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Old 07-02-2013, 02:39 PM   #151
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Yes, it does. You either didn't understand the testimony or else you're just making **** up. Which is it?
It's an opinion. I don't think the medical examiner, who is a employee of the state, really cahnged the defenses story. Which is Zimmerman was in fear for his life so he shot the kid.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:39 PM   #152
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It's relevant cause it contradicts zimmermans story.
I don't think so.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:43 PM   #153
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It's an opinion. I don't think the medical examiner, who is a employee of the state, really cahnged the defenses story. Which is Zimmerman was in fear for his life so he shot the kid.
is this really what you're resorting to to make your case? Lets release everyone currently in prison in the USA because the medical examiner is an employee of the state.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:44 PM   #154
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is this really what you're resorting to to make your case? Lets release everyone currently in prison in the USA because the medical examiner is an employee of the state.
Nah. As Cut said..the defense will probably call their own. It's very common. You can gather this from watching old episodes of Perry Mason.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:47 PM   #155
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Palm strikes are used by martial artists particularly to avoid the types of injuries that you're likely to get from trying to use a closed fist. Outside of a few very specific defensive techniques aimed at soft body targets ( including attacking the nose btw ) it's not taught.

It's not taught because it's not effective. Smacking someone with your palm can hurt a bit, especially if it's in the nose, but is not even remotely the type of thing that would cause any reasonable person (let alone a trained martial artist like Zimmerman apparently was) to fear for his life.

The reason you punch someone is to get maximum pressure. A proper punch applies all the force of the punch on your first and second knuckles which you align with your carpels and radius/ulna to translate the force into your wrist/arm without applying a transverse force on your carpels. Failing to do this properly results in broken knuckles/carpels and/or a broken/sprained wrist. The same force applied in a palm strike is around an order to two orders of magnitude less pressure. It's why you don't use it unless you're aiming at a soft target and/or your goal is to move the other person, not damage them.
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Old 07-02-2013, 04:42 PM   #156
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Not to mention the lack of any wounds on his hands, which were highly likely even if he was doing any serious punching. It takes a lot of time and effort to train and condition yourself to throw a serious punch (to a non soft target) without also hurting your hand to some degree (bruises, lacerations, broken bones, sprained wrists, etc).
Sup b****?

http://www.wftv.com/news/news/local/...uries-h/nN6gs/

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_1...-his-knuckles/

Last edited by errand; 07-02-2013 at 04:49 PM..
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Old 07-02-2013, 05:01 PM   #157
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776.012 Use of force in defense of person.—A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:
(1) He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or
(2) Under those circumstances permitted pursuant to s. 776.013.

This is what the Florida "stand your ground" law states.

For those who think Zimmerman will be sued if he is acquitted of 2nd degree murder....keep this in mind -

(3) The court shall award reasonable attorney’s fees, court costs, compensation for loss of income, and all expenses incurred by the defendant in defense of any civil action brought by a plaintiff if the court finds that the defendant is immune from prosecution as provided in subsection (1).
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Old 07-02-2013, 05:02 PM   #158
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I question if the prosecution ever really wanted to try this case or if they were forces to by political pressure. They aren't trying real hard to win it.
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Old 07-02-2013, 05:10 PM   #159
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I question if the prosecution ever really wanted to try this case or if they were forces to by political pressure. They aren't trying real hard to win it.
The investigating officer stated he believed Zimmerman's version of events...and felt there was no need to charge him.

But once the race baiters like Sharpton and Jackson got involved, along with the president stating that "If I had a son, he'd look like Trayvon..." it didn't take long before the district attorney bowed to political pressure to charge him.

I can understand some thinking that perhaps they charged him with 2nd degree murder because they knew they had a weak case, and if he is acquitted, then they could always say "Well, the legal system works"
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Old 07-02-2013, 05:13 PM   #160
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776.012 Use of force in defense of person.—A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other’s imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:
(1) He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or
(2) Under those circumstances permitted pursuant to s. 776.013.

This is what the Florida "stand your ground" law states.

For those who think Zimmerman will be sued if he is acquitted of 2nd degree murder....keep this in mind -

(3) The court shall award reasonable attorney’s fees, court costs, compensation for loss of income, and all expenses incurred by the defendant in defense of any civil action brought by a plaintiff if the court finds that the defendant is immune from prosecution as provided in subsection (1).
This case isn't being defended on the grounds of stand your ground. Probably because the people who wrote the law stated publicly that SYG didn't apply to zimmermans case.
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Old 07-02-2013, 08:18 PM   #161
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Sorry dumb ass, but the actual autopsy report indicates no wounds consistent with any sort of physical alternation on Martin's hands.

"According to Martin’s autopsy report, the young man died from a single gunshot wound to his chest. The autopsy will be a key piece of evidence in this trial, as both sides attempt to string together a timeline and explanation of the night for the jury. According to the report, other than the single gunshot wound, Martin had only one other injury on his body -- a small abrasion on his left ring finger below the knuckle."

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/06...martin-autopsy
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Old 07-02-2013, 08:47 PM   #162
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The judge could totally throw this case out if it wasn't a nationally televised circus right now.





Had Trayvon lived, he would have been charged with assault and battery. Zimmerman shouldn't have gotten out of the car and followed, but that's totally irrelevant. His head was being smashed into the concrete and he chose to defend himself in the best way possible. End of story. I cannot believe the absurdity this case has brought out of some people. I just watched a prosecutor say if they were given those pictures as a case, they would not press assault and battery. Is everyone out of their minds? In what looney tune world do we live in where injuries like that are used against the victim? In what looney tune world does the man who has zero evidence of racism in his life, but in fact has a history of helping his community including its black population, gets labeled a racist while the kid who literally described him using a racial epithet gets totally ignored? I'm surprised the prosecution thinks they should bring up Zimmerman's past, which has zero value to the case. All it's going to do is open another can of worms in Martin's own past. A past that shows him flashing guns, gangsigns, weed, and everything else that would signify the sort of person who would ambush and beat a man.

I was amazed in every sense of the word by the medical examiner's statements and the direction the prosecutor took with them. These injuries aren't severe, therefore ... what? It doesn't matter! If I took a swing at you with a baseball bat and missed, would you have any injuries at all? Nope! But would you feel threatened and perhaps compelled to defend yourself? Of course. This is such a low-point for American media, television, the justice system, racial tensions, all of it. Beyond silly. And much of the media's obfuscation of the facts is going to be directly culpable for the inevitable riots and violence that will follow a not guilty verdict. There's truly not a single piece of evidence one could use to say Zimmerman murdered this kid, but you wouldn't know that watching most T.V. stations.
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Old 07-02-2013, 08:55 PM   #163
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The medical examiner that testified today said there were wounds on Martins knuckles.
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Old 07-02-2013, 09:11 PM   #164
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The judge could totally throw this case out if it wasn't a nationally televised circus right now.





Had Trayvon lived, he would have been charged with assault and battery. Zimmerman shouldn't have gotten out of the car and followed, but that's totally irrelevant. His head was being smashed into the concrete and he chose to defend himself in the best way possible. End of story. I cannot believe the absurdity this case has brought out of some people. I just watched a prosecutor say if they were given those pictures as a case, they would not press assault and battery. Is everyone out of their minds? In what looney tune world do we live in where injuries like that are used against the victim? In what looney tune world does the man who has zero evidence of racism in his life, but in fact has a history of helping his community including its black population, gets labeled a racist while the kid who literally described him using a racial epithet gets totally ignored? I'm surprised the prosecution thinks they should bring up Zimmerman's past, which has zero value to the case. All it's going to do is open another can of worms in Martin's own past. A past that shows him flashing guns, gangsigns, weed, and everything else that would signify the sort of person who would ambush and beat a man.

I was amazed in every sense of the word by the medical examiner's statements and the direction the prosecutor took with them. These injuries aren't severe, therefore ... what? It doesn't matter! If I took a swing at you with a baseball bat and missed, would you have any at all? Nope! But would you feel threatened and perhaps compelled to defend yourself? Of course. This is such a low-point for American media, television, the justice system, racial tensions, all of it. Beyond silly. And much of the media's obfuscation of the facts is going to be directly culpable for the inevitable riots and violence that will follow a not guilty verdict. There's truly not a single piece of evidence one could use to say Zimmerman murdered this kid, but you wouldn't know that watching most T.V. stations.
So your obviously biased. You don't have your facts straight.
1. It doesn't mean **** what is in trayvon martins history,Zimmerman wouldn't have known at the time he decided to run after him. The relevant thing that would matter is that if he had a history of violence which he didn't.
2. I'm sorry that a couple scratches would make you run home crying to mommy,but that is what they were. Here's a little secret,cuts on the face will bleed more than any other part of the body.
3. Had trayvon lived Zimmerman would be signing a plea deal,let's not forget Zimmerman was the aggressor. If he were truly scared for his life he should've stayed in the truck. TBH, I'm still trying to figure out what is so scary about a can of ice tea & skittles.
4. Losing a fight that you provoke/start doesn't justify pulling out a gun and killing him.
You don't like the MEs testimony,tough,those are the facts of the case.
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Old 07-02-2013, 09:14 PM   #165
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The medical examiner that testified today said there were wounds on Martins knuckles.
Also testified that the injuries to Zimmerman were consistent with there being one punch thrown & that the injuries were insignificant, not at all life threatening.
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Old 07-02-2013, 09:26 PM   #166
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Also testified that the injuries to Zimmerman were consistent with there being one punch thrown & that the injuries were insignificant, not at all life threatening.
You're obviously biased.
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Old 07-02-2013, 09:45 PM   #167
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So your obviously biased. You don't have your facts straight.
1. It doesn't mean **** what is in trayvon martins history,Zimmerman wouldn't have known at the time he decided to run after him. The relevant thing that would matter is that if he had a history of violence which he didn't.
2. I'm sorry that a couple scratches would make you run home crying to mommy,but that is what they were. Here's a little secret,cuts on the face will bleed more than any other part of the body.
3. Had trayvon lived Zimmerman would be signing a plea deal,let's not forget Zimmerman was the aggressor. If he were truly scared for his life he should've stayed in the truck. TBH, I'm still trying to figure out what is so scary about a can of ice tea & skittles.
4. Losing a fight that you provoke/start doesn't justify pulling out a gun and killing him.
You don't like the MEs testimony,tough,those are the facts of the case.
I offered evidence of Martin's past given that the case is possibly going to discuss Zimmerman's past. That is only fair, is it not?

A couple of scratches? You don't bleed from the nose and the back of the head with a couple of scratches. Being punched in the back of the head is illegal in every single combat sport because it is the most vulnerable part of the entire body. You can die by being punched, you realize that, right? People have fallen against the concrete and literally died. Although your knowledge of the human body is simple, I assure you, injuries to the back of the skull are never a joke. Also, let me remind you, getting punched by an unacquainted person is not some random fight. You don't know when the fight will end. The severity of the injuries is irrelevant. Are you going to sit there and tell me Zimmerman should have waited until his brain was mush to defend himself?

Again, if I swung a baseball at you and missed, you'd have no injuries right? Well, from your argument, I wasn't even being aggressive because you were unharmed. Your injuries were less than "insignificant", they were nonexistent! Per your idiotic world perception, only after your face has been smashed in can you defend yourself.

Also, Zimmerman was not the initiator of the fight. Getting out of your car to follow someone is not illegal, nor is it considered physically aggressive in any way whatsoever. You can't just attack someone because you're suspicious of them. This isn't a court of morals, you ignorant moron, it's a court of law. The evidence -- and this has already been conceded by the way -- is that Trayvon doubled back and ambushed Zimmerman. This makes sense as Zimmerman was attacked heading back down the route he had just walked. He ended up on the ground with Trayvon on top of him. It also corroborates the evidence of the injuries of those involved.

The medical examiner's testimony was bad and the defense attorneys pretty much walked back every single thing she said. So yes, she didn't do a good job at all. And these weren't "facts of the case." The medical examiner was there to give her opinion on the severity of the injuries. Unfortunately, she gave a particularly bad one, and then corrected herself when pressed by the defense. Any medical practitioner in the world will tell you that having your head smacked against concrete is not good. There could have been no blood at all and it still could be serious.

And let me remind everyone that this case is for 2nd degree murder. That means they have to prove malice and intent to kill. Zimmerman had Trayvon in his sights but did not shoot him. A man on the phone with the cops is probably not going to be committing murder. When the cops interrogated Zimmerman they lied and said they had footage of the incident. What did Zimmerman say? Great! Let's see it. There's not a single shred of evidence that Zimmerman had the intention to kill this kid. But, ostensibly, for some, he had so much malice that he called the cops first, let himself get beat up, and called for help for a good minute before deciding oh yeah, my intention was to kill this individual. Lunacy.
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Old 07-03-2013, 01:11 AM   #168
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Sorry dumb ass, but the actual autopsy report indicates no wounds consistent with any sort of physical alternation on Martin's hands.

"According to Martin’s autopsy report, the young man died from a single gunshot wound to his chest. The autopsy will be a key piece of evidence in this trial, as both sides attempt to string together a timeline and explanation of the night for the jury. According to the report, other than the single gunshot wound, Martin had only one other injury on his body -- a small abrasion on his left ring finger below the knuckle."

http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/06...martin-autopsy

you are the dumbass that said there was no wound to his hand..... an abrasion is a wound.
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Old 07-03-2013, 04:30 AM   #169
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Also testified that the injuries to Zimmerman were consistent with there being one punch thrown & that the injuries were insignificant, not at all life threatening.
Yes but she also admitted she owes her job to the lady whose office is running the prosecution and invetigation of zimmerman. Then she also admitted it could be more then one punch and it was only her opinion.

The defense will call their own medical experts and the testimony will not be as damaging after that.
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Old 07-03-2013, 05:57 AM   #170
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He's the reality. Let's say Trayvon Martin were an armed 35 year old black man who ignored a 911 dispatcher and unjustly pursued an unarmed, teenaged Zimmerman, who was doing nothing more than walking home after buying a tea and some Skittles. Then the young Zimmerman, understandably feeling threatened by a perfect stranger following and harassing him for no reason, defends himself and kicks the older, armed Martin's ass. Martin then shoots and kills Zimmerman. errand, Garcia, et al wouldn't be defending Martin as having acted in self-defense then. No....they'd be telling us what a thug Martin is and demanding he be thrown under the jail. They'll deny it. They may even believe it. But they would.
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:07 AM   #171
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You didn't give the race of the teenager but changed assailant to black. Why is that?
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:08 AM   #172
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the facts the same regardless of race. It's hard for minorities to accept that because they have a chip on their shoulder. The country though bends over backwards for blacks to suggest otherwise is a joke.
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:09 AM   #173
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You didn't give the race of the teenager but changed assailant to black. Why is that?
Same as the real Zimmerman. Point is, not a "thuggish" black kid in a hoodie and baggy pants.
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:11 AM   #174
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Saying how it would be a big deal if races were reversed is a joke, it's only a big deal because the kid was young. Race doesn't matter IMO.

This is about an adult who shot a kid that was almost a man. That is why its big news. And because a concealed gun was involved which media loves right now.
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Old 07-03-2013, 06:13 AM   #175
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the facts the same regardless of race.
You're correct. It's clear (or should be) either way that the kid was the one in "self-defense" mode, and that the adult was the armed aggressor. The variance comes in the interpretation when the roles are switched around.

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It's hard for minorities to accept that because they have a chip on their shoulder. The country though bends over backwards for blacks to suggest otherwise is a joke.
You really believe that, don't you?
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