The Orange Mane -  a Denver Broncos Fan Community  

Go Back   The Orange Mane - a Denver Broncos Fan Community > Orange Mane Discussion > Orange Mane Central Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Chat Room Mark Forums Read



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-07-2009, 03:23 PM   #1
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 
Zimm to HOF

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Long Beach
Posts: 36,916
Default Is Bears defense even still good?

To tell you the truth I don't think I have cared enough about Bears to be informed on this team at all......Until now.

So you know I've been doing what everyone else has been doing. Snooping around, reading, checking stats, looking at the Bears depth chart and getting to know their depth chart.

Of course we all focused on the offensive line and WR, how will Jay do?

But people may be surprised to know that the Bears defense isn't as good as you think.

Bears offense scored 23.4 points a game with was 16th in the NFL. Now they did that while being 26th in yrds which could point to good field position, defense scoring. But considering the amount of pressure Bears qbs were under I'm surprised they did as well as that.

The defense did no better IMO.

they gave up 21.9 points a game which was 16th in the NFL. 334 yrds a game which was 21st in the NFL. The secondary gave up 250 yrds a game and was 30th defending the pass. The run defense was pretty good but maybe team just passed all day.

So if the Bears don't have the weapons Broncos have, and Cutler is less effective, and they don't get better on defense, then will they really be that good this yr?
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 04-07-2009, 03:30 PM   #2
broncofan7
Ring of Famer
 
broncofan7's Avatar
 
BQ looks ALMOST as good as I do

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: BIG D
Posts: 6,005
Default

Yes. They will be better this year with an improved offensive line and a better QB,a 2nd year RB and the defense will not feel as though they have to win games. Don't kid yourself into thinking that they are going to struggle to anywhere NEAR the level of our pending ineptitude.

Last edited by broncofan7; 04-07-2009 at 03:32 PM..
broncofan7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:31 PM   #3
lex
Ring of Famer
 
lex's Avatar
 
The Broncos have been DisemBowlened

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Chi-Town
Posts: 10,236

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

It seems to flow through Tommie Harris for the most part. And it seems that if he has a good year then a lot of guys have a good year. Urlacher had some back problems a couple of years ago. That could have played into it. Also, Chicagos safeties werent all that once you got past Mike Brown. Theyve overpaid their CBs considering that theyre cover 2.
lex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:31 PM   #4
hambone13
Ring of Famer
 
Salty Lurking Vet

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 2,079

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
To tell you the truth I don't think I have cared enough about Bears to be informed on this team at all......Until now.

So you know I've been doing what everyone else has been doing. Snooping around, reading, checking stats, looking at the Bears depth chart and getting to know their depth chart.

Of course we all focused on the offensive line and WR, how will Jay do?

But people may be surprised to know that the Bears defense isn't as good as you think.

Bears offense scored 23.4 points a game with was 16th in the NFL. Now they did that while being 26th in yrds which could point to good field position, defense scoring. But considering the amount of pressure Bears qbs were under I'm surprised they did as well as that.

The defense did no better IMO.

they gave up 21.9 points a game which was 16th in the NFL. 334 yrds a game which was 21st in the NFL. The secondary gave up 250 yrds a game and was 30th defending the pass. The run defense was pretty good but maybe team just passed all day.

So if the Bears don't have the weapons Broncos have, and Cutler is less effective, and they don't get better on defense, then will they really be that good this yr?
The general consensus in the Chicago media and (educated/football smart) fan base is that the Bears defense is aging and underperformed last year. The theme of many conversations in Chi-town is that the core of the defense has another 2-4 years before they're really in trouble and that the team is poised to be more balanced and could be relatively competitive (top 10) with the buzz/inspiration of a more promising offense and increased PR spotlight on the team.
hambone13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:38 PM   #5
24champ
Livin' the dream!
 
24champ's Avatar
 
Keep Calm and Chive on

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Southern California
Posts: 19,846

Adopt-a-Bronco:
DomCasual
Default

Why are we talking about the Bears? Why are we so worried about what they will look like next season, if their D is up to snuff or not?
24champ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:38 PM   #6
CEH
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 4,132
Default

32 forced turnovers compared to 13 for Denver last year.
Big big differnce. I'd say they are going to give Cutler plenty of opportunities to score points.
Much more than the piss poor Denver D gave our O last year.
PPl tend to ignore that stat when comparing the offensive output of both teams.
CEH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:40 PM   #7
lex
Ring of Famer
 
lex's Avatar
 
The Broncos have been DisemBowlened

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Chi-Town
Posts: 10,236

Adopt-a-Bronco:
None
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by A.L.F. View Post
Why are we talking about the Bears? Why are we so worried about what they will look like next season, if their D is up to snuff or not?

Schadenfreude
lex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:41 PM   #8
boltaneer
17
 
boltaneer's Avatar
 
ATTA BABY!

Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: America's Finest City
Posts: 4,486
Default

The Bears defense started going downhill once they let Ron Rivera go.
boltaneer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:45 PM   #9
Tombstone RJ
Ring of Famer
 
Tombstone RJ's Avatar
 
Old School

Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: In the Tetons!
Posts: 22,240

Adopt-a-Bronco:
WorrellWilliams
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
To tell you the truth I don't think I have cared enough about Bears to be informed on this team at all......Until now.

So you know I've been doing what everyone else has been doing. Snooping around, reading, checking stats, looking at the Bears depth chart and getting to know their depth chart.

Of course we all focused on the offensive line and WR, how will Jay do?

But people may be surprised to know that the Bears defense isn't as good as you think.

Bears offense scored 23.4 points a game with was 16th in the NFL. Now they did that while being 26th in yrds which could point to good field position, defense scoring. But considering the amount of pressure Bears qbs were under I'm surprised they did as well as that.

The defense did no better IMO.

they gave up 21.9 points a game which was 16th in the NFL. 334 yrds a game which was 21st in the NFL. The secondary gave up 250 yrds a game and was 30th defending the pass. The run defense was pretty good but maybe team just passed all day.

So if the Bears don't have the weapons Broncos have, and Cutler is less effective, and they don't get better on defense, then will they really be that good this yr?
Da bears benefit greatly from the crappy NFCN schedule. I mean, playing the lions twice a year is a good thing. You never know what your gonna get with the viqueens and the puckers. They could be good, they could suck.

But I agree, there are some issues with da bears defense. Reputation has gotten them the benefit of the doubt. However, in reality, if the da bears field a mediocre defense they still can go far with Cutler.
Tombstone RJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:46 PM   #10
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 
Zimm to HOF

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Long Beach
Posts: 36,916
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CEH View Post
32 forced turnovers compared to 13 for Denver last year.
Big big differnce. I'd say they are going to give Cutler plenty of opportunities to score points.
Much more than the piss poor Denver D gave our O last year.
PPl tend to ignore that stat when comparing the offensive output of both teams.
good point
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:47 PM   #11
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 
Zimm to HOF

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Long Beach
Posts: 36,916
Default

I've seen bad defenses get a ton of turnovers before though. You ever know when you might start getting those or not getting them.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:48 PM   #12
baja
Happy camper
 
baja's Avatar
 
Sweet

Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: in the present moment
Posts: 60,148

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Ware
Default

Here is theur schedule;

Chicago
Home: Detroit, Green Bay, Minnesota, Arizona, St. Louis, Philadelphia, Cleveland, Pittsburgh
Away: Detroit, Green Bay, Minnesota, San Francisco, Seattle, Atlanta, Baltimore, Cincinnati
baja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:55 PM   #13
Popps
It's so easy
 
Popps's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 29,804
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
To tell you the truth I don't think I have cared enough about Bears to be informed on this team at all......Until now.

So you know I've been doing what everyone else has been doing. Snooping around, reading, checking stats, looking at the Bears depth chart and getting to know their depth chart.

Of course we all focused on the offensive line and WR, how will Jay do?

But people may be surprised to know that the Bears defense isn't as good as you think.

Bears offense scored 23.4 points a game with was 16th in the NFL.


A lot of good a "franchise" QB did us, huh?

The lowly Bears put as many points on the board as we did.
Popps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 03:59 PM   #14
cutthemdown
A verbis ad verbera
 
cutthemdown's Avatar
 
Zimm to HOF

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Long Beach
Posts: 36,916
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Popps View Post


A lot of good a "franchise" QB did us, huh?

The lowly Bears put as many points on the board as we did.
Broncos get a lot of yrds between the 20's but for some reason lately Shanny had a tough time being good in the redzone.

Broncos left a lot of points on the field over last 2 yrs.
cutthemdown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 04:11 PM   #15
anon
Seasoned Veteran
 

Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 290
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
Broncos get a lot of yrds between the 20's but for some reason lately Shanny had a tough time being good in the redzone.

Broncos left a lot of points on the field over last 2 yrs.
It's been that way with Shanny's Broncos for years: difficulty punching it in once the offense got close.

The Bears' team stats hint that a more balanced team can win just as many games as a team with a "great" offense and poor defense. Let's hope we hit with this mother lode of draft picks.
anon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 04:27 PM   #16
Kaylore
Because I am better
 
Kaylore's Avatar
 
Everything

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 46,779

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Pat Bowlen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by A.L.F. View Post
Why are we talking about the Bears? Why are we so worried about what they will look like next season, if their D is up to snuff or not?
The worse they are, the better our pick is. I hope they win 3-4 games. No more. No less.
Kaylore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 04:33 PM   #17
USMCBladerunner
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Two weeks from everywhere
Posts: 1,229

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Danny Trevathan
Default

I need to finish reading the whole first post, but I thought the Broncos were 16th in scoring...both can't be.
USMCBladerunner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 04:42 PM   #18
Popps
It's so easy
 
Popps's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 29,804
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by A.L.F. View Post
Why are we talking about the Bears? Why are we so worried about what they will look like next season, if their D is up to snuff or not?
Well, we have this little issue of a draft pick that could end up #1 or #30 overall. Some fans may find that somewhat significant.
Popps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 04:43 PM   #19
Kaylore
Because I am better
 
Kaylore's Avatar
 
Everything

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 46,779

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Pat Bowlen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bladerunner View Post
I need to finish reading the whole first post, but I thought the Broncos were 16th in scoring...both can't be.
Sure it can, if we scored the same number of points as them...and we did.

Edit: So I checked and the 2008 Broncos scored 370 making them 16th alone. According to NFL.com the Bears tied with the Vikings for 14th with 375 points each. Profootball reference shows us tied with the bears as the 16th best scoring offense.

FYI the Bears had the 16th best scoring defense.

Last edited by Kaylore; 04-07-2009 at 04:51 PM..
Kaylore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 04:52 PM   #20
RunSilentRunDeep
Ring of Famer
 
RunSilentRunDeep's Avatar
 
I root for laundry

Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,428

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Julius Thomas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CEH View Post
32 forced turnovers compared to 13 for Denver last year.
Big big differnce. I'd say they are going to give Cutler plenty of opportunities to score points.
Much more than the piss poor Denver D gave our O last year.
PPl tend to ignore that stat when comparing the offensive output of both teams.
Bingo. The Bears +17 and the Broncos -5 is far more important than any yardage total.
RunSilentRunDeep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 05:00 PM   #21
Kaylore
Because I am better
 
Kaylore's Avatar
 
Everything

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 46,779

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Pat Bowlen
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RunSilentRunDeep View Post
Bingo. The Bears +17 and the Broncos -5 is far more important than any yardage total.
The problem with that is it could be, and probably is, anomalous. Turnovers are pretty streaky team to team, year to year, even for the good defensive teams. For comparison, the only team to force fewer fumbles than the Broncos were the Bears, so all their turnovers came from interceptions. You can bet that they won't get near the number of interceptions they did next year versus this year.

The other issue to that differential you posted is giveaways, and Cutler was the second highest intercepted QB last year second only to (you guessed it) queen Favre. I have serious doubts that Cutler is going to throttle that down in his first season learning a new system. That's going to pull things down a bit for the Bears as well.
Kaylore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 05:48 PM   #22
CEH
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 4,132
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaylore View Post
The problem with that is it could be, and probably is, anomalous. Turnovers are pretty streaky team to team, year to year, even for the good defensive teams. For comparison, the only team to force fewer fumbles than the Broncos were the Bears, so all their turnovers came from interceptions. You can bet that they won't get near the number of interceptions they did next year versus this year.

The other issue to that differential you posted is giveaways, and Cutler was the second highest intercepted QB last year second only to (you guessed it) queen Favre. I have serious doubts that Cutler is going to throttle that down in his first season learning a new system. That's going to pull things down a bit for the Bears as well.
Cutler's INT to Pass ratio was like 1:31. Brees 1:34 BRoth 1:32

Bears are always up there in defensive turnovers. I expect to be even more aggresive with a better offense.

22,16,24,24,17 INTs the last five years. I'd bet the over at 19 in '09
CEH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 05:57 PM   #23
Kaylore
Because I am better
 
Kaylore's Avatar
 
Everything

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ceti Alpha V
Posts: 46,779

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Pat Bowlen
Default

Cutler also has a way worse redzone turnover ratio than either Brees or Roethlisberger. And to be fair, Big Ben didn't really have that good of a year last year.
Kaylore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 06:11 PM   #24
snowspot66
Ring of Famer
 

Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,841
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by broncofan7 View Post
Yes. They will be better this year with an improved offensive line and a better QB,a 2nd year RB and the defense will not feel as though they have to win games. Don't kid yourself into thinking that they are going to struggle to anywhere NEAR the level of our pending ineptitude.
Improved offensive line? Who? An old Pace? A 2nd year Williams coming off of back surgery and never having played a snap? It could just as easily be a disaster on the OL.

They'll get some wins just from being in the NFC North though.
snowspot66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2009, 06:15 PM   #25
broncosteven
Kranz Dictum
 
broncosteven's Avatar
 
Juwan The Headless Thompson Gunner!

Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Tranquility Base
Posts: 36,290

Adopt-a-Bronco:
Juwan Thompson
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by A.L.F. View Post
Why are we talking about the Bears? Why are we so worried about what they will look like next season, if their D is up to snuff or not?
Everyone is afraid that we made a bad move.

DA BEARS D is aging, Hillenmeyer is the lone LB that found a way to play himself out of starting.

They have a bad WR Corp who dropped a lot of balls the last couple of years.

I agree with the guy who said Tommie Harris makes others better.

Urlicker has a bad back he has peaked and now usually has a OL blocking him.

Briggs, who pulled the same thing Cutler did but worse 2 years ago, is the best player on the D at WILL.

They have issues at Safety and corner play is not consistent. The safety issues are more telling due to the cover 2 system and each playing 1/2 the field.

Cutler will help out their Oline as he can move and is healthy. Orton played on a bum knee 1/2 the year.

I think Cutler will get Bennet on the field this year.

Chris Williams and a healthy Orlando Pace are both improvements on the Oline, they actually have decent depth at tackle now on Paper.

I am guessing their 2nd round pick this year is either WR or Safety. They will not have to worry about picking a 1st round bust and can focus on talent that fits their system.

Their D faded down the stretch last year much like ours but they still have more talent than we do.
broncosteven is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes



Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:30 AM.


Denver Broncos