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Old 03-23-2014, 03:34 PM   #276
Mat'hir Uth Gan
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Think you're missing Pryor MUG, unless you deliberately left him out.
I have Pryor #45 on my board. I don't feel he controls the field like Dix does, and while his instincts are solid as an enforcer and he hits like a mack truck, I like several guys more as more complete safeties. Personally, pure strong safety prospects I devalue a little bit. They are taking the big hits out of the game, and you're left with a liability against the pass. I can appreciate the run defense aspect still, but that's a lower value requiring a less elite prospect.
A mid-2nd is about as high as I'm willing to invest in a SS.
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Old 03-23-2014, 03:41 PM   #277
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Actually, no. I like him better than most and I have seen interest in him from ARI and PHI. I would be surprised if he would be there in real life at 31. However, I was hoping he would be there in the OM mock as a steal! You took care of that for me though
Thanks, I feel better about the pick now. Philly needs corner help in a substantial way and I think Fuller was the best pick for them.
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Old 03-23-2014, 04:13 PM   #278
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Whats wrong with this guy?

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Old 03-23-2014, 04:14 PM   #279
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Whats wrong with this guy?

*Cyrus Kouandjio
teams worried about his knees
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Old 03-23-2014, 04:28 PM   #280
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My sleeper guy is de will Clarke.....I like him a lot. He is the goods.
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Old 03-23-2014, 04:46 PM   #281
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I love Ha-Ha. He to me is a guy who will roam the field and make it much harder to sling the ball around at will.
If you can draft him to a team with a great MLB it will be a sick defense.
I don't think Shazier is #5 nor better than Barr but I do think he is a top 20 talent.
For Shazier, I think he's a generational talent at LB. A true freak. The issue is that WLB isn't a premium position. It's not a neglected position either, it's in the middle. So, why I think he's an extremely rare talent, like what Aaron Curry was supposed to be, I'm not sure how high a WLB will be drafted in the deepest and most talented draft possibly ever. The earliest might be #5 to Oakland or #8 to Minnesota. I can't imagine he makes it out of the 1st Round though at worst.

I think he's definitely better than Barr. It's not really close. They do different things though, different positions. But in terms of production, leadership, and being pro ready from day 1, he's far ahead. He might even be ahead of Mack, but it's hard to tell because Mack dominates his crappy competition to silly degrees.
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Old 03-23-2014, 05:42 PM   #282
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Yeah MUGs back with his excellent college analysis. Always look forward to it. Question, do you see a JJ Watt type of guy in this draft (meaning a severely underrated player in your eyes). I still give you mad respect for saying you think Watt could be the best player in that draft when nobody said anything remotely close to such things.
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Old 03-23-2014, 05:48 PM   #283
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For Shazier, I think he's a generational talent at LB. A true freak. The issue is that WLB isn't a premium position. It's not a neglected position either, it's in the middle. So, why I think he's an extremely rare talent, like what Aaron Curry was supposed to be, I'm not sure how high a WLB will be drafted in the deepest and most talented draft possibly ever. The earliest might be #5 to Oakland or #8 to Minnesota. I can't imagine he makes it out of the 1st Round though at worst.

I think he's definitely better than Barr. It's not really close. They do different things though, different positions. But in terms of production, leadership, and being pro ready from day 1, he's far ahead. He might even be ahead of Mack, but it's hard to tell because Mack dominates his crappy competition to silly degrees.
I am speechless.
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Old 03-23-2014, 06:02 PM   #284
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Yeah MUGs back with his excellent college analysis. Always look forward to it. Question, do you see a JJ Watt type of guy in this draft (meaning a severely underrated player in your eyes). I still give you mad respect for saying you think Watt could be the best player in that draft when nobody said anything remotely close to such things.
Thanks! I take it you're from Mania then?

On the level of Watt? No. But there are quite a few I think are undervalued right now in the draft community. Ryan Shazier is underrated, and I think Kareem Martin is greatly underrated. There are a few other guys as well, but they haven't been drafted in our mock game yet, so keeping them under the vest for now.

But at the top of the draft, Shazier and Martin, I see as difference making talents that aren't necessarily being viewed as such. I expect Shazier to come in and make an impact like Kuechly did. I have Shazier ranked as the 5th best player in this draft, and it would not surprise me if he was the best defensive player from this draft a few years from now. Martin I think may take a year, but will come on very strong to be a dominating 43 DE, he's on another level physically than most DEs already in the NFL. Two more days until his Pro Day, and I expect the 1st round hype to start, not because he'll work out again, he won't except for the short shuttle and drill work, but because his name will be floated again. We'll see if I'm right or wrong on that.

In the 2nd round area, I have some guys I like considerably more than most, I'll be discussing them as they're picked, and I'll post my 33 - 64 board when everyone is gone. That actually may take a long while.
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Old 03-23-2014, 06:06 PM   #285
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Of course you name two players you drafted.

I think Martin sucks!
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Old 03-23-2014, 06:11 PM   #286
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Of course you name two players you drafted.
yeah, go figure he drafted guys he has a high grade on.
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Old 03-23-2014, 06:14 PM   #287
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yeah, go figure he drafted guys he has a high grade on.
Thanks for trolling!
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Old 03-24-2014, 08:19 AM   #288
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For Shazier, I think he's a generational talent at LB. A true freak. The issue is that WLB isn't a premium position. It's not a neglected position either, it's in the middle. So, why I think he's an extremely rare talent, like what Aaron Curry was supposed to be, I'm not sure how high a WLB will be drafted in the deepest and most talented draft possibly ever. The earliest might be #5 to Oakland or #8 to Minnesota. I can't imagine he makes it out of the 1st Round though at worst.

I think he's definitely better than Barr. It's not really close. They do different things though, different positions. But in terms of production, leadership, and being pro ready from day 1, he's far ahead. He might even be ahead of Mack, but it's hard to tell because Mack dominates his crappy competition to silly degrees.
I don't think Shazier will be drafted in the top 25 as a WLB, it will take someone who thinks they can put him at ILB/MLB to do that. Right now I see him as a perfect candidate to be picked with the top pick in round 2.
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Old 03-24-2014, 10:42 AM   #289
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Shazier's ceiling to me is around #24. I do not think even with the combine & 4.36 40 that he will ascend much higher than that.
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Old 03-24-2014, 10:45 AM   #290
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Originally Posted by Mat'hir Uth Gan View Post
Thanks! I take it you're from Mania then?

On the level of Watt? No. But there are quite a few I think are undervalued right now in the draft community. Ryan Shazier is underrated, and I think Kareem Martin is greatly underrated. There are a few other guys as well, but they haven't been drafted in our mock game yet, so keeping them under the vest for now.

But at the top of the draft, Shazier and Martin, I see as difference making talents that aren't necessarily being viewed as such. I expect Shazier to come in and make an impact like Kuechly did. I have Shazier ranked as the 5th best player in this draft, and it would not surprise me if he was the best defensive player from this draft a few years from now. Martin I think may take a year, but will come on very strong to be a dominating 43 DE, he's on another level physically than most DEs already in the NFL. Two more days until his Pro Day, and I expect the 1st round hype to start, not because he'll work out again, he won't except for the short shuttle and drill work, but because his name will be floated again. We'll see if I'm right or wrong on that.

In the 2nd round area, I have some guys I like considerably more than most, I'll be discussing them as they're picked, and I'll post my 33 - 64 board when everyone is gone. That actually may take a long while.
No, mostly from Broncos country and here (account got wiped). Anyways, thanks for the response. Looking forward to more of your thoughts as we get closer to the draft.
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Old 03-24-2014, 12:55 PM   #291
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Shazier's ceiling to me is around #24. I do not think even with the combine & 4.36 40 that he will ascend much higher than that.
Depends on how teams value WLB and team needs early in the draft. It is a deep draft, so that makes it more challenging. It was only two years ago that Kuechly went 9th, and I think Shazier is better all around. And it was four and five years ago that Aaron Curry and Keith Rivers went 4th and 9th overall. And I have Shazier as clearly better than both of them in every conceivable way.

I'll be really surprised if he goes as late as the 20s. I think he's the best OLB prospect since LaVar Arrington coming out.
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Old 03-24-2014, 12:57 PM   #292
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No, mostly from Broncos country and here (account got wiped). Anyways, thanks for the response. Looking forward to more of your thoughts as we get closer to the draft.
Same place. Broncomania became Broncos Country shortly before I was perma-banned about 3-4 years ago.

Add S Deone Bucannon to the list of guys greatly undervalued right now. He's going to rise as we get closer to the draft possibly into the 1st Round, and he's a complete, all-around safety.
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Old 03-24-2014, 01:10 PM   #293
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Depends on how teams value WLB and team needs early in the draft. It is a deep draft, so that makes it more challenging. It was only two years ago that Kuechly went 9th, and I think Shazier is better all around. And it was four and five years ago that Aaron Curry and Keith Rivers went 4th and 9th overall. And I have Shazier as clearly better than both of them in every conceivable way.

I'll be really surprised if he goes as late as the 20s. I think he's the best OLB prospect since LaVar Arrington coming out.
Kuechly was a clearcut MLB though, that gives additional value. Curry was in a weak ass draft class that really lacked blue chip talents, which makes LB more attractive since it is a position that is easier project. Rivers is the closest you get to Shazier, a pure WLB, and he really got overdrafted.
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Old 03-24-2014, 02:43 PM   #294
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Kuechly was a clearcut MLB though, that gives additional value. Curry was in a weak ass draft class that really lacked blue chip talents, which makes LB more attractive since it is a position that is easier project. Rivers is the closest you get to Shazier, a pure WLB, and he really got overdrafted.
Well, yes, and no. You have to remember, Kuechly was fairly small when he came out and was pretty close in size to Shazier. He also started at WILL his rookie year in Carolina, it was only after Beason got hurt that they had to move him inside. He flourished and he stayed there. If Beason hadn't gotten hurt, he might still be playing WILL.
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Old 03-24-2014, 02:59 PM   #295
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MUG- what do you think of the DE i like- will clarke?

If you cant say cuz the draft, you can always PM me or ignore this outright. I like him as a potential guy.....later round. But I dont evaluate guys like you and chris and the others do. So id like some input from those who do.
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Old 03-24-2014, 03:11 PM   #296
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MUG- what do you think of the DE i like- will clarke?

If you cant say cuz the draft, you can always PM me or ignore this outright. I like him as a potential guy.....later round. But I dont evaluate guys like you and chris and the others do. So id like some input from those who do.
I'll PM you.
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Old 03-24-2014, 05:01 PM   #297
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Depends on how teams value WLB and team needs early in the draft. It is a deep draft, so that makes it more challenging. It was only two years ago that Kuechly went 9th, and I think Shazier is better all around. And it was four and five years ago that Aaron Curry and Keith Rivers went 4th and 9th overall. And I have Shazier as clearly better than both of them in every conceivable way.

I'll be really surprised if he goes as late as the 20s. I think he's the best OLB prospect since LaVar Arrington coming out.
Luke K was a MLB. Shazier is a WLB or 3-4 ILB.
Not the same type of value and Shazier is not heady enough to run a defense.
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Old 03-24-2014, 05:04 PM   #298
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Old 03-24-2014, 05:10 PM   #299
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Luke K was a MLB. Shazier is a WLB or 3-4 ILB.
Not the same type of value and Shazier is not heady enough to run a defense.
As mentioned 3 posts prior, Kuechly was drafted as a WILL LB and started there. It was only until Beason tore his Achilles that Carolina was forced to move him inside. He wasn't just a MLB. He was a small, dynamic LB prospect that played that position at BC. NFL Teams had him all over the place due to his athleticism. And Shazier played MIKE at Ohio State at times. He was moved all over the place in college.

And, come on. Shazier's dad was a football coach. He's been raised to be the next big LB since he was born (literally). He's a film rat. He's smart enough to run any defense for any team any where. If you put him in the middle in a 43, you limit his ability off the edge though.

You have your opinion, and that's fine, but it's REALLY uninformed.
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Old 03-24-2014, 05:22 PM   #300
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To me Shazier is a perfect fit in Tampa Two defense as WLB. Dallas would be good fit for him if the stick with that defense.
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