Marcus Thomas - The Orange Mane

SleepingTiger · 02-25-2008, 01:34 PM

Is he any good? I see alot of people praising Marcus, but he is invisible for most of the games. Anybody see different than I did?

Beantown Bronco · 02-25-2008, 01:37 PM

some stuff here:

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthr...=marcus+thomas

and here:

http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=65370

Gcver2ver3 · 02-25-2008, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleepingTiger

Is he any good? I see alot of people praising Marcus, but he is invisible for most of the games. Anybody see different than I did?

It would be terrific for him to turn the corner this year...we need it...

i wouldn't say he was invisible but he didn't make a ton of big plays either...

i think he'll be good...

Dempsey Dog · 02-25-2008, 02:25 PM

We got him because his draft stock dropped, not because of talent, but because of off-field issues. I think he could be pretty good.

I am thinking Tommy Blake, the highly talented DE from TCU who will probably drop to the 4th or so because of off-field issues, could be good. I hate the fact we gamble on guys sometimes, but if we must, what are the thoughts on the mane?

cmhargrove · 02-25-2008, 02:36 PM

I'll also add that I think he was misused last year. Honestly, we just didn't even have the right personnel to run the Bates system. Marcus Thomas was good at Florida because he used his speed and athleticism to break through the line and disrupt the backfield - that was his strength. Last year, we asked him to "stack the line" and he was often fighting against double teams.

If Slowik goes back to our previous system and starts trying to cut the gaps and bring creative blitzes, Thomas should have much more of an impact. I think last year was a great learning year, and the skills he learned should help him in short yardage defenses.

Most rookie DT's don't make an impact. His playing time was a huge bonus for his growth. I don't expect that he will ever be a game breaker. But I think he could be as effective as Gerrard Warren was (when he was trying hard). And, I think that is a good thing. He should be a solid player for us. If we can find some better talent to stick next to him, I think he will play up to that level also.

Also, remember that he hadn't been in game situation for quite a while (due to his suspension), so it probably took him a while to get back into "football shape." He should be in much better shape by TC this year.

chrisp · 02-25-2008, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleepingTiger

Is he any good? I see alot of people praising Marcus, but he is invisible for most of the games. Anybody see different than I did?

Virtually all D-linemen are invisible their 1st year - Trevor Pryce wasn't exactly a probowler in his first year either (in fact I think he saw less playing time than Thomas did).

Jury's still out on him but he remains talented with a ton of upside and nothing can be read into his rookie year performance, except for the fact that he did see playing time and was a legit part of the rotation: sometimes even the best DTs just warm the bench for some or all fo the first year, although we did have pretty poor starters this year so maybe that means little....

BroncoBuff · 02-25-2008, 02:58 PM

DTs were my special obsession this past season, as I played, replayed, re-replayed, and re-re-replayed over and over and over, wearing out my Tivo buttons watching them - feeding my obsessive hostility toward Amon Gordon.

My take: MT got pushed around pretty good early in the season ... spent alotta time mimicking Amon's signature move of giving up on beating his blocker, and instead just jumping up and down in front of the blocker with an arm outstretched in the general direction of the quarterback

But toward the middle of the season, that all changed for Marcus ... I don't know if the change coincided with scrapping the Bates system, or coincided with MT intercepting that pass and returning it nicely about 25 yards, but something changed and he became a lot more effective. He moves side to side really well, and blockers had a helluva time getting their hands into him when he was moving laterally ... and he started penetrating much better than he had, (although sometimes too much as the play went past him). Remember he only played the first month of his senior season, so he made the daunting jump from college to NFL with a rusty game.

Now I think he's a fixture guy on the D-Line - a decade long starter with Pro Bowl potential. The problem is he's our only certain keeper for '08 ... Mallard, McKinley and Burton are just street free agents, so we have alotta work to do at that spot ... we had the worst DT unit in the league last year...

lex · 02-25-2008, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncoBuff

DTs were my special obsession this past season, as I played, replayed, re-replayed, and re-re-replayed over and over and over, wearing out my Tivo buttons watching them - feeding my obsessive hostility toward Amon Gordon.

My take: MT got pushed around pretty good early in the season ... spent alotta time mimicking Amon's signature move of giving up on beating his blocker, and instead just jumping up and down in front of the blocker with an arm outstretched in the general direction of the quarterback

But toward the middle of the season, that all changed for Marcus ... I don't know if the change coincided with scrapping the Bates system, or coincided with MT intercepting that pass and returning it nicely about 25 yards, but something changed and he became a lot more effective. He moves side to side really well, and blockers had a helluva time getting their hands into him when he was moving laterally ... and he started penetrating much better than he had, (although sometimes too much as the play went past him). Remember he only played the first month of his senior season, so he made the daunting jump from college to NFL with a rusty game.

Now I think he's a fixture guy on the D-Line - a decade long starter with Pro Bowl potential. The problem is he's our only certain keeper for '08 ... Mallard, McKinley and Burton are just street free agents, so we have alotta work to do at that spot ... we had the worst DT unit in the league last year...

I thought I was the only one who had this kind of a grievance againts Amon Gordon. Basically, I did a lot of what youre saying about replaying games from the first pre-season game vs Amon Gordon. From the moment I saw Amon Gordon's name flashed up on the screen in that SF game, I knew we were in trouble. I also attentively watched Thomas. When watching him I was focused on things as basic as holding ones ground when double teamed, as this was something Amon Gordon was incredibly deficient in. He was pushed around in one-on-one scenarios as if he was being double teamed. But having also paid attention to this, I have to say that Thomas was showing signs as early as the Dallas preseason game. Up until that point he didnt look that great but I noticed he was more stalwart at holding his ground and certainly better than Gordon, even then. But thats actually not his strength, so what does that say about Gordon when a rookie is better than him in something that he isnt really even supposed to be good at?

Like a lot of rookies, Thomas was sporadic for a while then seemed to get some traction ( I think at about the point youre talkig about) then I think at the end he hit the wall a little bit.

But Thomas, if used properly, could easily be our best DLineman. Time will tell. In college, Thomas always seemed to be at his best in big games, where hed often be a wrecking ball. Florida won a national championship mainly because they had a great DLine and Safety. And if you saw the NC game you know why. Thomas didnt even play in that game and he was probably the best DLineman on the team during the time he was on the team.

Edit-- I would also like to add that I think he would greatly benefit by getting stronger in the upper-body.

Dudeskey · 02-25-2008, 08:23 PM

Most rookie DT's aren't going to be lights out... Their numbers won't be as gaudy as say, a rookie HB.

That One Guy · 02-25-2008, 08:31 PM

Either way, it's better than GBs first round DT who I don't think was even active for a game last year and with the franchising of Corey Williams, may still not be looking at a large role. Anything is better than bench time.

bpc · 02-25-2008, 08:44 PM

Seldomly do rookies come in and dominate. We didn't use him right either. He needs some help around him.

I would love to see him and Robertson playing next to each other... i think they are both power players that could wreak a lot of havok on opposing offenses.

TheReverend · 02-26-2008, 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncoBuff

DTs were my special obsession this past season, as I played, replayed, re-replayed, and re-re-replayed over and over and over, wearing out my Tivo buttons watching them - feeding my obsessive hostility toward Amon Gordon.

My take: MT got pushed around pretty good early in the season ... spent alotta time mimicking Amon's signature move of giving up on beating his blocker, and instead just jumping up and down in front of the blocker with an arm outstretched in the general direction of the quarterback

But toward the middle of the season, that all changed for Marcus ... I don't know if the change coincided with scrapping the Bates system, or coincided with MT intercepting that pass and returning it nicely about 25 yards, but something changed and he became a lot more effective. He moves side to side really well, and blockers had a helluva time getting their hands into him when he was moving laterally ... and he started penetrating much better than he had, (although sometimes too much as the play went past him). Remember he only played the first month of his senior season, so he made the daunting jump from college to NFL with a rusty game.

Now I think he's a fixture guy on the D-Line - a decade long starter with Pro Bowl potential. The problem is he's our only certain keeper for '08 ... Mallard, McKinley and Burton are just street free agents, so we have alotta work to do at that spot ... we had the worst DT unit in the league last year...

Just to clarify...

You have an obsession with watching 2007's DTs
MT comes on midseason
Might be due to his interception

I'd completely support this logic chain if his INT hadn't come in Week 2.

Just ****in with ya Buff, you know I love ya.

BroncoBuff · 02-26-2008, 04:23 AM

Whatever ... if you spent that much time analyzing football, your posts would probably be better.

Just ****in with ya Rev, you know I love ya.

cutthemdown · 02-26-2008, 04:29 AM

We will know soon enough. I thought it seemed like he wasn't used right. He isn't huge and the take on blocker type. I thought towards end of year when he started to be asked to disrupt and penetrate he started to show some flashes. I think though he needs to get bigger though. Hopefully this yr he will have 5-10 pounds more of muscle to work with.

fontaine · 02-26-2008, 04:29 AM

The best thing for Thomas is to have a genuine two gap run stopper beside him.

Thomas isn't a run stuffer, or a guy who's strength is to occupy two blockers against the run. If we can get even an average or half decent run stopping DT (Ian Scott) who can occupy a double team then it allows Thomas to play his natural game and try and penetrate into the backfield. If we don't then Thomas will be easily double teamed and won't get a chance to fully refine his game.

Yeah I know what you're thinking, Denver sign a decent run stopping DT? Yeah, that'll be the day.

TheReverend · 02-26-2008, 04:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncoBuff

Whatever ... if you spent that much time analyzing football, your posts would probably be better.

Just ****in with ya Rev, you know I love ya.

Kris Jenkins just called. He's wondering why you're posting instead of giving him his goodnight kiss on the ass.

Just ****in with ya Buff, you know I love ya.

missingnumber7 · 02-26-2008, 08:15 AM

Just my opinion, but with Thomas, Moss, and Elvis we've got a good young base for our D-line to build on all show that glimpse of brilliance...just wish Moss could've been healthy all year.

BroncoBuff · 02-27-2008, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheReverend

Kris Jenkins just called. He's wondering why you're posting instead of giving him his goodnight kiss on the ass.

Just ****in with ya Buff, you know I love ya.

okay, you win ...

Punisher · 02-27-2008, 11:05 PM

Marcus Thomas will step up this year

rastaman · 02-27-2008, 11:35 PM

MT just needs to start and play in 16 games this season to give him the experience he needs so bad. Slowick just needs to allow MT to play in an attack style defensive scheme. Point is, if MT can survive the season uninjured, he needs to be allowed to play as many down as possible.

Also, if Denver could manage to sign GB's free agent DT (forgot his name), and have him tandem next to MT, this would help Marcus Thomas development immensely.

Kaylore · 02-28-2008, 12:35 AM

Defensive tackle is one of the positions that takes the longest to develop at coming out college. Marcus Thomas will show more of what we are to expect from him as a player this year now that he's had a season to play and will have a full camp to re-visit what he did and did not do well. I still have serious concerns about Bates, but one thing that will help is that we will be sticking with one system and just going with that this year, whatever happens. That should make all the players more comfortable and improve the play in some measure.

chaz · 02-28-2008, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rastaman

Also, if Denver could manage to sign GB's free agent DT (forgot his name), and have him tandem next to MT, this would help Marcus Thomas development immensely.

Corey Williams. He was franchised by Green Bay.

rastaman · 03-01-2008, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chaz

Corey Williams. He was franchised by Green Bay.

I believe GB just traded Corey Williams to Cleveland for draft picks.

theAPAOps5 · 03-01-2008, 12:17 AM

Yep and Rogers went to Cleveland for a player and a pick

wolf754life · 03-01-2008, 12:32 AM

the broncos are fine at DT, 12 and 4 next year! no worries!

02-25-2008, 01:34 PM	#1
SleepingTiger Ring of Famer Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Murphy TX Posts: 1,161	Marcus Thomas Is he any good? I see alot of people praising Marcus, but he is invisible for most of the games. Anybody see different than I did?

02-28-2008, 12:35 AM	#21
Kaylore 6-37, Raider fans. Yummy birds and snow! Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Ceti Alpha V Posts: 41,019 Adopt-a-Bronco: Wesley Duke	Defensive tackle is one of the positions that takes the longest to develop at coming out college. Marcus Thomas will show more of what we are to expect from him as a player this year now that he's had a season to play and will have a full camp to re-visit what he did and did not do well. I still have serious concerns about Bates, but one thing that will help is that we will be sticking with one system and just going with that this year, whatever happens. That should make all the players more comfortable and improve the play in some measure. Last edited by Kaylore; 02-28-2008 at 09:35 AM..

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02-25-2008, 01:37 PM	#2
Beantown Bronco Athletic Supporter Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Mass Posts: 19,040 Adopt-a-Bronco: Matt Prater	some stuff here: http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthr...=marcus+thomas and here: http://www.orangemane.com/BB/showthread.php?t=65370

02-25-2008, 02:25 PM	#4
Dempsey Dog Seasoned Veteran Duke...we miss ya! Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 267 Adopt-a-Bronco: Eddie Royal	We got him because his draft stock dropped, not because of talent, but because of off-field issues. I think he could be pretty good. I am thinking Tommy Blake, the highly talented DE from TCU who will probably drop to the 4th or so because of off-field issues, could be good. I hate the fact we gamble on guys sometimes, but if we must, what are the thoughts on the mane?

02-25-2008, 02:36 PM	#5
cmhargrove Is this thing on??? Travis Henry's love child... Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Tulsa, OK Posts: 6,403 Adopt-a-Bronco: Peyton Hillis	I'll also add that I think he was misused last year. Honestly, we just didn't even have the right personnel to run the Bates system. Marcus Thomas was good at Florida because he used his speed and athleticism to break through the line and disrupt the backfield - that was his strength. Last year, we asked him to "stack the line" and he was often fighting against double teams. If Slowik goes back to our previous system and starts trying to cut the gaps and bring creative blitzes, Thomas should have much more of an impact. I think last year was a great learning year, and the skills he learned should help him in short yardage defenses. Most rookie DT's don't make an impact. His playing time was a huge bonus for his growth. I don't expect that he will ever be a game breaker. But I think he could be as effective as Gerrard Warren was (when he was trying hard). And, I think that is a good thing. He should be a solid player for us. If we can find some better talent to stick next to him, I think he will play up to that level also. Also, remember that he hadn't been in game situation for quite a while (due to his suspension), so it probably took him a while to get back into "football shape." He should be in much better shape by TC this year.

02-25-2008, 02:58 PM	#7
BroncoBuff *************** Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Seattle Posts: 25,433 Adopt-a-Bronco: QUANTERUS SMITH	DTs were my special obsession this past season, as I played, replayed, re-replayed, and re-re-replayed over and over and over, wearing out my Tivo buttons watching them - feeding my obsessive hostility toward Amon Gordon. My take: MT got pushed around pretty good early in the season ... spent alotta time mimicking Amon's signature move of giving up on beating his blocker, and instead just jumping up and down in front of the blocker with an arm outstretched in the general direction of the quarterback But toward the middle of the season, that all changed for Marcus ... I don't know if the change coincided with scrapping the Bates system, or coincided with MT intercepting that pass and returning it nicely about 25 yards, but something changed and he became a lot more effective. He moves side to side really well, and blockers had a helluva time getting their hands into him when he was moving laterally ... and he started penetrating much better than he had, (although sometimes too much as the play went past him). Remember he only played the first month of his senior season, so he made the daunting jump from college to NFL with a rusty game. Now I think he's a fixture guy on the D-Line - a decade long starter with Pro Bowl potential. The problem is he's our only certain keeper for '08 ... Mallard, McKinley and Burton are just street free agents, so we have alotta work to do at that spot ... we had the worst DT unit in the league last year...

02-25-2008, 08:23 PM	#9
Dudeskey Ring of Famer This space for rent Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 4,314	Most rookie DT's aren't going to be lights out... Their numbers won't be as gaudy as say, a rookie HB.

02-25-2008, 08:31 PM	#10
That One Guy Producer of Nonsense Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Sun and Beachville Posts: 14,042 Adopt-a-Bronco: None	Either way, it's better than GBs first round DT who I don't think was even active for a game last year and with the franchising of Corey Williams, may still not be looking at a large role. Anything is better than bench time.

02-25-2008, 08:44 PM	#11
bpc "Nemo Me Impune Lacessit" 1 sword keeps another in the sheath Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Northern California Posts: 12,568 Adopt-a-Bronco: Von Miller	Seldomly do rookies come in and dominate. We didn't use him right either. He needs some help around him. I would love to see him and Robertson playing next to each other... i think they are both power players that could wreak a lot of havok on opposing offenses.

02-26-2008, 04:23 AM	#13
BroncoBuff *************** Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Seattle Posts: 25,433 Adopt-a-Bronco: QUANTERUS SMITH	Whatever ... if you spent that much time analyzing football, your posts would probably be better. Just ****in with ya Rev, you know I love ya.

02-26-2008, 04:29 AM	#14
cutthemdown A verbis ad verbera Zimm to HOF Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Long Beach Posts: 32,443	We will know soon enough. I thought it seemed like he wasn't used right. He isn't huge and the take on blocker type. I thought towards end of year when he started to be asked to disrupt and penetrate he started to show some flashes. I think though he needs to get bigger though. Hopefully this yr he will have 5-10 pounds more of muscle to work with.

02-26-2008, 04:29 AM	#15
fontaine Ring of Famer Go John Manning! Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 12,422	The best thing for Thomas is to have a genuine two gap run stopper beside him. Thomas isn't a run stuffer, or a guy who's strength is to occupy two blockers against the run. If we can get even an average or half decent run stopping DT (Ian Scott) who can occupy a double team then it allows Thomas to play his natural game and try and penetrate into the backfield. If we don't then Thomas will be easily double teamed and won't get a chance to fully refine his game. Yeah I know what you're thinking, Denver sign a decent run stopping DT? Yeah, that'll be the day.

02-26-2008, 08:15 AM	#17
missingnumber7 Vote Joe Mays to Pro Bowl Joe 4 Pro Bowl ST's Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Bismarck Posts: 4,760 Adopt-a-Bronco: Joe Mays	Just my opinion, but with Thomas, Moss, and Elvis we've got a good young base for our D-line to build on all show that glimpse of brilliance...just wish Moss could've been healthy all year.

02-27-2008, 11:05 PM	#19
Punisher ® You Tell The NFL! We're coming for That Belt! WOOOOO® Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Broncos Video Vault Posts: 6,628 Adopt-a-Bronco: i4jelway7	Marcus Thomas will step up this year

02-27-2008, 11:35 PM	#20
rastaman Ring of Famer New to the Forum Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 7,180 Adopt-a-Bronco: None	MT just needs to start and play in 16 games this season to give him the experience he needs so bad. Slowick just needs to allow MT to play in an attack style defensive scheme. Point is, if MT can survive the season uninjured, he needs to be allowed to play as many down as possible. Also, if Denver could manage to sign GB's free agent DT (forgot his name), and have him tandem next to MT, this would help Marcus Thomas development immensely.

03-01-2008, 12:17 AM	#24
theAPAOps5 A new beginning! Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Denver Posts: 26,057 Adopt-a-Bronco: Watermock - RIP	Yep and Rogers went to Cleveland for a player and a pick

03-01-2008, 12:32 AM	#25
wolf754life Bleed Orange and Blue more scoring + more tackling = $$$ Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,776	the broncos are fine at DT, 12 and 4 next year! no worries!