The Orange Mane -  a Denver Broncos Fan Community  

Go Back   The Orange Mane - a Denver Broncos Fan Community > Orange Mane Discussion > Orange Mane Central Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Chat Room Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-30-2009, 07:57 AM   #1
Bronco Rob
Ring of Famer
 
Bronco Rob's Avatar
 
The Alpha & The Omega

Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,891

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Kush & Irsay
Default "Poor decisions plague Broncos' coach"

By Dan Parr (dparr@pfwmedia.com)
April 30, 2009


Fire front-office staff that nailed its top two draft picks in Ryan Clady and Eddie Royal last year and promote Brian Xanders to general manager.

Check. Josh McDaniels wants to pick his own guy to work with, which is understandable, albeit a bit arrogant.

Swing and miss on trading for old buddy Matt Cassel, angering Pro Bowl QB Jay Cutler.

Check. Again, arrogant, but it’s McDaniels’ right to explore.

Trade disgruntled, uncommunicative Cutler, the most rare and sought-after of commodities as a 25-year-old signalcaller in his prime, for two No. 1 draft picks and a much less talented replacement in Kyle Orton.

Check. Uh, this is getting ridiculous. Pressure is on. McDaniels better hit on these picks.

Rather than redeeming self on the big stage, make boneheaded decisions on Draft Day, most notably giving up No. 1 draft pick next year for second-rounder this year, and spend it on a 5-foot-8 7⁄8 cornerback who isn’t tall enough or fast enough to be a No. 1 corner.

Check.

This is McDaniels’ bizarre list of accomplishments thus far. While each decision brims with boldness, many of them have been damaging to the team. On paper, this looks like a worse club than the 8-8 one he inherited, thanks in large part to losing Cutler, and you have to wonder just what he was thinking at various points of the draft.


Denver, which needed help on defense in the worst way, particularly in the front seven, took Georgia RB Knowshon Moreno, the highest-rated back available, with its first pick at No. 12, passing on stud Texas DE-OLB Brian Orakpo and Ohio State CB-S Malcolm Jenkins. The Broncos could have used a defender more than a runner here, but Moreno is talented and will immediately become the team’s No. 1 ballcarrier.
McDaniels was sensible enough to take Tennessee OLB Robert Ayers with the 18th pick, acquired from Chicago, but he quickly dashed hopes that he had a solid plan in place by trading next year’s first-round pick, which could be in the top 10 the way he’s headed, to get the aforementioned diminutive Wake Forest CB Alphonso Smith in the second round.

No first-time head coach in history has reversed the perception of who he is so drastically without having coached a single game for his new team.

McDaniels was once known only as the brightest young offensive mind in the league, a guy who had learned under the tutelage of the most successful head coach of his generation in Bill Belichick.

He was young, getting the job at age 32, but it was hard to question his pedigree.

In less than four months as a head coach, however, questioning McDaniels has become as easy and as justifiable as possible. The luster has faded away and the curtain pulled back.

There’s a chance this draft class could turn out to be a great one and Orton will morph into a Cassel clone under McDaniels’ guidance. Early impressions have been wrong before.

McDaniels has to hope as hard as he can for that outcome. First-time head coaches usually get to enjoy a honeymoon period, but McDaniels’ ended in a hurry.



http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW...9/parr2403.htm

Yet another douche heard from.....
Bronco Rob is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 04-30-2009, 08:08 AM   #2
Hulamau
Polynesian Paralysis
 
Hulamau's Avatar
 
In the Pocket

Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Hulaville and Sedona
Posts: 9,409

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Bradley Roby
Default

Thanks for more 'insights' from yet another superficial writer with very little idea what he's talking about. ...

Ah I see, he's from PFW .... 'nuff said
Hulamau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 08:11 AM   #3
RMT
Rocky Mountain Thunder
 
RMT's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: United States
Posts: 3,296
Default

so, the writer's putting all of the Goodman's draft prowess on TWO picks? that should tell you enough about what "experts" they and shanahan were in the draft over the years - their track record speaks louder than the mere handful of good picks they've had.
RMT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 08:14 AM   #4
barryr
Ring of Famer
 
New to the Forum

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,971

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Has the writer checked Shanahan's draft record with defensive players?
barryr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 08:14 AM   #5
baja
Headmaster
 
baja's Avatar
 
The Fixer

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: in the present moment
Posts: 61,302

Adopt-a-Bronco:
C J Anderson
Default

It's great the national writers see us this why, when we win the division and make the playoffs they will be calling McDaniels the new Mastermind.
baja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 08:16 AM   #6
broncofan7
Ring of Famer
 
broncofan7's Avatar
 
BQ looks ALMOST as good as I do

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: BIG D
Posts: 6,004
Default

This guy wrote nothing that hadn't already been written on this board over a month or so ago.....
broncofan7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 08:23 AM   #7
Broncomutt
Looking for
 
Broncomutt's Avatar
 
the Sunflower Samurai

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Waxhaw, NC
Posts: 1,385
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by barryr View Post
Has the writer checked Shanahan's draft record with defensive players?
I think the writer was Shanahan.
Broncomutt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 08:26 AM   #8
bpc
"Nemo Me Impune Lacessit"
 
bpc's Avatar
 
1 sword keeps another in the sheath

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Northern California
Posts: 14,263

Adopt-a-Bronco:
TJ Ward
Default

To be honest, McDaniels has made a lot of errors... but what did we expect from a 32 year old handed the reigns to a prestigious franchise?

I hope moving forward that he made the right decisions on draft day and all the people he picked are the right guys.

I hope that Bowlen is not low-balling the future of our team by potentially dealing away a top 10 pick because he doesn't have the scratch to pay them.

Go Broncos.
bpc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 08:26 AM   #9
TheReverend
Permanent Facepalm
 
TheReverend's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 37,685

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Mike Shanahan
Default

While I agree with just about everything, this guy isn't qualified for his own thread anymore than anyone here.
TheReverend is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 09:23 AM   #10
supermanhr9
Ring of Famer
 
supermanhr9's Avatar
 
"I'm gonna burn this mother down"

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Back in DENVER BABY!!
Posts: 1,210

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Nobody
Default

this guys a fool.
supermanhr9 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 09:29 AM   #11
SonOfLe-loLang
Young Buck
 
SonOfLe-loLang's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 21,769

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Thunder (RIP)
Default

How do we know McDaniels made errors? Where is the proof of the error? The only empirical evidence of error is a win-loss record and, last time i checked, we haven't played a game yet.

If in 3 years he has a losing record, then yes, he made errors. If in 3 years we're in the super bowl? Well, then he knew exactly what he was doing.
SonOfLe-loLang is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 09:33 AM   #12
dbfan21
Floridian living in KS
 
dbfan21's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Wichita
Posts: 2,176

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Pat Bowlen
Default

Write a completely useless and biased article which prematurely judges the level of success a coach's decisions have had before he is even done assembling the team and gets them onto the field to play a single game.


Check.


I, for one, am going to reserve comment on McD's offseason activity until the fourth or fifth game of the season. Until then, it waaaaay too early to tell what type of job he's done.
dbfan21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 09:35 AM   #13
telluride
Ring of Famer
 
telluride's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,557

Adopt-a-Bronco:
--Rulon!--
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bpc View Post
what did we expect from a 32 year old handed the reigns to a prestigious franchise?
I'm kinda amazed at this myth. Yes, we were good in the late 1990s. But for almost a decade we've been a very middling team. For the past three seasons we've been a .500 team, with a historically bad defense, an underperforming offense, and a tendency to get embarrassed in big games and on national TV. That's not a "prestigious franchise."

So, McDaniels is no Shanny? Well, thank God for that. Because Shanny long ago ceased to be the Shanny of the late 90s.
telluride is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 09:36 AM   #14
BroncoBuff
***************
 
BroncoBuff's Avatar
 
Playing for January

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Seattle
Posts: 26,114

Adopt-a-Bronco:
MALIK+QUANTERUS
Default

I agree with every word in that PFW article, but I still say ...

GO BRONCOS!
BroncoBuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 09:38 AM   #15
Beantown Bronco
Athletic Supporter
 
Beantown Bronco's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Mass
Posts: 20,560

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Matt Prater
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SonOfLe-loLang View Post
How do we know McDaniels made errors? Where is the proof of the error? The only empirical evidence of error is a win-loss record and, last time i checked, we haven't played a game yet.

If in 3 years he has a losing record, then yes, he made errors. If in 3 years we're in the super bowl? Well, then he knew exactly what he was doing.
I take a final exam. I walk out at the end and make my answers public. Several other students and teaching assistants pull me aside to let me know they think several of my answers were wrong. But you're essentially saying that we have to assume I got an A+ on the test until a month later when I actually get the grade in the mail from the professor?
Beantown Bronco is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 09:41 AM   #16
BroncoBuff
***************
 
BroncoBuff's Avatar
 
Playing for January

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Seattle
Posts: 26,114

Adopt-a-Bronco:
MALIK+QUANTERUS
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bpc View Post
McDaniels has made a lot of errors... but what did we expect from a 32 year old handed the reigns to a prestigious franchise?
Exactly. I was front and center, posting exactly that even before the Matt Cassel botched trade talks. We should have learned from Shanahan's latter-day excesses that too much power is a bad thing.

I'm 100% behind Josh as head coach, I know our offense will rock.

But giving him near Shanahan-level franchise power has been near-catastrophic.
BroncoBuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 09:42 AM   #17
Beantown Bronco
Athletic Supporter
 
Beantown Bronco's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Mass
Posts: 20,560

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Matt Prater
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dbfan21 View Post
Write a completely useless and biased article which prematurely judges the level of success a coach's decisions have had before he is even done assembling the team and gets them onto the field to play a single game.


Check.


I, for one, am going to reserve comment on McD's offseason activity until the fourth or fifth game of the season. Until then, it waaaaay too early to tell what type of job he's done.
This is the argument several people are making here. Do you see the problem with this line of thinking? It's lumping of grades.

You do realize that you can grade him on his offseason moves and then give him a completely different grade for his "in season" coaching, don't you?

Think about it. We did it all the time with Shanny. A+ for his gameplanning and getting wins with less talent. F for his GM role because he was responsible for getting himself that lesser talent.

See how it works?

Say McDaniels gets to the playoffs next year. That doesn't necessarily mean the moves he's made thus far are the reason why. He could be completely whiffing today, but win during the season because his gameplans are good enough to overcome the lack of talent he provided himself with.
Beantown Bronco is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 09:46 AM   #18
Hercules Rockefeller
Ring of Famer
 
Hercules Rockefeller's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 16,273

Adopt-a-Bronco:
DJ Williams
Default

I'm still amazed at how many people "know" what went on within the franchise during this whole thing. They "know" that Xanders and Bowlen had no input with regards to Jay and this is 100% on Josh. They "know" that Josh has the same amount of power as Mike, the only difference is that Mike had the title while Josh does not. The Internetz is awesome.
Hercules Rockefeller is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 10:13 AM   #19
Drek
Ring of Famer
 
Drek's Avatar
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 12,334
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hercules Rockefeller View Post
I'm still amazed at how many people "know" what went on within the franchise during this whole thing. They "know" that Xanders and Bowlen had no input with regards to Jay and this is 100% on Josh. They "know" that Josh has the same amount of power as Mike, the only difference is that Mike had the title while Josh does not. The Internetz is awesome.
I'm personally of the opinion that Josh was willing to stick it out and make Cutler play, assuming that time would heal all wounds. When Cutler effectively snubbed Bowlen the real boss decided enough was enough.

He fired Mike Shanahan because he was tired of just paying the bills for what amounted to someone else's franchise. Cutler basically pushed the exact same button, challenging Bowlen's authority within his own team. No way that was going to fly.
Drek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 10:15 AM   #20
SonOfLe-loLang
Young Buck
 
SonOfLe-loLang's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 21,769

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Thunder (RIP)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beantown Bronco View Post
I take a final exam. I walk out at the end and make my answers public. Several other students and teaching assistants pull me aside to let me know they think several of my answers were wrong. But you're essentially saying that we have to assume I got an A+ on the test until a month later when I actually get the grade in the mail from the professor?
Thats a bad analogy because answers on a test are black and white and anything the broncos have done now exist in the grey until the black and white answers (wins/losses) can become apparent. I dont assume McDaniels gets an A+ or an F. Do you know for a fact that his moves won't work? If you do, I'd love to borrow your crystal ball, i have some other questions.

Also, there are no "experts" when it comes to football punditry. Surprises happen every year that are completely unpredictable.

Horrible analogy, horrible.
SonOfLe-loLang is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 10:16 AM   #21
dbfan21
Floridian living in KS
 
dbfan21's Avatar
 

Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Wichita
Posts: 2,176

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Pat Bowlen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beantown Bronco View Post
This is the argument several people are making here. Do you see the problem with this line of thinking? It's lumping of grades.

You do realize that you can grade him on his offseason moves and then give him a completely different grade for his "in season" coaching, don't you?

Think about it. We did it all the time with Shanny. A+ for his gameplanning and getting wins with less talent. F for his GM role because he was responsible for getting himself that lesser talent.

See how it works?

Say McDaniels gets to the playoffs next year. That doesn't necessarily mean the moves he's made thus far are the reason why. He could be completely whiffing today, but win during the season because his gameplans are good enough to overcome the lack of talent he provided himself with.
I see what you're saying. The problem I have with this is that people are judging McD based on what THEY think he should be doing versus judging McD based on what HIS actual plans are. We are all clueless to the plan the Broncos FO has. He may not be whiffing at all. For all we know, Josh may be hitting on 90-95% of his draft and FA targets, which would result in an "A" grade.

I like reading the articles because it gets me pumped for the upcoming season. Plus, it's better reading than some of the baseball/b-ball/hockey articles that are circulating right now. To a degree, I like the negative articles because it will motivate the team to prove the naysayers wrong.

Maybe the article just irritated me a bit because the writer is not very credible/noteable. Thanks for explaning your viewpoint, Beantown.

Go Broncos!!
dbfan21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 10:23 AM   #22
BroncoBuff
***************
 
BroncoBuff's Avatar
 
Playing for January

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Seattle
Posts: 26,114

Adopt-a-Bronco:
MALIK+QUANTERUS
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beantown Bronco View Post
This is the argument several people are making here. Do you see the problem with this line of thinking? It's lumping of grades.

You do realize that you can grade him on his offseason moves and then give him a completely different grade for his "in season" coaching, don't you?

Think about it. We did it all the time with Shanny. A+ for his gameplanning and getting wins with less talent. F for his GM role because he was responsible for getting himself that lesser talent.

See how it works?

Say McDaniels gets to the playoffs next year. That doesn't necessarily mean the moves he's made thus far are the reason why. He could be completely whiffing today, but win during the season because his gameplans are good enough to overcome the lack of talent he provided himself with.
What an excellent post, my fellow BB ... rep.

Personally, I LOVE "Coach Josh," can't wait to see that offense.

But "GM Josh" is a mistake that might take years to overcome.


The sad part is Bowlen knew about the problems that come with concentrating too much power in one guy ... and yet he fell right back into that trap. And we lost 2 of the 3 most effective guys in the organization because of it. Pat firing Goodman was not just "throwing the baby out with the bathwater," it was lapsing back into old behavior ... the comfort level of having just one guy to deal with.
BroncoBuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 10:26 AM   #23
eddie mac
Ireland's No1 Bronco
 
eddie mac's Avatar
 
Eddie Mac 87 gone but never forgott

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: IRELAND
Posts: 17,269

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Rod Smith
Default

You know why we get continuous articles like this

It's because no-one outside those 4 people (Bowlen, Xanders, McDaniels and Ellis) have a ****ing clue what goes on anymore within the Broncos Organisation and every facet of the media ****ing hate being in the dark about one of the best followed teams worldwide.
eddie mac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 10:31 AM   #24
BroncoBuff
***************
 
BroncoBuff's Avatar
 
Playing for January

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Seattle
Posts: 26,114

Adopt-a-Bronco:
MALIK+QUANTERUS
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by eddie mac View Post
no-one outside those 4 people (Bowlen, Xanders, McDaniels and Ellis) have a ****ing clue what goes on anymore within the Broncos Organisation and every facet of the media ****ing hate being in the dark about one of the best followed teams worldwide.
We DO know who's in charge: Bears' GM Jerry Angelo made it very clear who's the boss in Denver. He did an long post-mortem interview about the Cutler trade, wherein he mentioned Josh's name over and over. Never mentioned his GM counterpart Xanders ... the protocol would have been to acknowledge his peer, but he did not. THAT'S ALL WE NEED TO KNOW about who's in charge in Denver.

No more denial, please: Brian Xanders = John Beake/Ted Sundquist.

That much we know.
BroncoBuff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-30-2009, 10:32 AM   #25
footstepsfrom#27
helmet to helmet hitter
 
footstepsfrom#27's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Arlington, TX
Posts: 16,138

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Joe Mays
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronco Rob View Post
No first-time head coach in history has reversed the perception of who he is so drastically without having coached a single game for his new team.
This is a true statement no matter how you view this situation. The only guy that comes to memory as being this ultra-transformative straight out of the gate was Jimmy Johnson. However Johnson took over a team with very little talent and he had already coached a team to an NCAA title whereas this guy's never even coached a high school team. The length of time he's been in the game is serious concern. Couple that with the record of Belicheat's assistants and you've got a lot working against him.
footstepsfrom#27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:15 AM.


Denver Broncos