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Old 06-18-2014, 10:06 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by SonOfLe-loLang View Post
Yes, its our agenda. C'mon. The better question is why do you care so much to hold on to a name that, regardless of what you think, offends a good deal of people. Change the name, make new cool merch, make money off that.

This isn't unraveling the fabric of america, nor is it some trojan horse for a liberal agenda. Thats a paranoid speak. Its changing a team's name. There's a lot of things that will continue to change as society gets more progressive (and all societies do). I dont see the point of holding on to this.
1. It's a slippery slope when you "force" a team to change a long standing name.
2. It's simply not that big of a deal and more Native Americans don't care (far more) than do care.
3. This has nothing to do with offended Native Americans and more to do with extremist left wing agendas.
4. DC has much bigger issues to tackle than this side show.

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Old 06-18-2014, 10:06 AM   #27
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I still, in some context, use the word Negro. It's spanish. It means "black". I live around a bunch of Africans...actual I just came here from Africa...and some find that calling existing Negro's in this country African-Americans offensive. I find that interesting. I am also dating a woman from Mexico and that's the word she uses as well. Last I checked the UNCF was still taking donations. I guess my point is there are so many other reasons to dislike Harry Reid. This isn't one of them IMO.
If you wanted to use it as a Spanish word you should be pronouncing it correctly as well... Negro not Neegro and saying it with a bunch of other Spanish words, because you'd be speaking Spanish. Otherwise it's a bastardization and it's offensive. Blacks in this country do sometimes find African American as a term offensive because not all of them are from Africa. The best bet these days is to just use the word Black.
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Old 06-18-2014, 10:08 AM   #28
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The current congress is handcuffed by Republican majority, who are in 'do nothing' mode since there is a Democrat in the white house. Don't look for them to do anything.


Yeah, I think the writing is definitely on the wall now that they lose their trademark. They will be losing so much money if they keep using that trademark (name and logo) and money is the bottom line in the NFL so I look for them to find something new quite fast.
No they won't. And to the point, this is a waste of time for our government.
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Old 06-18-2014, 10:09 AM   #29
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This is almost certainly a leading indicator of the end of times. I really don't know how I can go on if the Washington football franchise isn't called the redskins.
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Old 06-18-2014, 10:21 AM   #30
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Actually, I'm not seeing exactly why this is huge news. Apparently the trademarks were cancelled by the Patent Office in 1999 as well, but the team got a judge to issue an injunction while the team appealed in court, which they can do this time as well.

Two separate appeals courts found in favor of the team in 2003 and 2009.

This new petition seems to satisfy the procedural issues raised by the courts who overturned the Patent Office ruling, but it still may mean a drawn out fight.

And then, even should the team lose there, they can fight for trademark protection on common-law grounds. Such rulings when the logo is found to be disparaging are normally found against the plaintiff, but it's been decades since similar fights have happened...so....
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Old 06-18-2014, 10:22 AM   #31
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I'm filing this one in the Official Jay Cutler Dooooon't Caaaare file.
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Old 06-18-2014, 10:42 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ View Post
1. It's a slippery slope when you "force" a team to change a long standing name.
2. It's simply not that big of a deal and more Native Americans don't care (far more) than do care.
3. This has nothing to do with offended Native Americans and more to do with extremist left wing agendas.
4. DC has much bigger issues to tackle than this side show.
1) Its not a slippery slope. its been done already. The fabric of St Johns University hasnt been ripped to shreds when they changed their name from the Redmen.

2) You dont speak for all native americans. Obviously it bothers a good amount of them. Who cares about a percentage.

3). This is retarded paranoid speak. It's about doing the right thing and showing tolerance. If this were the 1860s, would you be protecting slavery to protect against the "liberal agenda." And no, im not equating this to slavery, but what do you really care if the name is changed

4). Of course. But i doubt too much energy is really being expended. The only reason we keep hearing about it is because it involves the NFL. Congress has wasted their time with much worse.
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Old 06-18-2014, 10:56 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by SonOfLe-loLang View Post
1) Its not a slippery slope. its been done already. The fabric of St Johns University hasnt been ripped to shreds when they changed their name from the Redmen.

2) You dont speak for all native americans. Obviously it bothers a good amount of them. Who cares about a percentage.

3). This is retarded paranoid speak. It's about doing the right thing and showing tolerance. If this were the 1860s, would you be protecting slavery to protect against the "liberal agenda." And no, im not equating this to slavery, but what do you really care if the name is changed

4). Of course. But i doubt too much energy is really being expended. The only reason we keep hearing about it is because it involves the NFL. Congress has wasted their time with much worse.
1. It actually has NOT been done already. A government entity has not strong armed a private entity in a systematic way solely for the purpose of making them change their name. Never. St. John's et al were all done voluntarily, not by gov't action or mandate.

2. You don't speak for native americans, either, and neither do the Native American groups who claim to. This is why the percentages are irrelevant and why the market should determine the name, not a select percentage who seek to bully the issue. If a sufficient number of people are offended, they can vote with their wallets and explain why. Snyder's about money, so if he takes a hit from the supposedly large swath of offended, he will change it.

3. I don't care if the name is changed, I care about the fact that gov't seems to have it in its brain that it can force or mandate this change against the will of a proprietor. This isn't a restaurant not serving blacks, it's a name and nothing more. The government has overstepped its bounds by deliberately targeting this business by enacting things on it that it would not do on others equally. If you value equal protection under the law, then what the USPTO has done should offend you, regardless of the name change or not. You may think it's the right thing, others do not. Let the market decide.

4. Congress wastes its time all the time, that is a given. The red flag in all this is how arrogant it is to act on something in which it has no jurisdiction whatsoever.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:01 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SonOfLe-loLang View Post
1) Its not a slippery slope. its been done already. The fabric of St Johns University hasnt been ripped to shreds when they changed their name from the Redmen.

2) You dont speak for all native americans. Obviously it bothers a good amount of them. Who cares about a percentage.

3). This is retarded paranoid speak. It's about doing the right thing and showing tolerance. If this were the 1860s, would you be protecting slavery to protect against the "liberal agenda." And no, im not equating this to slavery, but what do you really care if the name is changed

4). Of course. But i doubt too much energy is really being expended. The only reason we keep hearing about it is because it involves the NFL. Congress has wasted their time with much worse.
Aaand you just lost all credibility with me.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:01 AM   #35
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1. It actually has NOT been done already. A government entity has not strong armed a private entity in a systematic way solely for the purpose of making them change their name. Never. St. John's et al were all done voluntarily, not by gov't action or mandate.

2. You don't speak for native americans, either, and neither do the Native American groups who claim to. This is why the percentages are irrelevant and why the market should determine the name, not a select percentage who seek to bully the issue. If a sufficient number of people are offended, they can vote with their wallets and explain why. Snyder's about money, so if he takes a hit from the supposedly large swath of offended, he will change it.

3. I don't care if the name is changed, I care about the fact that gov't seems to have it in its brain that it can force or mandate this change against the will of a proprietor. This isn't a restaurant not serving blacks, it's a name and nothing more. The government has overstepped its bounds by deliberately targeting this business by enacting things on it that it would not do on others equally. If you value equal protection under the law, then what the USPTO has done should offend you, regardless of the name change or not. You may think it's the right thing, others do not. Let the market decide.

4. Congress wastes its time all the time, that is a given. The red flag in all this is how arrogant it is to act on something in which it has no jurisdiction whatsoever.
1. The government is not forcing them to do anything. As many have already said, this isnt the first time THIS has even happened.

2. I still think its an inevitability and probably the right thing to do. I really don't care one way or another, but i dont see any native americans fighting for it to stay. My best guess is that the vast majority of them dont care either.

3. I dont think this is a market issue because its not a big enough issue to affect the markets one way or another.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:02 AM   #36
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Aaand you just lost all credibility with me.
You lost credibility with me once you claimed "liberal agenda.' I dont think anyone feels THAT strongly about this issue one way or another.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:03 AM   #37
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You lost credibility with me once you claimed "liberal agenda.' I dont think anyone feels THAT strongly about this issue one way or another.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:03 AM   #38
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When you systematically kill Native Americans, and the killer trades in the scalps of those murdered for Cash- the "redskin"- maybe its time to think about making a change- do we really want any part of that kind of awfulness, or support its usage to further remind Native Americans today of the decimation of theire people and culture?

While I don't like that Government would have a role forcing this change, it appears the owner of the team doesn't care enough to make the change for the right reasons. At the end of the Day, NFL fans should band together and force the name change- what saddens me is most of those fans don't care- but that is probably a sympton of being in the Preferred Demographic- myself included, but I'd like to see the name changed.

Is it a slippery slope? I don't know, maybe. But using the term has historical precedent for muder and brutality against other humans beings... to me, has few comparison that the PC crowd is pushing today, ie not calling people "Fat"

If there shoe were on the other foot, and the White Christian Killers were a team in LA, would people be defending the same free speech, and be afraid of the that slippery slope? Hyperbole in some sense, but think about it for a moment.....

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Old 06-18-2014, 11:06 AM   #39
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I guess my point to this thing is its just people being over sensitive. I'm White and I don't get all but hurt when someone call me White. I have never heard of a person being offended by being called black. It's the same damn thing. It's not like people are saying it in a disrespectful way, hell they have 70k fans go to a stadium and worship the name for gods sake.. Lets see a church come up with those numbers every Sunday.

If people don't get over this bull**** then we may as well just not talk to one and other any more.

Ridiculous waste of tax payers money.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:07 AM   #40
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When you systematically kill Native Americans, and the killer trades in the scalps of those murdered for Cash- the "redskin"- maybe its time to think about making a change- do we really want any part of that kind of awfulness, or support its usage to further remind Native Americans today of the decimation of theire people and culture?

While I don't like that Government would have a role forcing this change, it appears the owner of the team doesn't care enough to make the change for the right reasons. At the end of the Day, NFL fans should band together and force the name change- what saddens me is most of those fans don't care- but that is probably a sympton of being in the Preferred Demographic- myself included, but I'd like to see the name changed.

Is it a slippery slope? I don't know, maybe. But using the term has historical precedent for muder and brutality against other humans beings... to me, has few comparison that the PC crowd is pushing today, ie not calling people "Fat"
If Paula Deen uses slurs, the gov't does not have the right to confiscate her business or decide if she can be on TV anymore. The market should determine this based on viewers and active participants in the market (e.g. consumers and service providers). The same is true here. Whether the name is offensive is relative and many Native Americans don't consider it to be. If people determine that it is, they will likely stop buying Redskins stuff which would then determine Snyder's next move. If not, Snyder is not violating the law and should be left alone to run his business as he sees fit.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:11 AM   #41
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You lost credibility with me once you claimed "liberal agenda.' I dont think anyone feels THAT strongly about this issue one way or another.
The fact the govt feels the need to get involved with something no one cares about while everything else is falling apart is what bothers people.

The govt can't even do their own jobs right, and they want to tell someone else how to run/name their business?
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:12 AM   #42
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The uppity kneegrows.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:12 AM   #43
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If Paula Deen uses slurs, the gov't does not have the right to confiscate her business or decide if she can be on TV anymore. The market should determine this based on viewers and active participants in the market (e.g. consumers and service providers). The same is true here. Whether the name is offensive is relative and many Native Americans don't consider it to be. If people determine that it is, they will likely stop buying Redskins stuff which would then determine Snyder's next move. If not, Snyder is not violating the law and should be left alone to run his business as he sees fit.
I don't disagree. But the government by pulling the Patent doesn't have to condone it.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:13 AM   #44
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The uppity kneegrows.
you Raysis.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:13 AM   #45
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If the term Redskin is rooted in racism then it should be changed, but not forced to change by the government.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:19 AM   #46
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Every nickname better watch out now, if the Redskins change their name, then the Compton Tarbabes high school team better be next.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:22 AM   #47
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I don't disagree. But the government by pulling the Patent doesn't have to condone it.

Then we should expect to see the Blackhawks, Braves, and Indians also pulled? Betcha we don't.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:27 AM   #48
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I remember when Pekin (Il) HS was called the Chinks. That might not fly, now.

http://www.ccamuseum.org/index.php/e...-pekin-dragons
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:28 AM   #49
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They have no choice about changing the name now. Anyone can make and sell Redskins gear.
Actually since they use "Skins" and not redskins on a lot of their gear they can just get that copyrighted and sell it that way. Plus the logo itself is a artistic creation and is still a viable licensing product.

This changes nothing.
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Old 06-18-2014, 11:42 AM   #50
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Actually since they use "Skins" and not redskins on a lot of their gear they can just get that copyrighted and sell it that way. Plus the logo itself is a artistic creation and is still a viable licensing product.

This changes nothing.

I doubt that any derivations of the name are currently protected.

I also doubt that the Washington franchise is prepared to lose revenue to every joe blow who manufactures 'Redskins' gear.

The whole mess is of no consequence to me, personally.

Last edited by bombay; 06-18-2014 at 11:49 AM..
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