Senate Blocks Alaska Refuge Drilling

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Good job by the repubs that have some guts and don't tow the party line!

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By H. JOSEF HEBERT, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - The Senate blocked an attempt to open an Alaska wildlife refuge to oil drilling Wednesday, foiling an attempt by drilling backers to force the measure through Congress as part of a must-have defense spending bill.

It was a stinging defeat for Sen. Ted Stevens (news, bio, voting record), R-Alaska, one of the Senate's most powerful members, who had given senators a choice to support the Alaska drilling measure, or risk the political fallout of voting against money for American troops and for victims of Hurricane Katrina.

Democrats accused Stevens, the senior Republican in the Senate, of holding the defense bill hostage to drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge.

"It took a lot of guts for a lot of people to stand up," Sen.
Joe Lieberman, D-Conn., said after the vote.

Republican leaders fell four votes short of getting the required 60 votes to avoid a threatened filibuster of the defense measure over the oil drilling issue. The vote prompted GOP leaders to huddle in private over their next move.

The vote that was 56-44.

Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist for procedural reasons cast a vote with ANWR opponents, so that he might be able to resurrect the issue for another try. But Democrats said they expected the defense bill to be withdrawn and reworked without the Arctic refuge provision.

The 43 senators who voted against refuge drilling — all but four Democrats as well as GOP Sens. Mike DeWine of Ohio and Lincoln Chafee of Rhode Island — "are intent and unyielding" and not expected to budge should Frist try for another vote, said Lieberman.

Stevens called the refuge's oil vital to national security and bemoaned repeated attempts over the years by opponents using the filibuster to kill drilling proposals.

Democrats, conversely, accused Stevens of holding hostage a military spending bill that includes money to support troops in
Iraq and $29 billion for victims of Hurricane Katrina.

"Our military is being held hostage by this issue, Arctic drilling," fumed Sen. Harry Reid (news, bio, voting record), the Democratic leader. The Nevada Democrat said the Senate could move quickly to pass the defense bill once the refuge issue was resolved.

"We all agree we want money for our troops. ... This is not about the troops," said Sen.
John Kerry, D-Mass., a strong critic of disturbing the refuge in northeastern Alaska by oil development.

During the vote, Stevens, 82, who had fought to open the refuge to drilling since 1980 and is the most senior Republican in the Senate, sat unsmiling in a chair midway back in the chamber, watching his colleagues vote. When it became apparent that he had lost, he briefly talked with Frist, presumably over what move should be taken next. He briefly shook his head, a signal of his disappointment.

"We need ... to open up the small area of the coastal plain (of the refuge) for oil exploration and development," said Sen. Lisa Murkowski (news, bio, voting record), R-Alaska. She called making the oil available a matter of national security by reducing U.S. reliance on oil imports.

Senators determined to protect the refuge from development found it difficult to oppose the politically popular defense bill, which has money for troops in Iraq, relief for Katrina hurricane victims and help for low-income families to pay energy bills.

"Destroying this wilderness will do very little to reduce energy costs nor does it do very much for oil independence," said Sen. Dianne Feinstein (news, bio, voting record), D-Calif.

The Alaska refuge's 1.5-million-acre coastal plain is believed to contain about 10 billion barrels of oil and possibly a reserve comparable to the Prudhoe Bay fields 65 miles to the west. Oil companies have pumped 13 billion barrels from Prudhoe since 1977.

But drilling opponents long have argued that ANWR's oil should not be exploited because of the coastal plain's fragile ecosystem and its wildlife. While the region looks bleak during its long winters and oil can be seen seeping from some of its rock formations, the coastal strip also is the calving ground for caribou and home to polar bears, musk oxen, and the annual influx of millions of migratory birds.

"There are literally hundreds of thousands of Americans following this issue," William Meadows, president of the Wilderness Society, said Tuesday, adding that there has been "an outpouring of angst and concern" over Stevens' attempt to link hurricane relief money, low-income energy assistance funds and money for the Iraq war to push the drilling measure through a reluctant Senate.

Stevens and others maintain the refuge's oil can be extracted using modern techniques without damaging the environment.
http://tinyurl.com/9bj2k

[Rascal]

Next time you complain that we are dependent on foreign oil I suggest you look at this thread.

I don't care what percentage you claim it will be, the fact is that is x% that wouldn't be going to the middle east but to our own people. But hey, you are all about helping the american worker.....errrr.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by Rascal

Next time you complain that we are dependent on foreign oil I suggest you look at this thread.

I don't care what percentage you claim it will be, the fact is that is x% that wouldn't be going to the middle east but to our own people. But hey, you are all about helping the american worker.....errrr.

Too bad repubs like Rascal still don't get it. We need to eliminate the dependency on oil not prolong it.

And of course, you're incorrect about "where" that oil would end up going.

[RaiderH8r]

My thoughts from another thread:

I just hope they do EXACTLY as Sen. Durbin said. We need to pull all political money out of this bill so that we can get to the bipartite task of funding our troops. I wonder what Durbin's reaction would be to pulling the hurricane relief funding and LIHEAP funding out of this bill..... I say yank it all out, scuttle the bill and watch Durbin cry while you brow beat him with his own words. Same goes for Kerry, Cvntsmell, BoxMuncher, and the whole lot. 2,000 acres out of 19 million, and the 2K are arctic tundra. If you can find me 100 people over 10 years who will visit the 2K acres in question on anything other than work related or scientific endeavors I'll concede that it is a tourist industry and needs to be protected. Good f***ing luck. Clearly 2,000 acres of arctic tundra trumps funding the troops and DoD, hurricane relief, LIHEAP, and a ****load of other measures contained within the bill. Anyone who tells you otherwise is selling you a line of ****.

Yank EVERY single penny not related to DoD spending out of this bill.

Roll hurricane relief, LIHEAP, and a couple of other desperately wanted programs into a bill with ANWR and Coastal drilling in a budget reconciliation bill where royalties from the drilling go to fund the aforementioned projects. See where priorities lie then. You have spending measures and the revenue measures to pay for them rolled into the same bill. It is then germaine and fully within the rules of both Houses...and not subject to filibuster. Don't budge an inch, lose ANWR or coastal drilling, lose all projects wholly or partially funded by the royalties from those measures. Bang, you'll see that the left would, again, side with the arctic tundra and religious left. ANWR is roughly the size of South Carolina (20 million acres v. 19 million acres in ANWR) ANWR is larger than ten different states.

[Rascal]

Originally Posted by RaiderH8r

My thoughts from another thread:

I just hope they do EXACTLY as Sen. Durbin said. We need to pull all political money out of this bill so that we can get to the bipartite task of funding our troops. I wonder what Durbin's reaction would be to pulling the hurricane relief funding and LIHEAP funding out of this bill..... I say yank it all out, scuttle the bill and watch Durbin cry while you brow beat him with his own words. Same goes for Kerry, Cvntsmell, BoxMuncher, and the whole lot. 2,000 acres out of 19 million, and the 2K are arctic tundra. If you can find me 100 people over 10 years who will visit the 2K acres in question on anything other than work related or scientific endeavors I'll concede that it is a tourist industry and needs to be protected. Good f***ing luck. Clearly 2,000 acres of arctic tundra trumps funding the troops and DoD, hurricane relief, LIHEAP, and a ****load of other measures contained within the bill. Anyone who tells you otherwise is selling you a line of ****.

Yank EVERY single penny not related to DoD spending out of this bill.

Roll hurricane relief, LIHEAP, and a couple of other desperately wanted programs into a bill with ANWR and Coastal drilling in a budget reconciliation bill where royalties from the drilling go to fund the aforementioned projects. See where priorities lie then. You have spending measures and the revenue measures to pay for them rolled into the same bill. It is then germaine and fully within the rules of both Houses...and not subject to filibuster. Don't budge an inch, lose ANWR or coastal drilling, lose all projects wholly or partially funded by the royalties from those measures. Bang, you'll see that the left would, again, side with the arctic tundra and religious left. ANWR is roughly the size of South Carolina (20 million acres v. 19 million acres in ANWR) ANWR is larger than ten different states.

Quoted for truth.

[Rascal]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

Too bad repubs like Rascal still don't get it. We need to eliminate the dependency on oil not prolong it.

And of course, you're incorrect about "where" that oil would end up going.

To bad left wing nut jobs like Slug don't get it. This wouldn't be prolonging the dependency just helping bring back a portion of our money back to the USA.

Who cares where it goes, if we sell it for more then what we bring in good for us.

[Spider]

Hell the way the ANWAR Bill was presented is pure Chickenshít , whether you agree with anwar or not , dont attach it to a defense bill, as with Katrina and other monies ........Fúcking gutless wonders ..........

[RaiderH8r]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

Hell the way the ANWAR Bill was presented is pure Chickenshít , whether you agree with anwar or not , dont attach it to a defense bill, as with Katrina and other monies ........Fúcking gutless wonders ..........

It comes down to the fact that those voting against cloture put 2K acres of tundra ahead of funding the DoD. It's their right to do so, I just disagree with it.

Hell, if ANWR could get a straight up or down vote instead of being subject to a super majority support the bill would stand alone and win in a walk. But opponents deem it necessary to require a super majority to pass the legislation. This is the closest thing to a fair shake ANWR can get.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by RaiderH8r

It comes down to the fact that those voting against cloture put 2K acres of tundra ahead of funding the DoD. It's their right to do so, I just disagree with it.

Hell, if ANWR could get a straight up or down vote instead of being subject to a super majority support the bill would stand alone and win in a walk. But opponents deem it necessary to require a super majority to pass the legislation. This is the closest thing to a fair shake ANWR can get.

there has to be somthing wrong with ANWAR we dont know about .. even some reps jumped ship ............

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by Rascal

To bad left wing nut jobs like Slug don't get it. This wouldn't be prolonging the dependency just helping bring back a portion of our money back to the USA.

Who cares where it goes, if we sell it for more then what we bring in good for us.

Make up your mind. You just said any amount would reduce our dependency then turnaround and say
Who cares where it goes.

It absolutely takes us in the wrong direction and prolongs our dependency on oil (which means our dependency on foreign oil). If these repubs would put this much time, energy and money into developing renewable and alternative energy we wouldn't have to waste our time on this kind of crap.

[RaiderH8r]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

there has to be somthing wrong with ANWAR we dont know about .. even some reps jumped ship ............

Chaffee is a NE republican. He's the Republican version of Zell Miller. You Dems remember good ole Zell don't you? DeWine has a bee in his bonnet about ANWR for some unfathomable reason. He supports other drilling measures, but que sera sera. Blanche Lincoln is probably open to changing her vote. If Frist can pull Pryor away from the Dems then you would probably see DeWine and Lincoln change their votes as well thus giving 60. There's a lot of arm twisting going on right now I can tell you that.

[Rascal]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

Make up your mind. You just said any amount would reduce our dependency then turnaround and say
Who cares where it goes.

It absolutely takes us in the wrong direction and prolongs our dependency on oil (which means our dependency on foreign oil). If these repubs would put this much time, energy and money into developing renewable and alternative energy we wouldn't have to waste our time on this kind of crap.

Are you really being serious?

[RaiderH8r]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

Make up your mind. You just said any amount would reduce our dependency then turnaround and say
Who cares where it goes.

It absolutely takes us in the wrong direction and prolongs our dependency on oil (which means our dependency on foreign oil). If these repubs would put this much time, energy and money into developing renewable and alternative energy we wouldn't have to waste our time on this kind of crap.

And right there is the achilles heel of liberal thought. Wait for the repubs to come up with innovative ideas and techniques. Corporations are evil, but they should be expected to come up with a better widget. And when they do they'll be villified for not giving it over to the every man. Villify corporations at every turn for perceived wrong doing and a fundamental hatred of their very existence and then wonder why in the world won't they listen.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by RaiderH8r

And right there is the achilles heel of liberal thought. Wait for the repubs to come up with innovative ideas and techniques. Corporations are evil, but they should be expected to come up with a better widget. And when they do they'll be villified for not giving it over to the every man. Villify corporations at every turn for perceived wrong doing and a fundamental hatred of their very existence and then wonder why in the world won't they listen.

you wouldnt be a lobbist for the oil and gas industry ?

[RaiderH8r]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

you wouldnt be a lobbist for the oil and gas industry ?

What would lead you to believe that?

[TheDave]

Let me see if i've got this straight...

You Dems are stupid... You repubs are idiots...
You libs are the reason everything is f***ed up... If it weren't for you Neo-Cons all would be perfect...

Gee, i wonder why they can't get anything done in Washington

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by Rascal

Are you really being serious?

Yeah, you're right. Expecting innovation, forward thinking and creating industrial and manufacturing jobs (new fields from developing renewable and alternative energies) from repubs in this congress, is quite the pipe dream.

[RaiderH8r]

Originally Posted by TheDave

Let me see if i've got this straight...

You Dems are stupid... You repubs are idiots...
You libs are the reason everything is f***ed up... If it weren't for you Neo-Cons all would be perfect...

Gee, i wonder why they can't get anything done in Washington

Times may change but traditions must remain.

[RaiderH8r]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

Yeah, you're right. Expecting innovation, forward thinking and creating industrial and manufacturing jobs (new fields from developing renewable and alternative energies) from repubs in this congress, is quite the pipe dream.

Another fallacy of liberal thought. Government creates none of these things. Inventors, businessmen and women, manufacturing companies et al do the things you mentioned. Government just tries to steal their money from time to time.

[Bronco_Beerslug]

Originally Posted by RaiderH8r

Another fallacy of liberal thought. Government creates none of these things. Inventors, businessmen and women, manufacturing companies et al do the things you mentioned. Government just tries to steal their money from time to time.

Government is giving our money to big oil and gas so what are you talking about? Government can advance the things I'm talking about by providing incentives for corporate America to move away from big oil and quit feeding it.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by Rascal

Next time you complain that we are dependent on foreign oil I suggest you look at this thread.

I suggest you look at the evidence that the GOP crooks you support are responsible for our dependence on foreign oil:

Carter Tried To Stop Bush's Energy Disasters - 28 Years Ago

http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0503-22.htm

Note how Carter anticipated the energy problems facing us today.

Note how Reagan, Bush I, and Bush II have all ignored Carter's warnings and have instead pandered to the oil industry for political gain.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

"We can be sure that all the special interest groups in the country will attack the part of this [energy] plan that affects them directly," he said. "They will say that sacrifice is fine, as long as other people do it, but that their sacrifice is unreasonable, or unfair, or harmful to the country. If they succeed, then the burden on the ordinary citizen, who is not organized into an interest group, would be crushing." But that would be wrong. It would be un-American. It would lead to future oil shocks, and the probable death of American soldiers in Middle Eastern oil wars. Instead of caving in to the Saudis and the oil industry, Carter said: "There should be only one test for this program: whether it will help our country."

Jimmy Carter, 1978

[W*GS]

Originally Posted by L.A. BRONCOS FAN

Note how Reagan, Bush I, and Bush II have all ignored Carter's warnings and have instead pandered to the oil industry for political gain.

You forgot one name in your list - Clinton.

Indeed, you've praised Clinton for low gas prices during his watch. Is that really the best way to get us off of our oil addiction?

Geezus, LABF, you sure can't keep your lies straight. That's why telling the truth is better.

[watermock]

Originally Posted by Bronco_Beerslug

Yeah, you're right. Expecting innovation, forward thinking and creating industrial and manufacturing jobs (new fields from developing renewable and alternative energies) from repubs in this congress, is quite the pipe dream.

This is so classic it's unreal,,,yes of course the repubicans hate alternative energy...that's why is was so clearly mapped out in the Clinton Administration.

Are you people on a different planet?

Oh, I forgot, we were going to steal Kuwait's oil, and Saudi Arabia...now we are after Iraq's...next is Iran....we are just colonizing them...

[Rigs11]

Originally Posted by watermock

This is so classic it's unreal,,,yes of course the repubicans hate alternative energy...that's why is was so clearly mapped out in the Clinton Administration.

Are you people on a different planet?

Oh, I forgot, we were going to steal Kuwait's oil, and Saudi Arabia...now we are after Iraq's...next is Iran....we are just colonizing them...

I thought we were liberating them? What was Dubya's estimate? 30,000 Iraqis dead...err..liberated?