Well, Who Won? - The Orange Mane

frerottenextelway · 09-26-2008, 07:38 PM

poll coming

UPDATE:

Quick CNN Poll (telephone poll)

Obama wins 51-35

CBS Telephone Poll

40% Obama Wins
38% Tie
22% McCain won

theAPAOps5 · 09-26-2008, 07:40 PM

I thought McCain was really doing well until Foreign Policy and then I think McCain lost his cool and went into attack mode. So in my mind Obama slightly won.

kappys · 09-26-2008, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brick

I thought McCain was really doing well until Foreign Policy and then I think McCain lost his cool and went into attack mode. So in my mind Obama slightly won.

I agree - Mccain held the early edge but didn't quite match Obama on foreign policy particularly regarding Iran IMO.

frerottenextelway · 09-26-2008, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brick

I thought McCain was really doing well until Foreign Policy and then I think McCain lost his cool and went into attack mode. So in my mind Obama slightly won.

Same. I thought that was weird, McCain score more on economics and Obama scored more on foreign policy. Supposed to be the other way around.

Gergen on CNN completly disagree with us.

frerottenextelway · 09-26-2008, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kappys

I agree - Mccain held the early edge but didn't quite match Obama on foreign policy particularly regarding Iran IMO.

On the caring about the troops, McCain kinda got pwned when O had his own moving story.

kappys · 09-26-2008, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frerottenextelway

Same. I thought that was weird, McCain score more on economics and Obama scored more on foreign policy. Supposed to be the other way around.

Gergen on CNN completly disagree with us.

Well our small board seems to be reaching some small consensus on the debate.

frerottenextelway · 09-26-2008, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kappys

Well our small board seems to be reaching some small consensus on the debate.

Bennett on CNN completely disagrees with us too. Weird - I'm watching bizarro world.

frerottenextelway · 09-26-2008, 07:46 PM

The completely impartial MarKOS

Quote:

Obama was forceful, poised, presidential, blah blah blah blah. You can get that **** on TV.

Here's what really struck me: Obama's biggest weakness is the notion that he's not ready or experienced enough. It was the basis of many a McCain attack: "Senator Obama doesn't understand/doesn't get it..." He flat out accused Obama of not having the judgement to lead at one point.

Obama fought back by speaking at length on every issue, aided by a format that allowed him to speak beyond 30 second sound bites, and he name dropped countries and foreign leaders by the bucketful, to underscore the fact that he knows what he's talking about. It was very effective.

There were no gaffes, and no obvious YouTube moments, so if nothing else, this debate maybe reinforced Obama's fit to be president, but I don't think that line of attack has had much salience beyond the wingnut sense anyway.

And given where McCain is in the polls (lagging and getting worse), this wasn't what he needed tonight.

And given that the status quo probably remains, in a debate that was supposed to focus more on McCain's "strength" (national security), Obama wins.

----

One other point -- Lehrer was the best moderator, BY FAR, of any debate this season. And the audience was perfectly behaved. A triumphal debate. Perfect. Kudos to everyone involved in making it happen

enjolras · 09-26-2008, 07:47 PM

I don't think McCain 'won' on economics, I think he simply did better than I was expecting.

cutthemdown · 09-26-2008, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brick

I thought McCain was really doing well until Foreign Policy and then I think McCain lost his cool and went into attack mode. So in my mind Obama slightly won.

Really because I thought he showed great restraint as Obama mocked him a few times. Also Obama was calling him John McCain instead of Senator McCain another slight. At the end he started calling him Senator McCain but I think that was a ploy.

The debate had no clear winner IMO.

L.A. BRONCOS FAN · 09-26-2008, 07:48 PM

When the fact checking is complete, the record will show that McCain is still a world-class liar.

Everytime he lied through his teeth about his support for veterans I wanted to puke.

baja · 09-26-2008, 07:49 PM

I don't vote in secret polls

I say Obama by a little.

enjolras · 09-26-2008, 07:49 PM

McCain won!!!!!!!!!

At least according to the McCain camp... of course they posted this several hours ago long before the debate happened

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.co...-has-alre.html

jsco70 · 09-26-2008, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

The debate had no clear winner IMO.

This in my opinion equals a victory for Obama. McCain should have won the foreign policy debate based on his "experience." Didn't happen. Edge to Obama.

mhgaffney · 09-26-2008, 07:51 PM

Nobody won.

The American people lost -- because both Obama and McCain showed they are clueless about the wider world we live in. Both stated untruths about the recent Georgia War, the Mideast mess, Pakistan and Afghanistan.

How absurd that both men are still projecting the hubris that got us into the mess we are in. The truth is that we are bankrupt as a nation -- both morally and in our pocketbook due to the void of leadership, massive deficit spending, pervasive corruption on Wall Street and in Washington that has caused a financial melt down, and our chronic failure to learn from history.

Obama is the least bad choice -- because McCain is a lunatic -- but that ain't saying much. G-d help America.

MHG

baja · 09-26-2008, 07:51 PM

I will say mccain did surprise me with how well he did do. Still Obama by a little

SoCalBronco · 09-26-2008, 07:54 PM

I thought that was a solid debate.

OrangeDoofus · 09-26-2008, 07:57 PM

Nobody got in a knockout punch. Since foreign policy was supposed to be home field for McCain, and he's trailing right now and didn't do anything to change that, it's a win for Obama.

kappys · 09-26-2008, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCalBronco

I thought that was a solid debate.

As solid as any of these presidential debates. Like most of them they tend to outline generalities more than specifics.

I though Mccain scored points when he brought up that the surge in Iraq has "worked (which depends entirely on your definition of work)" But neither really outlined any real plans for the future in Iraq and at least Obama emphasized the need to start removing troops.

theAPAOps5 · 09-26-2008, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

Really because I thought he showed great restraint as Obama mocked him a few times. Also Obama was calling him John McCain instead of Senator McCain another slight. At the end he started calling him Senator McCain but I think that was a ploy.

The debate had no clear winner IMO.

You see the one I saw mocking was McCain. AT times he talked down to Obama and when Obama went on the attack it clearly flustered McCain. McCain was bouncing around fidgeting, and on edge. Much like he had Obama at the start.

frerottenextelway · 09-26-2008, 08:02 PM

P'bly the most memorable moment of a debate that had very few of them

theAPAOps5 · 09-26-2008, 08:03 PM

I agree it kind of sputtered as a debate. It got frustrating watching both candidates dance around the issues.

frerottenextelway · 09-26-2008, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brick

You see the one I saw mocking was McCain. AT times he talked down to Obama and when Obama went on the attack it clearly flustered McCain. McCain was bouncing around fidgeting, and on edge. Much like he had Obama at the start.

Same here. Seems to be a majority opinion out there that McCain was condenscending.

Traveler · 09-26-2008, 08:04 PM

Draw.

Vega$Bronco · 09-26-2008, 08:05 PM

It's no secret I'm for Obama, but I think McCain won. I wonder who is prepping Obama for these debates? Why did he keep saying I agree with McCain... you don't agree with your opponnet. And when McCain talked about Obama didn't have the understanding to lead he should have zapped him with "You don't have the temperment to lead." And when McCain kept talking about nuclear waste, Obama went to the tip bringing up Arizona but then stopped... He should have said you don't want it in your backyard but you want to ship it to Yucca mountain. And why did Obama let McCain dictate the debate talking about taxes and pork barrel spending... McCain failed to mention Palin's Alaskan pork barrel requests... I'm done.

09-26-2008, 07:38 PM	#1
frerottenextelway █████ █████ Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: █████ Posts: 7,888 Adopt-a-Bronco: ██	Well, Who Won? poll coming UPDATE: Quick CNN Poll (telephone poll) Obama wins 51-35 CBS Telephone Poll 40% Obama Wins 38% Tie 22% McCain won Last edited by frerottenextelway; 09-26-2008 at 08:39 PM..

09-26-2008, 07:54 PM	#17
SoCalBronco Nixonite Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Arcadia, CA Posts: 33,313 Adopt-a-Bronco: D.J. Williams	I thought that was a solid debate. __________________ ITS A PLAYOFF HOCKEY NIGHT IN PITTSBURGH!

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09-26-2008, 07:40 PM	#2
theAPAOps5 A new beginning! Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Denver Posts: 26,058 Adopt-a-Bronco: Watermock - RIP	I thought McCain was really doing well until Foreign Policy and then I think McCain lost his cool and went into attack mode. So in my mind Obama slightly won.

09-26-2008, 07:47 PM	#9
enjolras Ring of Famer Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 6,941	I don't think McCain 'won' on economics, I think he simply did better than I was expecting.

09-26-2008, 07:48 PM	#11
L.A. BRONCOS FAN Mo' holla fo' yo' dolla! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: In a bunker in an undisclosed location Posts: 52,694	When the fact checking is complete, the record will show that McCain is still a world-class liar. Everytime he lied through his teeth about his support for veterans I wanted to puke.

09-26-2008, 07:49 PM	#12
baja It is what it Is. Pay attention. Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 53,912 Adopt-a-Bronco: Buy My Book	I don't vote in secret polls I say Obama by a little.

09-26-2008, 07:51 PM	#15
mhgaffney Ring of Famer Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 9,779	Nobody won. The American people lost -- because both Obama and McCain showed they are clueless about the wider world we live in. Both stated untruths about the recent Georgia War, the Mideast mess, Pakistan and Afghanistan. How absurd that both men are still projecting the hubris that got us into the mess we are in. The truth is that we are bankrupt as a nation -- both morally and in our pocketbook due to the void of leadership, massive deficit spending, pervasive corruption on Wall Street and in Washington that has caused a financial melt down, and our chronic failure to learn from history. Obama is the least bad choice -- because McCain is a lunatic -- but that ain't saying much. G-d help America. MHG

09-26-2008, 07:57 PM	#18
OrangeDoofus Ring of Famer (nationalchamps.net/Helmet_Project) Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 2,318	Nobody got in a knockout punch. Since foreign policy was supposed to be home field for McCain, and he's trailing right now and didn't do anything to change that, it's a win for Obama.

09-26-2008, 08:02 PM	#21
frerottenextelway █████ █████ Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: █████ Posts: 7,888 Adopt-a-Bronco: ██	P'bly the most memorable moment of a debate that had very few of them

09-26-2008, 08:03 PM	#22
theAPAOps5 A new beginning! Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Denver Posts: 26,058 Adopt-a-Bronco: Watermock - RIP	I agree it kind of sputtered as a debate. It got frustrating watching both candidates dance around the issues.

09-26-2008, 08:04 PM	#24
Traveler Traveling Man! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 4,411 Adopt-a-Bronco: Ryan Clady	Draw.

09-26-2008, 08:05 PM	#25
Vega$Bronco Seasoned Veteran Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Fabulous Las Vegas Posts: 419	It's no secret I'm for Obama, but I think McCain won. I wonder who is prepping Obama for these debates? Why did he keep saying I agree with McCain... you don't agree with your opponnet. And when McCain talked about Obama didn't have the understanding to lead he should have zapped him with "You don't have the temperment to lead." And when McCain kept talking about nuclear waste, Obama went to the tip bringing up Arizona but then stopped... He should have said you don't want it in your backyard but you want to ship it to Yucca mountain. And why did Obama let McCain dictate the debate talking about taxes and pork barrel spending... McCain failed to mention Palin's Alaskan pork barrel requests... I'm done.