Leinart and Cards at an impasse - The Orange Mane

Clockwork Orange · 07-31-2006, 02:31 PM

Looks like Hollywood is officially a holdout.

With first-round draft choice Matt Leinart scheduled to be throwing to Arizona Cardinals receivers on Monday, the initial day of training camp practice, the agent for the former Southern California quarterback instead threw in the towel on contract negotiations.

At least for now.

"We've been [in the Phoenix area] since Friday and couldn't get it done," agent Tom Condon said Sunday night, after three days of face-to-face negotiations failed to produce an agreement for the 2004 Heisman Trophy winner. "We're hung up on a lot of issues. It's time to go home."

The 10th overall choice in the draft, and probably a bargain in that slot after he posted a brilliant 37-2 record as the Trojans' starter for three seasons, Leinart missed the team's Sunday evening deadline for reporting to training camp at Flagstaff, Ariz. The Cardinals' first practice is Monday morning, and it will take a major change in the two sides' bargaining positions for him to be on the field for that session.

Leinart has been in Phoenix for the past few days and has actually spent time throwing with some Arizona receivers. It is not known if Leinart, who wanted to be in the vicinity in the event of a contract accord, plans to stay in the area with the negotiations seemingly at an impasse.

Cardinals coach Dennis Green implied Sunday that the reason for the impasse rested more with Leinart's people than the Cardinals organization.

"I would assume that an inability to get the contract done is just some continuation of looking at what possibilities are from their end," Green told The Associated Press.

Leinart wouldn't be the first high Cardinal draft pick to hold out. But Green defended the team's dealings with recent first-round selections.

"Larry Fitzgerald got a very good deal, and he was our No. 3 pick a few years ago," Green said. "Antrel Rolle got a very good contract last year at the No. 8 pick.

"We have to understand that Matt Leinart, who we are very high on and feel is going to be a very good quarterback for us and have a great impact on the National Football League, also would have been offered a very good contract," Green said. "We've signed every other player, so there's only a certain amount of money that's available."

Leinart is expected to battle two-year veteran John Navarre for the backup job behind starter Kurt Warner. The consensus is that the Cardinals chose Leinart to groom him as the team's quarterback of the future.

During his celebrated college career, Leinart completed 807 of 1,245 passes for 10,693 yards, with 99 touchdown passes and 23 interceptions.

Condon would not discuss areas of disagreement in the talks. But one is believed to be the length of the contract, with the Cardinals holding firm on a six-year proposal and Leinart preferring five years. Teams can sign players chosen in the top half of the first round to contracts with a maximum term of six years.
-------------------------

What sense does this make? The 9th & 11th picks are signed, what's the hold up?

Taco John · 07-31-2006, 02:39 PM

I agree that if they don't like the contract, they shouldn't sign it... What I don't agree with is holding out of training camp. I think players should go to camp in good faith, and then draw a deadline date that they won't play past... For instance, the week before their first preseason game.

The NFLPA apparently agreed, and addressed this with the veterans with contracts by making it uncomfortable for them to hold out. A week's holdout cost them almost $75,000. That's a lot of scratch to lose. Something needs to be done about getting the rookies into camp so that they don't get so far behind in their development.

MechanicalBull · 07-31-2006, 02:51 PM

I never understood this. Is there a reason why these guys get drafted in April and don't sign until July-August? Mario Williams signed right away why can't more guys sign soon after?

KipCorrington25 · 07-31-2006, 02:54 PM

I wonder if Leinart has ever heard of David Klingler?

Hulamau · 07-31-2006, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco John

I agree that if they don't like the contract, they shouldn't sign it... What I don't agree with is holding out of training camp. I think players should go to camp in good faith, and then draw a deadline date that they won't play past... For instance, the week before their first preseason game.

The NFLPA apparently agreed, and addressed this with the veterans with contracts by making it uncomfortable for them to hold out. A week's holdout cost them almost $75,000. That's a lot of scratch to lose. Something needs to be done about getting the rookies into camp so that they don't get so far behind in their development.

The injury issue looms large though and they would have to have insurance that covered most of thier expected contract should they have a catastrophic injury the sometime during camp, prior to the contract signing, and lose all bargaining power.

Hulamau · 07-31-2006, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MechanicalBull

I never understood this. Is there a reason why these guys get drafted in April and don't sign until July-August? Mario Williams signed right away why can't more guys sign soon after?

I know this cat and mouse stuff waiting up until the last minute is nits.
If a few more of the top guys signed early it would start a trend as agents want to hold out to see what the slots are!

ClevelandBronco · 07-31-2006, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco John

What I don't agree with is holding out of training camp. I think players should go to camp in good faith, and then draw a deadline date that they won't play past...

Something needs to be done about getting the rookies into camp so that they don't get so far behind in their development.

Too much of a gamble for the player. What happens if the unsigned player suffers a career-ending injury in camp? Or even just a season-ending injury? I just can't agree. No pay, no play.

The only something that needs to be done is for the team and the player to reach agreement before either party does harm to the other or to themselves.

ClevelandBronco · 07-31-2006, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hulamau

The injury issue looms large though and they would have to have insurance that covered most of thier expected contract should they have a catastrophic injury the sometime during camp, prior to the contract signing, and lose all bargaining power.

You're faster than me and I agree.

ward63 · 07-31-2006, 04:40 PM

Lets see...I agree w/Clockwork when he say's both picks 9 and 11 are signed. Also, 11 was Cutler, so his contract figures should be just as close. Maybe Leinert's realizing he misses Hollywood to much and just isn't going to play. Going to go back and become an actor or something.

SoCalBronco · 07-31-2006, 04:43 PM

What a surprise.

ludo21 · 07-31-2006, 04:45 PM

lol, Get to camp pretty boy, what does he think hes worth?

Also, what does Denny Green think by saying this:

"We've signed every other player, so there's only a certain amount of money that's available."

Im pretty sure they have about 10 mil left to spend....

SoCalBronco · 07-31-2006, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ludo21

lol, Get to camp pretty boy, what does he think hes worth?

Also, what does Denny Green think by saying this:

"We've signed every other player, so there's only a certain amount of money that's available."

Im pretty sure they have about 10 mil left to spend....

The rookie cap limits the amount of money you can spend on rookie contracts.

ward63 · 07-31-2006, 04:50 PM

SoCal is correct. The NFL figures up how many picks you have and how high the teams picks are and that's where they get the rookie cap.

Kaylore · 07-31-2006, 04:52 PM

They've got Young and Cutler as points of reference. I don't get what the big deal is.

ward63 · 07-31-2006, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaylore

They've got Young and Cutler as points of reference. I don't get what the big deal is.

Especially w/Cutler. I mean he was only ONE pick after him. Maybe he wants his #1 money from last year. If he's worried bout money, then he should of came out last year and sucked it up and go to SF(I mean it isn't that far from LA).

ludo21 · 07-31-2006, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaylore

They've got Young and Cutler as points of reference. I don't get what the big deal is.

Typical Cards are probably trying to low ball him.

TY Socal, i wasnt aware of that.

Dr. Broncenstein · 07-31-2006, 05:01 PM

Kaylore · 07-31-2006, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Broncenstein

..

ward63 · 07-31-2006, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Broncenstein

..

...So I can I leave it and make more money than you!

Pendejo · 07-31-2006, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hulamau

The injury issue looms large though and they would have to have insurance that covered most of thier expected contract should they have a catastrophic injury the sometime during camp, prior to the contract signing, and lose all bargaining power.

The clubs do purchase insurance policies for the players...that's why you see guys like Reggie Bush, or Cutler with the teams during minicamps...and they do offer insurance for unsigned players for training camp. The values of the insurance policies differ from team to team. Por ejemplo last year when Merriman was holding out some of the Dolts front office people went on the air, and talked about how he should show up because they have insurance...but they skirted around how much the policy would pay out. A veteran player said that it wasn't much. I inferred that he meant it wouldn't even touch a first round signing bonus.

What makes Taco's idea about showing up in camp without a deal completely ridiculous is that there is no such thing as "in good faith" in the NFL. If Leinart showed up in camp without a contract, and blew out his knee or his shoulder...the Cardinals would use the injuries as leverage in future negotiations.

It doesn't seem like there should be too much of a problem in getting a deal done though...all the picks around his slot have signed. His camp is clearly posturing to try and squeeze every cent that they can out of the birds.

Rock Chalk · 07-31-2006, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCalBronco

What a surprise.

Beat me to it.

Broncobiv · 07-31-2006, 05:30 PM

Are rookies that haven't signed yet (Leinart in this case) susceptible to the $14K per day fine for not showing to camp?

Rock Chalk · 07-31-2006, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Broncobiv

Are rookies that haven't signed yet (Leinart in this case) susceptible to the $14K per day fine for not showing to camp?

Well, I wouldnt imagine. Since, you know, technically they aren't employed yet.

MechanicalBull · 07-31-2006, 05:38 PM

Now I know Leinart and his agent want the best deal/most money but like others have said picks 9 and 11 have signed. This leads me to question who works for who. Tom Condon works for Leinart and not the other way around.

ward63 · 07-31-2006, 05:43 PM

Leinart needs to realize that if he gets in there and actually studies the playbook, he'll be taking over by Week 5 or 6, with or w/out a Warner injury.

07-31-2006, 04:43 PM	#10
SoCalBronco Nixonite Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Arcadia, CA Posts: 33,303 Adopt-a-Bronco: D.J. Williams	What a surprise. __________________ ITS A PLAYOFF HOCKEY NIGHT IN PITTSBURGH!

07-31-2006, 05:01 PM	#17
Dr. Broncenstein Overdriven Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Sterile Fields Posts: 11,619 Adopt-a-Bronco: Wesley Woodyard	.. Attached Images

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

07-31-2006, 02:31 PM	#1
Clockwork Orange Persona Non Grata I seen him! Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 21,438	Leinart and Cards at an impasse Looks like Hollywood is officially a holdout. With first-round draft choice Matt Leinart scheduled to be throwing to Arizona Cardinals receivers on Monday, the initial day of training camp practice, the agent for the former Southern California quarterback instead threw in the towel on contract negotiations. At least for now. "We've been [in the Phoenix area] since Friday and couldn't get it done," agent Tom Condon said Sunday night, after three days of face-to-face negotiations failed to produce an agreement for the 2004 Heisman Trophy winner. "We're hung up on a lot of issues. It's time to go home." The 10th overall choice in the draft, and probably a bargain in that slot after he posted a brilliant 37-2 record as the Trojans' starter for three seasons, Leinart missed the team's Sunday evening deadline for reporting to training camp at Flagstaff, Ariz. The Cardinals' first practice is Monday morning, and it will take a major change in the two sides' bargaining positions for him to be on the field for that session. Leinart has been in Phoenix for the past few days and has actually spent time throwing with some Arizona receivers. It is not known if Leinart, who wanted to be in the vicinity in the event of a contract accord, plans to stay in the area with the negotiations seemingly at an impasse. Cardinals coach Dennis Green implied Sunday that the reason for the impasse rested more with Leinart's people than the Cardinals organization. "I would assume that an inability to get the contract done is just some continuation of looking at what possibilities are from their end," Green told The Associated Press. Leinart wouldn't be the first high Cardinal draft pick to hold out. But Green defended the team's dealings with recent first-round selections. "Larry Fitzgerald got a very good deal, and he was our No. 3 pick a few years ago," Green said. "Antrel Rolle got a very good contract last year at the No. 8 pick. "We have to understand that Matt Leinart, who we are very high on and feel is going to be a very good quarterback for us and have a great impact on the National Football League, also would have been offered a very good contract," Green said. "We've signed every other player, so there's only a certain amount of money that's available." Leinart is expected to battle two-year veteran John Navarre for the backup job behind starter Kurt Warner. The consensus is that the Cardinals chose Leinart to groom him as the team's quarterback of the future. During his celebrated college career, Leinart completed 807 of 1,245 passes for 10,693 yards, with 99 touchdown passes and 23 interceptions. Condon would not discuss areas of disagreement in the talks. But one is believed to be the length of the contract, with the Cardinals holding firm on a six-year proposal and Leinart preferring five years. Teams can sign players chosen in the top half of the first round to contracts with a maximum term of six years. ------------------------- What sense does this make? The 9th & 11th picks are signed, what's the hold up?

07-31-2006, 02:39 PM	#2
Taco John 24/7 Broncos In Elway I Trust Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 49,705 Adopt-a-Bronco: Peyton Manning	I agree that if they don't like the contract, they shouldn't sign it... What I don't agree with is holding out of training camp. I think players should go to camp in good faith, and then draw a deadline date that they won't play past... For instance, the week before their first preseason game. The NFLPA apparently agreed, and addressed this with the veterans with contracts by making it uncomfortable for them to hold out. A week's holdout cost them almost $75,000. That's a lot of scratch to lose. Something needs to be done about getting the rookies into camp so that they don't get so far behind in their development.

07-31-2006, 02:51 PM	#3
MechanicalBull Interesting Times Ahead Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,825	I never understood this. Is there a reason why these guys get drafted in April and don't sign until July-August? Mario Williams signed right away why can't more guys sign soon after?

07-31-2006, 02:54 PM	#4
KipCorrington25 Free Safety Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Centennial Posts: 3,051	I wonder if Leinart has ever heard of David Klingler?

07-31-2006, 04:40 PM	#9
ward63 The Burner Returner Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,161 Adopt-a-Bronco: Quincy Morgan	Lets see...I agree w/Clockwork when he say's both picks 9 and 11 are signed. Also, 11 was Cutler, so his contract figures should be just as close. Maybe Leinert's realizing he misses Hollywood to much and just isn't going to play. Going to go back and become an actor or something.

07-31-2006, 04:45 PM	#11
ludo21 RIP Darrent Williams Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Glendale, AZ Posts: 17,906 Adopt-a-Bronco: Paul Ernster	lol, Get to camp pretty boy, what does he think hes worth? Also, what does Denny Green think by saying this: "We've signed every other player, so there's only a certain amount of money that's available." Im pretty sure they have about 10 mil left to spend....

07-31-2006, 04:50 PM	#13
ward63 The Burner Returner Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,161 Adopt-a-Bronco: Quincy Morgan	SoCal is correct. The NFL figures up how many picks you have and how high the teams picks are and that's where they get the rookie cap.

07-31-2006, 04:52 PM	#14
Kaylore 6-37, Raider fans. Yummy birds and snow! Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Ceti Alpha V Posts: 41,051 Adopt-a-Bronco: Wesley Duke	They've got Young and Cutler as points of reference. I don't get what the big deal is.

07-31-2006, 05:30 PM	#22
Broncobiv Tee many martoonis Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 2,265	Are rookies that haven't signed yet (Leinart in this case) susceptible to the $14K per day fine for not showing to camp?

07-31-2006, 05:38 PM	#24
MechanicalBull Interesting Times Ahead Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,825	Now I know Leinart and his agent want the best deal/most money but like others have said picks 9 and 11 have signed. This leads me to question who works for who. Tom Condon works for Leinart and not the other way around.

07-31-2006, 05:43 PM	#25
ward63 The Burner Returner Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,161 Adopt-a-Bronco: Quincy Morgan	Leinart needs to realize that if he gets in there and actually studies the playbook, he'll be taking over by Week 5 or 6, with or w/out a Warner injury.