New England's Porous Pass Defense - The Orange Mane

footstepsfrom#27 · 01-10-2006, 08:07 PM

With all the talk I keep hearing from Pats fans about "stoping Denver's running game and forcing Jake to pass" being the key to victory...based on the questionable "bad Jake" theory...I have a question:

Do you REALY want to do that?

If so...WHY?

Here are the relevant numbers on the Pats pass defense in terms of where they rank with the rest of the NFL. Let's not hear any more about our overrated secondary with this record...

Attempts per game: 20th
Yards per game: 31st
Yards per completion: 32nd
Pass Completion percentage: 4th
TD passes: 28th
Interceptions: 28th
Sacks: 23rd
1st downs by pass: 22nd
Completions over 20 yards: 31st
Completions over 40 yards: 31st

I know I'll hear all about Duane Starks and Ellis Hobbs now...but lets be honest. You don't post these kind of numbers if Starks was your only problem. Hobbs has played well for sure...but I think Rod Smith has seen quite a few rookies in his day...and burned all of them.

So maybe Jake just needs to come out firing and Marino these guys.

Jetmeck · 01-10-2006, 08:15 PM

I believe they will STRETCH the field early.

Bronx33 · 01-10-2006, 08:15 PM

You would think the pats would try to control our running attack, this might be exploited fairly soon in the game.

broncogary · 01-10-2006, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetmeck

I believe they will STRETCH the field early.

I believe you've hit the nail on the head, Holmes.

Hopefully, Belichick isn't monitoring this board.

Kaylore · 01-10-2006, 08:27 PM

WAIT! Tedy Bruschi will be back on the field. We can't throw when he's out there. I don't mean deep, I mean at all.

Rulon Velvet Jones · 01-10-2006, 08:40 PM

Nothing but smart people in the Arlington area.

Glad I got my degree from UTA.

Word.

footstepsfrom#27 · 01-10-2006, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rulon Velvet Jones

Nothing but smart people in the Arlington area.

Glad I got my degree from UTA.

Word.

Back at cha...

broncogary · 01-10-2006, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rulon Velvet Jones

Nothing but smart people in the Arlington area.

Glad I got my degree from UTA.

Word.

Is that you in full football uniform in your avatar?

BigPlayShay · 01-10-2006, 08:58 PM

Stopping the run, well, the Pats have faced 6 of the top 10 rushing teams in the NFL. To those teams they have given up and average of 125 yards and an average of 4.3 per rush. In 5 of there other game they faced teams that were ranked below 20th in rushing (OAK, NY Jets twice, Buffalo twice).

RMT · 01-10-2006, 09:08 PM

By saying that the Patriots are better off forcing Plummer to beat them is asinine. It's as though the Patriots' secondary is the "lesser of the two evils." I'd love to see the Broncos come out throwing the ball out of 4 WR and even empty backfield sets. Then what are the Patriots going to do, force the Broncos to beat them with the run?

There's no doubt in my mind that:
1. The fans will provide the Broncos with the best home game atmosphere Invesco has ever seen
2. Shanahan will gameplan for this game unlike any other, knowing a win could help him and the Broncos escape from the "can't win without Elway" talk
3. The Patriots and their fans have NO CLUE what they are in for ... they may be 10-0 in their last 10 playoff games, but how many of those have been at Invesco? ... NONE ...

Bronx33 · 01-10-2006, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RMT

By saying that the Patriots are better off forcing Plummer to beat them is assinine. It's as though the Patriots' secondary is the "lesser of the two evils." I'd love to see the Broncos come out throwing the ball out of 4 and even empty backfield sets. Then what are the Patriots going to do, force the Broncos to beat them with the run?

There's no doubt in my mind that:
1. The fans will provide the Broncos with the best home game atmostphere Invesco has ever seen
2. Shanahan will gameplan for this game unlike any other, knowing a win could help him and the Broncos escape from the "can't win without Elway" talk
3. The Patriots and their fans have NO CLUE what they are in for ... they may be 10-0 in their last 10 playoff games, but how many of those have been at Invesco? ... NONE ...

The streak is going up in flames....

Bronco Bob · 01-10-2006, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by footstepsfrom#27

With all the talk I keep hearing from Pats fans about "stoping Denver's running game and forcing Jake to pass" being the key to victory...based on the questionable "bad Jake" theory...I have a question:

Do you REALY want to do that?

If so...WHY?

So maybe Jake just needs to come out firing and Marino these guys.

I guess they are forgetting about that 72 yarder Jake threw to Rod
and the back to back 19 and 55 yarder he threw to Ashley in the
game against the Pats in October. Has the Pats secondary gotten
that much better since then?

RMT · 01-10-2006, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bronco Bob

I guess they are forgetting about that 72 yarder Jake threw to Rod
and the back to back 19 and 55 yarder he threw to Ashley in the
game against the Pats in October. Has the Pats secondary gotten
that much better since then?

Yeah, I doubt they give up back-to-back passes to Ashley. And maybe Rod "only catches a 60-yarder" ... that's okay ... the Broncos will win and it'll all be moot

Bronco Bob · 01-10-2006, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RMT

Yeah, I doubt they give up back-to-back passes to Ashley. And maybe Rod "only catches a 60-yarder" ... that's okay ... the Broncos will win and it'll all be moot

Those passes to Lelie were a thing of beauty, the Broncos started on their
own 9 yard line. Two plays later they are on the Pats 17 yard line.
Two nice running plays and a pass to Rod and they are in the endzone
and the score is 14-3.

RMT · 01-10-2006, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bronco Bob

Those passes to Lelie were a thing of beauty, the Broncos started on their
own 9 yard line. Two plays later they are on the Pats 17 yard line.
Two nice running plays and a pass to Rod and they are in the endzones
and the score is 14-3.

What a lot of people have forgotten is that the score, 28-20, was closer than the game was. Champ sat out the 2nd half, too, which is when the Patriots made their comeback.

TommyD4207 · 01-10-2006, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bronco Bob

I guess they are forgetting about that 72 yarder Jake threw to Rod
and the back to back 19 and 55 yarder he threw to Ashley in the
game against the Pats in October. Has the Pats secondary gotten
that much better since then?

Short answer yes. Their run defense is markedly better as well.

Paladin · 01-10-2006, 10:18 PM

I tell you, when those plays came off, the stadium rocked. The guys behind me were Pat's fans, and they even said that the Broncos had them beat bad. Dam(n), that was neat to see.

Paladin · 01-10-2006, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TommyD4207

Short answer yes. Their run defense is markedly better as well.

I don't think so. I think the quality of their opponents got worse.

RMT · 01-10-2006, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TommyD4207

Short answer yes. Their run defense is markedly better as well.

Which teams did they play during that stretch that were ranked in the top 5 in rushing?

Bronco Bob · 01-10-2006, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TommyD4207

Short answer yes. Their run defense is markedly better as well.

And when did that happen, after they played Indy, or after they played the
Chiefs, because both of them also burned the Pats on long pass plays.
Heck, even Vinnie got a TD on them, and the Broncos shut the Jets out 27-0.

footstepsfrom#27 · 01-11-2006, 01:21 PM

This is to good to bury on page 3 this quick...

Attempts per game: 20th
Yards per game: 31st
Yards per completion: 32nd
Pass Completion percentage: 4th
TD passes: 28th
Interceptions: 28th
Sacks: 23rd
1st downs by pass: 22nd
Completions over 20 yards: 31st
Completions over 40 yards: 31st

orange 4 life · 01-11-2006, 01:26 PM

i hope theyre stupid enough to come in and stack the box.

if they do, plummer will carve up that secondary like a thanksgiving turkey.

our only problem last game was letting off the gas too soon.

my guess is shanny comes out passing early and often.
stick it to em and run the ball in the 4th when we just want to kill clock.

Hulamau · 01-11-2006, 01:27 PM

I wouldnt be surprised to see David Terrell active for this game and lining up with Ash, Rod, Jeb and Wesley Duke on some "cover this if you can" plays.

Each of those guys is a big body that can catch and could overwhelm the Pats secondary and make for a hell of a group of downfield blockers when tossing the rock to Tatum in the second half.

shaftedelic · 01-11-2006, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RMT

3. The Patriots and their fans have NO CLUE what they are in for ... they may be 10-0 in their last 10 playoff games, but how many of those have been at Invesco? ... NONE ...

That's because the Broncos couldn't make it past the Colts.

Hulamau · 01-11-2006, 01:34 PM

I imagine Shanny will make a point to remind all the refs before the game of the "Mugging rule" that was installed to counter NE's propensity for downfield holding and pass interference in years past.

Lelie is bound to draw two or three long PIs in addition to some big catches for us. No one in their secondary can cover him so they'll HAVE to grab him.

6'-3" David Terrell was the main weapon for a few years at Chicago with revolving QBs and he can catch and have a good number of NFL TDs and is well worked into our system by now. When he didnt play early I thought Shanny was going to save him for a playoff surprise.

01-10-2006, 08:07 PM	#1
footstepsfrom#27 helmet to helmet hitter Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Arlington, TX Posts: 16,126 Adopt-a-Bronco: Joe Mays	New England's Porous Pass Defense With all the talk I keep hearing from Pats fans about "stoping Denver's running game and forcing Jake to pass" being the key to victory...based on the questionable "bad Jake" theory...I have a question: Do you REALY want to do that? If so...WHY? Here are the relevant numbers on the Pats pass defense in terms of where they rank with the rest of the NFL. Let's not hear any more about our overrated secondary with this record... Attempts per game: 20th Yards per game: 31st Yards per completion: 32nd Pass Completion percentage: 4th TD passes: 28th Interceptions: 28th Sacks: 23rd 1st downs by pass: 22nd Completions over 20 yards: 31st Completions over 40 yards: 31st I know I'll hear all about Duane Starks and Ellis Hobbs now...but lets be honest. You don't post these kind of numbers if Starks was your only problem. Hobbs has played well for sure...but I think Rod Smith has seen quite a few rookies in his day...and burned all of them. So maybe Jake just needs to come out firing and Marino these guys.

01-10-2006, 08:58 PM	#9
BigPlayShay Ring of Famer Novaking Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,241 Adopt-a-Bronco: Got Cut	Stopping the run, well, the Pats have faced 6 of the top 10 rushing teams in the NFL. To those teams they have given up and average of 125 yards and an average of 4.3 per rush. In 5 of there other game they faced teams that were ranked below 20th in rushing (OAK, NY Jets twice, Buffalo twice). Last edited by BigPlayShay; 01-10-2006 at 09:08 PM..

01-10-2006, 09:08 PM	#10
RMT Rocky Mountain Thunder Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: United States Posts: 3,211	By saying that the Patriots are better off forcing Plummer to beat them is asinine. It's as though the Patriots' secondary is the "lesser of the two evils." I'd love to see the Broncos come out throwing the ball out of 4 WR and even empty backfield sets. Then what are the Patriots going to do, force the Broncos to beat them with the run? There's no doubt in my mind that: 1. The fans will provide the Broncos with the best home game atmosphere Invesco has ever seen 2. Shanahan will gameplan for this game unlike any other, knowing a win could help him and the Broncos escape from the "can't win without Elway" talk 3. The Patriots and their fans have NO CLUE what they are in for ... they may be 10-0 in their last 10 playoff games, but how many of those have been at Invesco? ... NONE ... Last edited by RMT; 01-10-2006 at 09:30 PM..

01-11-2006, 01:34 PM	#25
Hulamau Polynesian Paralysis In the Pocket Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Hulaville and Sedona Posts: 8,042 Adopt-a-Bronco: Eric Decker	I imagine Shanny will make a point to remind all the refs before the game of the "Mugging rule" that was installed to counter NE's propensity for downfield holding and pass interference in years past. Lelie is bound to draw two or three long PIs in addition to some big catches for us. No one in their secondary can cover him so they'll HAVE to grab him. 6'-3" David Terrell was the main weapon for a few years at Chicago with revolving QBs and he can catch and have a good number of NFL TDs and is well worked into our system by now. When he didnt play early I thought Shanny was going to save him for a playoff surprise. Last edited by Hulamau; 01-11-2006 at 01:38 PM..

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01-10-2006, 08:15 PM	#2
Jetmeck Not a Chief's board Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 5,427	I believe they will STRETCH the field early.

01-10-2006, 08:15 PM	#3
Bronx33 lets go partner Rumpson Rocks Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Lakewood,Colo Posts: 41,221 Adopt-a-Bronco: Woodyard	You would think the pats would try to control our running attack, this might be exploited fairly soon in the game.

01-10-2006, 08:27 PM	#5
Kaylore 6-37, Raider fans. Yummy birds and snow! Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Ceti Alpha V Posts: 41,322 Adopt-a-Bronco: Wesley Duke	WAIT! Tedy Bruschi will be back on the field. We can't throw when he's out there. I don't mean deep, I mean at all.

01-10-2006, 08:40 PM	#6
Rulon Velvet Jones You're not really here. Tight Butthole Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 6,599 Adopt-a-Bronco: Rent-A-DC	Nothing but smart people in the Arlington area. Glad I got my degree from UTA. Word.

01-10-2006, 10:18 PM	#17
Paladin Ring of Famer Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 9,152	I tell you, when those plays came off, the stadium rocked. The guys behind me were Pat's fans, and they even said that the Broncos had them beat bad. Dam(n), that was neat to see.

01-11-2006, 01:21 PM	#21
footstepsfrom#27 helmet to helmet hitter Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Arlington, TX Posts: 16,126 Adopt-a-Bronco: Joe Mays	This is to good to bury on page 3 this quick... Attempts per game: 20th Yards per game: 31st Yards per completion: 32nd Pass Completion percentage: 4th TD passes: 28th Interceptions: 28th Sacks: 23rd 1st downs by pass: 22nd Completions over 20 yards: 31st Completions over 40 yards: 31st

01-11-2006, 01:26 PM	#22
orange 4 life Old School Orange Home team qb homer Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Anywhere, CO. Posts: 8,642	i hope theyre stupid enough to come in and stack the box. if they do, plummer will carve up that secondary like a thanksgiving turkey. our only problem last game was letting off the gas too soon. my guess is shanny comes out passing early and often. stick it to em and run the ball in the 4th when we just want to kill clock.

01-11-2006, 01:27 PM	#23
Hulamau Polynesian Paralysis In the Pocket Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Hulaville and Sedona Posts: 8,042 Adopt-a-Bronco: Eric Decker	I wouldnt be surprised to see David Terrell active for this game and lining up with Ash, Rod, Jeb and Wesley Duke on some "cover this if you can" plays. Each of those guys is a big body that can catch and could overwhelm the Pats secondary and make for a hell of a group of downfield blockers when tossing the rock to Tatum in the second half.