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Old 03-28-2014, 11:46 AM   #76
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My favorite part of capitalism is when the financial sector writes its own regulatory regime, bankrupts the country, steals billions in taxpayer dollars to pay themselves bonuses, and then allows the politicians to line up and kiss the oligarchs' rings in order to run for office. Yay democracy!
You're naive to think democrats don't do this.
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Old 03-28-2014, 11:51 AM   #77
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You know, Phil Gramm, the guy who got Glass/Steagle overturned? He retired from politics to become a VP at UBS Bank. Not even an American bank.
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Old 03-28-2014, 11:52 AM   #78
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Norway is the second wealthiest nation in the world.
1. Norway is BY FAR the largest exporter of oil per capita in the world, with their development of North Sea oil reserves coinciding with an explosion in oil prices worldwide.

2. Norway is the 5th largest oil producer in the world.

3. Norway has cut government spending drastically over the last 30 years as a percentage of GDP, now on par with the US, and far under Socialist countries like France.

4. Norway is the most heavily taxed advanced economy on the planet. Tax revenues are 57% of GDP. 75% of tax revenue is from the bottom 90% earners, making Norway a regressive tax system. The US is the most progressive tax system in the world.

5. Norway has a total population of about 4.7M people, greater than 90% of which are white Christian. Their population has been exploding with immigrants in the last 5 years, due to the wealth brought on by the oil boom.

6. Norway makes an average of $14k per year, per capita from oil.
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Old 03-28-2014, 11:53 AM   #79
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Yeah I don't think most Socialists are evil. But I think they are wrong and oblivious to how horrid some of their ideas are. They basically want to force anyone who doesn't think the way they do out of existence. I believe a socialist wet dream is the Borg from Star Trek, but with a twist where each Borg is a transgender bisexual minority who likes all musics and cultures of the world and judges none of them - and none of the Borg actually do anything. They just plug into the collective and listen to NPR, Nome Chomsky and Janeane Garafalo on a loop.
haha are you living in my head?

All kidding aside, people like me believe in a very simple tenet (though following is just spoken in ideals). The world is a very interconnected web, and all of us are constantly at the whim of luck and circumstance that are completely beyond our control. Considering we rely on each other for pretty much everything, it makes sense to fortify that collective to create a stronger greater good. Or as Pricejj says, a tyrannical a-hole looking to take advantage of alllll da guiiiiuzzzz

Also, I'd see true capitalists point more if we were all born with identical background, identical intelligence capacities, identical opportunities and so on. Now, Im not advocating we all should be equal or anything like that, but I do think we have an advanced enough society to support one another enough to provide a base so that disadvantaged people actually have a shot. I'm also someone who doesn't believe happiness comes from millions and billions, so I don't care if billionaires would have to pay high taxes so poor people don't get bankrupt if they want to go to college or break their foot or whatever.

Also, economically speaking, we're strongest when we have a healthy middle class, which we don't right now.
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Old 03-28-2014, 11:54 AM   #80
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You're naive to think democrats don't do this.
When did he say democrats are innocent?
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:00 PM   #81
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You're naive to think democrats don't do this.
Who says I don't? I think the entire U.S. government is rotten to its core. Hell, this week there was a report that Right Wing politicians are lining up to kiss Sheldon Adelman's ring. They have to have his money to run for office. If you can't pass the Koch Bros. litmus test, you don't run on the Right. The SCOTUS decided that corporations are people and the Bill of Rights applies to them. Corporations were against the law when the BOR was signed. Hillary should be wearing clothes with Wall Street logos on them. Her husband, Bubba, did more to ruin the lives of working people in America than just about anybody on the Right. Obama is a Wall Street stooge.

I think that, politically and economically, you should have a system that benefits the widest range of your populace. Seems like common sense to me. I think America has become, basically, just another banana republic.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:01 PM   #82
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When did he say democrats are innocent?
I find it hard to believe he's a conservative.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:02 PM   #83
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Who says I don't? I think the entire U.S. government is rotten to its core. Hell, this week there was a report that Right Wing politicians are lining up to kiss Sheldon Adelman's ring. They have to have his money to run for office. If you can't pass the Koch Bros. litmus test, you don't run on the Right. The SCOTUS decided that corporations are people and the Bill of Rights applies to them. Corporations were against the law when the BOR was signed. Hillary should be wearing clothes with Wall Street logos on them. Her husband, Bubba, did more to ruin the lives of working people in America than just about anybody on the Right. Obama is a Wall Street stooge.

I think that, politically and economically, you should have a system that benefits the widest range of your populace. Seems like common sense to me. I think America has become, basically, just another banana republic.


Or you can go straight to the gangs for money like democratic senator Leland Yee does.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:03 PM   #84
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My favorite part of capitalism is when the financial sector writes its own regulatory regime, bankrupts the country, steals billions in taxpayer dollars to pay themselves bonuses, and then allows the politicians to line up and kiss the oligarchs' rings in order to run for office. Yay democracy!
This post manages to "out-stupid" your "Buy Tesla" timing.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:03 PM   #85
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Not saying some people aren't more altruistic than others. Especially some whose ancestors have lived in the same region for 8,000 years, but the average Norwegian citizens pay heavily for it.

The average American citizen pays no federal income tax, and they get more handouts everyday. They are brainwashed to believe they are entitled to all this and more.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:04 PM   #86
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Or you can go straight to the gangs for money like democratic senator Leland Yee does.
What's the difference between that and Adelman? Or the Koch Bros.? Or Goldman Sachs?
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:10 PM   #87
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What's the difference between that and Adelman? Or the Koch Bros.? Or Goldman Sachs?
The difference between known murderers and Koch bros?? Do you know who shrimp boy chow is? Ask those innocent people who died in the golden dragon restaurant how they compare CEOs to killers.

And whose adelman? You mean adelson

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Old 03-28-2014, 12:12 PM   #88
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The difference between known murderers and Koch bros?? Do you know who shrimp boy chow is? Ask those innocent people who died in the golden dragon restaurant how they compare CEOs to killers.
Never heard of him.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:13 PM   #89
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The difference between known murderers and Koch bros?? Do you know who shrimp boy chow is? Ask those innocent people who died in the golden dragon restaurant how they compare CEOs to killers.
Id honestly argue theres not much difference. Scum is scum.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:16 PM   #90
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Id honestly argue theres not much difference. Scum is scum.
Someone who made money or someone who blatantly kills people.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:18 PM   #91
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Never heard of him.
Posing with Newsome.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:20 PM   #92
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Posing with Newsome.
Who's Newsome?
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:21 PM   #93
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This guy is a little lower on the level of a human being than the Kochs.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:22 PM   #94
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Who's Newsome?
the Lt governor of California. Former Mayor of SF.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:30 PM   #95
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You forget human nature, and the primary reason Communism/Socialism doesn't work. The average Socialist on the street envisions themselves as a taker, which in effect makes them a ruler, a slave driver of their fellow citizens.

Why work hard if you can enjoy a luxurious lifestyle without working hard? Most people won't. They will let others think, they will let others do the work. This becomes widespread economic inefficiency, debt, inflation, widening income gaps, a massive class of people where assets are out of reach, and eventually collapse.
I'm not forgetting the market. I understand all the consequences. I'm just saying I've met many socialism protagonists who mostly struggle with the inequality. Not even really their own. Just the divide from rich to poor in general. I think capitalists understand that while inequality (in outcomes) isn't ideal, it's also a necessary evil. Socialists and proggies tend to view inequality itself (in outcomes or anything else) as a core evil that should be stamped out.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:42 PM   #96
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How can the U.S. be more like Norway?

1. Reduce government spending
2. Institute a HEAVY federal income tax on lower wage earners who currently don't pay any FIT
3. Limit publicly funded healthcare to legal residents (except for acute care)
4. Drill for oil like there's no tomorrow
5. Create a sense of unity among the people


This is the EXACT OPPOSITE of the US Progressive Socialist agenda.

If you are a supporter of the US Progressive Socialist's then you have NOTHING in common with Norway.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:43 PM   #97
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I'm not forgetting the market. I understand all the consequences. I'm just saying I've met many socialism protagonists who mostly struggle with the inequality. Not even really their own. Just the divide from rich to poor in general. I think capitalists understand that while inequality (in outcomes) isn't ideal, it's also a necessary evil. Socialists and proggies tend to view inequality itself (in outcomes or anything else) as a core evil that should be stamped out.
There's a difference between normal inequality and hyper-inequality. Inequality like we have now matches 1928. http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank...st-since-1928/

It's a matter of survival. It's also a matter of history. Historically, when inequality reaches a certain tipping point, governments topple. You may think I would favor a Chavez type government, but I really wouldn't. I mean really, really wouldn't. The kind of inequality we have now leads to social unrest. I really wouldn't be surprised to see some American cities on fire this summer, like in the 60s. I'm a Teddy Roosevelt socialist. Stay away from the radical ****, on both sides of the spectrum. The problem now is that many on the Right think that things like SS are radical.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:44 PM   #98
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Norway is the second wealthiest nation in the world.
It's also got a population smaller than Metro Atlanta while being one of the world's top 5 exporters in both oil and nat. gas. It leads the developed world in per capita oil production.

It's a one-trick resource exploitation model that can't be taken seriously for a large-scale economic superpower. Especially from the green-at-any-cost left.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:48 PM   #99
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Sorry, I see Price already covered most of what I just said.
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:50 PM   #100
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I'm not forgetting the market. I understand all the consequences. I'm just saying I've met many socialism protagonists who mostly struggle with the inequality. Not even really their own. Just the divide from rich to poor in general. I think capitalists understand that while inequality (in outcomes) isn't ideal, it's also a necessary evil. Socialists and proggies tend to view inequality itself (in outcomes or anything else) as a core evil that should be stamped out.
Socialism creates inequality.

Unsustainable social welfare programs and government spending lead to deficits, which lead to inflation, which lead to a widening gap between the rich and the poor.

In the US, all people USED TO (for a brief amount of time) have equal rights and equal opportunity to pursue their dreams. The current Fascist takeover has driven asset prices out of reach for most, while usurping the rights of all, to benefit a select few.
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