Nutjob Harris Shows Her True Colors

[Rohirrim]

Here’s the words of the woman who helped Bush get elected in Florida:

"If you're not electing Christians, then in essence you are going to legislate sin," Harris said.

Separation of church and state is "a lie we have been told," Harris said in the interview, published Thursday, saying separating religion and politics is "wrong because God is the one who chooses our rulers."


http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/08/....ap/index.html

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Another religious right "person" who knows why she's going to Heaven and your not

[bendog]

hmmm, nutjob. hmmmm.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Separation of church and state is "a lie we have been told," Harris said in the interview, published Thursday, saying separating religion and politics is "wrong because God is the one who chooses our rulers."

[enjolras]

Originally Posted by Crazy Neocon

"If you're not electing Christians, then in essence you are going to legislate sin"

Apparently there is no morality outside of Christianity. How 6th century.

[W*GS]

Wadda moron... Typical of the evangelicals infesting the GOP...

[BroncoBuff]

t e n . m i l l i o n . d o l l a r s

[Mile High Shack]

she sure didn't chose her words very good
but in essense
God is in control, so if you believe that...everything happens for a reason

[bendog]

She's a nutjob, though I wouldn't mind if the did a job on my .....

Anyway, it's probably correct to say the consitutional convention and bill of rights did not mean to set up a seperation of church and state. They did not want a state religion, that's very clear. And the history of the Episcopal church in inherently intertwined. We were originally Anglicans via the Church of England. Originally, any bishop installed by English bishops (it takes 3) had to sign an oath to the King/Queen. We never did, though many of the Tories expelled to Canada and the Carrabbian were Anglicans.

But seperation of church and state? That's nowhere in the const or bill of rights. Someone asked John Adams why God wasn't mentioned in the const, and he deadpaned "OMG we forgot!"

But with a multi-ethnic society, the seperation seems like a good idea. What's goofy about Harris is that if some fundy protestant goes into Little Havana or Brooklyn and suggests school prayer, they're gonna be hysterically disappointed with what the community proposes for prayer.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by Mile High Shack

she sure didn't chose her words very good
but in essense
God is in control, so if you believe that...everything happens for a reason

Actually, the republicans are in control (for now). God has nothing to do with it.

She's a certified wacko but does somewhat represent the right as evidenced by your post.

[Rohirrim]

Originally Posted by bendog

But seperation of church and state? That's nowhere in the const or bill of rights. Someone asked John Adams why God wasn't mentioned in the const, and he deadpaned "OMG we forgot!"

But with a multi-ethnic society, the seperation seems like a good idea. What's goofy about Harris is that if some fundy protestant goes into Little Havana or Brooklyn and suggests school prayer, they're gonna be hysterically disappointed with what the community proposes for prayer.

I think the intent was pretty clear:

"It was the Universal opinion of the Century [1600’s] preceding the last [1700’s], that Civil Government could not stand without the prop of a Religious establishment, & that the Christian religion itself, would perish if not supported by a legal provision for its Clergy. The experience of Virginia conspicuously corroborates the disproof of both opinions. The Civil Government...functions with complete success; Whilst the number, the industry, and the morality of the Priesthood, & the devotion of the people have been manifestly increased by the total separation of the Church from the State."
James Madison


"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith and worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people that declared that their Congress should make no laws respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; thus building a wall of separation between Church & State."
Thomas Jefferson

[DBruleU]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

Actually, the republicans are in control (for now). God has nothing to do with it.

She's a certified wacko but does somewhat represent the right as evidenced by your post.

I think he meant God puts those who are in control, into the controlling position. I agree with him.

[Mile High Shack]

Originally Posted by DBruleU

I think he meant God puts those who are in control, into the controlling position. I agree with him.

exactly

I'm not self centered enough, nor do I have a big enough ego to believe that I am in control......I believe in a higher power who has a hand in everything that goes on.

[alkemical]

Wow

that's all i'm gonna say

[bendog]

Originally Posted by Rohirrim

I think the intent was pretty clear:

"It was the Universal opinion of the Century [1600’s] preceding the last [1700’s], that Civil Government could not stand without the prop of a Religious establishment, & that the Christian religion itself, would perish if not supported by a legal provision for its Clergy. The experience of Virginia conspicuously corroborates the disproof of both opinions. The Civil Government...functions with complete success; Whilst the number, the industry, and the morality of the Priesthood, & the devotion of the people have been manifestly increased by the total separation of the Church from the State."
James Madison


"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith and worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people that declared that their Congress should make no laws respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; thus building a wall of separation between Church & State."
Thomas Jefferson

Yet didn't children prey (_: at school? But, I've never seen support that the founders intended ban prayer or even displays of the ten commandments in court houses. Mind you, I think that in the 21st century there's no option.

[alkemical]

Originally Posted by bendog

She's a nutjob, though I wouldn't mind if the did a job on my .....

Anyway, it's probably correct to say the consitutional convention and bill of rights did not mean to set up a seperation of church and state. They did not want a state religion, that's very clear. And the history of the Episcopal church in inherently intertwined. We were originally Anglicans via the Church of England. Originally, any bishop installed by English bishops (it takes 3) had to sign an oath to the King/Queen. We never did, though many of the Tories expelled to Canada and the Carrabbian were Anglicans.

But seperation of church and state? That's nowhere in the const or bill of rights. Someone asked John Adams why God wasn't mentioned in the const, and he deadpaned "OMG we forgot!"

But with a multi-ethnic society, the seperation seems like a good idea. What's goofy about Harris is that if some fundy protestant goes into Little Havana or Brooklyn and suggests school prayer, they're gonna be hysterically disappointed with what the community proposes for prayer.

The last paragraph is dead on. We can't have a society that we have, if people want us to turn into the middle east (theocratic rule).

it amazes me that people don't really get that.

[Mile High Shack]

Originally Posted by claviculasolomonis

The last paragraph is dead on. We can't have a society that we have, if people want us to turn into the middle east (theocratic rule).

it amazes me that people don't really get that.

you have to have a seperation of church and state......you can't force people into believing

but I see no problem with looking to a higher power on some issues that trouble you

[alkemical]

Originally Posted by Mile High Shack

you have to have a seperation of church and state......you can't force people into believing

but I see no problem with looking to a higher power on some issues that trouble you

My problem MHS - are those people that have bumper stickers that say:

"If god is your co-pilot, move over" - where as in they have no control over their lives and god is only in total control. That's false from MY perspective. It removes accountability and the joy of living life and making decisions.

That's where i err on the side of caution. I get twitchy when someone wants a theocracy here in the USA. I mean, how many cults of christianity are out there? They can't even agree on the same thing. Other than the cross (although a sacred image, i'd think doves or something would be a more fitting tribute to jesus' message - but that's me - and it's a whole other topic) -


I mean i don't mind religions or religious people - i get nervous though when people want to force their beliefs on me - because i've believed them all at one point or another - and none of them have the real answer anyway.

I think kindergarden was the closest.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by DBruleU

I think he meant God puts those who are in control, into the controlling position. I agree with him.

Really? This is the first time I've heard that the reason for Hitler, Saddam, etc.. is God.

[W*GS]

[DBruleU]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

Really? This is the first time I've heard that the reason for Hitler, Saddam, etc.. is God.

They still chose to do what they did with that power. God doesnt control them.

[TheDave]

Originally Posted by DBruleU

They still chose to do what they did with that power. God doesnt control them.

just playing devils advocate here...


Doesn't god already know the outcome... I.E. "it's all part of his plan"?


Add to that your belief that God places people into a position of Power... IE Hitler


then...the death of 4+ million jews was "Part of Gods plan"?


obviously i must be missing something

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by TheDave

just playing devils advocate here...


Doesn't god already know the outcome... I.E. "it's all part of his plan"?


Add to that your belief that God places people into a position of Power... IE Hitler


then...the death of 4+ million jews was "Part of Gods plan"?


obviously i must be missing something

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by DBruleU

They still chose to do what they did with that power. God doesnt control them.

Wait a minute:

You just said God puts them in power, and now you're saying God doesn't control them?

You don't consider putting someone in control of the fate of nations an act of control?

(Particularly when God, as a purportedly omniscient being, knows about everything an Adolph Hitler or a Pol Pot or a George W. Bush is going to do in advance?)

[DBruleU]

Originally Posted by TheDave

just playing devils advocate here...


Doesn't god already know the outcome... I.E. "it's all part of his plan"?


Add to that your belief that God places people into a position of Power... IE Hitler


then...the death of 4+ million jews was "Part of Gods plan"?


obviously i must be missing something

Since he has already planned everything from the beginning, yes, it was his plan. He has told the Jews from the beginning of time that this would happen to them. You are surprised?

Sometimes he has to let certain things to happen so that people can come to him in times of despair.