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Old 09-27-2013, 05:55 AM   #276
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Originally Posted by Taco John View Post
You guys like to get busy in the business of personal attacks... Let's keep this on track.

Boehner is going for concessions here. He's got an opportunity to show the base that he, too, can be a fighter. What's more - he'll get practically anything he asks for at this point.

So the question is - provided there is no surprises in the Senate between now and then - what trophy does Boehner get to hand to Cruz for these efforts?

After some discussion and consideration, I'm thinking it will be something in this neighborhood:
  • A 6-12 month delay in the individual mandate
  • A repeal of the medical device tax

These two things would play very well broadly with the American public and make good talking points for Republicans for the 2014 referendum on Obamacare.
You are living in the Romney election bubble if you think that Obama or the Senate is going along with that. Obama has nothing to lose and the Democrats are going to use government shutdown like a hammer in the election if it occurs.
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Old 09-27-2013, 06:30 AM   #277
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Speaking of the bubble...

Quote:
...consumers of conservative media listen, watch and read people who presume to tell them what “America thinks” and what “Republicans want.” Someone like Cruz says he is the embodiment of American conservatism. Sometimes they present a true measure of the electorate. But a lot of the time they don’t (as I’ve frequently written on immigration). Taking all of it too seriously is a mistake. And it gives the base the idea that if you only speak and write clearly and loudly enough, America will accept a very, very conservative agenda. It just isn’t so.
Read the whole thing here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...-what-they-do/
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Old 09-27-2013, 07:17 AM   #278
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You are living in the Romney election bubble if you think that Obama or the Senate is going along with that. Obama has nothing to lose and the Democrats are going to use government shutdown like a hammer in the election if it occurs.
Yeah, they really want to make it look like they'd rather shut down the government than give Joe Six Pack a breather on the Individual Mandate. That'll sell well when the IRS starts handing out the fines and the rubes learn that it was only their Boss and Insurance companies that got a reprieve.
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Old 09-27-2013, 08:13 AM   #279
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You are living in the Romney election bubble if you think that Obama or the Senate is going along with that. Obama has nothing to lose and the Democrats are going to use government shutdown like a hammer in the election if it occurs.
I'm sorry, but this is the momentum of the situation right now. Of course I think that the Senate Dems will go along with it. These are Democrats we're talking about here. And really, they wont have any choice at that point.
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Old 09-27-2013, 08:42 AM   #280
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The GOP has become a laughing stock. At least Christie gets it.

Christie: It's 'irresponsible' to threaten a government shutdown

Washington (CNN) – New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie said he's not in favor of the Republican-led strategy to defund the federal health care law by tying it to a spending bill, a maneuver that risks a government shutdown if Congress doesn't reach a deal before the Tuesday deadline.

Asked in a CBS News interview if Republicans should be threatening a shutdown over Obamacare, the Republican governor said "no."



"I think there's got to be a solution other than that," he continued. "I think quite frankly, to be fair, I don't think you hear responsible Republican leaders advocating a shutdown of the government."

Christie is often mentioned as a potential 2016 Republican presidential candidate along with Sens. Ted Cruz, Rand Paul and Marco Rubio, who have all been at the front of the defund-Obamacare effort that could lead to a shutdown.

Some conservatives say they're not trying to shut down the government; rather, they say their plan keeps the government afloat. If the measure fails, it's the Democrats who are voting against it, they say.

But moderate Republicans in the Senate tend to argue the tactic is too dangerous. And Christie agrees.

"I think it's always irresponsible if you're running the government to be advocating for shutting it down," he said. "That by definition is a failure. You gotta work it out."

The governor, who's up for re-election in November, said he's confident Congress will "work it out" this weekend.

"I don't think anyone wants to go down that road," he said.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...own/?hpt=hp_c2
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Old 09-27-2013, 08:43 AM   #281
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"That crossed him"?

Please. No one is afraid of a first year senator with a 37% approval rating in his own state.
he wasn't even born here
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Old 09-27-2013, 08:59 AM   #282
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As a registered Independent, I do not appreciate the strategy the GOP is taking here.

I do believe that our health care system is broken. Something needs to be done. I also believe that Obama-care is a flawed compromise that at best is a bridge to something else. Better or not remains to be seen.

I say let the GOP shut the Gov. down and let the chips fall where they may. I'm getting sick and tired of this extortion crap. It will be dealt with at the polls next election.

I think it's pretty clear who will get the brunt of the blame.
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Old 09-27-2013, 09:08 AM   #283
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As a registered Independent, I do not appreciate the strategy the GOP is taking here.

I do believe that our health care system is broken. Something needs to be done. I also believe that Obama-care is a flawed compromise that at best is a bridge to something else. Better or not remains to be seen.

I say let the GOP shut the Gov. down and let the chips fall where they may. I'm getting sick and tired of this extortion crap. It will be dealt with at the polls next election.

I think it's pretty clear who will get the brunt of the blame.

The "extortion" is not going away. We operate our government on the brink just by the nature of how enormous it is, and how much debt we've accumulated. This is the new norm.

And yes, midterms will help sort this out. I wish the Democrats the best of luck, because everyone knows that midterms have been the Republicans playground. Obama voters don't come out for midterms, as we've seen already. We're about to get a republican house and a republican senate. What they do with it - that's another story...
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Old 09-27-2013, 09:13 AM   #284
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I'm sorry, but this is the momentum of the situation right now. Of course I think that the Senate Dems will go along with it. These are Democrats we're talking about here. And really, they wont have any choice at that point.
Yeah they do, they will allow the house to shut the government down to make a point and take the blame. You continue to think that Republican are unified and are in position of strength. They not.
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Old 09-27-2013, 09:17 AM   #285
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As a registered Independent, I do not appreciate the strategy the GOP is taking here. I do believe that our health care system is broken. Something needs to be done. I also believe that Obama-care is a flawed compromise that at best is a bridge to something else. Better or not remains to be seen.

I say let the GOP shut the Gov. down and let the chips fall where they may. I'm getting sick and tired of this extortion crap. It will be dealt with at the polls next election.

I think it's pretty clear who will get the brunt of the blame.
Sometimes you need to do the right thing and accept the consequences, it's like taking the keys from a drunk driver.
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Old 09-27-2013, 09:27 AM   #286
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Manchin doing that to play to the folks in WV. He is the same guy that ran an ad shooting the original bill when he was running for the Senator Byrd's seat. But he will vote with his party for CR and tell his folks that he wanted to ensure that WV got federal funds and continue forward.
And I'm sure Manchin is also quite aware of how weak Cruz and his antics are playing in his home state.

Quote:
Democrats aren't likely to win a Presidential race in West Virginia any time soon. But their best chance of it based on our polling right now is if Ted Cruz was the Republican candidate against Hillary Clinton in 2016. Cruz leads Clinton just 44/41 in a state that Mitt Romney won by 26 points last fall. The rest of the Republicans we tested all lead Clinton by much more substantive margins- 47/38 for Chris Christie, 49/39 for Rand Paul, 50/38 for Paul Ryan, and 52/38 for Jeb Bush.
http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/main/ted-cruz/

Now we'll get to hear how polls don't mean anything.

Dance, puppets!
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Old 09-27-2013, 09:28 AM   #287
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The "extortion" is not going away. We operate our government on the brink just by the nature of how enormous it is, and how much debt we've accumulated. This is the new norm.

And yes, midterms will help sort this out. I wish the Democrats the best of luck, because everyone knows that midterms have been the Republicans playground. Obama voters don't come out for midterms, as we've seen already. We're about to get a republican house and a republican senate. What they do with it - that's another story...
Sadly these extreme tactics will probably become the new norm.I'm sure the Demo's will pull the same **** their go around.

My Grandfather was the Chief Council to the U.S.(R) Senate for years. Was offered a Supreme court nomination but declined in favor of well earned retirement. Spent his whole life in the Federal meat grinder. He had some very interesting stories i can tell you. He'd be flabbergasted by what goes on now. I'm almost glad he's not here to see it.
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Old 09-27-2013, 09:33 AM   #288
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Sadly these extreme tactics will probably become the new norm.I'm sure the Demo's will pull the same **** their go around.

My Grandfather was the Chief Council to the U.S.(R) Senate for years. Was offered a Supreme court nomination but declined in favor of well earned retirement. Spent his whole life in the Federal meat grinder. He had some very interesting stories i can tell you. He'd be flabbergasted by what goes on now. I'm almost glad he's not here to see it.
Just curious. When every single Democrat in the Senate voted against raising the debt ceiling in 2006, were those 'extreme tactics?'

What's changed? I guess other than annual deficits probably being 3-4 times higher now?
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Old 09-27-2013, 09:38 AM   #289
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Yes, a different kind of B.S but still B.S.
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Old 09-27-2013, 09:40 AM   #290
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Yes, a different kind of B.S but still B.S.
Do you believe they would do any different if their roles were reversed again?

And you're overreading on the defund thing. Delay is where this is headed. And I think it's more likely than not, considering the Exchange train wreck that awaits next week.
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Old 09-27-2013, 10:28 AM   #291
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Ouch, the vote that Cruz took a stand for, the complicated one TJ has been attempting to explain, well Cruz just lost that 79-19. Wow! Not even a majority of Repbulicans stood with Calgary Cruz.
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Old 09-27-2013, 10:35 AM   #292
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Is the real issue the insurance we carry or perhaps the health problems of our nation?

Is more drug availability to the masses really the answer?
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Old 09-27-2013, 11:58 AM   #293
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I'm really excited to see how much $$ I'm going to save tuesday. Small business owners, rejoice!

Colorado is going to see the biggest savings of all the states, lucky for my family back home.

Last edited by Blart; 09-27-2013 at 12:01 PM..
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Old 09-27-2013, 12:03 PM   #294
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I'm really excited to see how much $$ I'm going to save tuesday. Small business owners, rejoice!

Colorado is going to see the biggest savings of all the states, lucky for my family back home.
Oh what a rude awakening you're in for.
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Old 09-27-2013, 12:04 PM   #295
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Oh what a rude awakening you're in for.
If it's not a savings, I'll stick with my current insurance. No big deal to me.


Also, think of this like November, 2012. Your sources of information paint a very different reality than mine. Sometimes that reality is tested.

Americans are going to save billions, period.

Last edited by Blart; 09-27-2013 at 12:10 PM..
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Old 09-27-2013, 12:09 PM   #296
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If it's not a savings, I'll stick with my current insurance. No big deal to me.


Also, think of this like November, 2012. Your sources of information paint a very different reality than mine. Sometimes that reality is tested.
Huh. I wonder if that's the same thinking that members of Congress have when they're called out for not signing up for the ACA exchanges.
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Old 09-27-2013, 12:10 PM   #297
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If it's not a savings, I'll stick with my current insurance. No big deal to me.


Also, think of this like November, 2012. Your sources of information paint a very different reality than mine. Sometimes that reality is tested.
http://www.mercurynews.com/politics-...-rates-country
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Old 09-27-2013, 12:16 PM   #298
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Also, I've already checked the estimates. I'd save about 20% on my plan alone.

http://laborcenter.berkeley.edu/heal...cy/calculator/

https://www.healthcare.gov/marketpla...ate=california

Overall Americans will save billions in premiums, and that's before rebates.


And the penalty everyone was worried about, for those who refuse to get insured? Between $0 and $95 per year, depending on income. The tyranny!

Last edited by Blart; 09-27-2013 at 12:21 PM..
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Old 09-27-2013, 12:22 PM   #299
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Ouch, the vote that Cruz took a stand for, the complicated one TJ has been attempting to explain, well Cruz just lost that 79-19. Wow! Not even a majority of Repbulicans stood with Calgary Cruz.
Even Cruz expected to lose that vote. This is no surprise. As I've said, this fight isn't really about Republicans vs. Democrats at this point. This is about the civil war happening in the Republican party...


Now it's in the house's hand where pressure is being put on Boehner:

Thursday, Cruz met again with House conservatives at a venue near the Capitol. According to one House member, the bicameral bloc talked deep into the night about the CR and how to pressure Boehner. At the top of the agenda: making a one-year delay of Obamacare a requirement for government funding, and to accept nothing less, should the defunding effort continue to unravel. There is fear the Boehner is resistant to making that demand as part of a CR, and conservatives discussed ways to force his hand.

Leadership sources, for their part, are startled by Cruz’s attempt to shape House strategy and work against the speaker. They knew he’d oppose Boehner’s playbook, but they didn’t expect him to huddle with conservatives and ask them to ignore it. So, Cruz’s meetings have made him a key House player, but they’ve worsened his already-fraught relationship with the leadership.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner...r-robert-costa
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Old 09-27-2013, 12:24 PM   #300
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We just got told in a company meeting our premiums are going up. Your welcome.
They've been going up every year since I can remember.
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