Coaches with QBs named Elway become "Masterminds." Coaches with QBs named Tom Brady become "Geniuses." See a pattern here?
Rohirrim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2010, 07:13 AM   #25
cmhargrove
Is this thing on???
 
cmhargrove's Avatar
 
Travis Henry's love child...

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 6,711

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Peyton Hillis
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rohirrim View Post
Coaches with QBs named Montana become "Innovators." Coaches with QBs named Elway become "Masterminds." Coaches with QBs named Tom Brady become "Geniuses." See a pattern here?
Coaches with Cutler = fired?
cmhargrove is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:45 AM.


Denver Broncos