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[Nuggets4]

Originally Posted by RhymesayersDU

Uh... no, he's not.

http://82games.com/random23.htm
http://82games.com/random12.htm

Dammit Rhyme, stop using statistics.

Dirk for God!

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by GonzoLays

Dirt "clutch" Nitwitzksi isn't much better at 33% while shooting 60% from the free throw line. Yea, he is the guy I want at the end of the game taking the final shot. He really steps up in the clutch.

So you think that LeBron James is more deserving as MVP? He's shooting .125% and 50% from the line. He is 2-16 from the field.

Steve Nash? He's 1-14! That's an outstanding .017%! Nash is shooting .667 from the line there.

Dirk's stats are looking pretty good in comparison to the other two leading candidates.

I knew that you'd eventually hang yourself unintentionally on this thread!

Edit: Kobe Bryant is shooting .250 on the same stat. And "Big Shot" Chauncey Billups is way behind Dirk shooting just .208.

[Rulon Velvet Jones]

Oh wow, I really got destroyed in that argument on ****ING CLUTCH FREE THROW SHOOTING. What does that prove? You want links?

Read this

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baske...rs-table_x.htm

So I botched part of my commentary. Does that make me any less credible than someone trying to make an argument for the Celtics? How about those Nuggets? Not a contender in the bunch.

Whose team has been competitive with the top 10 in the league througout the season? The Pistons, Spurs and Mavericks have been. Phoenix is 12-13 versus. The Heat are 8-16. Lakers are 9-17. And just for fun, the Celtics are 4-19.

What I don't hear from any of you are viable arguments as to why Dirk shouldn't be the MVP. You can't do it without leaning on stats. And it's become obvious that you haven't watched enough NBA this season to know about the contenders for the award.

Remember - Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital. ~Aaron Levenstein

[GonzoLays]

When you finish blowing Dirk you can see the real MVP below:

Elton Brand Los Angeles Clippers (30-18) PF 6-8 254
Stats: 25.6 PPG, 10.3 RPG, 2.7 APG, 2.61 BPG
Comments: Incredible season from Mr. Brand. A truly dominant power forward with a complete game. He added increased shooting range this season. Shooting 53.3% FG.

He scores just as much as dirt, rebounds the ball better than dirt; blocks more shots than dirt; shoots 5% better from the field than dirt; passes out more assists than dirt.

Now tell me how Dirt is better than Brand this year? And try to make sense this time.

[Rulon Velvet Jones]

Nestle Crunch Time Points, NBA Regular Season 2005-06
Player Pt RB Ats Stl Bk FGA FGM FTA FTM TO W/L* Nestle
1. Vince Carter (Nets) 171 35 16 5 7 98 41 94 84 4 156 319
2. Dirk Nowitzki (Mavericks) 133 50 13 3 10 96 39 53 47 6 164 304
3. LeBron James (Cavaliers) 179 35 25 5 5 93 50 101 73 7 120 291
4. Chauncey Billups (Pistons) 121 17 26 2 1 68 21 76 71 8 176 283
5. Steve Nash (Suns) 141 22 39 6 0 81 36 63 59 9 132 282
6. Shawn Marion (Suns) 116 68 3 2 7 89 48 21 14 8 132 272
7. Jason Kidd (Nets) 108 31 25 5 0 57 21 65 53 6 156 271
8. Ben Wallace (Pistons) 41 49 5 8 12 18 13 38 15 1 176 262
9. Andrei Kirilenko (Jazz) 89 56 8 6 19 42 13 68 58 6 128 261
10. Michael Redd (Bucks) 163 37 5 4 1 94 36 90 81 6 116 253
11. Kobe Bryant (Lakers) 201 26 11 5 3 138 51 96 83 15 120 251
12. Andre Miller (Nuggets) 94 27 33 2 0 62 25 55 42 9 148 245
12. Carmelo Anthony (Nuggets) 124 24 2 6 0 68 30 70 60 11 148 245
14. Tony Parker (Spurs) 80 13 17 2 1 48 23 40 33 6 164 239
15. Rasheed Wallace (Pistons) 53 31 6 6 6 43 17 19 12 3 172 238

Nestle Crunch Time Rating
The Nestle Crunch Time Stat was designed by the NBA and Nestle to provide an innovative way to measure "Crunch Time" performances -- players who step up when the game is on the line! A formula has been created to measure the top Nestle Crunch Time players, and the formula kicks in when Crunch Time kicks in -- the last two minutes and all overtime periods.

Here's the formula:

(PTS + REB + AST + STL + BLK) - ((FGA - FGM) + (FTA - FTM) + TO) + 4 points if their team wins

Note: If the point differential of the game is greater than 15 points at the two-minute mark, only the losing team's players will be eligible to earn Crunch Time points.

http://www.nba.com/features/nestle/c...time_stat.html

[Rulon Velvet Jones]

Originally Posted by GonzoLays

When you finish blowing Dirk you can see the real MVP below:

Elton Brand Los Angeles Clippers (30-18) PF 6-8 254
Stats: 25.6 PPG, 10.3 RPG, 2.7 APG, 2.61 BPG
Comments: Incredible season from Mr. Brand. A truly dominant power forward with a complete game. He added increased shooting range this season. Shooting 53.3% FG.

He scores just as much as dirt, rebounds the ball better than dirt; blocks more shots than dirt; shoots 5% better from the field than dirt; passes out more assists than dirt.

Now tell me how Dirt is better than Brand this year? And try to make sense this time.

And yet he's not even the MVP on his own team. Sam Cassell is.

Mavs v. Clippers this season - Dirk dropped 26/11 [20 point win] and 17/10 [2 point win] with Brand on him. We'll see how they fare when they play again tonight.

[RhymesayersDU]

Originally Posted by Rulon Velvet Jones

Look up clutch shooting and you'll see that Dirk is far and away the best in the NBA this season.

Originally Posted by Rulon Velvet Jones

What I don't hear from any of you are viable arguments as to why Dirk shouldn't be the MVP. You can't do it without leaning on stats. And it's become obvious that you haven't watched enough NBA this season to know about the contenders for the award.

Remember - Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital. ~Aaron Levenstein

So, which one is it? Should we "look up clutch shooting," or should we "stop leaning on stats" and just watch games? Seriously, pick one way and go with it.

Look, I'm not a Dirk hater, and I'll be the first one to tell you he should be in the Top 3 (maybe even Top 2) in voting, but I still like Nash ahead of him.

[TheManeMan]

I cant belive they have formulas now for stupid **** like this...

Great post Rhyme...

[Rulon Velvet Jones]

Originally Posted by RhymesayersDU

So, which one is it? Should we "look up clutch shooting," or should we "stop leaning on stats" and just watch games? Seriously, pick one way and go with it.

Look, I'm not a Dirk hater, and I'll be the first one to tell you he should be in the Top 3 (maybe even Top 2) in voting, but I still like Nash ahead of him.

In my case, I use stats to emphasize my point. Not the other way around like others like to do.

[ludo21]

Originally Posted by TheManeMan

I cant belive they have formulas now for stupid **** like this...

Great post Rhyme...

I really dont watch much basketball, so i should have no say, but Nash is a stud, ill stand by that

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by GonzoLays

He scores just as much as Dirk, rebounds the ball better than dirt

So averaging a whole point less per game is averaging "the same", but rebounding an extra board per game is rebounding better? Someone has a little spin happening in their posts.

Now tell me how Dirt is better than Brand this year?

Dallas has the third best record in the league and has already matched their win totals from last season at 58-19. The LA Clippers have only lost 13 1/2 more games than Dallas.

In their two matchups this season :
Dirk 21.5 pts/10.5 boards
Brand 19.5 pts/9.0 boards
Dallas 2, LA Clippers 0
In the 93-91 victory, Dirk blocked Cassell's game-winning attempt at the
buzzer.

[GonzoLays]

Originally Posted by Rulon Velvet Jones

In my case, I use stats to emphasize my point. Not the other way around like others like to do.

Originally Posted by Rulon Velvet Jones

And yet he's not even the MVP on his own team. Sam Cassell is.

Mavs v. Clippers this season - Dirk dropped 26/11 [20 point win] and 17/10 [2 point win] with Brand on him. We'll see how they fare when they play again tonight.

It seems to me that you are just as guilty as anyone else on this thread of using statistics to back up your points. You just don't like statistics when they DONT back up your points.

But you believe statistics have nothing to do who gets the MVP so let me be the first to nominate Bruce Bowen for MVP because his impact on the game is immeasurable.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Look, really the only other competitor for MVP right now is LeBron James. No one has brought an argument supporting him at all. Someone put together a cogent argument for James.

Nashie has fallen apart down the stretch, and I think that its over for his chances. Nowitzki and James are both playing MVP basketball down the stretch. I think that one of those two are going to win it.

[BroncoMan4ever]

MELO
LeBron
Nash

I say those 2 are the most valuable players and it should b one of the who wins. All 3 of these players have carried and kept their respecive teams in contention for the playoffs singlehandedly almost all season.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by GonzoLays

let me be the first to nominate Bruce Bowen for MVP because his impact on the game is immeasurable.

He is black, so in your eyes that makes him a better candidate than Dirk or Nash.

[cutthemdown]

I don't think any team in the nba needs a guy to score 35 points a night as much as lakers need kobe to. Lakers would only win about 20 games the whole year without Bryant. To me MVP means who mean the most to his team in addition to who is having a stellar year. This year Kobe meets both of those requirements.

[Rulon Velvet Jones]

"It seems to me that you are just as guilty as anyone else on this thread of using statistics to back up your points. You just don't like statistics when they DONT back up your points.

But you believe statistics have nothing to do who gets the MVP so let me be the first to nominate Bruce Bowen for MVP because his impact on the game is immeasurable."

Exactly. Like I said (if the Celtics green was messing with your eyes), I use stats to back up my point. I don't fish out statistics and make claims using only the numbers.

[Clockwork Orange]

Originally Posted by angryllama

Nashie has fallen apart down the stretch, and I think that its over for his chances.

Care to place a friendly wager on that?

[GonzoLays]

Originally Posted by angryllama

He is black, so in your eyes that makes him a better candidate than Dirk or Nash.

I b**** slapped you so hard now you are playing the race card. Good for you.

Gonzolays 1, Angryllama 0

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

I don't think any team in the nba needs a guy to score 35 points a night as much as lakers need kobe to. Lakers would only win about 20 games the whole year without Bryant. To me MVP means who mean the most to his team in addition to who is having a stellar year. This year Kobe meets both of those requirements.

That's a good place to start with the Kobe Bryant argument.

I think that Bryant is the best player in the league, but I dont think that he should win the MVP award. The award is given to a player on one of the top few teams in the league 99% of the time (actually probably closer to 95%). The Lakers have hovered around .500 for the majority of the season, and look to inferior to most of the playoff teams in the league. The big argument against Bryant is that he is great, but his team doesnt win like the other MVP candidates are able to get their teams to.

[epicSocialism4tw]

Originally Posted by GonzoLays

I b**** slapped you so hard
Gonzolays 1, Angryllama 0

You must have missed post #61

[GonzoLays]

Originally Posted by Rulon Velvet Jones

"It seems to me that you are just as guilty as anyone else on this thread of using statistics to back up your points. You just don't like statistics when they DONT back up your points.

But you believe statistics have nothing to do who gets the MVP so let me be the first to nominate Bruce Bowen for MVP because his impact on the game is immeasurable."

Exactly. Like I said (if the Celtics green was messing with your eyes), I use stats to back up my point. I don't fish out statistics and make claims using only the numbers.

Man you are freaking slick. Some how you managed to say that when you use statistics they are there to only back up your points but when other use them they are only numbers.

I gotta rep you for that! That was awesome.

[dbfan4life]

Originally Posted by angryllama

That's a good place to start with the Kobe Bryant argument.

I think that Bryant is the best player in the league, but I dont think that he should win the MVP award. The award is given to a player on one of the top few teams in the league 99% of the time (actually probably closer to 95%). The Lakers have hovered around .500 for the majority of the season, and look to inferior to most of the playoff teams in the league. The big argument against Bryant is that he is great, but his team doesnt win like the other MVP candidates are able to get their teams to.

I agree with almost everything in your post. I think the biggest argument about Kobe for MVP has nothing to do with basketball. Everytime I mention Kobe here I have to run for cover.

[Clockwork Orange]

Chauncey Billups isn't getting much mention in this thread, but he's as worthy a candidate as anyone. 19 points, 9 assists, the best assist to turnover ratio in the NBA as well as playing outstanding defense and hitting big shots. Oh, and his team has the best record in the NBA.

[Rulon Velvet Jones]

Originally Posted by GonzoLays

Man you are freaking slick. Some how you managed to say that when you use statistics they are there to only back up your points but when other use them they are only numbers.

I gotta rep you for that! That was awesome.

"Dirt Notwiztski averages less than nine rebounds a game and stands over seven feet. He shoots less than 50% from the field. He is a terrible defender that barely averages a block per game and his two assissts per game shows that he doesn't make his teammates better. And you call this guy the MVP? Please."

Sounds like a better way to argue than to just spout off crap like this.