Judge Says Probable Cause in Kircus Case to Continue on to Trial

[Bronco_Beerslug]

How many Broncos are suspended or pending suspension this year, 3?

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Kircus to face arraignment for alleged assault
A Centennial man says he never saw the punch that knocked him down at a party at his house.
By Carlos Illescas Denver Post Staff Writer
Article Last Updated: 07/13/2007 12:47:18 AM MDT

Centennial - A man who alleges Broncos wide receiver David Kircus punched him outside his house earlier this year testified Thursday that he never saw the punch that felled him.

"It was just a pop and flash and then I realized I was on the ground on my hands and knees," Jeff Krieger said during Kircus' preliminary hearing.

After the testimony, a judge determined there was probable cause to continue toward trial. Kircus will be arraigned next month.

Kircus, 27, has been charged with felony assault after the incident in Krieger's driveway on South Krameria Way in Centennial at about 4 a.m. May 20. Kircus faces five to 16 years in prison if convicted.

Kircus has said he was acting in self-defense.

Krieger, 26, testified that Kircus showed up at his house early May 20, after he had been talking to Leslie Schote, one of several women Krieger was partying with that night to celebrate his girlfriend's birthday.

After Schote got upset with Kircus, Krieger said he tried to get the player to leave peacefully. After trying several times, he escorted Kircus out of his home through the garage.

Krieger testified that as the two walked, Kircus said, "Once we get to the end of the driveway, you're not protected anymore."

Krieger said after the punch, Kircus stood over him and said, "You don't know what I am capable of."

Krieger had multiple fractures in his face.

He was the only person to testify Thursday. After the hearing, Kircus promptly left the courthouse without commenting.

Defense attorney Harvey Steinberg noted repeatedly that Krieger had been drinking and that his memory of the events might have been clouded. Under oath, Krieger said he had at least 10 alcoholic drinks that night.

Krieger testified he never punched Kircus.

After the incident, Kircus took a lie-detector test, and Broncos coach Mike Shanahan said he passed it and believes the fourth-year player acted in self-defense.

[That One Guy]

If he gets off, it'll be because of the booze and the fact that they were the only ones present. That definitely sounds bad.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

Kircus faces five to 16 years in prison if convicted.

5-16 for decking somebody? I just spent two hours scanning sex offender database records down here to email somebody info and half the people on the list got probation for messing with kids.

This whole country's gone nuts.

[Garcia Bronco]

Originally Posted by footstepsfrom#27

5-16 for decking somebody? I just spent two hours scanning sex offender database records down here to email somebody info and half the people on the list got probation for messing with kids.

This whole country's gone nuts.

Assault charges are like that every where.

[Beantown Bronco]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

Kircus faces five to 16 years in prison if convicted.

Apparently, Kircus didn't know what the law was capable of...

[Los Broncos]

Originally Posted by footstepsfrom#27

5-16 for decking somebody? I just spent two hours scanning sex offender database records down here to email somebody info and half the people on the list got probation for messing with kids.

This whole country's gone nuts.

Its ass backwards, just like in a divorce.

[NYBronco]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

How many Broncos are suspended or pending suspension this year, 3?

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Kircus to face arraignment for alleged assault
A Centennial man says he never saw the punch that knocked him down at a party at his house.
By Carlos Illescas Denver Post Staff Writer
Article Last Updated: 07/13/2007 12:47:18 AM MDT

Centennial - A man who alleges Broncos wide receiver David Kircus punched him outside his house earlier this year testified Thursday that he never saw the punch that felled him.

"It was just a pop and flash and then I realized I was on the ground on my hands and knees," Jeff Krieger said during Kircus' preliminary hearing.

After the testimony, a judge determined there was probable cause to continue toward trial. Kircus will be arraigned next month.

Kircus, 27, has been charged with felony assault after the incident in Krieger's driveway on South Krameria Way in Centennial at about 4 a.m. May 20. Kircus faces five to 16 years in prison if convicted.

Kircus has said he was acting in self-defense.

Krieger, 26, testified that Kircus showed up at his house early May 20, after he had been talking to Leslie Schote, one of several women Krieger was partying with that night to celebrate his girlfriend's birthday.

After Schote got upset with Kircus, Krieger said he tried to get the player to leave peacefully. After trying several times, he escorted Kircus out of his home through the garage.

Krieger testified that as the two walked, Kircus said, "Once we get to the end of the driveway, you're not protected anymore."

Krieger said after the punch, Kircus stood over him and said, "You don't know what I am capable of."

If Krieger knowingly challenges the verbal threat by Kircus and goes to the end of the driveway isn't he (Kreiger) inviting or encouraging the violence?

[cutthemdown]

Originally Posted by footstepsfrom#27

5-16 for decking somebody? I just spent two hours scanning sex offender database records down here to email somebody info and half the people on the list got probation for messing with kids.

This whole country's gone nuts.

so what do you think someone should get for inflicting multiple fractures to another mans face? Not that I think it should be more then for molesting a child I don't. But I'm curious because you sound like you think it shouldn't be a big deal.

[cutthemdown]

Originally Posted by NYBronco

If Krieger knowingly challenges the verbal threat by Kircus and goes to the end of the driveway isn't he (Kreiger) inviting or encouraging the violence?

no

[footstepsfrom#27]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

so what do you think someone should get for inflicting multiple fractures to another mans face? Not that I think it should be more then for molesting a child I don't. But I'm curious because you sound like you think it shouldn't be a big deal.

Why is that? Because I don't think 16 years in prison is appropriate for throwing a punch? ONE punch? If he'd beat the living hell out of this guy with repeated punches with the guy lying on the ground I'd think differently but I can't see giving somebody more than 6 months for throwing a single punch. Yes, the guy suffered fractures...because Kircus is probably stronger than the average Joe but if throwing a single punch deserves 16 years in prison I bet most people on this board would be in the slammer. Who in here has never been in a fight? And how is it you can get probation for molesting a child and 16 years for popping somebody in the face? That makes no sense.

[Mediator12]

OK, where is the felony part of the assault? Felony assault requires that the violence be committed during an ongoing felony or against an officer of the law. What kind of crap is the Denver DA trying to pull? Or does Colorado have some kind of stupid overarching statute on what constitutes felony Assault? 5-16 years for a domestic dispute fight where alcohol has been involved? Come on!

[telluride]

Still think Shanny should have cut his ass by now.

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Originally Posted by Mediator12

OK, where is the felony part of the assault? Felony assault requires that the violence be committed during an ongoing felony or against an officer of the law. What kind of crap is the Denver DA trying to pull? Or does Colorado have some kind of stupid overarching statute on what constitutes felony Assault? 5-16 years for a domestic dispute fight where alcohol has been involved? Come on!

There were broken bones, that's 2nd degree assault in Colorado.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by Mediator12

OK, where is the felony part of the assault? Felony assault requires that the violence be committed during an ongoing felony or against an officer of the law. What kind of crap is the Denver DA trying to pull? Or does Colorado have some kind of stupid overarching statute on what constitutes felony Assault? 5-16 years for a domestic dispute fight where alcohol has been involved? Come on!

Uh, no. Felony assault is defined by seriousness of injury among other things.

[cutthemdown]

footsteps is trying to focus on the 15 year max the penalty says 5-15. If Kircus just cold cocked the dude and broke his face then I don't think 5 years is that harsh. Probably get out on parole after a few years. We simply can not have people that feel they can just crush a dudes face because they are upset. True people have gotten less for more but that doesn't make me feel sorry for Kircus.

[footstepsfrom#27]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

footsteps is trying to focus on the 15 year max the penalty says 5-15. If Kircus just cold cocked the dude and broke his face then I don't think 5 years is that harsh. Probably get out on parole after a few years. We simply can not have people that feel they can just crush a dudes face because they are upset. True people have gotten less for more but that doesn't make me feel sorry for Kircus.

I suspect your lack of sympathy has considerably more to do with the fact he's an NFL player than anything else. I focused on the max because of the current state of idiocy in our "justice" system. Chalk it up to things like mandatory sentencing laws that remove discretion from judges, to name a single example. But fine...I'll address the 5 year threshold instead. Five years is also to long. There are rapists who get less. If he held the dude down and pounded his face into hamburger meat I'd say, GREAT!...sock him away for five years...he deserves it. In this case the prison sentence is probably determined by the fact that his fist happened to find just the right spot. Move it half an inch either way and maybe the guy gets no broken bones...who knows?

Again...I understand the guy suffered nasty injuries. If convicted Kircus deserves jail time...but not five years worth. Question...have YOU ever thrown a punch at any time in your adult life? Actually let's say anytime in your "quasi" adult life...defined roughly as age 16 and up since the "justice" system is now bent on frequently prosecuting kids as adults. I have...the last time was 4 years ago. My wife's abusive alcoholic ex showed up drunk to pick up his daughter for scheduled weekend visitation and used the liquid courage to take a swing at me for refusing to let her leave with his drunken self. So I decked him flat on the ground...felt good too I confess. Wisely surmising somehow through the fog of booze that my 235 trumped his 190, he beat a track lickety-split back home as I dialed 911 to have the cops sling his *** in the pokey. He showed up three days later with a wicked black and blue welt about the size of a medium sized egg under the left eye. Had I connected an inch different either direction...would I deserve 5-15 in the can with murderers, rapists and child molestors? I say no.

It used to be two guys could duke it out in this country without "prison" being the end result. We ought to return to some sanity here.

[OrangeRising]

I understand that Shanny has more or less absolved Kircus of guilt after a lie detector test of something, but I just can't see this guy playing another down for Denver.

It's not fair if he's innocent, but the team can't let this thing linger in the local press while he practices for the team. I check the Denver Post web site frequently, but don't see much about this. Anyone know if this is big news in Denver?

With Rod Smith a huge question mark, the Broncos need to find somebody for that roster spot fast.

[Cosmo]

What kind of guy that gets punched feels justified to put some guy in prison for 5-15?!! If I got my ass beat I would just want monetary compensation, nothing more.

[Popps]

Originally Posted by Cosmo

What kind of guy that gets punched feels justified to put some guy in prison for 5-15?!! If I got my ass beat I would just want monetary compensation, nothing more.

Yea, what is this guy thinking taking up legal action?

Bigger people should be allowed to freely bash in the face of smaller people any time they see it necessary. Civilized society is overrated.

[cutthemdown]

Originally Posted by Cosmo

What kind of guy that gets punched feels justified to put some guy in prison for 5-15?!! If I got my ass beat I would just want monetary compensation, nothing more.

The civil case will come after probably. But in a way you are right. If Kircus is cut he would have less money to give the guy in a settlement.

[cutthemdown]

Footsteps why does it take you 300 hundred sentences to say nothing. See I did it in two.

[NYBronco]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

no

Yes he is!

[x123z]

The other guy had 10 or 12 drinks. Kircus should have been able to protect himself without breaking the man's face. That said; 5-15 years is not justified.

[gunns]

You don't assault someone on their own property and then call it self defense, unless you have lots of truthful witnesses. I don't think he'll get anywhere near the 5-15 unless he's got a past record. Probably a hefty fine, pay the medical bills and probation. But assault is serious, look at the 3 strikes law. People just don't know when to walk away anymore. I believe the courts are now giving some leniency to people who use the old fashion method of fists over guns.

[Florida_Bronco]

Originally Posted by OrangeRising

I understand that Shanny has more or less absolved Kircus of guilt after a lie detector test of something, but I just can't see this guy playing another down for Denver.

It's not fair if he's innocent, but the team can't let this thing linger in the local press while he practices for the team. I check the Denver Post web site frequently, but don't see much about this. Anyone know if this is big news in Denver?

With Rod Smith a huge question mark, the Broncos need to find somebody for that roster spot fast.

I disagree completely. I'm glad the team stands behind it's players until they are proven guilty.