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Old 12-01-2009, 11:24 AM   #1
fontaine
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Default Robert Ayers looks fat, lazy, and slow

I've tried to hold off posting this thread for a while because I was really hoping that with increasing playing time, Ayers would finally show me something.

Except he hasn't. Ayers will occassionally flash one good move and make a quick burst to the QB or hold the point of attack in the perimeter against the run. It shows you why Denver thoughtly highly enough of him to draft him in the 1st.

But most of the rest is just trash. The guy just takes plays off. And he stands out because the rest of the front 7 really hustle. His first step is usually pretty slow, he doesn't finish tackles, hasn't shown any real pass rush moves, and worst of all he just doesn't hustle towards the ball!

That more than anything else really pisses me off. I see guys like Holiday who's ancient, Peterson who doesn't really have a ton of talent, or other limited players and the one thing they're all doing is swarming to the ball carrier against the run, and really fighting hard in the trenches in pass rush.

Except Ayers who routinely just gives up on plays, doesn't flow to the ball carrier and looks plain lazy.

There's a reason why this guy was inactive, even though injury free (he played against the Giants) and Moss was activated in his stead who's an even bigger douche.

I hope somehow the light comes on for this guy, but right now it's an issue of heart and effort at which he's failing from what I've seen.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:27 AM   #2
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Doom wasn't special until this year...
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:28 AM   #3
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Doom wasn't special until this year...
that's not true...he was a bright spot last year too
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:28 AM   #4
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Doom wasn't special until this year...
But he did have 8.5 sacks his rookie year.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:33 AM   #5
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that's not true...he was a bright spot last year too
Still, not his rookie year.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:34 AM   #6
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Doom was ALWAYS about effort.

But what does he have to do with Ayers?

Look, I'm just going by what I see. I see guys like Reid etc who are naturally LESS talented than Ayers put in serious effort, sometimes against double teams to fight through blockers.

Ayers does the opposite. And it's not like he has outside contain or is protecting the flat, in the plays I've seen he just looks hesitant, slow getting of the line (in a two or three point stance), and doesn't fight blockers.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:34 AM   #7
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Still, not his rookie year.
He had 8.5 sacks his rookie year! I think that is showing something.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:36 AM   #8
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All I have to say is....Orakpo!!
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:38 AM   #9
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And I'm not down on Ayers because of his lack of sacks. I understand he's got a long way to go before developing as a pass rusher.

I'm talking about what he was supposed to be good at from Day 1. Which is fighting hard against the run game, holding the point of attack and so on. None of which he's desplayed really in any sustained period of play.

In short I'm looking at the ONLY player who STANDS out in our front 7 because he's not showing the hustle, the effort that the others guys are.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:38 AM   #10
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Light a fire under his mother****ing ass
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:40 AM   #11
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I have not watched Ayers all that closely so I can't really comment. The speed of the game may be slowing him down and making him hesitant. It's really up to Nolan and the coaching staff to get this kid's head in the right place. From the outside looking in, we can make a lot of assumptions but I'm not sure if work ethic is something we can know at this point and time.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:41 AM   #12
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I'm not down on Ayers. He's learning the ropes. He's already showed me more in a few games than Moss or Crowder did over a few years.

It just takes time. Simmer down.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:41 AM   #13
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Doom wasn't special until this year...
8.5 sacks as a rookie,He also had 12.5 sacks his sophmore yr. As a matter of FACT, he only had 1 bad yr. he's averageing 10 sacks a season and he's not even done with his 4th season.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:44 AM   #14
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8.5 sacks as a rookie,He also had 12.5 sacks his sophmore yr. As a matter of FACT, he only had 1 bad yr. he's averageing 10 sacks a season and he's not even done with his 4th season.
That means he's mediocre here at the mane.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:50 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fontaine View Post
...........

Except Ayers who routinely just gives up on plays, doesn't flow to the ball carrier and looks plain lazy.

.......

I hope somehow the light comes on for this guy, but right now it's an issue of heart and effort at which he's failing from what I've seen.
Well I give Ayers a 'Pass' for this season, the guy is a 'Rookie'. Also you have to figure he was behind the learning curb (by his agents accord) when he reported late to camp.

Most 'Rookies' take more than a few weeks to perform at a high level.

But I've seen him contribute, didn't he force a fumble and also return a fumble for a TD.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:52 AM   #16
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Not only is he a rookie, but he came out as a Junior didn't he? He had one good season at Tennessee so I am not too quick to get on his case. The fact that he didn't dress for the Chargers game does worry me though...
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:52 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peacepipe View Post
8.5 sacks as a rookie,He also had 12.5 sacks his sophmore yr. As a matter of FACT, he only had 1 bad yr. he's averageing 10 sacks a season and he's not even done with his 4th season.
26 sacks in 3 seasons does not compute to 10 sacks a season....

1 out of 3 years being bad, still computes to a D grade.

"ONLY one bad year" Might be a better argument for someone with more than 3 years of work lol
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:53 AM   #18
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That means he's mediocre here at the mane.
as my above post says.... Hope you don't stress your kids out too much pushing them for those D's
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:55 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by fontaine View Post
Doom was ALWAYS about effort.

But what does he have to do with Ayers?

Look, I'm just going by what I see. I see guys like Reid etc who are naturally LESS talented than Ayers put in serious effort, sometimes against double teams to fight through blockers.

Ayers does the opposite. And it's not like he has outside contain or is protecting the flat, in the plays I've seen he just looks hesitant, slow getting of the line (in a two or three point stance), and doesn't fight blockers.
He's hesitant because he played nothing but DL, and about as much DT as DE, while in college. He's now trying to convert to OLB in a different front, and its having some growing pains.

He had some real bright spots in some other games this year, collapsing the pocket on more than a few occasions to help Doom get a sack. He's still very young and he's already playing significant snaps. In time he'll likely emerge as more of a play maker.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:57 AM   #20
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I think he is developing just fine. There is always a learning curve and he is being converted from a DE to OLB. I notice him flashing all the time - there was an article not too long ago about how what he is being asked to do does not always show up in the stats. Early on, he looked like he was thinking too much but, lately, he seems to be getting more instinctive. I expect big things from him next year.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:57 AM   #21
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as my above post says.... Hope you don't stress your kids out too much pushing them for those D's
You should probably leave someones kids out of an argument about a game.
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Old 12-01-2009, 11:58 AM   #22
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Old 12-01-2009, 12:00 PM   #23
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I'm not talking about the complexity of the game, the mental learning curve, or adjustment period etc etc.

I'm talking about basic football 101.

1. His burst/explosiveness at the snap - Sluggish
2. His hand placement/leverage against blockers - non existent.
3. His effort and hustle and chasing ball carriers - not there, takes plays off.
4. His ability to fight through blockers - nope.

In other words, the very basics that apply to every scheme, every player along the front 7.

Someone mentioned that fumble recovery for a TD. He didn't force a fumble but was stoned on that play by the tackle and just ended up being the only guy aroung that was upright to run towards the fumble.
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Old 12-01-2009, 12:02 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doggcow View Post
26 sacks in 3 seasons does not compute to 10 sacks a season....

1 out of 3 years being bad, still computes to a D grade.

"ONLY one bad year" Might be a better argument for someone with more than 3 years of work lol
Well aren't you the cherry picker, He also has 14 sacks this(his 4th)season. unless the NFL has figured out a way to take away sacks ,he's avg 10 sacks a season. 8.5,12.5 are very good numbers to put up your 1st 2 seasons at his height & weight. He's only had 1 bad season.
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Old 12-01-2009, 12:04 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fontaine View Post
I'm not talking about the complexity of the game, the mental learning curve, or adjustment period etc etc.

I'm talking about basic football 101.

1. His burst/explosiveness at the snap - Sluggish
2. His hand placement/leverage against blockers - non existent.
3. His effort and hustle and chasing ball carriers - not there, takes plays off.
4. His ability to fight through blockers - nope.

In other words, the very basics that apply to every scheme, every player along the front 7.

Someone mentioned that fumble recovery for a TD. He didn't force a fumble but was stoned on that play by the tackle and just ended up being the only guy aroung that was upright to run towards the fumble.
Didn't he only play like 1 or 2 years in college and came out early? Come on man.
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