Tiny terrier saved kids from pit bulls

[obediah]

I knew that, just seeing if you were paying attention.. lord....


obediah

[Spider]

Originally Posted by obediah

I knew that, just seeing if you were paying attention.. lord....


obediah

ok then ...........

[cutthemdown]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

I am a pretty tough guy , but those pictures bothered me ........ In Wyoming , they had a dog fighting circuit , Guys wold take Pits and breed them with Wolf hybrids ( up to 98% blood line) one idiot outside of Rawlins wyoming would tie his dogs up and beat em with a whip to toughen their hides up ........ Michale Vick needs to do some hard time .......

To bad we aren't always dog's best friend.

[orange 4 life]

Originally Posted by obediah

Do you think you are god of the board or something? Judge and juror over everyones post? why would i give a crap what you treat me like? is this the fuggin playground, its a discussion board i think.. means people will agree and disagree, but with you, you just like to slam people so you dont have to argue points. besides, i posted an opinion not the ten commandments jackass. lighten up..

either way, you win big man i got other things to do now, enjoy your thread.

*shakes head* just like a pitbull owner, perfect example....

Obediah

you expressed ignorance and arrogance, and you insulted me as a person and a father....all in your 1st post.

im not the "god" of anything, and ive engaged in "discussion" throughout the thread.
you on the other hand acted like it was a playground. good analogy.
you jumped in, spewed out your "opinion" that is based on......nothing, and insulted people in the process.
you get treated that way by me whether you care about it or not.
keep shaking your head a-hole.

[orange 4 life]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

To bad we aren't always dog's best friend.

the quote on the fighting link was very appropriate:

Despite having had the bond of man and dog betrayed, they still look at humans with love and - God knows why - trust.

my dogs will lay on their back paws in the air (a plea to be loved) and once i start rubbing the belly, theyll wiggle around and pay no attention to the fact that theyre about to fall off the bed. ill cradle them and make sure they dont fall of course, but the level of trust is pretty amazing. how many people would we trust completely like that?
those dogs define "unconditional love", which is why the horrible treatment of so many of them makes me so upset.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

To bad we aren't always dog's best friend.

or being our own Grandpa ............

[Spider]

How do you become your own Grandpa .......Glad you asked ..........
Many many years ago when I was twenty three,
I got married to a widow who was pretty as could be.
This widow had a grown-up daughter
Who had hair of red.
My father fell in love with her,
And soon the two were wed.

This made my dad my son-in-law
And changed my very life.
My daughter was my mother,
For she was my father's wife.

To complicate the matters worse,
Although it brought me joy,
I soon became the father
Of a bouncing baby boy.

My little baby then became
A brother-in-law to dad.
And so became my uncle,
Though it made me very sad.

For if he was my uncle,
Then that also made him brother
To the widow's grown-up daughter
Who, of course, was my step-mother.

Father's wife then had a son,
Who kept them on the run.
And he became my grandson,
For he was my daughter's son.

My wife is now my mother's mother
And it makes me blue.
Because, although she is my wife,
She's my grandmother, too.

If my wife is my grandmother,
Then I am her grandchild.
And every time I think of it,
It simply drives me wild.

For now I have become
The strangest case you ever saw.
As the husband of my grandmother,
I am my own grandpa!

[BroncoInSkinland]

[QUOTE=cutthemdown;1577508]

Originally Posted by BroncoInSkinland

[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]I worked as a field service technician for a humane society for 5 and ½ years with an average workweek of 70 hours. That is roughly 20,000 logged hours, with roughly a quarter of those hours being spent in the field dealing face to face with animals.


As someone with first hand knowledge how many Cane Corso's, Tosa Inu's, Presar Canario, Bully Kutta, dogo argentino, Fila Brasileiro ,American Bandogge breeds did you encounter? If I'm right and you didn't really see but a few I'd like to ask your honest opinion. If there were a bunch of those breeds in the USA don't you think those breeds would be a problem? If your answer is yes then I think that would support your argument that a breed ban on pit bulls would be shortsighted. It wouldn't help owners of dogs be any more responsible. They would just start to own some of the other hard to manage breeds.

I actually encountered very few, maybe around 5 or 6 between all of the breeds you mentioned over all the years. One of the bigest concerns at the shelter was what will the next fighting breed be when pits get outdated, which will happen, ban or not. I think any of the breeds you mentioned, in particular Canarios, would be worse than pits. The sheer mass of Canarios would lead to any incidents being much more serious, and the tempermant of the dogs is even more aggressive towards humans.

[Rigs11]

Disturbing video of Pit attacking other dog.Now this pit seems like he wants to instill injury at all costs. From many reports, they are fine one minute and then they snap.

http://www.buzzhumor.com/videos/2151...ll_Attacks_Dog

[Steve Sewell]

Originally Posted by orange 4 life

that explains alot. you need to get out more.

Hmm, a personal insult during a disagreement in philosphy on dog breeds. REALLY mature...

[Steve Sewell]

Originally Posted by orange 4 life

we should educate, we should look BEYOND the surface (again, if for arguments sake 30% of all dogs are abused and/or neglected, its likely TWICE that for pits. what about those numbers?), and most importantly we should punish the human offenders swiftly and harshly.

OK...are you up for this, orange 4 life?:

If your dog somehow gets out, loses his cool, acts on instinct, and maims/kills another dog or god forbid a human being, what do you propose your penalty should be? Seeing as you are using your own personal situation with your pitbulls to rationalize your position on the breed in general, we might as well turn the tables here and get your opinion on that as well.

[DenverBroncosJM]

Well ten pages later and I have come to see the light.

Its not the Pit Bulls are bad its the owners of them. So I promise from now on if a Pit Bull "owner" ever chases me, bites me or maims me I will place all the blame firmly on the Pit Bull.

[Popps]

Originally Posted by Rigs11

Disturbing video of Pit attacking other dog.Now this pit seems like he wants to instill injury at all costs. From many reports, they are fine one minute and then they snap.

http://www.buzzhumor.com/videos/2151...ll_Attacks_Dog

Did I miss something in that video? They sort of roll on each other, then are out of screen... then one runs off? Hard to tell what happened there.

I've seen a couple PBs go nuts at the dog park. One dickhead used to bring his unfixed male into the park and he constantly stirred up ****. I saw him get into it with a large male Boxer. The Boxer did quite well. (They're fighters, too... just not killers by nature.) It was broken up. Had it not been, I suspect the PB would have eventually gotten the best of it. It was ugly.

Why anyone would want to pay to watch that is beyond me. ****ing losers.

[cutthemdown]

Originally Posted by Popps

Did I miss something in that video? They sort of roll on each other, then are out of screen... then one runs off? Hard to tell what happened there.

I've seen a couple PBs go nuts at the dog park. One dickhead used to bring his unfixed male into the park and he constantly stirred up ****. I saw him get into it with a large male Boxer. The Boxer did quite well. (They're fighters, too... just not killers by nature.) It was broken up. Had it not been, I suspect the PB would have eventually gotten the best of it. It was ugly.

Why anyone would want to pay to watch that is beyond me. ****ing losers.

It's the same reason people like car crashes, boxing matches etc. The reason I am against dog fighting is because the dogs don't get to make a choice like humans can and the damage caused by the fighting is just too horrid for me to stomach. I am by no means an activist I enjoy fishing, hunting, horse racing and going to Seaworld or the Wild Animal park as much as the next person.

[cutthemdown]

Originally Posted by Steve Sewell

OK...are you up for this, orange 4 life?:

If your dog somehow gets out, loses his cool, acts on instinct, and maims/kills another dog or god forbid a human being, what do you propose your penalty should be? Seeing as you are using your own personal situation with your pitbulls to rationalize your position on the breed in general, we might as well turn the tables here and get your opinion on that as well.

There are already many laws to cover such things. Dog bites are strict liabilty in civil cases you can be sued for any damage your dog inflicts. If you are negligent and your dog kills someone you can be tried for manslaughter. If you purposefully set your dog on someone it can be tried as an attack with a deadly weapon. If said person dies it can be tried as murder. Of course every case where a dog bites someone is not negligence but civilly speaking you still will lose a lawsuit.

[-Slap-]

Originally Posted by BroncoInSkinland

I worked as a field service technician for a humane society for 5 and ½ years with an average workweek of 70 hours. That is roughly 20,000 logged hours, with roughly a quarter of those hours being spent in the field dealing face to face with animals. For 3 and ½ years of my employment I was the assistant field services supervisor with a primary focus of my position being involvement with animal control regarding aggressive dog cases, and animal neglect and abuse. I cross-trained throughout the animal shelter at every position including kennel staff and veterinary technician positions. Many of the fill in shifts I worked required close daily interaction (feeding, cleaning and moving) with anywhere from 4-20 quarantined aggressive animals. As a very rough guess I would estimate I captured and transported an average of 3 truly aggressive dogs per week for the entire course of the 5+ years for a total of around 175 aggressive dogs. I was personally involved in the capture of 4 dogs that had severely injured humans. I have a friend and previous coworker who lost 70% functionality in his right arm due to a dog attack. The county I worked in was considering a ban on Pitbulls, and an adjacent county that we worked closely with had an active ban on the breed.

Whenever I refer to pits, I include purebred American Staffordshire Terriers, Staffordshire Bull Terriers, Bull Terriers, American Pitbull Terriers, or any mixed breed animal that is predominately one of those breeds. 3 of the 4 dogs that had severely injured humans were pits, the other was a Rott. The dog that severed my coworkers arm was a pit. Of the 175 dogs I captured and transported I would estimate 75 or so were pits. Of the 4-20 animals in our aggressive animal quarantine area at any given point in time I would say roughly 50% were pits. If I hear about an aggressive dog or a dog attack, I would give 50/50 odds that a Pit is involved.

That having been said, I would love to own a pit. If I have the time to train one properly I guarantee that will be my next dog. I also won’t worry for a second about leaving it alone with my child, and god help any person who seeks to do harm to that child while my pit is with them. A properly cared for, loved, and trained pitbull is the most loyal, and affectionate animal in the world. For every “bad” pit I saw during my time at the humane society I saw two “good” ones that redeemed the breed in my eyes. Further I can say without a doubt that the “bad” ones weren’t born bad, they were the product of either negligent or abusive owners. I saw such owners on an almost daily basis, and my loathing for them defies description. I would love nothing more than to know they will receive as much pain as they have inflicted on these poor creatures.


I saw a lot of coworkers leave the shelter while I was there, and many of them left because of pits and the issues involved with them. Two veterinary technicians spring to mind immediately. While the county I was in didn’t have an outright ban on pits, adoption processes involving them were very strict, and as a result many of even the “good” pits were unadoptable. In that five year stretch we had two vet-techs leave the field entirely because they grew attached to animals that they then had to put down. I volunteered to “hold” pits many times when they were being euthanized.


“Holding” involves keeping the animal still and calm while exposing a vein for the lethal injection the animal is about to receive. This is basically what happens. You lift the dog onto a metal table and stretch its arm out to expose the vein, and it leans its head against your chest, wanting nothing more from you than your love and attention. Then the technician, who has cared for this animals every need for about the past month to 6 weeks, puts a needle in its vein and you both get to watch as the life fades from its eyes and its head slumps to the table. It is about as heart wrenching as it gets. I am not sure anyone that hasn’t done it really understands what the repercussions of an all out ban would be.

I want to thank you for doing an incredibly difficult (and important) job with as much humanity and compassion as possible. Personally, I could never perform the most gut wrenching tasks of your job, regardless of compensation. I think its very instructive that you love pit bulls despite seeing first hand the problems that are attendant with the breed.

My veterinarian is one of those people who chose the profession for which he was ideally suited. I think he would have been successful in any field, but he was born to be a veterinarian and I'm so glad he made that career choice. When my Great Pyrenees Bronco was seven, my vet discovered a nasty growth in an area I never would have detected anything. He got me emotionally prepared to lose my best friend, but his skill as a surgeon carried the day and Bronco went on to live four more years. There are few people I hold in greater esteem than that brilliant man. My vet has two or three dogs himself and they're all pit bulls.

Isn't it interesting that people who possess such huge amounts of love and compassion for animals would choose pit bulls for their companions?

[Popps]

Damn.... in one day?

Dogs Out Of Control Across Lubbock



A rash of dog attacks involving children occurred across Lubbock Saturday. In all, five children were viciously attacked, the youngest was just two years old. There's no telling why the dogs attacked, but Saturday night, four dogs are in custody at Lubbock Animal Services.

And though five in one day is an abnormally high number, Lubbock Police say that animal attacks have been on the rise lately.

Sgt. Ross Hester from the LPD said, "Over the past two months, there have been several issues with aggressive animals."

And that trend continued Saturday as five children, one just two-years-old, were attacked by dogs, and not all of the dogs were strangers.

Hester added, "A child was being mauled in a backyard and being drug by the family dog."

The family dog was this pitbull. The first incident of the day happened in South Lubbock off 108th Street, where Lubbock Animal Services took three dogs into custody. The details of the gruesome attack are too graphic to share, however when police arrived on the scene, a half naked two-year-old boy was being attacked.

Hester said, "Children's Protective Services was called to the scene. They removed the children. They were taken from the home and taken to UMC, and I believe they're being placed with a family placement at this time."

The second attack of the day happened at a local park near 24th and Frankford. There, four children were bitten by this chow/pitbull mix.

Kevin Overstreet with Animal Services said, "We do have the dog in our custody from 24th and Frankford and we also have the animal, actually have 3 animals from the address on 108th St. in our custody right now."

And the best advice to everyone from police, Hester said, "If they don't know the animal, I'd stay away from them."

Regarding the dog taken from the home in South Lubbock, the one that attacked the two-year-old boy, that attack is currently under evaluation and there will be a dangerous animal hearing in the next 20 days to determine exactly what happened and who's at fault.

We just had another Pitbull attack here in SoCal. 75 year old man out walking his dog in his neighborhood. Two Pitbulls attacked and killed his dog, then turned to him. People apparently got there in time to save him and he was lucky to only land in the hospital for injuries.

[Popps]

Jezuz! Was trying to look up the one that happened here locally on Google, and it's just littered with Pitbull attacks.

http://www.fox12news.com/Global/stor...&nav=menu439_2
but as he was trying to get back up his drive way the dogs lunged knocking him off his feet as they were attempting to rip out his throat.


http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/s...?storyid=82455
ecurity cameras were rolling when two pit bulls attacked a five-year old boy outside of a Detroit gas station.

http://www.newsnet5.com/news/13383577/detail.html
man was attacked by a pitbull on the city's east side Thursday morning before a gas station owner shot the dog.

http://www.wkyc.com/news/news_articl...?storyid=67373
Georgia Rice was playing at her best friend's house Tuesday night around 7 p.m. when she was mauled. It's not clear why the dog attacked.

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?se...cal&id=5317810
A two-year-old boy is fighting for his life Friday after he was mauled by the family pit bull.


This is just the last few weeks.

[orange 4 life]

i love the last part of the article.
typical.
"they got there in time to save him." uh huh. they read the dogs mind and knew he was gonna attack the man next right?

i cant and wont give up the fight, but it makes me so angry i cant even think straight.
again, many of these articles are accusing pits, when in reality its another dog.
many of these articles make the dog sound like the family pet, but in reality its the "tough guy" dog and there just happened to be kids in the house.
the last reported "pitbull" attack here in denver involved a staffy/mastiff mix, and while it was reported as "pitbull (family pet) mauls child" it was LATER reported that the dog was chained, malnourished, and abused. the "child" jumped the backyard fence coming down behind the dog, and the mother was later charged with animal and CHILD abuse. not quite the original story huh? yet no retraction was printed.

i dont know what happened with these stories because i wasnt there.
what i DO know is that if you go back to the 70's and 80's it wasnt pitbulls that were leading the way for attacks. why is that?
because there wasnt a stigma there. God this is frustrating.
i love ya popps, but if you ACTUALLY believe the breed is the problem AND you think breed specific legislation is the solution then i dont even know what to say.
most people dont even know what a "pitbull" looks like, and my guess is that at LEAST half (and probably more like 3/4) of these stories dont even involve an actual pitbull.
in the cases where they actually do, im guessing NINETY percent are NOT just "the average family pet".

in a comprehensive study of dog bites that resulted in death, the writer of the book couldnt find ONE case of a dog that WASNT abused or neglected in some way....

....but the media finds them all the time. whatever.

wanna come kill my dogs popps? is that your point?
you think theyre gonna "snap" randomly despite having never even NIPPED at a human before?
you think we should just kill 'em all despite knowing that these "professional" dog fighters choose pitbulls because they ARENT aggressive towards humans?

tell me popps, whats your solution?

maybe i dont wanna know.

jake

[orange 4 life]

here is my post from another thread. do you wanna HONESTLY tell me that most people wouldnt incorrectly identify many of these dogs as "pitbulls"?
further, these are only purebreds, so that doesnt even account for the numerous mixes out there.
should we ban boxers and shepherds because it came out later in one of these stories that the boxer and shepherd attacked the kid while the pit wasnt involved?

do you know what an "american pitbull terrier" looks like?

neither do most people.
thats why all the bite statistics you see are EXTREMELY misleading, and even WITH the misleading stats AND the higher incidence of abuse (because of all the "tough guy" dogs out there) and neglect amongst pitbulls, the number of serious and/or fatal bites is amazingly LOW.

take the test (i have an unfair advantage, though my 1st guess was in fact correct) and see how many breeds you pick incorrectly before identifying the real APBT.
as ive said many times, their appearance is different from public perception.
after, scroll down and look at just some of the examples of the press misreporting "pitbull" attacks.

www.pitbullsontheweb.com/petbull/findpit.html

Examination of newspaper archival records dating back to the 1950s and 1960s reveal the same types of severe and fatal attacks occurring then as today. The only difference is the breed of dog responsible for these events. A random study of 74 severe and fatal attacks reported in the Evening Bulletin (Philadelphia, PA) from 1964-1968, show no severe or fatal attacks by Rottweilers and only one attack attributed to a Pit-Bull-type dog. The dogs involved in most of these incidents were the breeds that were popular at the time.

here are just a few examples of bad reporting:

Killer Pit Bulls Rip Granny to ShredsNew York Post (NYPost.com) Dec. 11, 2002Pet Pit Bulls Kill Woman, 80, in Her HomeThe New York Times (nytimes.com) Dec. 11, 2002
[The victim's daughter and granddaughter (owner of the dogs) could not believe the dogs, a female Pit Bull and a male Lab/Pit mix attacked and killed the elderly woman. The family hired a forensic pathologist to review the case. It was determined that although the victim had sustained some dog bites, all the bites were non-lethal and post-mortem. The grandmother was not "ripped to shreds" by the dogs but died from cardiac arrhythmia. Both dogs were eventually returned to their owners.]

Pit Bull Attack Victim Leaves Hospital WTVO (Channel 17) April 25, 2003
Man Struggles to Recover from Pit Bull Attack WTVO (Channel 17) April 29, 2003
[The man in this case was never bitten by a Pit bull. Indeed, there is no mention of the dog making contact with the man at all. Instead, the man was running from the dog and he ran into the road and "slammed" into a passing van. He sustained serious injuries from the collision with the vehicle.]

Pit Bull Horror New York Daily News February 7, 2004
Pit Bull Mauls 3-Year-Old's Face New York Newsday February 6, 2004
[A Bronx family owned a Boxer dog and a German Shepherd puppy that usually were kept in the basement as guard dogs. Two days before the girl was bitten, the family took in a Pit Bull. The 3-year-old was alone playing with the three dogs when a dogfight started. At this point the girl was bitten in the face by the Boxer (also reported to be an American bulldog). It was later acknowledged that the Pit bull (also reported to be a Pit bull mix and a "pet bulldog") was not involved in the attack on the girl]

Cortland Pit Bull Mauling Death WBNG.com (Channel 12) Dec. 9, 2002
[It was later determined that although the Pit bull participated in the death of 24-year-old Eric Tallman, the dog did not inflict the fatal wounds. The victim died from blunt force injury. It was later revealed that the victim was beaten to death by an acquaintance over a drug debt.]

Vancouver Girl Badly Injured in Pit Bull Attack CTV News Dec. 23, 2002
[This was a very severe attack and as such garnered much media attention. As a result of more in-depth coverage the breed was later correctly identified as a Mastiff/Rottweiler mixed breed]

Family's Pit Bull Kills Boy, 20, months The Gainesville Sun May 8, 2000
20-month-old Killed by Bull Terrier Naples Daily News May 9, 2000
[This child was not killed by a Pit Bull, nor a Bull Terrier, nor a "family" dog. How the dog came to be labelled a "Pit bull" is unexplained. The owner described the dog to be a Labrador/Mastiff/Rottweiler cattle dog. The dog was used to herd cattle and was kept chained on the property. Animal control and the Alachua Sheriff's office confirm the dog was a mixed breed. Photographs of the dog reveal no discernable breed.]
__________________

[orange 4 life]

by the way, the book i referenced is "fatal dog attacks- the story behind the statistics" by karen delise.

here is part of the disclaimer before listing fatal dog bite stats that others have used on this thread to attempt to show how dangerous pitbulls are:

Since there may be error in the identification of the breed of dog(s) involved in a fatal attack as reported in newspaper stories, it would be a mistake to use information posted on this site to support agendas promoting legislation banning, limiting or curtailing the ownership of certain breeds of dog, such as a so-called "pit bull" dog (read "Problems with American pit bull terrier identification"). Note that a pit bull is not a breed of dog, but instead the term has come to be widely used to describe a dog that has an appearance similar to a American Pit Bull terrier or American Staffordshire terrier. In some cases a dog described as a pit bull may in fact be an American Staff (AKC recognized) or an American Pit Bull (UKC recognized), but in other cases it may not. Since other breeds of dog physically resemble these breeds, mistaken identity is frequntly made and consequently numbers are inflated for the number of attacks involving so-called "pit bulls". Further, correct breed identification becomes more problematic when the dog involved in an attack is a mixed-breed. Hence, ambiguity exists when using the term "pit bull".

here is the link to "pitbull identification":

http://www.dogexpert.com/FatalDogAtt...ification.html

do you really think breed specific legislation is the answer?
you really think its a black and white issue?

[BroncoInSkinland]

Originally Posted by orange 4 life

i dont know what happened with these stories because i wasnt there.
what i DO know is that if you go back to the 70's and 80's it wasnt pitbulls that were leading the way for attacks. why is that?
because there wasnt a stigma there.

It actually goes a bit deeper than that. In the 70' and 80's pit's were under the radar. The "tough guy" dog of choice back then was Dobbermans, and they got a lot of negative press. Little bit of regulation later, it became harder to raise/adopt/own Dobbermans, and before long the tough guys needed a new breed. Enter pit-bulls.

There is now an effort in progress to do to pit's what happened to Dobbies. The real problem is this is only treating a symptom, not the disease itself. Bans/regulations on owning a specific breed will only introduce a new breed into the equation. Until a much tougher stance on animal crimes including fighting, neglect, and abuse is taken we will continue to see stories like these.

Banning a breed will change the names involved, and hurt a lot of good dogs. While it looks like an attractive solution on the surface, anyone in the field will tell you it is only a bandaid on internal bleeding.

[orange 4 life]

thats spot on accurate, and it FLOORS me that people (especially a good guy and an animal lover like popps) dont seem to see it.

[Popps]

Jake, they have pictures of the dogs in this case. One happened on video. Now, unless you're saying they went to the pound.... randomly grabbed some pit bulls and planted them to create these "fake" stories, I'd say there might be a little validity, here.

So, please don't tell me that "I don't get it," Jake. I absolutely LOVE dogs, and love the pit bulls I've come into contact. I'm also not going to pull the covers over my face and pretend that there isn't a problem, here. It reminds me a lot of the fans who assume that all of these athlete thugs are innocent every time they're arrested. Sometimes where there's enough smoke there's fire.

Oh, and yea... I want to "kill your dogs," Jake. That was a pretty smart thing for you to say.

[Popps]

Originally Posted by BroncoInSkinland

Banning a breed will change the names involved, and hurt a lot of good dogs..

Yea, well... we're doing a world of good for them now, huh? Pounds full of these dogs waiting to die... people being attacked, the breed being over-bred, used as temporary tough-guy fixtures, then crapped on.

Last I checked, Pit Bulls and PB mixes were among the most euthanized dog breeds. That's doing the breed a world of good, right?

Then there's this little issue of people being killed, kids being attacked, etc.

Yea, doing nothing about the problem is just working wonders for the breed. If they could talk, I'm sure they'd thank us.