Broncos Defense - The Orange Mane

Popps · 10-25-2005, 11:13 PM

Passing Yards

Our defense ranks near the bottom of the league in passing yards allowed. Only six teams are worse.

Passing TDs Allowed

Also in the bottom half. Only 9 teams have allowed more TD passes.

Sacks

You guessed it.... dead last. We've got 8 sacks on the SEASON. (Teams have done nearly that in a game, this season) Only Cleveland is as bad as us at getting to the QB... and they've played one less game.

Interceptions

Again, in the lower half of the league. Five INTs on the season.

Pass Completions

Near the very bottom in pass completions allwed. Only three teams in the NFL have allowed more completed passes.

Late Scoring

The Broncos are the worst defense in the league in the final two minutes of the game.

Sassy · 10-25-2005, 11:15 PM

How are we 5-2 then

ncjmirabile · 10-25-2005, 11:18 PM

Denver being in the top five in the turnover differential and leading the league in QB pressures and being top five in passes defensed might have something to do with it.

Popps · 10-25-2005, 11:21 PM

A couple of stats to add to that mix.... our offense is 2nd in the league in turnovers, allowing only 6 on the season.

We're 2nd in the league in rushing offense and 13th in the league at time of possession.

Now, if I recall correctly... our defense's woes were Jake Plummer's fault? I recall hearing that all we needed to do was limit turnovers, dominate with the run game, put up points and manage the clock... and our defense would have no more excuses.

Hmmmm.....

Popps · 10-25-2005, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sassy

How are we 5-2 then

We defend the run well.

We also run the ball well.

That's good for 8 wins a year, right there.

Anything more than that, and you've got to be able to get to the QB, stop teams at crunch time, etc.

Sassy · 10-25-2005, 11:24 PM

I was being Sass the Smart***

Popps · 10-25-2005, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sassy

I was being Sass the Smart***

I know.

I actually think this team does a lot of things well. We're a very hard team to run against... and we average over 20 points a game on offense.

I DO think we've got to play better on third downs, and I'm not sure who or what to blame. Plummer is doing everything they ask and our running game should be opening up the passing game. It hurts not having a clutch tight end, and I think after Rod Smith, none of our receivers remotely scare anyone.
We couldn't top Burress when it counted. Unfortunately, I don't think our offense has anyone like that anymore.

Hence, we've got to get it done on defense. We're an above average offensive team. But, we're not the Colts. We're simply not going to be for quite some time. We've got to stop people. Few teams in the league are good enough to build double-digit leads near the end of every game. We're doing that... and our defense can't hold their ground. They play great for three quarters, and then horrific in the fourth. Even more concerning, this trend has gotten worse... not better.

Our best game of the season was the Jags game, in my opinion. Why? We played a tough defense and still managed to get out to a lead. Our defense held strong while our offense struggled early... and then they kicked asss IN THE FOURTH QUARTER to preserve our lead.

Right there is your blueprint for how this team wins. Not scoring 50 points a game, not blowing 10, 13, 25 point leads at the end of games, etc.

Kaylore · 10-26-2005, 02:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Popps

Passing Yards

Our defense ranks near the bottom of the league in passing yards allowed. Only six teams are worse.

Passing TDs Allowed

Also in the bottom half. Only 9 teams have allowed more TD passes.

Sacks

You guessed it.... dead last. We've got 8 sacks on the SEASON. (Teams have done nearly that in a game, this season) Only Cleveland is as bad as us at getting to the QB... and they've played one less game.

Interceptions

Again, in the lower half of the league. Five INTs on the season.

Pass Completions

Near the very bottom in pass completions allwed. Only three teams in the NFL have allowed more completed passes.

Late Scoring

The Broncos are the worst defense in the league in the final two minutes of the game.

Proof that Jake Plummer is a bad Quarterback.

Taco John · 10-26-2005, 03:10 AM

I don't know about any of the stats, but what I do know is that the Defense intercepted the ball in the clutch and won this game for us, at which point the offense promptly choked it back up.

meangene · 10-26-2005, 03:36 AM

[QUOTE=Popps]I know.

I actually think this team does a lot of things well. We're a very hard team to run against... and we average over 20 points a game on offense.

I DO think we've got to play better on third downs, and I'm not sure who or what to blame. Plummer is doing everything they ask and our running game should be opening up the passing game. It hurts not having a clutch tight end, and I think after Rod Smith, none of our receivers remotely scare anyone.
We couldn't top Burress when it counted. Unfortunately, I don't think our offense has anyone like that anymore.

Hence, we've got to get it done on defense. We're an above average offensive team. But, we're not the Colts. We're simply not going to be for quite some time. We've got to stop people. Few teams in the league are good enough to build double-digit leads near the end of every game. We're doing that... and our defense can't hold their ground. They play great for three quarters, and then horrific in the fourth. Even more concerning, this trend has gotten worse... not better.

Our best game of the season was the Jags game, in my opinion. Why? We played a tough defense and still managed to get out to a lead. Our defense held strong while our offense struggled early... and then they kicked asss IN THE FOURTH QUARTER to preserve our lead.

Right there is your blueprint for how this team wins. Not scoring 50 points a game, not blowing 10, 13, 25 point leads at the end of games, etc.[/QUOTE

I think the single biggest need on this team is somebody, anybody, to step up as a consistent second receiving threat. We really don't have a true No. 1 but could get by with two solid receivers. No disrespect to Rod - I love the guy - but he's not a true No. 1 at this point. Lelie is fluff. No other wide out are being given much chance (maybe justifiably). Putzier always produces when given the chance and has certainly proven his toughness. But, again, his reps are limited. Defensively, it's hard to put a finger on what's missing. Other than, maybe, playing too conservatively when we get ahead. Or, for some reason, a tendency to relax until we lose momentum.

DB-Freak · 10-26-2005, 04:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ncjmirabile

Denver being in the top five in the turnover differential and leading the league in QB pressures and being top five in passes defensed might have something to do with it.

What we have is an overrated and oft injured secondary here.

Bronco9798 · 10-26-2005, 04:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco John

I don't know about any of the stats, but what I do know is that the Defense intercepted the ball in the clutch and won this game for us, at which point the offense promptly choked it back up.

And then the Defense allowed the Giants to move the ball 83 yards in about 3 minutes. Both sides are working against each other. Somewhere it has to get fixed. Both sides.

OrangeShadow · 10-26-2005, 04:32 AM

People look at stats to much.

Teams can have a lot of sacks but we are getting a lot pf pressure.

look up the stat for QB pressures...

Mediator12 · 10-26-2005, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Popps

A couple of stats to add to that mix.... our offense is 2nd in the league in turnovers, allowing only 6 on the season.

We're 2nd in the league in rushing offense and 13th in the league at time of possession.

Now, if I recall correctly... our defense's woes were Jake Plummer's fault? I recall hearing that all we needed to do was limit turnovers, dominate with the run game, put up points and manage the clock... and our defense would have no more excuses.

Hmmmm.....

You are absolutely right about the secondary. There has not been one game where the starting three CB's have played the Whole game. The safeties have been hurt recently. The DL has not gotten to the QB the last three games. About the Only consistent unit is the LB's.

And the other side of the story popps

As usual nowhere to be found.

The defense is allowing 18 points a game, 89 rushing yards, and 2 TO's a game. Yet they have struggled again Mightily with Injuries to the CB's. Does anyone here question Lenny Walls frailty anymore

I have contended they should have paid both Herndon and Walls for one year.

Where would this team be Without the Rookie CB's everyone loved to hate after the draft. Definitely not 5-2. As is, they Struggle late in games with injuries and Are getting schooled with the game on the line. Champ was robbed of any effectiveness versus Burress with the Liberal PI penalties and the lack of reciprocal pushoff penalties versus Burress downfield. Tough Recipe to overcome, but they almost did anyway.

I have yet to see any prominent offensive injuries popps. If they lose Rod and Bell in the fourth Q for the seventh straight game then I might just have to cut them a little slack for their fourth Q lack of production. Until then, the defense is going to struggle late with 50% of the secondary Hurt and 30% rookies. The biggest Problem IMHO is the Late TD percentage in the Red Zone. That is totally uncharacteristic and unacceptable. Have to keep teams out of the end zone late.

Rock Chalk · 10-26-2005, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco John

I don't know about any of the stats, but what I do know is that the Defense intercepted the ball in the clutch and won this game for us, at which point the offense promptly choked it back up.

So its the offense's fault that they moved the ball just enough to give Saurbrun a good opportunity to pin the Giants back around th 10 yard line with 2 minutes left?

Its the offense's fault that, when push came to shove, the giants marched right down the field and got a game winning touchdown? dont give me that bull**** that they were exhaused, we had the ball most of the game.

Its the offense's fault always isn't it Taco? Yeah, it was a 3 and out, tough ****ing luck. If the defense was so god damn good, they could have forced a three and out too.

Rock Chalk · 10-26-2005, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco John

I don't know about any of the stats, but what I do know is that the Defense intercepted the ball in the clutch and won this game for us, at which point the offense promptly choked it back up.

So its the offense's fault that they moved the ball just enough to give Saurbrun a good opportunity to pin the Giants back around th 10 yard line with 2 minutes left?

Its the offense's fault that, when push came to shove, the giants marched right down the field and got a game winning touchdown? dont give me that bull**** that they were exhaused, we had the ball most of the game.

Its the offense's fault always isn't it Taco? Yeah, it was a 3 and out, tough ****ing luck. If the defense was so god damn good, they could have forced a three and out too.

BroncoInferno · 10-26-2005, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco John

I don't know about any of the stats, but what I do know is that the Defense intercepted the ball in the clutch and won this game for us, at which point the offense promptly choked it back up.

What I know is that the offense gave us a 13 point 4th quarter cushion and had this game won for us, at which point the defense that Shanahan has built this team around promptly choked it back up.

Mediator12 · 10-26-2005, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroncoInferno

What I know is that the offense gave us a 13 point 4th quarter cushion and had this game won for us, at which point the defense that Shanahan has built this team around promptly choked it back up.

This is the Stupidest argument I have ever seen. The defense also gave them the 13 point lead. The Jake does not play defense argument also works both ways. The defense had given up ten points until the fourth Q. That Lead was from BOTH sides of the Ball. Should we just send the offense home after the third Q with a 13 point lead? I mean 37-3 points in the fourth Q over the last three games where the three came from the Giants 47?

The defense has not been able to hold leads since JAX for the simple reason of inconsistent secondary play and Penalties on the CB's. What the hell is the offenses excuse for poor execution?

Billy Clyde Puckett · 10-26-2005, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediator12

This is the Stupidest argument I have ever seen. The defense also gave them the 13 point lead. The Jake does not play defense argument also works both ways. The defense had given up ten points until the fourth Q. That Lead was from BOTH sides of the Ball. Should we just send the offense home after the third Q with a 13 point lead? I mean 37-3 points in the fourth Q over the last three games where the three came from the Giants 47?

The defense has not been able to hold leads since JAX for the simple reason of inconsistent secondary play and Penalties on the CB's. What the hell is the offenses excuse for poor execution?

Key phrase in this argument TEAM SPORT. They all take the credit, they all take the blame.

BroncoInferno · 10-26-2005, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mediator12

This is the Stupidest argument I have ever seen. The defense also gave them the 13 point lead. The Jake does not play defense argument also works both ways. The defense had given up ten points until the fourth Q. That Lead was from BOTH sides of the Ball. Should we just send the offense home after the third Q with a 13 point lead? I mean 37-3 points in the fourth Q over the last three games where the three came from the Giants 47?

The defense has not been able to hold leads since JAX for the simple reason of inconsistent secondary play and Penalties on the CB's. What the hell is the offenses excuse for poor execution?

I actually agree for the most part with what you're saying. I'm trying to reverse TJs own idiotic logic that one INT "won" the game for us. I can just as easily say that having a 13 point 4th quarter lead should have "won" the game. Both sides sucked and share in the loss.

I do think, though, that since Shanny has devoted the majority of this teams resources to building a top quality defense--at the perril of any offensive improvement beyond a Stephen Alexander role-player type--that more of the responsibility falls on the defense to get it done. We just don't have a lot of talent on offense. When we have double-digit 4th quarter leads, this defense that Shanny has clearly built the team around needs to protect that lead.

Rascal · 10-26-2005, 08:42 AM

I'm beginning to think Champ is a bit overrated. We will see how he does against TO, but I'm not looking forward to it.

I would still do the trade, I just don't think he is as good as advertised.

Let the insults begin.

DarkHorse · 10-26-2005, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rascal

I'm beginning to think Champ is a bit overrated. We will see how he does against TO, but I'm not looking forward to it.

I would still do the trade, I just don't think he is as good as advertised.

Let the insults begin.

I'm not going to disagree with you on this one with today's "Pro-Offense" NFL rules. Pre-Tag the fag rules - Champ was a stud. Now, he's just another CB out there on the field. He does certain things well but as we've seen for 2 years now - the league is different and it's affecting his play dramatically.

Had I known we would hit on D-Will and Fox - I would have kept Portis.

meangene · 10-26-2005, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rascal

I'm beginning to think Champ is a bit overrated. We will see how he does against TO, but I'm not looking forward to it.

I would still do the trade, I just don't think he is as good as advertised.

Let the insults begin.

From my limited time here, I know there is a lot of support for Champ on this board. I realize he gets the toughest assaignments, that other aspects of the defense benefit from this, that he got "jobbed" by the refs last week, etc. But, I'm tired of him losing these one on one battles with top recievers all day long. Last year I thought he was vastly overrated. This year he had been playing better but I still agree that he is not as good as advertised. Teams seem to have no qualms about throwing at him. I think we would be better off playing him within the scheme of the overall defense more and not matching him up with specific receivers all day long. If he's matched up one on one with TO all day Sunday it will be ugly.

Play2win · 10-26-2005, 09:20 AM

Last year was his first year here, and we had the Gibbs debacle and all, and this year he has been atleast some what injured all season. I'm not making excuses, I'm just sayin'...

BTW- I think Champ has played very well this year, its just that the (his) standard is set so HIGH.

tornado927 · 10-26-2005, 09:26 AM

Ok, this is what happens when I have too much time on my hands, and let me say first of all for all to feel free to check my math because it has never been my strong point.

But that being said, I did this because I keep hearing about how the Defense is fading away in the second half of games this season and that is the reason for the the last few games have been close or a loss.

I took the total number of second half possessions for Denver's Opponents this year. I got a total of 37. I then totaled the number of TD's and FG's they allowed as well as the total number of Punts, TO's, TO's on Downs, and FG's Blocked they have forced. The numbers I got look like this.

TD's - 10 (3 of these came in the Miami Debacle)
FG's - 3
Punts - 16
TO's - 6
TOD's - 1
FG's B - 1

I used these number's to come up with the following percentages (which have been rounded up).

TD's allowed 27% of the time
FG's allowed 8% of the time
Punts forced 42% of the time
TO's forced 16% of the time
TO on Downs forced 3% of the time
FG's Blocked 3% of the time

So, IF my numbers are right, in the second half of games this year, the Defense is giving the ball back to the Offense with no scoring allowed 64% of the time. They are giving up points only 35% of the time.

I have absolutely no idea where this would put them in the context of the rest of the leagues Defenses, but not giving up any pts almost 2/3 of the time sounds good to me. To be fair, I have no idea what kind of point percentage the offense has been putting up, (I ran out of free time) and we all know that you can make stats say whatever you want, but I did think these were interesting.

But, whatever....let the debate rage on!

10-25-2005, 11:13 PM	#1
Popps TEAM FIRST. Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 29,785	Broncos Defense Passing Yards Our defense ranks near the bottom of the league in passing yards allowed. Only six teams are worse. Passing TDs Allowed Also in the bottom half. Only 9 teams have allowed more TD passes. Sacks You guessed it.... dead last. We've got 8 sacks on the SEASON. (Teams have done nearly that in a game, this season) Only Cleveland is as bad as us at getting to the QB... and they've played one less game. Interceptions Again, in the lower half of the league. Five INTs on the season. Pass Completions Near the very bottom in pass completions allwed. Only three teams in the NFL have allowed more completed passes. Late Scoring The Broncos are the worst defense in the league in the final two minutes of the game.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

10-25-2005, 11:15 PM	#2
Sassy Ring of Famer Join Date: May 2001 Location: ND Posts: 37,952 Adopt-a-Bronco: Eddie Royal	How are we 5-2 then

10-25-2005, 11:18 PM	#3
ncjmirabile Spiderman 3's Gwen Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Princeton, WV Posts: 338	Denver being in the top five in the turnover differential and leading the league in QB pressures and being top five in passes defensed might have something to do with it.

10-25-2005, 11:21 PM	#4
Popps TEAM FIRST. Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 29,785	A couple of stats to add to that mix.... our offense is 2nd in the league in turnovers, allowing only 6 on the season. We're 2nd in the league in rushing offense and 13th in the league at time of possession. Now, if I recall correctly... our defense's woes were Jake Plummer's fault? I recall hearing that all we needed to do was limit turnovers, dominate with the run game, put up points and manage the clock... and our defense would have no more excuses. Hmmmm.....

10-25-2005, 11:24 PM	#6
Sassy Ring of Famer Join Date: May 2001 Location: ND Posts: 37,952 Adopt-a-Bronco: Eddie Royal	I was being Sass the Smart***

10-26-2005, 03:10 AM	#9
Taco John 24/7 Broncos In Elway I Trust Join Date: Apr 2001 Posts: 49,697 Adopt-a-Bronco: Peyton Manning	I don't know about any of the stats, but what I do know is that the Defense intercepted the ball in the clutch and won this game for us, at which point the offense promptly choked it back up.

10-26-2005, 03:36 AM	#10
meangene Ring of Famer Offseason Mode Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Virginia Posts: 2,075	[QUOTE=Popps]I know. I actually think this team does a lot of things well. We're a very hard team to run against... and we average over 20 points a game on offense. I DO think we've got to play better on third downs, and I'm not sure who or what to blame. Plummer is doing everything they ask and our running game should be opening up the passing game. It hurts not having a clutch tight end, and I think after Rod Smith, none of our receivers remotely scare anyone. We couldn't top Burress when it counted. Unfortunately, I don't think our offense has anyone like that anymore. Hence, we've got to get it done on defense. We're an above average offensive team. But, we're not the Colts. We're simply not going to be for quite some time. We've got to stop people. Few teams in the league are good enough to build double-digit leads near the end of every game. We're doing that... and our defense can't hold their ground. They play great for three quarters, and then horrific in the fourth. Even more concerning, this trend has gotten worse... not better. Our best game of the season was the Jags game, in my opinion. Why? We played a tough defense and still managed to get out to a lead. Our defense held strong while our offense struggled early... and then they kicked asss IN THE FOURTH QUARTER to preserve our lead. Right there is your blueprint for how this team wins. Not scoring 50 points a game, not blowing 10, 13, 25 point leads at the end of games, etc.[/QUOTE I think the single biggest need on this team is somebody, anybody, to step up as a consistent second receiving threat. We really don't have a true No. 1 but could get by with two solid receivers. No disrespect to Rod - I love the guy - but he's not a true No. 1 at this point. Lelie is fluff. No other wide out are being given much chance (maybe justifiably). Putzier always produces when given the chance and has certainly proven his toughness. But, again, his reps are limited. Defensively, it's hard to put a finger on what's missing. Other than, maybe, playing too conservatively when we get ahead. Or, for some reason, a tendency to relax until we lose momentum.

10-26-2005, 04:32 AM	#13
OrangeShadow armed and dangerous Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 6,771	People look at stats to much. Teams can have a lot of sacks but we are getting a lot pf pressure. look up the stat for QB pressures...

10-26-2005, 08:42 AM	#21
Rascal RIP Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 16,581 Adopt-a-Bronco: Turf	I'm beginning to think Champ is a bit overrated. We will see how he does against TO, but I'm not looking forward to it. I would still do the trade, I just don't think he is as good as advertised. Let the insults begin.

10-26-2005, 09:20 AM	#24
Play2win Ring of Famer Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 9,610 Adopt-a-Bronco: The Duke	Last year was his first year here, and we had the Gibbs debacle and all, and this year he has been atleast some what injured all season. I'm not making excuses, I'm just sayin'... BTW- I think Champ has played very well this year, its just that the (his) standard is set so HIGH.

10-26-2005, 09:26 AM	#25
tornado927 TORNADO Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Washington D.C. Posts: 84	Ok, this is what happens when I have too much time on my hands, and let me say first of all for all to feel free to check my math because it has never been my strong point. But that being said, I did this because I keep hearing about how the Defense is fading away in the second half of games this season and that is the reason for the the last few games have been close or a loss. I took the total number of second half possessions for Denver's Opponents this year. I got a total of 37. I then totaled the number of TD's and FG's they allowed as well as the total number of Punts, TO's, TO's on Downs, and FG's Blocked they have forced. The numbers I got look like this. TD's - 10 (3 of these came in the Miami Debacle) FG's - 3 Punts - 16 TO's - 6 TOD's - 1 FG's B - 1 I used these number's to come up with the following percentages (which have been rounded up). TD's allowed 27% of the time FG's allowed 8% of the time Punts forced 42% of the time TO's forced 16% of the time TO on Downs forced 3% of the time FG's Blocked 3% of the time So, IF my numbers are right, in the second half of games this year, the Defense is giving the ball back to the Offense with no scoring allowed 64% of the time. They are giving up points only 35% of the time. I have absolutely no idea where this would put them in the context of the rest of the leagues Defenses, but not giving up any pts almost 2/3 of the time sounds good to me. To be fair, I have no idea what kind of point percentage the offense has been putting up, (I ran out of free time) and we all know that you can make stats say whatever you want, but I did think these were interesting. But, whatever....let the debate rage on!