Total blown call on Pitt's first TD - did anyone see this???? - The Orange Mane

Archie · 11-05-2006, 09:20 PM

So just went and looked in the game thread to see all the outrage and there was none. I really couldn't believe it.

So this blatant non-call was on Pittsburgh's first TD. As you'll recall Toothlisberger had all day to throw and scrambled way out to the left and then back towards the middle before finding Willie Parker going into the end zone. Right as the play happened I commented that I could not believe there were no lineman illegally downfield after a scramble like that.

Turns out there were. At least one drove his block all the way down to the 5 yard line before beginning to scamper back (although still well downfield when the ball was thrown and "getting back" would have been irrelevant).

Anyway - I can't believe a) it was not noticed by the refs, b) not noticed by any of the announcers (I guess that's not that surprising) and c) was not outrageously discussed on the game thread.

So - I'm I the only one who saw this?

Crushaholic · 11-05-2006, 09:24 PM

I guess so. Good call...

-Slap- · 11-05-2006, 09:26 PM

Their last touchdown drive was completely giftwrapped, too. That holding call on Warren was utter bull****. All that happened was Gerard was ridden out of the play. The back judge had the flag out of his pocket practically as soon as the ball was snapped.

freak6 · 11-05-2006, 09:37 PM

Nice find Archie, I didn't notice that. Good call.

theAPAOps5 · 11-05-2006, 09:38 PM

Didn't even think about that. I was too upset about how he worked himself open.

Archie · 11-05-2006, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ApaOps5

Didn't even think about that. I was too upset about how he worked himself open.

Well - as I was explaining to the youth who were present (and their parents) while it may not sound like a big deal - its huge. If you are the line backer covering Parker and you see lineman moving down field you can now leave your coverage assignment and chase down the QB. I would not be surprised to see exactly that happening (although once I saw the lineman I stopped watching and started making my point with anyone who would listen).

Anyway - as a defender once those lineman move downfield you don't have to worry about pass coverage anymore. It's no wonder Parker was wide open (that and the 10 seconds toothlisberger had to throw).

Clockwork Orange · 11-05-2006, 10:05 PM

Not all that surprising. I'm still in disbelief that they ignored the pass interference on that 3rd down pass to Rod Smith. That was unbelievable.

SprintRightOption · 11-05-2006, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Slap-

Their last touchdown drive was completely giftwrapped, too. That holding call on Warren was utter bull****. All that happened was Gerard was ridden out of the play. The back judge had the flag out of his pocket practically as soon as the ball was snapped.

Is it even possible to have defensive holding on a running play? I have never seen that called ever before today. Warren did nothing that even looked like holding, even if he was an offensive lineman. This has to be one of the most suspicious calls this year in the league.

There were several calls in this game that seemed to go against us and noncalls on the Steelers o-line. Gee, it's almost like the league wanted the defending Superbowl winners to stay in the playoff race a little longer. That would never happen, would it....

ClevelandBronco · 11-05-2006, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SprintRightOption

Is it even possible to have defensive holding on a running play?(

I've seen it, but I've never understood it.

I could be wrong, but some brain cell buried way down deep thinks it may have happened in the last Super Bowl or some other time late in last year's postseason.

rubaiyat · 11-05-2006, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SprintRightOption

Is it even possible to have defensive holding on a running play? I have never seen that called ever before today. Warren did nothing that even looked like holding, even if he was an offensive lineman. This has to be one of the most suspicious calls this year in the league.

There were several calls in this game that seemed to go against us and noncalls on the Steelers o-line. Gee, it's almost like the league wanted the defending Superbowl winners to stay in the playoff race a little longer. That would never happen, would it....

While it looked fishy, I wouldn't believe that for a second.

For one, we won. If someone higher up wanted a Steelers victory they would have gotten it. All you have to do is a couple calls at key points, hcanges how the offense and defense can play, and bam Steelers can play to their strengths.

WABronco · 11-05-2006, 10:29 PM

I noticed two holding calls against Engelberger in that set of downs inside their 5 yard line...neither was called (even though he's RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE REF). I noticed a blatant hold on Warren that sprung Davenport's 19 yard screen catch-and-run. I noticed a hold on Chukwurah on an off-tackle run.

They tried to give it to 'em (again)...too bad.

It's funny you mention illegal-men-downfield...there were at least 3 on that big scramble play Ben made in the super bowl when he completed a pass down inside the Seattle 10.

11-05-2006, 10:33 PM

there were several blown calls on pitt offense today for holds and illegal men down field. good observation, but it felt like the league wanted pitt to win today... looking at the way the game was called

ClevelandBronco · 11-05-2006, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DB84FAN

…it felt like the league wanted pitt to win today... looking at the way the game was called

Dude, get your conspiracy-believing self over to the war, religion and politics forum immediately. mhgaffney is selling mini-nukes as the cause for the WTC collapses. I bet you'd enjoy a double dip of that stuff.

SprintRightOption · 11-05-2006, 10:47 PM

I also thought the bonehead throw by Jake that was bobbled obviously but was called a catch by the Ref standing right there with a perfect view of it was interesting. The booth review took about twice as long as the 2 reviews on the Colts-Pats game tonight. That needed no more than 5 seconds to see it was clearly not a catch. It was almost like they were sitting there in review booth saying "Is there any way we can say this is inconclusive? What if we only look at this angle?"

-Slap- · 11-06-2006, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SprintRightOption

Is it even possible to have defensive holding on a running play? I have never seen that called ever before today. Warren did nothing that even looked like holding, even if he was an offensive lineman. This has to be one of the most suspicious calls this year in the league.

There were several calls in this game that seemed to go against us and noncalls on the Steelers o-line. Gee, it's almost like the league wanted the defending Superbowl winners to stay in the playoff race a little longer. That would never happen, would it....

Its rarely called, but the reason for the rule is sound. Say you're a defensive tackle and you see the guard start to pull for a sweep. You know you're too big and fat to help string the play out to the sideline, but you can help your teammates by tackling that guard before he ever gets a chance to lead the play. Same thing on screen passes.

The rule began to be enforced the year after Baltimore lucked into that fluke Super Bowl. Everybody remembers the twin fatass DT alignment with Siragusa and Sam Adams eating up blockers for Ray Ray. Well, the Ravens took it a step further (and lower). They were having Goose and Adams just fire out at the guards' and centers' knees on every snap. These guys were more concerned about protecting their careers than making blocks. You saw a spate of defensive holding calls on defensive linemen at the start of 2001 to clean that stuff up.

Cito Pelon · 11-06-2006, 01:58 PM

Yup, just watched it on the tape.

orange 4 life · 11-06-2006, 02:06 PM

i was too ticked off at the fact that we were letting him run around, though my buddy did in fact catch it, and he was furious. im glad i DID miss it, because i probably wouldve had a friggin coronary.

the officials were bad....very bad.
thankfully it didnt cost us the game.

the call on warren was completely pulled out of thin air, and there were plenty of other questionable calls, such as the no-call on rods deep pass that he dropped, the hold on alexander (looked more like a push to me) that negated marshalls great catch, the OBVIOUS lack of control on that wouldve been plummer int (that caused us to lose momentum in the challenge), etc.

hell, these guys called a personal foul for roughness on the punt returner!!
at least they reversed that one.

everything else aside, we got a win against a good team, and we did it without our "A" game on defense or in the running game.

Northman · 11-06-2006, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by -Slap-

Their last touchdown drive was completely giftwrapped, too. That holding call on Warren was utter bull****. All that happened was Gerard was ridden out of the play. The back judge had the flag out of his pocket practically as soon as the ball was snapped.

Yea, i have more problems with the last one than the first. At least 2 Phantom calls were on that last drive which was bogus.

Mile High Shack · 11-06-2006, 02:13 PM

I just laughed when I saw our Dlineman get tackled to the ground and no flags came out

it's typical it seems, no conpiracy theory, just a common fact, for some reason our Dlineman do not get any calls, I guess they aren't flava clown enough

Barry Ramey · 11-06-2006, 02:28 PM

Yeah, holding on a DL is rarely called, but it's a legit penalty. I don't know if Warren did it, but typically teams at times will try to get away with a DL, usually a DT holding onto a pulling guard or center so he can't go down and block a LB or safety, whoever happens to be there, so trying to keep the back seven free to make a play.

I didn't notice a Steeler OL down the field on that play. Good call Archie. But maybe it wasn't called because the QB is out of the pocket, so OL can go down the field since left the pocket. Anyone know what if such a rule exists?

Barry Ramey · 11-06-2006, 02:30 PM

I also think our DL doesn't get too many calls for holding or even hands to the face either and I've seem some instances when it happened, and nothing.

freak6 · 11-06-2006, 02:38 PM

The worst call I saw was that fkn idiot Ref in the Indy/NE game come in, rule it a 1st down on 4th and 1, without stopping the clock and measuring.

Brady did not get the first down, imo. But he came in and didn't even look at the spot, he just ruled first down without blinking. I thought the fix was in on that one. Total BS. At least Brady threw a pick on the drive.

Jose Chung · 11-06-2006, 02:49 PM

Refs try and protect the teams with lots of bandwagon fans. Anyone remember last year's Super Bowl? One of the worst officiating games ever.

Bronco_Beerslug · 11-06-2006, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archie

So just went and looked in the game thread to see all the outrage and there was none. I really couldn't believe it.

Not that big of deal. When you're only 15 yards from the endzone that call will rarely if ever be called.

ZONA · 11-06-2006, 08:04 PM

I think the refs do a great job for the most part but sometimes they do miss some obvious stuff. How about the Brady plunge for a 1st down on 4th and 1. The ref from the sideline comes running in declaring a 1st down and they move the chains, not even thinking of a measurement. From every angle I could see, he wasn't even close man. Total hometown ref there.

11-05-2006, 09:20 PM	#1
Archie R Gang Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 1,151 Adopt-a-Bronco: Keith Bishop	Total blown call on Pitt's first TD - did anyone see this???? So just went and looked in the game thread to see all the outrage and there was none. I really couldn't believe it. So this blatant non-call was on Pittsburgh's first TD. As you'll recall Toothlisberger had all day to throw and scrambled way out to the left and then back towards the middle before finding Willie Parker going into the end zone. Right as the play happened I commented that I could not believe there were no lineman illegally downfield after a scramble like that. Turns out there were. At least one drove his block all the way down to the 5 yard line before beginning to scamper back (although still well downfield when the ball was thrown and "getting back" would have been irrelevant). Anyway - I can't believe a) it was not noticed by the refs, b) not noticed by any of the announcers (I guess that's not that surprising) and c) was not outrageously discussed on the game thread. So - I'm I the only one who saw this?

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11-05-2006, 09:24 PM	#2
Crushaholic Armchair Poster Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Topeka, KS Posts: 22,043	I guess so. Good call...

11-05-2006, 09:26 PM	#3
-Slap- Ring of Famer Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 31,895	Their last touchdown drive was completely giftwrapped, too. That holding call on Warren was utter bull****. All that happened was Gerard was ridden out of the play. The back judge had the flag out of his pocket practically as soon as the ball was snapped.

11-05-2006, 09:37 PM	#4
freak6 3,631 - WAKE UP!!!! Impeach President Cheney and Puppet Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: San Diego Posts: 4,651 Adopt-a-Bronco: MJK	Nice find Archie, I didn't notice that. Good call.

11-05-2006, 09:38 PM	#5
theAPAOps5 A new beginning! Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Denver Posts: 26,058 Adopt-a-Bronco: Watermock - RIP	Didn't even think about that. I was too upset about how he worked himself open.

11-05-2006, 10:05 PM	#7
Clockwork Orange Persona Non Grata I seen him! Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 21,438	Not all that surprising. I'm still in disbelief that they ignored the pass interference on that 3rd down pass to Rod Smith. That was unbelievable.

11-05-2006, 10:29 PM	#11
WABronco WE SUCK AGAIN All dat force Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Denver Posts: 4,976	I noticed two holding calls against Engelberger in that set of downs inside their 5 yard line...neither was called (even though he's RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE REF). I noticed a blatant hold on Warren that sprung Davenport's 19 yard screen catch-and-run. I noticed a hold on Chukwurah on an off-tackle run. They tried to give it to 'em (again)...too bad. It's funny you mention illegal-men-downfield...there were at least 3 on that big scramble play Ben made in the super bowl when he completed a pass down inside the Seattle 10.

11-05-2006, 10:33 PM	#12
DB84FAN Guest Posts: n/a	there were several blown calls on pitt offense today for holds and illegal men down field. good observation, but it felt like the league wanted pitt to win today... looking at the way the game was called

11-05-2006, 10:47 PM	#14
SprintRightOption Back on track in 08 Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 391	I also thought the bonehead throw by Jake that was bobbled obviously but was called a catch by the Ref standing right there with a perfect view of it was interesting. The booth review took about twice as long as the 2 reviews on the Colts-Pats game tonight. That needed no more than 5 seconds to see it was clearly not a catch. It was almost like they were sitting there in review booth saying "Is there any way we can say this is inconclusive? What if we only look at this angle?"

11-06-2006, 01:58 PM	#16
Cito Pelon Attack at all times . . . Happy dog at the Divide Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: AFC West Championshipville Posts: 15,193 Adopt-a-Bronco: Elvis	Yup, just watched it on the tape.

11-06-2006, 02:06 PM	#17
orange 4 life Old School Orange Home team qb homer Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Anywhere, CO. Posts: 8,642	i was too ticked off at the fact that we were letting him run around, though my buddy did in fact catch it, and he was furious. im glad i DID miss it, because i probably wouldve had a friggin coronary. the officials were bad....very bad. thankfully it didnt cost us the game. the call on warren was completely pulled out of thin air, and there were plenty of other questionable calls, such as the no-call on rods deep pass that he dropped, the hold on alexander (looked more like a push to me) that negated marshalls great catch, the OBVIOUS lack of control on that wouldve been plummer int (that caused us to lose momentum in the challenge), etc. hell, these guys called a personal foul for roughness on the punt returner!! at least they reversed that one. everything else aside, we got a win against a good team, and we did it without our "A" game on defense or in the running game.

11-06-2006, 02:13 PM	#19
Mile High Shack Ring of Famer Cock-a-doodle-do Join Date: May 2001 Location: Somewhere Posts: 17,010	I just laughed when I saw our Dlineman get tackled to the ground and no flags came out it's typical it seems, no conpiracy theory, just a common fact, for some reason our Dlineman do not get any calls, I guess they aren't flava clown enough

11-06-2006, 02:28 PM	#20
Barry Ramey Ring of Famer Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,700	Yeah, holding on a DL is rarely called, but it's a legit penalty. I don't know if Warren did it, but typically teams at times will try to get away with a DL, usually a DT holding onto a pulling guard or center so he can't go down and block a LB or safety, whoever happens to be there, so trying to keep the back seven free to make a play. I didn't notice a Steeler OL down the field on that play. Good call Archie. But maybe it wasn't called because the QB is out of the pocket, so OL can go down the field since left the pocket. Anyone know what if such a rule exists?

11-06-2006, 02:30 PM	#21
Barry Ramey Ring of Famer Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,700	I also think our DL doesn't get too many calls for holding or even hands to the face either and I've seem some instances when it happened, and nothing.

11-06-2006, 02:38 PM	#22
freak6 3,631 - WAKE UP!!!! Impeach President Cheney and Puppet Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: San Diego Posts: 4,651 Adopt-a-Bronco: MJK	The worst call I saw was that fkn idiot Ref in the Indy/NE game come in, rule it a 1st down on 4th and 1, without stopping the clock and measuring. Brady did not get the first down, imo. But he came in and didn't even look at the spot, he just ruled first down without blinking. I thought the fix was in on that one. Total BS. At least Brady threw a pick on the drive.

11-06-2006, 02:49 PM	#23
Jose Chung Trust No One She's with me. Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tucson Posts: 88 Adopt-a-Bronco: Mike Bell (UA)	Refs try and protect the teams with lots of bandwagon fans. Anyone remember last year's Super Bowl? One of the worst officiating games ever.

11-06-2006, 08:04 PM	#25
ZONA Ring of Famer Liquid greatness in every packet Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 7,374 Adopt-a-Bronco: Chris Harris	I think the refs do a great job for the most part but sometimes they do miss some obvious stuff. How about the Brady plunge for a 1st down on 4th and 1. The ref from the sideline comes running in declaring a 1st down and they move the chains, not even thinking of a measurement. From every angle I could see, he wasn't even close man. Total hometown ref there.