Senior al Qaeda in Iraq leader held

[Chupacabra]

Saw this yesterday (Wednesday) morning... didn't figure it'd be posted on here. Here goes it:

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/...ure/index.html

[Chupacabra]

Commence with the typical "okay so now #2 will step up and fill the void" or "was he carrying his al Queda card" or "so what bush is an idiot" or etc etc etc.

[freak6]

They had him since July 4th.

I wonder why the announced that they caught him the day the NIE came out stating ver batim that the OCCUPATION of IRAQ is

KILLING OUR TROOPS IN AN EFFORT THAT IS

HELPING AL QAEDA!!!!!!

[Bronco Bob]

Yes, it is rather odd that the guy was caught two weeks ago and the Bush
administration is just now getting around to announcing it, on the heels
of a report that al-Quada has regrouped and is now as strong as it was
before 9/11. But then again the most senior al-Quada in Iraq leader is killed or
captured about once an month anyway according to the Bush administration,
so maybe the announcement about this guy fell behind a filing cabinet and
no one noticed it until the cleaning lady found it again yesterday.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by Bronco Bob

Yes, it is rather odd that the guy was caught two weeks ago and the Bush
administration is just now getting around to announcing it, on the heels
of a report that al-Quada has regrouped and is now as strong as it was
before 9/11. But then again the most senior al-Quada in Iraq leader is killed or
captured about once an month anyway according to the Bush administration,
so maybe the announcement about this guy fell behind a filing cabinet and
no one noticed it until the cleaning lady found it again yesterday.

"We're at war with Eurasia. We've always been at war with Eurasia."

[Spider]

Well that backfired ........

[Spider]

[mosca]

Good job on capturing the guy. Here's to getting more of 'em.

[Bronco Bob]

Originally Posted by mosca

Good job on capturing the guy. Here's to getting more of 'em.

Only next time be forthcoming about it and report it the day it happens
instead of waiting weeks until some bad news for the administration comes
out and using the capture/killing as a deflection.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by mosca

Good job on capturing the guy. Here's to getting more of 'em.

um how do you say ooops in College republican lingo ?

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/US_say...ment_0719.html
US says militant that Iraqi government once 'captured' never even existed
RAW STORY
Published: Thursday July 19, 2007

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According to the US, an Iraqi militant that the Iraq government had previously claimed it had "captured" never even existed.

Tina Susman writes in the Thursday edition of the L.A. Times, "In March, he was declared captured. In May, he was declared killed, and his purported corpse was displayed on state-run TV. But on Wednesday, Abu Omar Baghdadi, the supposed leader of an Al Qaeda-affiliated group in Iraq, was declared nonexistent by U.S. military officials, who said he was a fictional character created to give an Iraqi face to a foreign-run terrorist organization."

"An Iraqi actor has been used to read statements attributed to Baghdadi, who since October has been identified as the leader of the Islamic State of Iraq group, said U.S. Army Brig. Gen. Kevin Bergner," the article continues. "Bergner said the new information came from a man captured July 4, described as the highest-ranking Iraqi within the Islamic State of Iraq."

Excerpts from article:
#

There was no way to confirm the military's claim, which comes at a time of heightened pressure on the White House to justify keeping U.S. troops in Iraq. Critics of the Bush administration say the president has been trying to do so by linking Bin Laden's Al Qaeda terrorist network to the conflict in Iraq, even though the organization had no substantial presence here until after the U.S.-led invasion of March 2003. "The same people that attacked us on September the 11th is the crowd that is now bombing people" in Iraq, Bush said Tuesday.

The U.S. military's announcement Wednesday was the latest bizarre twist surrounding the figure known as Baghdadi. If the Iraqi government's reaction was anything to go by, it won't be the last. Defense Ministry spokesman Mohammed Askari rejected the U.S. assertion, insisting that Baghdadi is real. "Al-Baghdadi is wanted and pursued. We know many things about him, and we even have his picture," Askari said. However, he said he could not release a photograph or additional information because it could jeopardize attempts to capture Baghdadi.

....

In March, the Iraqi government announced it had captured him, but then said that it was someone else. In May, confusion reigned when both Iraqi and U.S. officials announced the death of a high-ranking Islamic State of Iraq member. Iraqis identified the man as Baghdadi and showed a body they said was his on television. The Americans said it was someone else and they had the DNA to prove it. The Iraqis countered by insisting it was the same man, but dropped the matter. At that time, U.S. officials hinted that they had doubts about Baghdadi's existence.
#

FULL LA TIMES ARTICLE AT THIS LINK

[mosca]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

um how do you say ooops in College republican lingo ?

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/US_say...ment_0719.html
US says militant that Iraqi government once 'captured' never even existed

Interesting... the article you link to is referring to the mythical Abu Omar al-Baghdadi, not the guy the U.S. recently reported capturing, Khalid al-Mashadani. Kinda funny how the Rawstory article also has a picture of the late al-Zarqawi on there for some reason. Anyway, here's another story addressing al-Baghdadi, who may have just been a media invention of al-Qaeda:

http://www.thestar.com/News/article/237525

Insurgents' leader never existed: U.S.

Character created by Al Qaeda in Iraq to mask foreign influence in Iraqi group, military says

BAGHDAD–For more than a year, the leader of one the most notorious insurgent groups in Iraq was said to be a mysterious Iraqi called Abu Omar al-Baghdadi.

As the titular head of the Islamic State in Iraq, al-Baghdadi issued incendiary pronouncements. Despite claims by an Iraqi interior ministry official in May that al-Baghdadi had been killed, he appeared to have persevered unscathed.

Yesterday, the chief U.S. military spokesperson here, Brig.-Gen. Kevin Bergner, provided a new explanation for al-Baghdadi's ability to escape attack: He never existed.

Bergner told reporters that a senior Iraqi insurgent captured this month said the elusive Baghdadi was actually a fictional character whose declarations on audiotape were read by a man named Abu Abdullah al-Naima.

Bergner said the ruse was devised by Abu Ayyub al-Masri, the Egyptian-born leader of the insurgent group Al Qaeda in Iraq. While the group is mostly Iraqi, much of its leadership is foreign, and al-Masri was reportedly trying to mask the outsiders' dominance.

Bergner said al-Masri's ploy was to invent al-Baghdadi, a figure whose very name was meant to establish an Iraqi pedigree, install him as the head of a front organization called the Islamic State of Iraq, and then arrange for al-Masri to swear allegiance to him.

Adding to the deception, he said, the deputy leader in Osama bin Laden's group Al Qaeda, Ayman al-Zawahri, publicly supported Baghdadi in a video and Internet statements.

The captured insurgent who was said to have alerted the Americans was identified as Khalid Abdul Fatah Daoud Mahmud al-Mashadani. He was said to have been detained by U.S. forces in Mosul on July 4.

(continued at link)

[mosca]

Originally Posted by Bronco Bob

Only next time be forthcoming about it and report it the day it happens
instead of waiting weeks until some bad news for the administration comes
out and using the capture/killing as a deflection.

If that's the reason they waited to announce it, it's detestable. I won't rule out the possibility of other, valid, reasons for delaying the announcement of his capture. Namely the fact that announcing it could affect ongoing military or intelligence operations in the field.

[Chupacabra]

Nobody knows why they waited to announce this tidbit... but I would guess because, like mosca noted, it could affect ongoing military/intelligence operations. Much like criminal investigations here in the homeland, details are often kept from the public to prevent it from interfering with the investigation. Suppose they announced the capture the day it happened. What would the captured's associates do? I would imagine they would stop operations, hideout, flee, etc. My guess, is that they would try to get as much information out of him as possible in order to hunt down his associates/superiors. Letting the news out immediately would, without a doubt, hinder the investigation.

But, then again... what you all say could be true... It could be a government coverup, witheld from the public until need be. But my question to you people, what would be the point? Would the administration not want news like this to hit the press asap to thwart the idiot conspiracy theorists and liberals who hate good news from Iraq? As you and I both know, Bush is feeling the heat on Iraq.

[Spider]

oh mosca

a little slow on the uptake I see , but it proves my point , we cant trust anything we are told when it comes to Iraq .....So why should we believe the lead story ? I guess you want to believe the lead story Cause it fits your agenda , you want to believe it , desperate to have something , anything to cling to ,in hopes Bush was right ...........
thats ok we have identified your problem , In my professional opinion , we can cure you in about 20 years , with 3 days a week 1 hour sessions of therapy .....

[Chupacabra]

I know it is next to impossible for most of you to understand........ but the government/military does need to withold some information from the public in order to do maximize its performance/results.

In this case, it is rather simple. Let the news out immediately, what happens to all this guy's leads?

[Chupacabra]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

oh mosca

a little slow on the uptake I see , but it proves my point , we cant trust anything we are told when it comes to Iraq .....So why should we believe the lead story ? I guess you want to believe the lead story Cause it fits your agenda , you want to believe it , desperate to have something , anything to cling to ,in hopes Bush was right ...........
thats ok we have identified your problem , In my professional opinion , we can cure you in about 20 years , with 3 days a week 1 hour sessions of therapy .....

To fit my agenda...perhaps. However, it has nothing to do with Bush.

My question to you, Spider...... For what good reason would the uppers withold this story? And the "to save it for a rainy day" excuse is idiotic.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Chupacabra

I know it is next to impossible for most of you to understand........ but the government/military does need to withold some information from the public in order to do maximize its performance/results.

In this case, it is rather simple. Let the news out immediately, what happens to all this guy's leads?

Grasp away

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Chupacabra

To fit my agenda...perhaps. However, it has nothing to do with Bush.

My question to you, Spider...... For what good reason would the uppers withold this story? And the "to save it for a rainy day" excuse is idiotic.

are you mosca ? we already know you have a bad case of Hero worship
but to answer your ?
Same reasons they held they released the Bin Laden tapes during the elections .....Counter bad news , with a ray of hope of good news .......

[Chupacabra]

My agenda is to spread the good news that comes from Iraq. I think the media doesn't report on any of the good stories that happen.

I had lunch with one of my HS buddies who just got back from Iraq. He is a sergeant in the Army. He is going back Saturday. I asked him what he thought about the media's take on the war. He leans left and made it clear that he thinks the war is pointless. But he strongly stated that the media's perception of the war undermines the mission that he and his fellow soldiers risk their lives to accomplish. He said good things are happening in Iraq and people at the homeland should know about these things.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Chupacabra

My agenda is to spread the good news that comes from Iraq. I think the media doesn't report on any of the good stories that happen.

I had lunch with one of my HS buddies who just got back from Iraq. He is a sergeant in the Army. He is going back Saturday. I asked him what he thought about the media's take on the war. He leans left and made it clear that he thinks the war is pointless. But he strongly stated that the media's perception of the war undermines the mission that he and his fellow soldiers risk their lives to accomplish. He said good things are happening in Iraq and people at the homeland should know about these things.

even if it turns out to be false .......good plan

[Chupacabra]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

are you mosca ? we already know you have a bad case of Hero worship
but to answer your ?
Same reasons they held they released the Bin Laden tapes during the elections .....Counter bad news , with a ray of hope of good news .......

So the "save it for a rainy day" excuse.... hmmk. I will say, the theory does have a chance. IMO, a remote chance.

And you absolutely deny the possiblity that the witholding of the story had anything to do with possible complications of military intelligence/investigation? Really? Completely deny the possibility? Are you so blinded by your partisanship that you would deny common sense?

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Chupacabra

So the "save it for a rainy day" excuse.... hmmk. I will say, the theory does have a chance. IMO, a remote chance.

And you absolutely deny the possiblity that the witholding of the story had anything to do with possible complications of military intelligence/investigation? Really? Completely deny the possibility? Are you so blinded by your partisanship that you would deny common sense?

you may want ot reread this post and make a few changes .... but in the meantime I gave rock solid evidence of our government , using the rainy day excuse before , so tell me why it has a remote chance of working

[Spider]

did you find the error in your post yet Chuck ?

[mosca]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

oh mosca

a little slow on the uptake I see , but it proves my point , we cant trust anything we are told when it comes to Iraq .....So why should we believe the lead story ? I guess you want to believe the lead story Cause it fits your agenda , you want to believe it , desperate to have something , anything to cling to ,in hopes Bush was right ...........
thats ok we have identified your problem , In my professional opinion , we can cure you in about 20 years , with 3 days a week 1 hour sessions of therapy .....

I don't trust anything coming out of Iraq blindly, whether it come from the U.S. military, the mainstream media, bloggers, or even al-Qaeda propaganda. They must all be viewed with a critical eye. What, if any, story I choose to believe has nothing to do with Bush. The truth, while often hard to discern, is the truth. If other facts come to the surface later, I have no problem saying "Oops" and acknowledging that the truth may in fact be different than what I had thought it to be earlier. A wise man sees failure as progress.

Funny that the lead story (the capture of Khalid al-Mashadani) actually supports the story that you posted (about Abu Omar al-Baghdadi being an al-Qaeda created myth). Are you questioning whether or not al-Mashadani was actually captured?

[Spider]

Originally Posted by mosca

I don't trust anything coming out of Iraq blindly, whether it come from the U.S. military, the mainstream media, bloggers, or even al-Qaeda propaganda. They must all be viewed with a critical eye. What, if any, story I choose to believe has nothing to do with Bush. The truth, while often hard to discern, is the truth. If other facts come to the surface later, I have no problem saying "Oops" and acknowledging that the truth may in fact be different than what I had thought it to be earlier. A wise man sees failure as progress.

Funny that the lead story (the capture of Khalid al-Mashadani) actually supports the story that you posted (about Abu Omar al-Baghdadi being an al-Qaeda created myth). Are you questioning whether or not al-Mashadani was actually captured?

one is the same as another , only thing they have in common is they are all Al Qadea #2 man when we kill them or capture them , but I gave up trying to discern what is true what isnt about Iraq , the breaking point for me is when the media released a picture of a mural of 9-11 on a Iraqi hospital wall ...turned out to be a bunch of **** ..........