What if the Democrats came out and said this ?

[Spider]

We have done our job over the past three years. We have freed the Iraqi people from a brutal dictator and given them their first taste of freedom. Iraq held successful presidential elections earlier this year, and the nation is now run by a democratic-elected government.

We have accomplished what we set out to do -- bring freedom to Iraq and rid the region of the specter of Saddam's terror.

But now it is time to let the Iraqis take charge of their own lives. The future belongs to a free democratic Iraq, but it is a future they must fight for themselves.

[Crushaholic]

Democracy is STILL being threatened in Iraq and leaving now would create a power void that would threaten the security of the Middle East. There is a time to get out of the country, but we're not quite there, yet.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Crushaholic

Democracy is STILL being threatened in Iraq and leaving now would create a power void that would threaten the security of the Middle East. There is a time to get out of the country, but we're not quite there, yet.

I see , so we should just hand over Freedom to the Iraqis , dont let them fight for it ...... the real power void is Iran.........

[Spider]

So on one side , we have a group that says , Look the Iraqi People have to fight for themselfs ........
The other side says , no we need to babysit the iraqis every step of the way , continue on paying for everything , making sure they are safe .........
Interesting line of debate .......

[Hotrod]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

So on one side , we have a group that says , Look the Iraqi People have to fight for themselfs ........
The other side says , no we need to babysit the iraqis every step of the way , continue on paying for everything , making sure they are safe .........
Interesting line of debate .......

I would love to hand over the whole thing to them and let them fight for it like they should the only problem is they would get smashed and bingo a new terrorist training state.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by Crushaholic

Democracy is STILL being threatened in Iraq and leaving now would create a power void that would threaten the security of the Middle East.

Democracy, as we understand it, has never existed in Iraq and never will.

We would have all been a lot better off if the PNAC lunatics who crafted the Iraq policy had taken the time to study the history of the region.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by L.A. BRONCOS FAN

Democracy, as we understand it, has never existed in Iraq and never will.

We would have all been a lot better off if the PNAC lunatics who crafted the Iraq policy had taken the time to study the history of the region.

well , what those that want us to say dont understand is , as long as we are there , the Sunnis and the Shiates , dont have to come together and build a goverment ....... in the end it iwill be up to the Iraqis to maintain their Freedoms . their goverment , their economy , we cant do it , nor should we ........

[Hotrod]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

well , what those that want us to say dont understand is , as long as we are there , the Sunnis and the Shiates , dont have to come together and build a goverment ....... in the end it iwill be up to the Iraqis to maintain their Freedoms . their goverment , their economy , we cant do it , nor should we ........

So your for walking out right now Thats the worst thing we could possibly do.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Hotrod

So your for walking out right now Thats the worst thing we could possibly do.

I wasnt aware I said Now ...... But no pulling out right now would be 1 of many mistakes made in this little vendetta of Bushs .... But I sure in the hell dont want us there in 5 years from now either .........

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

well , what those that want us to say dont understand is , as long as we are there , the Sunnis and the Shiates , dont have to come together and build a goverment ....... in the end it iwill be up to the Iraqis to maintain their Freedoms . their goverment , their economy , we cant do it , nor should we ........

Yep. Those ethnic groups (along with the Kurds) were at each other's throats long before we came down the pike. If the pinhead thinks he's going to have them sitting down together and singing 'Kumbaya" anytime in the foreseeable future, then he's truly delusional (but we already knew that.)

Memo to the chimp: Picking up where Saddam left off at places like Abu Grhaib and killing >100,000 Iraqi civilians probably isn't the way to get it done.

[Hotrod]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

I wasnt aware I said Now ...... But no pulling out right now would be 1 of many mistakes made in this little vendetta of Bushs .... But I sure in the hell dont want us there in 5 years from now either .........

Fair enough....Im not very happy with many things going on right now including the war in Iraq heres the problem thou all I hear the dems do is b**** about it. If they have a better idea or solution they should come out and say it. Instead they are a party with no ideas they are just like their talking head Dean and just b**** about s*** without a single solution offered.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Hotrod

Fair enough....Im not very happy with many things going on right now including the war in Iraq heres the problem thou all I hear the dems do is b**** about it. If they have a better idea or solution they should come out and say it. Instead they are a party with no ideas they are just like their talking head Dean and just b**** about s*** without a single solution offered.

you have heard me say plenty of times , we never should have went in , We should have stayed in Afghanastan ,But we had to go in and get this Boogey man ....... So yeah We had a better idea , But then Bush fixed the Intell to fit his cause , passed it out to congress , and the Dems bit . so we can blame the Dems for not having a Plan , but in the End it was Bush that decided to go in , he will have to accept responsibilty some day for it

[Hotrod]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

you have heard me say plenty of times , we never should have went in , We should have stayed in Afghanastan ,But we had to go in and get this Boogey man ....... So yeah We had a better idea , But then Bush fixed the Intell to fit his cause , passed it out to congress , and the Dems bit . so we can blame the Dems for not having a Plan , but in the End it was Bush that decided to go in , he will have to accept responsibilty some day for it

Great be pissed about that Im not happy were there either but again I hear nothing but b****ing from the dems. I think everyone would like to not be there right now but obviously unless we come up with a time machine thats not an option. Maybe it would help if the dems and Dean would start talking solutions instead of bashing people would give them an ear. IMO the reason they dont is because they are a party without ideas.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by Hotrod

Fair enough....Im not very happy with many things going on right now including the war in Iraq heres the problem thou all I hear the dems do is b**** about it. If they have a better idea or solution they should come out and say it. Instead they are a party with no ideas they are just like their talking head Dean and just b**** about s*** without a single solution offered.

rofl

It wasn't our idea to invade Iraq in the first place, and now you're complaining because we aren't providing a solution to the problem Bush created?

I though republicans stood for personal responsibility and all that shyte.

[Hotrod]

Originally Posted by L.A. BRONCOS FAN

rofl

It wasn't our idea to invade Iraq in the first place, and now you're complaining because we aren't providing a solution to the problem Bush created?

I though republicans stood for personal responsibility and all that shyte.

Not at all just pointing out the fact that the dems are simply b**** about s***. That all they are doing. Its funny really. So far the only solutions Ive heard is pull out and close Gitmo. Wow what an insightful group.

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Hotrod

Great be pissed about that Im not happy were there either but again I hear nothing but b****ing from the dems. I think everyone would like to not be there right now but obviously unless we come up with a time machine thats not an option. Maybe it would help if the dems and Dean would start talking solutions instead of bashing people would give them an ear. IMO the reason they dont is because they are a party without ideas.

who has the Majority ?
Who thrashed anyone as a Terrorist sympathizer , Saddam Lover , if they spoke up ?
Cheney just got done saying Dems didnt want to capture terrorist , we wanted to give them Therapy ........... How can we work with People like that ?
you talk about Dean , yet you ignore Sanitorium ...........
Every time Kerry came up with a Plan he was blasted , now the Reps realize they are in over their head , they want Dems to step up and bail them out .......
Biden has came up with Several Plans , and guess what ? .. nothing .... Media wont even cover it , Bill Oreilly did , but He chooped the Video and took Credit for the Idea , you remember Al Franken bust Bill O'Reilly thread ?
so you tell me what the Dems are supposed to do ?

[Hotrod]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

who has the Majority ?
Who thrashed anyone as a Terrorist sympathizer , Saddam Lover , if they spoke up ?
Cheney just got done saying Dems didnt want to capture terrorist , we wanted to give them Therapy ........... How can we work with People like that ?
you talk about Dean , yet you ignore Sanitorium ...........
Every time Kerry came up with a Plan he was blasted , now the Reps realize they are in over their head , they want Dems to step up and bail them out .......
Biden has came up with Several Plans , and guess what ? .. nothing .... Media wont even cover it , Bill Oreilly did , but He chooped the Video and took Credit for the Idea , you remember Al Franken bust Bill O'Reilly thread ?
so you tell me what the Dems are supposed to do ?

Either speak up or shut up is what they should do. Seriously Im not very happy with the repubs right now but the dems crying like children does not exactly give voters anywhere else to go.

Im starting my own party. Hotrods men without a party party

[Spider]

Saxby Chalbliss Realy did a # on Max Clelland remeber that ? yeah even had Clelland buddied up with Ossama .......Cheney telling Lehey go **** yourself .......

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by Hotrod

Not at all just pointing out the fact that the dems are simply b**** about s***. That all they are doing. Its funny really. So far the only solutions Ive heard is pull out and close Gitmo. Wow what an insightful group.

First your party works tirelessly (and in a no-holds-barred fashion) to control all three branches of government and to marginalize the influence/input of Democrats.

Then you create this whopping mess in Iraq.

And now you're trying to duck responsibility by shifting blame to the Dems.

Unreal!

Don't you people ever take responsibility for anything you do?

[Hotrod]

Originally Posted by §Pide®

Saxby Chalbliss Realy did a # on Max Clelland remeber that ? yeah even had Clelland buddied up with Ossama .......Cheney telling Lehey go **** yourself .......

I may be to redneck for politics but I like having a VP who freely tells someone to "go **** yourself. Shows backbone

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Hotrod

Either speak up or shut up is what they should do. Seriously Im not very happy with the repubs right now but the dems crying like children does not exactly give voters anywhere else to go.

Thats my point they did speak up , they are speaking up now ..... Remember Bush saying we got to stay the course ?

Im starting my own party. Hotrods men without a party party

[W*GS]

Originally Posted by L.A. BRONCOS FAN

Democracy, as we understand it, has never existed in Iraq and never will.

Why "never will"?

[Spider]

Originally Posted by Hotrod

I may be to redneck for politics but I like having a VP who freely tells someone to "go **** yourself. Shows backbone

it is nice , but not on the senate floor

[Hotrod]

Originally Posted by L.A. BRONCOS FAN

First your party works tirelessly (and in a no-holds-barred fashion) to control all three branches of government and to marginalize the influence/input of Democrats.

Then you create this whopping mess in Iraq.

And now you're trying to duck responsibility by shifting blame to the Dems.

Unreal!

Don't you people ever take responsibility for anything you do?

Exactly where do you see me blaming the dems for the war Try to focus here ok

The point of what Im saying is not that the dems hold any responsibilty its that all they do is cry and moan. Now we hear oh the media would not cover our ideas BS. What do they think as a party if people get mad at Bush they will convert to our party and cry with us

Lets not forget the Dems voted for the war thats a fact. Well before they voted against it.

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by Hotrod

Exactly where do you see me blaming the dems for the war Try to focus here ok

The point of what Im saying is not that the dems hold any responsibilty its that all they do is cry and moan. Now we hear oh the media would not cover our ideas BS. What do they think as a party if people get mad at Bush they will convert to our party and cry with us

Memo to hotrod:

Your party (the GOP) controls all three branches of government.

The Dems have been reduced to a token opposition party.

Why are you suddenly concerned about their input?

You wanted all the marbles, and you got them.

This is your president's war, and it's on him to clean up his own mess.

Originally Posted by Hotrod

Lets not forget the Dems voted for the war thats a fact. Well before they voted against it.

They voted to give bush the authorization to use force in prosecuting a war on terrorism in the aftermath of the 9/11 attacks. They didn't vote for bush's subsequent plan to invade and occupy Iraq. In other words, they trusted bush to do the right thing on terrorism, and, just like the rest of us, they got burned.