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Old 04-16-2014, 11:20 PM   #1
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Default The ACA covering more people than first reported

Obamacare effects are bigger than expected, poll finds

New Gallup survey data suggest that about 12 million previously uninsured Americans have gained coverage since the fall.


http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...#ixzz2z7cUwt64



The newly insured also seem to reflect the nation's deep political divide over the health law; 54% are Democrats, while just 24% are Republicans.

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...#ixzz2z7cGXxje
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Old 04-16-2014, 11:21 PM   #2
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The best news about this is that Democrats are the ones taking advantage of this and getting healthcare. That means they will have insurance, be more healthy and live longer.
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Old 04-17-2014, 07:17 AM   #3
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As good a place as any to post this:

http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2014/...n-health-care/

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There’s simply no denying that the law has been rescued by an impressive post-fiasco operation that did to ACA-opponents what the Obama campaign did to the Clintons in 2008 and to Romney in 2012. Obama out-muscled the nay-sayers on the ground. I have a feeling that this has yet to fully sink in with the public, and when it does, the politics of this might change. (Since the law was pummeled at the get-go as something beyond the skills of the federal government to implement, its subsequent successful implementation would seem to me to do a lot to reverse the damage.) There are some signs that this is happening...
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Old 04-17-2014, 07:58 AM   #4
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As good a place as any to post this:

http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2014/...n-health-care/
Might be a little too late though. Can you imagine the havoc republicans will cause if they get the Senate?
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Old 04-17-2014, 08:16 AM   #5
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Just 12.9% of adults nationally lacked coverage in the first half of April, initial data from the Gallup-Healthways Well-Being Index indicate. That's the lowest rate since the survey began in 2008.
Eighteen percent were uninsured in the third quarter of 2013, just before Americans could start shopping for coverage on the new online marketplaces created by the law.
Wow talk about your shell game. They measure the low point from where all the Obamacare cancellations are in full swing and then count all the people returning to some form of coverage as 'gaining' coverage.

Oh and treating every medicaid enrollment as if it had anything to do with ACA. I wonder if it occurred to them that many people sign up for Medicaid every year, regardless of whatever the ACA did.

Anyway, this puts this whole shell game in easier-to-digest terms/



Statistically, we're basically back to where we were at the beginning of 2013 or 2011. It takes a special talent for data massage to look at all the upheaval from then to now and see substantial net benefit.

Prototypical proggie 'problem solving' though. Create the problem. Then take credit for 'solving' it.

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Old 04-17-2014, 08:33 AM   #6
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and those newly insured needing a hip replacement will now get a cane instead.
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Old 04-17-2014, 08:59 AM   #7
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Baja don't forget about the death panels
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Old 04-17-2014, 09:11 AM   #8
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Baja don't forget about the death panels
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Old 04-17-2014, 09:48 AM   #9
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FOX news?? They and Palin invented the 'death panels.'

What were the insurance companies who refused pre-existing conditions and took away coverage, mid treatment, from patients they deemed cost too much?

Weren't they the ultimate 'death panels?'
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Old 04-17-2014, 09:52 AM   #10
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FOX news?? They and Palin invented the 'death panels.'

What were the insurance companies who refused pre-existing conditions and took away coverage, mid treatment, from patients they deemed cost too much?

Weren't they the ultimate 'death panels?'
The statement came from Time’s Mark Halperin what difference does it make who's air waves it came over.
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Old 04-17-2014, 09:54 AM   #11
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What were the insurance companies who refused pre-existing conditions
They were doing insurance. What you're doing is redistributive refinancing.
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Old 04-17-2014, 09:57 AM   #12
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The statement came from Time’s Mark Halperin what difference does it make who's air waves it came over.
Agenda makes a difference.

It's the insurance companies who had/have death panels.

I'm not sure how the ACA implements 'rationing,' we barely understand the convoluted cluster****.
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Old 04-17-2014, 09:58 AM   #13
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They were doing insurance. What you're doing is redistributive refinancing.


Right, now it's my fault.
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Old 04-17-2014, 09:58 AM   #14
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Right, now it's my fault.
No. Just want to make sure you understand the difference between an insurance policy and a loan.
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:02 AM   #15
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Agenda makes a difference.

It's the insurance companies who had/have death panels.

I'm not sure how the ACA implements 'rationing,' we barely understand the convoluted cluster****.
That is exactly my point. Did you watch the short clip? The problem is who decides this all important 'rationing'. The greater problem is it will take 60 senate votes to repeal the law and after 2017 there is no recourse to repeal the law the way it is currently written. Watch the clip.
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:04 AM   #16
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No. Just want to make sure you understand the difference between an insurance policy and a loan.
Do you understand the difference between 'insurance' and 'denial of service'?
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:10 AM   #17
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That is exactly my point. Did you watch the short clip? The problem is who decides this all important 'rationing'. The greater problem is it will take 60 senate votes to repeal the law and after 2017 there is no recourse to repeal the law the way it is currently written. Watch the clip.
Are there provisions in Obamacare that allow government intervention of treatments, or are the insurance companies still doing that??

The point is simple. The insurance industry have made treatment decisions based upon cost for decades.

If they can 'deny service' by preventing treatment, that override the doctors/hospitals, then that's a 'death panel.'
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:12 AM   #18
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Do you understand the difference between 'insurance' and 'denial of service'?
Dear State Farm. I know you don't know me, because I've never done business with you. But recently my house has been diagnosed with terminal black mold due to a plumbing issue while I was away on vacation. I've been told the house will have to be demolished and rebuilt. Alas, I currently have no homeowners policy. The inspector said I should inquire with local banks to see what it would cost to get started on a rebuild. But it turns out they want me to pay for THE WHOLE THING! Anyway, I was hoping I could just sign up with you guys, since I heard you completely paid to rebuild that one dude's house when it burned down last year and he was only paying you like a couple hundred bucks a month. That's the plan I'd like to sign up for. Please let me know when I can start.

Sincerely,
Thomas J. Proggie
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:18 AM   #19
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Are there provisions in Obamacare that allow government intervention of treatments, or are the insurance companies still doing that??

The point is simple. The insurance industry have made treatment decisions based upon cost for decades.

If they can 'deny service' by preventing treatment, that override the doctors/hospitals, then that's a 'death panel.'
So your plan is to fix something that was broken by replacing it with an unknown that may well be more "broken" with no recourse to get rid of it?
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:23 AM   #20
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Nobody denies the need for health care reform. Obamacare is likely not the answer but the main issue is "We the People" will have no way to change what is yet unclear. Do you trust your government that much?
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:24 AM   #21
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Dear State Farm. I know you don't know me, because I've never done business with you. But recently my house has been diagnosed with terminal black mold due to a plumbing issue while I was away on vacation. I've been told the house will have to be demolished and rebuilt. Alas, I currently have no homeowners policy. The inspector said I should inquire with local banks to see what it would cost to get started on a rebuild. But it turns out they want me to pay for THE WHOLE THING! Anyway, I was hoping I could just sign up with you guys, since I heard you completely paid to rebuild that one dude's house when it burned down last year and he was only paying you like a couple hundred bucks a month. That's the plan I'd like to sign up for. Please let me know when I can start.

Sincerely,
Thomas J. Proggie
I didn't think you understood.

Denial of service is when, for instance' a cancer patient, who has paid premiums for years, is denied treatment because the insurance company deems it 'inappropriate' ie too expensive.

Your attempt at an analogy isn't in the ballpark. Denial of service happens after a patient has been insured and paid premiums.
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:25 AM   #22
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I didn't think you understood.

Denial of service is when, for instance' a cancer patient, who has paid premiums for years, is denied treatment because the insurance company deems it 'inappropriate' ie too expensive.

Your attempt at an analogy isn't in the ballpark. Denial of service happens after a patient has been insured and paid premiums.
You're the one who led off with pre-existing conditions. Something which by sheer definition can't be 'insured'

As for the rest, every type of insurance everywhere contains cost-containment schemes. Even (especially) if provided directly by the government.
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:27 AM   #23
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So your plan is to fix something that was broken by replacing it with an unknown that may well be more "broken" with no recourse to get rid of it?
Not my plan. Obamacare was passed in the middle of the night. I didn't understand it then, and sure as hell don;'t understand it now.

One thing I do know is that pre-existing conditions are no longer an issue.

That in itself helps millions. and will not be repealed.
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:28 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis;4093004[B
]You're the one who led off with pre-existing conditions. Something which by sheer definition can't be 'insured'[/B]

As for the rest, every type of insurance everywhere contains cost-containment schemes. Even (especially) if provided directly by the government.
Seriously, you're arguing something you don't understand.

Of course pre-existing conditions can and should be covered. Every healthcare system I know of covers them.

Now so does the US.
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Old 04-17-2014, 10:40 AM   #25
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Seriously, you're arguing something you don't understand.

Of course pre-existing conditions can and should be covered. Every healthcare system I know of covers them.

Now so does the US.
Lolz. An insurance company is not a "healthcare system"

To the extent that any of them (historically) 'covered' preexisting conditions they did so by collecting premium commensurate with the whole cost of treatment, plus an additional amount to cover future risk.

In other words, they financed (or excluded) the condition you brought with you and then insured the rest. Which means the only preexisting conditions they 'covered' were on behalf of people already capable of paying cash to treat it in the first place.

The only functional insurance-based system alternative would either have to be monopolistic, or assign known risks to a completely separate (likely subsidized) pool.

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