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Old 01-18-2010, 12:56 PM   #1
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Default Jack Clark rips McGwire...

Nothing new here, just interesting to hear a former pro talk about this stuff without holding back, to say the least...



By Rick Hummel
ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH
01/15/2010

Former Cardinals slugger Jack Clark apparently isn't enamored of the current hitting coach, especially in light of Mark McGwire's admission a few days ago that he had used steroids in 1998-99 when he played for the Cardinals and before that with Oakland.

Clark, who spoke whatever was on his mind when he played he was a big factor in two National League pennants for the Cardinals in the 1980s and occasionally when he hasn't been playing, said Thursday he was disgusted with the whole steroids issue and McGwire's now confirmed involvement in it.

"A lot of them should be banned from baseball, including Mark McGwire," Clark said.
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"All those guys are cheaters A-Rod (Alex Rodriguez). Fake, phony. Rafael Palmeiro. Fake, a phony.



"(Roger) Clemens, (Barry) Bonds. (Sammy) Sosa. Fakes. Phonies. They don't deserve to be in the Hall of Fame.

"They should all be in the Hall of Shame. They can afford to build it. They've all got so much money. And they could all go there and talk about the next way to rub something on your skin. The whole thing is creepy.

"They're all creeps. All these guys have been liars," Clark said.

Referring to some of the admitted steroids users' tearful apologies, Clark, who was the Los Angeles Dodgers' hitting coach several years ago, said, "They're not really a man's man. They're just whimpering boys who are just sad to watch.

"They try to put it off on somebody else. I don't know how they sleep at night, looking at all their fame, let alone the money they took by faking everybody out and lying to everybody. ...

"I don't know. I'd rather take my 340 home runs (11 seasons of more than 20) legitimately instead of taking that stuff to be phony."

Former Cardinals outfielder Andy Van Slyke, agreeing in part with Clark, said, "I never condoned a player who used steroids while they played, but I've never been mad at a player. But I think if you have an opportunity to tell the truth and you continue to be disingenuous and lie, then there's every right for people to be upset by the continued lying or finger-pointing.

"There's a lot of finger-pointing by Mark McGwire. He blames it on not being tested and he blames it on the era. Why would you blame baseball for taking steroids?

"That's like me saying the reason I was drunk driving was because I knew that on this particular highway, they didn't have anything for me to blow into."

Clark criticized McGwire's initial statements that McGwire's swing and mechanics were good enough that they would have allowed him to hit the record-setting 70-homer total he achieved in 1998 without the aid of steroids.

As if he were speaking to McGwire, Clark said, "No, because your hand-eye coordination was not good enough. You're kind of a big goof. You had one thing. If you uppercut a ball, you might hit it.

"If his hand-eye coordination was so good, why did he feel the need to apologize to the (Roger) Maris family?" Clark asked.

"It's shame that he thinks we're all stupid, that he only did (steroids) because of injuries. That's such a cop-out, such a lie. These guys did (steroids) to take the money to pump up their egos and then take their consequences down the road.

Van Slyke played many years in Pittsburgh with Barry Bonds, who has been at the center of the steroids-HGH issue.

As to whether Bonds would ever pull a McGwire, Van Slyke said, "If he does come forward, I hope he'll be truthful. One thing about Barry. He's not afraid to speak the truth. For the last four years (since his appearance before a congressional committee), McGwire could have said something."

Clark said the steroids abusers and suspected users "are all lucky they didn't end up in jail. It's all comical to a certain point. It's a three-ring circus. It really is.

"From (commissioner) Bud Selig to Tony (La Russa) to A-Rod to Manny Ramirez to Palmeiro ... what a joke."

Clark insists that Selig and La Russa, among others, knew more about the use of steroids 10 to 20 years ago than they were letting on.

"(McGwire's) own manager never knew that (Jose) Canseco and McGwire and anybody else ever had taken steroids?" Clark said. "Trust me, from (a former player), I have a lot of insight into who did what and when but I'm not even going to talk about it. It really doesn't matter.

"This thing stretches a long way back and it's really ugly and just really shocking. ...

"These guys are playing the game for their own benefits and it's really disgusting. ... They go up there and shed a tear and they think all is forgotten. Well, it's not forgotten and it never will be."

Clark and McGwire both are scheduled to be at the club's Winter Warm-Up this weekend. Should they meet, Clark said, "I'm not going to say hello. I'm not going to shake his hand. He's a sad excuse for a player in the industry of baseball. Just seeing him in uniform makes me throw up.

"He should not be in baseball. He should be banned from baseball more than ever."
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Old 01-18-2010, 01:22 PM   #2
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All fair points. Their records should be removed. When the hell is baseball going to get rid of Bud Selig?
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Old 01-18-2010, 01:29 PM   #3
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Baseball players have been on PEDs sice the 50's. So clear the record books back until the 50's. Otherwise STFD & STFU.
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Old 01-18-2010, 02:17 PM   #4
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I like the tone of Clark's message. That's one of the best sound bites anybody has given on steroids.

Unfortunately, I associate everybody in baseball with steroids. When Wally Joyner admitted to using them, it proved how wide scale it was in baseball. He was the most squeaky clean, Mormon guy in the game.

I even have strong suspicions of Ken Griffey, Jr., Tony Gwynn and Cal Ripken, Jr. using PES.

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Old 01-18-2010, 02:41 PM   #5
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Clark has a point, but when he says "they've all got so much money" it's the gist of his complaint. He's a very bitter boy.
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Old 01-18-2010, 02:45 PM   #6
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When I was growing up, Jack Clark was #2 on my man-crush list -- behind only John Elway. That was a good call.
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Old 01-18-2010, 02:57 PM   #7
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http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/column...ark&id=2225013

Wait: Are they really going after the greenies?

Is baseball really acknowledging its historic association with amphetamines and beginning an attempt to turn the tide of their use? This is, after all, a sport so steeped in speed that a whole host of its players might not even think they're doing anything illegal when they "bean up" before a game.

Baseball and greenies go together like hot dogs and apple pie, assuming the hot dogs come flying off the grill at Warp Seven and the pie sort of jitters and sweats slightly as it is removed from the oven. They've been together for a long, untouted while, is the thing
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Old 01-18-2010, 02:57 PM   #8
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Loved Jack when he played for the Giants. However my all-time favorite player was the other Clark.
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Old 01-18-2010, 03:01 PM   #9
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Even Hank Arron took drugs to play.

1) The Holy Hank Myth:

Usually history waits for Americans, particularly African-Americans, to die or become disabled before anointing sainthood or revising their legacy in a way that distorts their true modern day relevance. Martin Luther King has been transformed from relentless confrontational activist into a hopeful dreamer. In this 60th anniversary of the breaking of baseball’s color barrier, people pay homage to Jackie Robinson’s on-field integration, but forget about his ongoing fight against discrimination in sports management right up until his premature death. And like Dr. King on Vietnam, we don’t have to listen to Muhammad Ali rail against the war in Iraq, nowadays we could just cuddle with him instead. However, because of their urgent need for the ultimate “anti-Bonds”, the mainstream sports media has grown restless on waiting for the 73 year old Aaron to kick the bucket or slip in the bath tub. And while Aaron’s legacy has been largely ignored for the last 30 years[2], honors, tributes, and magazine covers have flourished that now endlessly praise the “dignity”, “honor”, and “grace” of “The People’s King”. Fortunately, these pieces by Tommy Craggs from Slate and D.K. Wilson and Jonathan Weiler from The Starting Five (TSF) have cut in on the canonization-in-progress.

Not surprisingly, it was on one of my daily blog check-in with TSF, where I first learned that Hank Aaron once tried amphetamines. Technically speaking, I knew about Hank’s not-so-hidden-secret way back in 1992! That was when I first bought, read, and subsequently forgot his excellent autobiography (“I Had a Hammer: The Hank Aaron Story”). To refresh my memory I dug up and dusted off, my yellowed, dog-eared, and old-book-smelling paperback this past week. On page 268, Aaron states:

“The 500thhome run came against Mike McCormick of the Giants, which meant that Willie Mays was on the field at the time. Willie elected not to have his picture taken with me that day, saying it wasn’t appropriate for him to fraternize with a player whose team had just beaten the Giants. For years Willie had been king and I’m sure that he wasn’t crazy about me elbowing into his territory. Most fans and critics still considered Willie to be a better player than me. It seems like the only ones who took up my cause were my teammates. Guys like Uecker and Boyer used to argue with the visiting writers who didn’t think I belonged in the class with Mays. It made me feel a little awkward to sit by my locker and hear them going on like that, but don’t think I didn’t appreciate it. [new paragraph begins] Actually, the 1968 season wasn’t the best time to present my case. It was the first time since my rookie year that I didn’t drive in or score 100 runs. I was so frustrated that at one point I tried using a pep pill—a greenie—that one of my teammates gave me. When that thing took hold, I thought I was having a heart attack. It was a stupid thing to do…”


http://www.cosellout.com/?p=78
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Old 01-18-2010, 03:04 PM   #10
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WWII sparks pill craze

If baseball players aren't alarmed by the sight of teammates taking pills between innings or gulping cups of juiced-up coffee, it's because they've been numbed to the use of amphetamines through the last 60 years.

The abuse dates back to World War II, when pilots and infantrymen were given pills to help them stay alert in battle. They were legal, sold over-the-counter and used to treat everything from asthma to fatigue.

Professional athletes called into service began using amphetamines during games at military bases. When the war ended and athletes returned to their teams, they brought along the pills.

They used the name "greenies" because Dexedrine, one brand name, came in green tablets. The equally common Benzedrine came in orange pills.

"They spread like wildfire when all of those guys came home," said Dr. Charles Yesalis, who co-authored the article, Anabolic Steroid and Stimulant Use in North American Sport between 1850 and 1980, in the December issue of Sport in History.

When Hall of Fame slugger Ralph Kiner returned to the Pittsburgh Pirates after flying Navy seaplanes, he found amphetamines in the training room.

Before the second game of a summer doubleheader, a trainer gave a weary Kiner some Benzedrine pills.

"All the trainers in all the ballparks had them," Kiner said.

In an era when a premium wasn't placed on off-season conditioning — players were discouraged from lifting weights for fear of becoming too bulky and losing flexibility — ballplayers sought stamina in pill form. Big-league roster spots were precious and players would do anything to keep them.

"You needed to perform your best and you were going to use everything that's legal to help you do it," Kiner said. "You worked to get that job and you wanted to stay in the lineup. If you got out of the lineup, you might never get back in."

Jim Brosnan, who pitched for four teams from 1954 through '63, chronicled life in the majors in his 1960 book, The Long Season. He said most players used greenies to recover from hangovers and instill confidence.

"It seemed to help," he said. "If you thought it would help, you tried it. I did. But it didn't always help me."

By the late '60s, amphetamine use worldwide was rampant, especially in sports.


http://www.palmbeachpost.com/sports/...PHET_0402.html
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Old 01-18-2010, 03:12 PM   #11
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Hall of Famer Mike Schmidt, arguably the greatest third basemen in the history of baseball, dropped a bombshell a few years back, by coming clean on the use of amphetamines, during the 1970’s and 1980’s. Amphetamines, also known as Greenies, are another famous and widely used performance enhancing drug. They give athletes a jolt of energy, boosting their performance. In 2006, amphetamines were also banned from baseball specifically because they were included as a performance-enhancing drug.

http://sportales.com/baseball/steroi...all-hypocrisy/
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Old 01-18-2010, 05:00 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronco LB52 View Post
I like the tone of Clark's message. That's one of the best sound bites anybody has given on steroids.

Unfortunately, I associate everybody in baseball with steroids. When Wally Joyner admitted to using them, it proved how wide scale it was in baseball. He was the most squeaky clean, Mormon guy in the game.

I even have strong suspicions of Ken Griffey, Jr., Tony Gwynn and Cal Ripken, Jr. using PES.
If any of them did roids then they might as well just call off the sport.
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Old 01-18-2010, 05:58 PM   #13
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it's baseball. a sport where cheating, oh im sorry, "gamesmenship" has been ingrained in the players since day 1. all of a sudden people have a problem with it?

ill always enjoy mcgwire's and sosa HR chase, peds or no peds. it's only entertainment to me.
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Old 01-19-2010, 03:50 PM   #14
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Props to Jack Clark for ripping McGwire. And boy, he really ripped him a new one.

That was great how he refuted McGwire's contention he had it all, didn't really need the PED's.

Clark was real fun to watch, he was a line-drive hitter. His HR's got out of the park FAST. They may have only reached 10-20 rows up in the stands, but they got there like a frozen rope.
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Old 01-19-2010, 05:30 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bombay View Post
Clark has a point, but when he says "they've all got so much money" it's the gist of his complaint. He's a very bitter boy.
Clark made a lot of money himself, so your point is moot. And that wasn't the point of Clark's comments. The point was "they have no pride."
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Old 01-19-2010, 06:40 PM   #16
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I feel it is inpossible to tell who was on the juice and who wasn't. So I think Mcguire should make the hall. Hell Clark could of been on the Juice.
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Old 01-19-2010, 06:54 PM   #17
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I feel it is inpossible to tell who was on the juice and who wasn't. So I think Mcguire should make the hall. Hell Clark could of been on the Juice.
Clark wasn't on the juice. Never was a question of it. Most people know who was on the juice, their numbers changed so dramatically, their physiques changed so dramatically, there was no question who was juicing. I always bring up Lenny Dykstra and Ron Gant because those two were so dramatically changed in one offseason.

Guys like Ken Griffey Jr, Tony Gwinn, Jack Clark I'll say they were clean because they were consistent year after year, no dramatic increases in size or stats.

Those that have admitted to it, their numbers and awards should be deleted.
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