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Old 06-03-2014, 08:15 AM   #101
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Originally Posted by Jekyll15Hyde View Post
That's not the point. The VA has been **** up for a long time. This new thing is something he is wholly responsible for. No way to pass the buck here. Why trade a marginal story for a clearly bad one of which there is no escape (so far)?

And besides that... I dont recall anyone campaigning and comparing the VA (the only thing in the US healthcare system that looks like the single payer model) with what we got which is a path to allow the existing multi-payer, for-profit insurance model get more people on their doles. They arent really related at all.
If you are saying it's been ****ed up for a long time(which I agree) that means it just doesn't work no matter what. Govt cannot do it. And you should do some research on not knowing they compared the VA as an example of success. They are directly related because both are run by the same incompetence.

http://m.townhall.com/tipsheet/guybe...acare-n1841896



I derailed the thread a bit. Oops. I'll go Back to OP subject.

Last edited by Drunken.Broncoholic2; 06-03-2014 at 08:21 AM..
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Old 06-03-2014, 08:26 AM   #102
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The furious search for Sergeant Bergdahl, his critics say, led to the deaths of at least two soldiers and possibly six others in the area. Pentagon officials say those charges are unsubstantiated and are not supported by a review of a database of casualties in the Afghan war...
A review of the database of casualties in the Afghan war suggests that Sergeant Bergdahl's critics appear to be blaming him for every American soldier killed in Paktika Province in the four-month period that followed his disappearance.
Mr. Cornelison and Mr. Full both said they wanted to see Sergeant Bergdahl court-martialed as a deserter. "I'm not going to speak on the political, but I think that now that he's back, he needs to be held accountable," Mr. Full said.
Mr. Cornelison echoed Mr. Full. "I won't get into the politics, but now that he's back he needs to be held 100 percent accountable," he said. "For putting myself and 29 other people in my platoon in hell for 90 days."




http://gawker.com/who-are-the-gop-st...rgd-1585300923

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Old 06-03-2014, 08:31 AM   #103
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http://littlegreenfootballs.com/arti...ans_Necessary/

Y'all should make up your minds.
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Old 06-03-2014, 08:32 AM   #104
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Are there any soldiers who were there say any died trying to rescue? I haven't looked, but I'm believing the soldiers who were there right next to him and saw everything first hand.
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Old 06-03-2014, 08:38 AM   #105
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Are there any soldiers who were there say any died trying to rescue? I haven't looked, but I'm believing the soldiers who were there right next to him and saw everything first hand.
Who are now being propped up by the political right to gain points in an election year? What could possibly be their motivation?
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Old 06-03-2014, 08:42 AM   #106
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http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/joh.../18/id/553454/

"I would be inclined to support" the exchange for Bergdahl. -John McCain, Feb 14

http://www.politico.com/story/2014/0...#ixzz33YFIBqLf

"I would not have made this deal." -John McCain, June 2.
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Old 06-03-2014, 08:52 AM   #107
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Who are now being propped up by the political right to gain points in an election year? What could possibly be their motivation?
With all the **** that's happened over the last 2 years, they don't need any props to raise their points. I have zero faith in anything the WH or it's govt agencies say or do. That mirrors a lot of others in this country who until most recently did.
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Old 06-03-2014, 08:54 AM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheElusiveKyleOrton View Post
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/joh.../18/id/553454/

"I would be inclined to support" the exchange for Bergdahl. -John McCain, Feb 14

http://www.politico.com/story/2014/0...#ixzz33YFIBqLf

"I would not have made this deal." -John McCain, June 2.
On feb 14, did McCain know at what cost when he said that? 5 men for 1 seems ridiculous to me. 1 for 1. I notice that article states "a prisoner". Not "5 prisoners"
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Old 06-03-2014, 08:54 AM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheElusiveKyleOrton View Post
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/joh.../18/id/553454/

"I would be inclined to support" the exchange for Bergdahl. -John McCain, Feb 14

http://www.politico.com/story/2014/0...#ixzz33YFIBqLf

"I would not have made this deal." -John McCain, June 2.
You should probably read the actual articles you posted.

From the NewsMax article:

Quote:
McCain said his stance has changed only because the previous proposal was to release five "hard-core" Taliban leaders as a "confidence-building measure." The current proposal would be an actual exchange of prisoners.

"I would be inclined to support such a thing, depending on a lot of details," he said.
McCain's stance hasn't changed, he said he was opposed to trading Bergdahl for the Taliban 5. Which, BTW, is what the Taliban has been pushing for for years, and in the end is what the exchange turned out to be. He was opposed to it then, and he's still opposed to it.

So you either didn't read the initial article you posted, or you did, and flat out lied about what McCain's true position was.

Try again.

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Old 06-03-2014, 09:00 AM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drunken.Broncoholic2 View Post
Are there any soldiers who were there say any died trying to rescue? I haven't looked, but I'm believing the soldiers who were there right next to him and saw everything first hand.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-of-night.html

In response to Orton's claim they're now being propped up for political gain:

Quote:
After we redeployed, every member of my brigade combat team received an order that we were not allowed to discuss what happened to Bergdahl for fear of endangering him. He is safe, and now it is time to speak the truth.
They were required to sign non-disclosure agreements to not speak about what happened.
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:01 AM   #111
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Probably has to do with Obama wanting to show he really does care about the troops in regards to this VA scandal going on so can say "hey, I got a captured soldier back" though questions remain just how "captured" he was. Reportedly the Pentagon knew his whereabouts for awhile now, but took no more risks to get him since he was considered a "deserter." Also there is story that maybe as many as 14 soldiers were killed and others wounded trying to find this guy in the beginning.
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:02 AM   #112
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http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-of-night.html

In response to Orton's claim they're now being propped up for political gain:



They were required to sign non-disclosure agreements to not speak about what happened.
Thanks
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:03 AM   #113
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I don't think anyone knows what it's like to be a POW. Even if he was a deserter, he more than paid for his crime. I've been through low level SERE training...I couldn't imagine being a POW for 5 years!
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:04 AM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hercules Rockefeller View Post
http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-of-night.html

In response to Orton's claim they're now being propped up for political gain:



They were required to sign non-disclosure agreements to not speak about what happened.
Nothing this admin. does surprises me anymore and worse, they aren't held accountable for anything either and likely won't this time either, so they feel they have free reign to do whatever and the complicit media will ignore it for fear they have to report negative things about the guy they voted for and support.
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:08 AM   #115
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http://www.ijreview.com/2014/06/1439...owe-berghdahl/

James Rosen is reporting that Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl was under investigation by US intelligence agencies- not only during his final stretch of duty in Afghanistan, but also during his alleged captivity among the Taliban.
From Fox News:

A senior official confirms to Fox News that the conduct of Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl — both in his final stretch of active duty in Afghanistan and then, too, during his time when he lived among the Taliban — has been thoroughly investigated by the U.S. intelligence community and is the subject of “a major classified file.”
*
In conveying as much, the Defense Department source confirmed to Fox News that many within the intelligence community harbor serious outstanding concerns not only that Bergdahl may have been a deserter but that he may have been an active collaborator with the enemy.
Several important questions arise from this report:
Why did the Obama administration work so hard to release a man who is possibly a traitor, since intel agencies are investigating him for sympathies to the enemy? Plus, why did they agree to swap five Taliban commanders for his release?
Originally in 2010, the Defense Department believed that Berghdahl walked away from his unit, and it did not launch a major effort to find him. What circumstances changed?
Finally, given Bowe Bergdahl’s father’s history of controversial statements, e-mails, and online posts, whose decision was it to allow to him stand next to the president when the administration announced his son’s release?
The most important question: Is Bowe Bergdahl a hero or a traitor? Because with the “most transparent administration in history” at the helm, it’s anybody’s guess until the media starts putting together all the pieces…
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:12 AM   #116
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I still suspect alternate motives behind this whole story - and to be clear I certainly do not think that months of negociations were planned for a swap to clear the VA off the headlines.

The Taliban will be in control of Southern Afghan and Northern Pak - this is conceded by all parties. Opposing them(and in charge of Kabul) will be the old faction that made up the Northern Alliance that was crushed in the 90's by the Taliban. I would not be surprised if this is part of a larger plan to try and bring the Taliban into some semblance of governance within a larger Afghanistan - possibly as an autonomous region.
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:29 AM   #117
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Quote:
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I don't think anyone knows what it's like to be a POW. Even if he was a deserter, he more than paid for his crime. I've been through low level SERE training...I couldn't imagine being a POW for 5 years!
Okay, let's look at that angle.

Let's say a guy goes and robs a liquor store. On his way out, he slips on a discarded McDonald's wrapper, and falls headfirst through the glass front window. In the process, he severs arteries in his arm, and ends up losing the arm.

Would it be okay to say, "Almost none of us know what it's like to lose our right arm - this guy has been punished enough?"

No, losing his right arm was collateral damage from his own stupid, selfish decision.

Getting locked up for five years by a bunch of Taliban is collateral damage for Bergdahl's own stupid, selfish decision. If I am not mistaken, the punishment for desertion during war is up to the death penalty. He still should have some punishment coming his way.
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:31 AM   #118
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I don't think anyone knows what it's like to be a POW. Even if he was a deserter, he more than paid for his crime. I've been through low level SERE training...I couldn't imagine being a POW for 5 years!
Wrong. He deserted and when he is done being de-briefed he will, and should be court marshalled under the Uniformed Code of Military Justice (UCMJ). Then he can begin to pay the price for being a deserter. He has not, in my view, paid for this very serious crime. IMHO.
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:37 AM   #119
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At least we gave away some top terrorist generals in exchange for a borderline traitorous AWOL soldier. It reminds me of the ending of White Nights.
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:38 AM   #120
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At least we gave away some top terrorist generals in exchange for a general. It reminds me of the ending of White Nights.
obama is black so you're obviously a racist
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:52 AM   #121
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obama is black so you're obviously a racist
Nuh-uh, I watched the movie White Nights!
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:58 AM   #122
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One of if not all five of these guys will be responsible for the crashing of the missing MH370 plane into one of the new Freedom Towers. You just wait.

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Old 06-03-2014, 10:00 AM   #123
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http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/03/us...t.html?hp&_r=1

Apparently the dude even left a note saying he was deserting.

Hard to believe how mind-bendingly effed up this is. You could maybe believe they wanted to reel him in as a collaborator, but there's no way he was high level enough to justify the price we paid in terrorists we let go.

Not sure what the motive for this deal could've possibly been. Or was it so poorly constructed that the administration literally didn't ask the Army what the story was?
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Old 06-03-2014, 10:05 AM   #124
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Nuh-uh, I watched the movie White Nights!
(checking google....wiki...{facepalm}. God damn it )
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Old 06-03-2014, 10:21 AM   #125
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Viewing from the cheap seats...This is a complete FUBAR
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