SEC and Big 12...a look at the two conferences

[lex]

OK, there has been some back and forth over who is the better conference. It doesnt necessarily matter so much because Kansas and South Carolina arent playing in the NC game. Nevertheless, if youre going to look at what it means to score a lot of points and gain a lot of yards in the two conferences, its worth looking at what the conference did as a whole. As you can see, even teams like Kansas scored a lot of points. Perhaps that says a lot about the defenses and inflated offensive numbers in the Big 12, or perhaps it doesnt.

The defensive stats of the two conferences are listed first.

  G  Pts/G  Yds/G  PassYds  RushYds
Texas  12  18.6  339.9  3196  883
Oklahoma 13  24.5  359.1  3290  1378
Texas Tech 12  26.3  371.6  2857  1602
Oklahoma St. 12  26.9  392.3  3222  1485
Missouri 13  27.5  414.2  3709  1676
Nebraska 12  29.2  361.5  2828  1510
Colorado 12  29.3  381.6  2584  1995
Baylor  12  29.3  393.2  3063  1655
Kansas  12  29.5  402.2  3306  1520
Kansas St. 12  35.8  479.1  3137  2612
Iowa St. 12  35.8  452.8  3320  2114
Texas A&M 12  37.4  461.9  2912  2631
  146     400.58  37,424    21,061 
         
  G  Pts/G  Yds/G  PassYds  RushYds
Florida  13  12.8  279.3  2262  1369
Alabama  13  13  256.9  2315  1025
Tennessee 12  16.8  263.5  1925  1237
Mississippi 12  17.8  294.8  2518  1020
Auburn  12  18  317.8  2146  1667
Vanderbilt 12  20.1  318.7  2084  1740
South Carolina 12  20.3  288.9  1923  1544
Kentucky 12  21.7  327  2215  1709
Mississippi St. 12  24.7  327.5  2119  1811
Georgia  12  25.6  318.3  2261  1559
LSU  12  25.9  326.5  2650  1268
Arkansas 12  31.2  375.2  2453  2049
  146     307.32  26,871    17,998 

  G  Pts/G  Yds/G  PassYds  RushYds
Oklahoma 13  54  562.1  4635  2672
Texas Tech 12  44.6  536.2  5007  1427
Texas  12  43.9  476.4  3594  2123
Missouri 13  43.2  497.5  4425  2042
Oklahoma St. 12  41.6  489.3  2799  3072
Nebraska 12  36.2  458.3  3417  2082
Kansas St. 12  34.9  402.1  3235  1590
Kansas  12  32.7  431.3  3628  1547
Baylor  12  28  376.4  2168  2349
Iowa St. 12  25.3  386.8  2981  1661
Texas A&M 12  25  340.9  3029  1062
Colorado 12  20.2  318.5  2328  1494
  146    440.869863 41,246    23,121 
         
  G  Pts/G  Yds/G  PassYds  RushYds
Florida  13  45.2  442.4  2764  2987
Georgia  12  32.1  433.9  3360  1847
Alabama  13  31.2  367.2  2219  2554
Mississippi 12  30.8  398.7  2583  2201
LSU  12  30.3  371.8  2454  2007
Kentucky 12  22.4  298.4  2030  1551
Arkansas 12  21.9  373.1  3115  1362
South Carolina 12  21.7  316.8  2622  1180
Vanderbilt 12  19.4  260.9  1473  1658
Auburn  12  17.3  302.9  1985  1650
Tennessee 12  17.3  268.8  1750  1475
Mississippi St. 12  15.3  276  2092  1220
  146    343.4178082 28,447    21,692

[epicSocialism4tw]

The SEC is a two team conference while the Big 12 has been extremely comptetitive throughout.

I am confident that Oklahoma State, Texas, or Texas Tech would have been represented in the SEC championship game yesterday.

SEC apologists like the author of this thread like to talk about defenses...your defensive numbers would suffer too if you were facing teams like Oklahoma, Tech, Missouri, Texas, Kansas, and Oklahoma State.

All of those teams had outstanding offenses led by extremely high-quality skill position players.

[lex]

Originally Posted by McSkillet

The SEC is a two team conference while the Big 12 has been extremely comptetitive throughout.

I am confident that Oklahoma State, Texas, or Texas Tech would have been represented in the SEC championship game yesterday.

SEC apologists like the author of this thread like to talk about defenses...your defensive numbers would suffer too if you were facing teams like Oklahoma, Tech, Missouri, Texas, Kansas, and Oklahoma State.

All of those teams had outstanding offenses led by extremely high-quality skill position players.

. If you think Baylor and Kansas would have averaged 28 and 32.7 pts per game, respectively in the SEC, youre high. Youre rampant homerism knows no bounds. Furhtermore, at the outset, I if its between UF and OU, its more about those two teams. But if youre going to get into the analysis of the conference its hard to not overlook some mediocre offenses also putting up some inflated offensive #s.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by lex

If you think Baylor and Kansas would have averaged 28 and 32.7 pts per game, respectively in the SEC, youre high. Youre rampant homerism knows no bounds. Furhtermore, at the outset, I if its between UF and OU, its more about those two teams. But if youre going to get into the analysis of the conference its hard to not overlook some mediocre offenses also putting up some inflated offensive #s.

Mediocre compared to what? The other offenses in the Big 12?

Give it up, dude.

You have been trying to make the argument all year that the SEC is somehow even competitive with the Big 12, which any avergage college football fan would probably disagree with. In other seasons the story may be different, but not this season.

Here's where the irony comes in...You know that defensive monster known as the SEC? It was won by the only team in the conference with a decent offense. Florida's defense is average.

You have been sopping up too much of that CBS SEC propaganda. On that note, that station's coverage of the SEC is no less ridiculous than NBC's Notre Dame coverage. If that was the only college football you watched all year, you would think that Tebow is the first pick in the upcoming draft and that there has never been a conference with as many "best teams ever"...as in "the Chargers are the best 8-8 team ever". Ridiculous.

[lex]

Originally Posted by McSkillet

Mediocre compared to what? The other offenses in the Big 12?

Give it up, dude.

You have been trying to make the argument all year that the SEC is somehow even competitive with the Big 12, which any avergage college football fan would probably disagree with. In other seasons the story may be different, but not this season.

Here's where the irony comes in...You know that defensive monster known as the SEC? It was won by the only team in the conference with a decent offense. Florida's defense is average.

You have been sopping up too much of that CBS SEC propaganda. On that note, that station's coverage of the SEC is no less ridiculous than NBC's Notre Dame coverage. If that was the only college football you watched all year, you would think that Tebow is the first pick in the upcoming draft and that there has never been a conference with as many "best teams ever"...as in "the Chargers are the best 8-8 team ever". Ridiculous.

You can go into whatever diatribe you want but Kansas does not average 32.7 points a game in the SEC. And you could go down the line.

[bombay]

Las Vegas bookmakers last week did hypothetical point spreads of all top 10 teams against each other. USC was the only team that was favored against all comers. Florida was favored against everyone but SC, Oklahoma against all but SC and Florida. Interesting about Oklahoma, since Texas took them out on a neutral field.

[TheChamp24]

You don't know what Kansas would average, and I think you hardly watched any big 12 games because the offenses are pretty good throughout. Kansas has a decent QB, with a pretty solid receiving core and an okay running game. I could say that if Miss averaged 30 points a game, Kansas could too.
I mean, you have some really crappy teams in the SEC in Tenn, Kentucky, Arkansas, Auburn, Miss State, heck I think LSU this year was pretty bad.

I will say, once again, I think you underestimate how good these offenses were in the Big 12.

[lex]

Originally Posted by jth1331

You don't know what Kansas would average, and I think you hardly watched any big 12 games because the offenses are pretty good throughout. Kansas has a decent QB, with a pretty solid receiving core and an okay running game. I could say that if Miss averaged 30 points a game, Kansas could too.
I mean, you have some really crappy teams in the SEC in Tenn, Kentucky, Arkansas, Auburn, Miss State, heck I think LSU this year was pretty bad.

I will say, once again, I think you underestimate how good these offenses were in the Big 12.

No. Ole Miss has 3 guys that play on the LOS that could potentially be #1 picks in Hardy, Oher, and Jerry. And then Jevan Snead was highly recruited and can play. Kansas doesnt have that kind of talent and certainly not upfront. Nice try though. Understand too, that Im not claiming the SEC is superior like you Big 12 homers but, rather, Im just pointing the flaws in saying the its better because they have better offense. Again, if a team like Kansas averages 32.7 or a team like Baylor averages 28, that calls for some scrutiny.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by lex

No. Ole Miss has 3 guys that play on the LOS that could potentially be #1 picks in Hardy, Oher, and Jerry. And then Jevan Snead was highly recruited and can play. Kansas doesnt have that kind of talent and certainly not upfront. Nice try though. Understand too, that Im not claiming the SEC is superior like you Big 12 homers but, rather, Im just pointing the flaws in saying the its better because they have better offense. Again, if a team like Kansas averages 32.7 or a team like Baylor averages 28, that calls for some scrutiny.

No.

The Big 12 is better because the teams are better. Kansas may not have a swath of first-round talent, but first-round talent does not make a college football team.

More self-imposed irony by yourself: you propose that teams are measured against one another based on first round talent in key positions; how does this explain the SEC propaganda wagon's insistence that Tebow is the reason why Florida wins big games? He's not a first round prospect.

[lex]

Originally Posted by McSkillet

No.

The Big 12 is better because the teams are better. Kansas may not have a swath of first-round talent, but first-round talent does not make a college football team.

More self-imposed irony by yourself: you propose that teams are measured against one another based on first round talent in key positions; how does this explain the SEC propaganda wagon's insistence that Tebow is the reason why Florida wins big games? He's not a first round prospect.

No, obviously simply being in the Big 12 makes you a better team...it has nothing to do with talent...especially to Big 12 homers like you. And Im not even going to attempt to unwind the twisted logic in that last remark.

[bombay]

These discussions generally don't go anywhere, but I'll put in my two cents anyway. I don't think the SEC was as deep in quality teams this season as they usually are. Auburn, Tennessee, LSU, and to some extent Georgia weren't as good as they are most seasons. The Big XII, on the other hand, was deeper - in the South anyway - than it usually is. From Texas through Okie State, quality teams all. The wheels came off at Missouri after the Oklahoma St loss, so it's kind of hard to quantify them, but in general the North sucked.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by lex

No, obviously simply being in the Big 12 makes you a better team...it has nothing to do with talent...especially to Big 12 homers like you. And Im not even going to attempt to unwind the twisted logic in that last remark.

It was your twisted logic.

Also, the simple idea that the SEC has been in anyway as competitive as the Big 12 because the SEC "plays defense" is about as ignorant as it gets. Its as if you just sat awestruck in front of the CBS production of every SEC game this year and sopped up every bit of syrup they spewed to promote their games.

[Garcia Bronco]

The SEC is the tougher conference year in and out. The Big 12 might have the touger teams this year. It's hard to say. But when Florida probably beats OU, what does that mean?

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco

The SEC is the tougher conference year in and out. The Big 12 might have the touger teams this year. It's hard to say. But when Florida probably beats OU, what does that mean?

It's pretty funny that people are already counting Oklahoma out.

Oklahoma has seen the tougher competition and has produced the convincing results against highly ranked opponents.

Not only that, but this is the best offense of the past century in college football.

I'm sure that Stoops is happy to go in the underdog.

[Garcia Bronco]

Originally Posted by McSkillet

It's pretty funny that people are already counting Oklahoma out.

Oklahoma has seen the tougher competition and has produced the convincing results against highly ranked opponents.

Not only that, but this is the best offense of the past century in college football.

I'm sure that Stoops is happy to go in the underdog.

I think you can throw all that stuff out the window. OU is good, damn good. You could see it in the Mizzou game. It's like the teams were playing at two completely different speeds, but Florida has that same speed and the more experienced team. I think they win it, and the score will probably be 24 to 20.

I hope Florida wins for one reason: Bob Stoops is a classless jerk. Running up the score like that was just classless.

[SoonerBronco]

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco

I think you can throw all that stuff out the window. OU is good, damn good. You could see it in the Mizzou game. It's like the teams were playing at two completely different speeds, but Florida has that same speed and the more experienced team. I think they win it, and the score will probably be 24 to 20.

I hope Florida wins for one reason: Bob Stoops is a classless jerk. Running up the score like that was just classless.

Don't start it.

Do a little research and see how many points OU scored 1st half and 2nd half of games this year, you'll see the "classy" aspect of Stoops.

Again, his TEAM was going for a record that has stood for almost 90 years. It was important to them, and they deserved the chance to break it.

Funny you mention class when OU plays Mizzou and that fat, booger eating, bulliten board material making assclown Chase Daniel.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco

I think you can throw all that stuff out the window. OU is good, damn good. You could see it in the Mizzou game. It's like the teams were playing at two completely different speeds, but Florida has that same speed and the more experienced team. I think they win it, and the score will probably be 24 to 20.

I hope Florida wins for one reason: Bob Stoops is a classless jerk. Running up the score like that was just classless.

OU hung 60+ on the #2 team in the country...they had 42 at half.

They hung 60+ on the #13 team in the country, having to outscore a talented and motivated OSU.

The Sooners' 60 point games were all done in fine taste, with the second-half scoring coming for the major part by the running game.

I'm not sure why you are hung up on this "classless" idea...maybe you have a little brother that got punked by Bradford or something...I dont know, but there is no reason to cling to an unfounded idea like that unless you are bitter about something else and need a reason to explain the phenomenon away.

The Sooners have been flat-out dominant. When I have some more time, Ill put the stats up here.

[Garcia Bronco]

Originally Posted by SoonerBronco

Don't start it.

Do a little research and see how many points OU scored 1st half and 2nd half of games this year, you'll see the "classy" aspect of Stoops.

Again, his TEAM was going for a record that has stood for almost 90 years. It was important to them, and they deserved the chance to break it.

Funny you mention class when OU plays Mizzou and that fat, booger eating, bulliten board material making assclown Chase Daniel.

Both of you don't give me that crap, love ya and all, but they had them beat 6 ways to Sunday with 4 minutes left and were throwing the down field. I was embarassed for them.

[SoonerBronco]

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco

Both of you don't give me that crap, love ya and all, but they had them beat 6 ways to Sunday with 4 minutes left and were throwing the down field. I was embarassed for them.

You damned grouch!

[DenverBrit]

When OU played mighty FL State for the NC, they were double digit underdogs.
I recall a lot of talk about how the OU defense would be demolished and that OU didn't belong in the game.

Hopefully, we'll see a similar OU performance against the other 'FL' team.

[ohiobronco2]

It will be interesting to see how much pressure the great FL team puts on Bradford. I thought Wilson had a lot of time to throw against FL and I believe that Oklahoma has a better line, with much better skill players.

[DenverBrit]

Forgive me Sooners fans...I was wrong about your team
Dec 28, 2008 | 7:01PM | report this
OK...I have seen the light.

It all makes sense now.

No, I'm not a Sooners fan, but I have started to look hard at the FedEx Championship Game with a no-nonsense approach and have come up with a few reasons why the Gators will lose this game. No.... wait.

A lot of reasons.

The Sooners have faced seven top twenty five scoring offenses this season while the Gators have faced none. Oklahoma has had a much tougher challenge and they have been monsters on offense. The highest ranked scoring offense the Gators have faced is Florida State at No. 27. When you don't play prolific offenses, you are beating teams who don't post a lot of points. Spin it all you want, but Florida's D ranking is inflated due to the level of their opponents offense, while Oklahoma's D ranking is deflated due to the proliferation of their opponents' offenses.

Six of the top twenty passing offenses in the nation went up against Oklahoma, and except for one, couldn't beat the Sooners. Florida faced one top twenty passing offense - Georgia - who averages 280 yards in the air. Compare that average against a team like Texas Tech, who averages 417 yards, or Mizzou, who averages 380 yards, and suddenly, the defensive stats mean nothing and should be heavily discounted. The fact that the Sooners beat five of the six best top twenty passing offenses means a lot. Advantage Sooners.

The Heisman curse is alive and well. Only one Heisman winner has won a BCS Championship Game in the year he won the Heisman- Matt Leinart of USC. Last year Heisman winner Tim Tebow's Gators lost to Michigan in the Capital One Bowl, and although it's not a BCS game, the curse is now spreading to other bowls. Sam Bradford could be the next victim. Advantage Gators.

Injuries are prevalent on both sides, but the Gators' are very alarming. Two safeties and a linebacker have torn ACL's, and while the Gators have an excellent LB in Brandon Spikes, they are thin in the secondary. On the flip side, the Sooners lost a lineman (Granger) and a huge play maker - DeMarco Murray - who can run, catch and terrorize kicking teams. While the Sooners have another two running backs (Madu and Brown) who can fill Murray's shoes, the explosiveness of his big-play potential will be missed. But back to the Gators- is being thin in the secondary against Sam Bradford comforting? The Sooners pass for over 356 yards a game, and those DBs will be needing lots of rotations to keep fresh. Advantage Sooners.

Coaching is somewhat of an intangible, but we'll address it here. Meyer is 2-0 in BCS Bowls- a Fiesta Bowl win and a National Championship. Stoops is 2-4 in BCS Bowls, losing his last four, but winning a National Championship and a Rose Bowl. The Sooners have been embarrassed twice on a national stage, and that has to haunt their psyches just a bit even if those were different teams. Last year's debacle wasn't that long ago, and the chip on their shoulder may make them come out angry. Or curl up in the fetal position i####ame-changing play occurs. Advantage Gators.

Home field advantage is somewhat overrated- unless you don't have to travel out of state. While the tickets have been evenly distributed to both teams' fans, there will be more Chomp Chomps than Boomer Sooners in the stands. The Sooners have major travel plans while the Gators have a 285 mile road trip due south. Does it make a difference? Sure it can, especially when you are in different time zones, but east-to-west is harder on the body than west-to-east. Unless it snows in Miami Gardens, the Sooners will feel like visitors. Advantage Gators.

Final analysis: the Oklahoma Sooners' D is just fine, thank you very much. They have played some of the best offenses in the country and won convincingly. Their loss to Texas seems a bit more forgiveable than Florida's loss to Ole Miss. And no, Ole Miss isn't in the same league as Texas Tech, and will be exposed as a midling in the Cotton Bowl right before your very eyes.

The Gators are in the BCS Championship Game because of the perceived dominance of the SEC, but the reality is, the SEC is not nearly as strong as the Big 12, judging by play so far this year. Penn State, USC, Texas, Texas Tech and Utah all have just as a legitimate claim to be in the Championship Game as the Sooners and the Gators, which really makes this championship mythical, once again.

The winner will be crowned, but it won't mean any conference is better than another- it will just mean that one of two teams chosen to play is better than the other. So please, Big 12 fans, don't start those inane "B-I-G- 1-2" chants when you hoist that crystal trophy. Remember, Baylor is part of the Big 12, and so is Iowa State. They didn't earn that trophy. You did.

Oklahoma 47 Florida 31
http://community.foxsports.com/blogs...bout_your_team

[lex]

Originally Posted by DenverBrit

Forgive me Sooners fans...I was wrong about your team
Dec 28, 2008 | 7:01PM | report this
OK...I have seen the light.

It all makes sense now.

No, I'm not a Sooners fan, but I have started to look hard at the FedEx Championship Game with a no-nonsense approach and have come up with a few reasons why the Gators will lose this game. No.... wait.

A lot of reasons.

The Sooners have faced seven top twenty five scoring offenses this season while the Gators have faced none. Oklahoma has had a much tougher challenge and they have been monsters on offense. The highest ranked scoring offense the Gators have faced is Florida State at No. 27. When you don't play prolific offenses, you are beating teams who don't post a lot of points. Spin it all you want, but Florida's D ranking is inflated due to the level of their opponents offense, while Oklahoma's D ranking is deflated due to the proliferation of their opponents' offenses.

Six of the top twenty passing offenses in the nation went up against Oklahoma, and except for one, couldn't beat the Sooners. Florida faced one top twenty passing offense - Georgia - who averages 280 yards in the air. Compare that average against a team like Texas Tech, who averages 417 yards, or Mizzou, who averages 380 yards, and suddenly, the defensive stats mean nothing and should be heavily discounted. The fact that the Sooners beat five of the six best top twenty passing offenses means a lot. Advantage Sooners.

The Heisman curse is alive and well. Only one Heisman winner has won a BCS Championship Game in the year he won the Heisman- Matt Leinart of USC. Last year Heisman winner Tim Tebow's Gators lost to Michigan in the Capital One Bowl, and although it's not a BCS game, the curse is now spreading to other bowls. Sam Bradford could be the next victim. Advantage Gators.

Injuries are prevalent on both sides, but the Gators' are very alarming. Two safeties and a linebacker have torn ACL's, and while the Gators have an excellent LB in Brandon Spikes, they are thin in the secondary. On the flip side, the Sooners lost a lineman (Granger) and a huge play maker - DeMarco Murray - who can run, catch and terrorize kicking teams. While the Sooners have another two running backs (Madu and Brown) who can fill Murray's shoes, the explosiveness of his big-play potential will be missed. But back to the Gators- is being thin in the secondary against Sam Bradford comforting? The Sooners pass for over 356 yards a game, and those DBs will be needing lots of rotations to keep fresh. Advantage Sooners.

Coaching is somewhat of an intangible, but we'll address it here. Meyer is 2-0 in BCS Bowls- a Fiesta Bowl win and a National Championship. Stoops is 2-4 in BCS Bowls, losing his last four, but winning a National Championship and a Rose Bowl. The Sooners have been embarrassed twice on a national stage, and that has to haunt their psyches just a bit even if those were different teams. Last year's debacle wasn't that long ago, and the chip on their shoulder may make them come out angry. Or curl up in the fetal position i####ame-changing play occurs. Advantage Gators.

Home field advantage is somewhat overrated- unless you don't have to travel out of state. While the tickets have been evenly distributed to both teams' fans, there will be more Chomp Chomps than Boomer Sooners in the stands. The Sooners have major travel plans while the Gators have a 285 mile road trip due south. Does it make a difference? Sure it can, especially when you are in different time zones, but east-to-west is harder on the body than west-to-east. Unless it snows in Miami Gardens, the Sooners will feel like visitors. Advantage Gators.

Final analysis: the Oklahoma Sooners' D is just fine, thank you very much. They have played some of the best offenses in the country and won convincingly. Their loss to Texas seems a bit more forgiveable than Florida's loss to Ole Miss. And no, Ole Miss isn't in the same league as Texas Tech, and will be exposed as a midling in the Cotton Bowl right before your very eyes.

The Gators are in the BCS Championship Game because of the perceived dominance of the SEC, but the reality is, the SEC is not nearly as strong as the Big 12, judging by play so far this year. Penn State, USC, Texas, Texas Tech and Utah all have just as a legitimate claim to be in the Championship Game as the Sooners and the Gators, which really makes this championship mythical, once again.

The winner will be crowned, but it won't mean any conference is better than another- it will just mean that one of two teams chosen to play is better than the other. So please, Big 12 fans, don't start those inane "B-I-G- 1-2" chants when you hoist that crystal trophy. Remember, Baylor is part of the Big 12, and so is Iowa State. They didn't earn that trophy. You did.

Oklahoma 47 Florida 31
http://community.foxsports.com/blogs...bout_your_team

OK, we'll see. None of those teams were Florida which is one of the few teams that actually has the athletes to win more "in space" battles against Oklahoma. Football is like boxing, its a game of matchups.

Something else to consider. OU has a QB whose game greatly depends on him throwing in the pocket...or at least more than UF. Because of Tebows ability to scramble, his level of play might be less susceptible to rustyness.

[Kid A]

Bowl Count:

Big XII is at 2-1 (an unimpressive win my a listless Mizzou, an expected ass kicking by Kansas, and a shootout loss for Okie St to an Oregon team that just beat them down at the end)

SEC is at 2-0 (nice upset win for Vandy to get first bowl win since 1955, impressive steamrolling of Georgia Tech by LSU)

Obviously the bowl tally is hardly a conclusive marker, but it is interesting to see how conferences perform in these games. Big ones will be to see how Texas and Alabama handle their respective games and, of course, the title game.

[DenverBrit]

Originally Posted by lex

OK, we'll see. None of those teams were Florida which is one of the few teams that actually has the athletes to win more "in space" battles against Oklahoma. Football is like boxing, its a game of matchups.

Something else to consider. OU has a QB whose game greatly depends on him throwing in the pocket...or at least more than UF. Because of Tebows ability to scramble, his level of play might be less susceptible to rustyness.

It should be a hell of a game if both teams play to their potential.