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Old 01-28-2010, 08:25 PM   #1
Drek
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Default Bronco Facts Part 1: Kyle Orton is a Good QB

So in an attempt to swing this forum back to football discussion I'm going to start making threads in which I give one indisputable fact and how it plays a role going into the 2010 season.

This one: Kyle Orton is a good QB.

Why it is true:
Only 4 games with a QB rating below 83.0. Only 6 games with a QB rating below 90.0.

This despite 29 sacks (14th most in the league) and 541 attempts (t-6 with Aaron Rogers).

So he didn't have freakishly good protection helping inflate his QB rating and he didn't just pad QB ratings with 15 attempt games dominated by a running game.

What this means for 2010:

Well, depends if you think Orton has peaked, or if he can continue to improve. I'd personally go with the later, to some degree, but he isn't looking like he's about to blossom into Drew Brees next season.

Reasons to think he'll get better:
Lot of room for improvement in going through his progression.
Can get better at before the snap reads and adjustments.
McDaniels altered his delivery in the previous off-season, more time will only refine those corrections.

Reasons to question further potential:
limited athleticism
hasn't shown a penchant for making the big plays, often missing big play targets down field due to locking onto short to intermediate targets.
only showed limited growth in his reads over his first season.

What it all means:
In short, Orton improved a lot, he is now a good starting QB, but still shy of being a great one. We can reasonably expect him to take at least a small step closer to "great", but the skills needed to truly become great are things he didn't display last year despite his big break out season. Things like finding the big play when it is there and putting the dagger in the opposition when we have the ball in the red zone.

As it stands now Orton is a good enough QB to get us into the playoffs as long as other parts of the team don't handicap him. In the long term though, unless those skills spontaneously generate we'll need to either find our elite feature somewhere else (defense or running) or get a different QB if we want to win titles. All around very good teams don't win titles. They have Cinderella runs like the Jets until they meet a buzz saw in Peyton Manning and the Colts, or Tom Brady and the Pats, etc. and get bounced out while someone else wins the big one.

So discuss.
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Old 01-28-2010, 08:27 PM   #2
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It helps when you throw screens and 2-5yd passes
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Old 01-28-2010, 08:30 PM   #3
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It is a QB efficiency rating. It isn't hard to be efficient throwing 22 screens a game. I don't agree that he is a good QB based on anything he has shown in his career. If you watch him, you can see the struggle with how hard he makes it look. He also doesn't elevate the talent around him, another great sign that he isn't very good.
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Old 01-28-2010, 08:30 PM   #4
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This should end well.


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Old 01-28-2010, 08:38 PM   #5
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Quote:
This one: Kyle Orton is a good QB.
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Old 01-28-2010, 08:40 PM   #6
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Kyle Orton:

BY PASS PLAY
CMPATTYDSCMP%YPALNGTDINTSACKRATATTYDSAVGLNGTD
Pass Thrown: Behind line647946281.05.8549200.099.5000.000
Pass Thrown: 1-10 yds.143206132269.46.4252900.0101.2000.000


Tom Brady

BY PASS PLAYCMPATTYDSCMP%YPALNGTDINTSACKRATATTYDSAVGLNGTD
Pass Thrown: Behind line536843577.96.4038210.097.0000.000
Pass Thrown: 1-10 yds.196268164373.16.1354810.097.0000.000


Kurt Warner

Pass Thrown: Behind line558036768.84.5924210.081.6000.000
Pass Thrown: 1-10 yds.157220132971.46.0425830.093.2000.000


Drew Brees

BY PASS PLAYCMPATTYDSCMP%YPALNGTDINTSACKRATATTYDSAVGLNGTD
Pass Thrown: Behind line677642388.25.5736500.0111.8000.000
Pass Thrown: 1-10 yds.137193113371.05.8763830.093.0000.000


Kind of odd. Orton compares with other NFL qb's nicely. After 11 yards, not so much.

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Old 01-28-2010, 08:49 PM   #7
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Epic thread.

But I'll play along. Sure, Kyle Orton is a good QB. Good meaning not great but an average run of the mill QB.

Awesome. That a quarter will get you a cup of coffee.

The fact is, he's not a great QB and you really need one of those to win.
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Old 01-28-2010, 08:50 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RhymesayersDU View Post
Epic thread.

But I'll play along. Sure, Kyle Orton is a good QB. Good meaning not great but an average run of the mill QB.

Awesome. That a quarter will get you a cup of coffee.

The fact is, he's not a great QB and you really need one of those to win.

They sell coffee for a quarter? Welcome back 1958.


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Old 01-28-2010, 08:51 PM   #9
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I think most of the above posts show this is NOT an indisputable fact.
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Old 01-28-2010, 08:52 PM   #10
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I think he is solid
Dont think he is elite and dont think he prolly ever will be which is why I wouldnt pass up on a prospect like Bradford were he fall in the draft

But I am comfortable with him as the starter next year
The people who say he sucks dont know what they are talking about
He isnt flashy, but that doesnt mean he sucks
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Old 01-28-2010, 08:53 PM   #11
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I backed Orton for quite a while, but he is only a average QB...we need a guy who can move around a little in the pocket...make a play when things break down...have a strong enough arm to fit it tight in the middle 20 yards down the field...I don't dislike Orton, but this team needs a playmaker
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Old 01-28-2010, 08:54 PM   #12
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Your are correct Orton is a good QB, but what we need is a great QB......
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Old 01-28-2010, 08:55 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pony Boy View Post
Your are correct Orton is a good QB, but waht we need is a great QB......
I think McNabb would be a great fit in this system...I don't think he is great, but he is damn good and has play making abilities.
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:06 PM   #14
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You trade for McNabb and I think you set us back further. What are you trading him for anyway? Trade a 2nd round pick at least for QB in his mid 30's? We;re not one piece away like the Vikings looked, were a few, especially in the trenches. I support Orton and think we can groom someone else good behind him through the draft while we build this team up at the important position. The lines
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:10 PM   #15
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He peaked at about 5 games into his senior year at Purdue.

Been downhill ever since.

He was the best QB Denver had last year though, so he can put that award on his mantle.
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:12 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by broncswin View Post
I think McNabb would be a great fit in this system...I don't think he is great, but he is damn good and has play making abilities.
Now, you're talking great QB ...... but don't think that will ever happen here.
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:16 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fusionfrontman View Post
You trade for McNabb and I think you set us back further. What are you trading him for anyway? Trade a 2nd round pick at least for QB in his mid 30's? We;re not one piece away like the Vikings looked, were a few, especially in the trenches. I support Orton and think we can groom someone else good behind him through the draft while we build this team up at the important position. The lines
don't agree with that, I think McNabb would be a much better QB to sit behind if I am a developing QB...so we give up a 2nd for him...chances we hit a great talent with that with that pick is slim...McNabb gives us a much better chance too win...the moral and confidence on the team would be much better suited for victories with McNabb than hoping for victories behind Orton...with wins and success comes stability and this teams need a coaching staff to stay in tact for a while...I think McNabb brings all those positives or atleast a much better chance at them
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:18 PM   #18
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:20 PM   #19
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01-28-2010, 09:10 PM
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Not sure why it took me this long.
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:33 PM   #20
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:33 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drek View Post
Reasons to think he'll get better:
Lot of room for improvement in going through his progression.
Can get better at before the snap reads and adjustments.
McDaniels altered his delivery in the previous off-season, more time will only refine those corrections.
I'd also say he needs to get into some kind of training regimen. May not be the most athletic QB in the NFL, but he can still work out and make himself a little better in running around.
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:37 PM   #22
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Quote:
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I'd also say he needs to get into some kind of training regimen. May not be the most athletic QB in the NFL, but he can still work out and make himself a little better in running around.

In his defense, he did sprain both ankles. That never really heals if you dont stay off your feet, and he was playing the very next week. But I agree. Wouldnt kill him to work on strength training.


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Old 01-28-2010, 09:38 PM   #23
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The funniest part of this thread is that you think 29 sacks is a lot of sacks.

The fact of the matter is Denver's offensive line probably would have led the league in fewest sacks allowed had they had a quarterback who was better at avoiding the rush.

Orton has cement feet.

I'd say it's a stretch to call Orton a good quarterback. I don't think he does anything particularly well. He's about average.

The Broncos will never win squat with Orton and the sooner you all realize it the better off you'll be.
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:42 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sirhcyennek81 View Post
In his defense, he did sprain both ankles. That never really heals if you dont stay off your feet, and he was playing the very next week. But I agree. Wouldnt kill him to work on strength training.


I dont think he ever really heals, dude is always hurt. He did have some games that really impressed me but most the time I saw the defense as the more dominant unit.
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Old 01-28-2010, 09:45 PM   #25
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I dont think he ever really heals, dude is always hurt. He did have some games that really impressed me but most the time I saw the defense as the more dominant unit.

Broncos offense had problems. I dont think the most glaring was the play of Kyle Orton. What would annoy me is that too many times this season, just sidestepping a passrusher would cause Orton to fall over. Its like the 2nd coming of Brian Griese.


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