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Old 07-02-2013, 01:04 PM   #126
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Not to mention the lack of any wounds on his hands, which were highly likely even if he was doing any serious punching. It takes a lot of time and effort to train and condition yourself to throw a serious punch (to a non soft target) without also hurting your hand to some degree (bruises, lacerations, broken bones, sprained wrists, etc).
Also,there was no blood on the sidewalk.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:05 PM   #127
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The problem with all those little things is fights are hard to describe and the cops admit that. Then cops say they think he is truthful and the prosecution has to object to it. The judge unrang the bell by saying disregard that last answer as one witness not allowed to speculate on another witnesses truthfullness? Whatever not sure why judge sustained it but there is a saying in the legal world you can't really uynring the bell.

Time and again jurors admit that testimoney they were told to disregard still swayed them. It's impossible to unhear something or disregard it completely.

Zimmerman could say well i couldn't see well once the fight started. I thought it was his hand, or maybe he got hit after that, or the pavement caused all the wounds, who knows. Just saying the police are not helping the prosecution enough to remove reasonable doubt. Manslaughter probably already proved but they went against the police recommendation for manslaughter.

Who knows maybe the fact these officers are pro zimmerman is because they are pissed the DA made them look bad? the media made them look bad?

I've followed a lot of trials and honestly never say the police offer up goodies for the defense under prosecution direct examination. Usually they stick to the facts and give opinions showing guilt. Then maybe under cross examination the defense can pull out some goodies. Or maybe when defense calls their witnesses they get some police experts from outside the area to help them a bit. Usually you have to pay those ones though so it doesn't look great.

Just like when the doctor testified that the wounds were insignificant and not life threatening, maybe even from one punch. Then under cross she grudingly admitted it could have been more punches, but then added that is not her opinion. She was being very prosecution friendly. Then under cross defense pulls out that she owes her job and position in the govt to the person whose office is conducting the case. BOOM! her bias showed.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:07 PM   #128
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Yeah but in the end doesn't he say it was a struggle for his weapon? How many punches thrown before that may not matter once it gets to that point. They should have just sent this down the pike in a plea deal for manslaughter. He does some times, get out quick, over for family and they can get on with a wrongful death case. Too bad guy doesn't have any money though just don't see what they could get out of him. Maybe any money from a movie deal or something i don't know.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:08 PM   #129
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Police could have missed blood on the sidewalk. They don't seem to be that on top of this whole situation IMO.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:09 PM   #130
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The problem with all those little things is fights are hard to describe and the cops admit that. Then cops say they think he is truthful and the prosecution has to object to it. The judge unrang the bell by saying disregard that last answer as one witness not allowed to speculate on another witnesses truthfullness? Whatever not sure why judge sustained it but there is a saying in the legal world you can't really uynring the bell.

Time and again jurors admit that testimoney they were told to disregard still swayed them. It's impossible to unhear something or disregard it completely.

Zimmerman could say well i couldn't see well once the fight started. I thought it was his hand, or maybe he got hit after that, or the pavement caused all the wounds, who knows. Just saying the police are not helping the prosecution enough to remove reasonable doubt. Manslaughter probably already proved but they went against the police recommendation for manslaughter.

Who knows maybe the fact these officers are pro zimmerman is because they are pissed the DA made them look bad? the media made them look bad?

I've followed a lot of trials and honestly never say the police offer up goodies for the defense under prosecution direct examination. Usually they stick to the facts and give opinions showing guilt. Then maybe under cross examination the defense can pull out some goodies. Or maybe when defense calls their witnesses they get some police experts from outside the area to help them a bit. Usually you have to pay those ones though so it doesn't look great.

Just like when the doctor testified that the wounds were insignificant and not life threatening, maybe even from one punch. Then under cross she grudingly admitted it could have been more punches, but then added that is not her opinion. She was being very prosecution friendly. Then under cross defense pulls out that she owes her job and position in the govt to the person whose office is conducting the case. BOOM! her bias showed.
As many times as Zimmerman was supposedly punched there would've been some blood.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:12 PM   #131
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Another problem is that the medical examiners testimony goes against Zimmerman story. The MEs testimony is going to carry more weight than any witness.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:14 PM   #132
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Police could have missed blood on the sidewalk. They don't seem to be that on top of this whole situation IMO.
It's a good thing that a crime scene unit would've been on top of it.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:17 PM   #133
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Yeah but in the end doesn't he say it was a struggle for his weapon? How many punches thrown before that may not matter once it gets to that point. They should have just sent this down the pike in a plea deal for manslaughter. He does some times, get out quick, over for family and they can get on with a wrongful death case. Too bad guy doesn't have any money though just don't see what they could get out of him. Maybe any money from a movie deal or something i don't know.
There was never a struggle for his gun. The witness recanted and stated he "misheard" Zimmerman when he wrote his book.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:40 PM   #134
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Reporting on what a witness said is not the same thing as the media claiming Zimmerman was white.
Nah Bro. It was reported as such by the media over a year ago.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:41 PM   #135
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Another thing serino pointed out is that there was no blood on trayvon martins hands. Which is significant because Zimmerman claimed martin tried to suffocate him with hand. There's no way martin could not have gotten blood on his hands if that were true.
That's not true. All manner of things can happen.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:42 PM   #136
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Not to mention the lack of any wounds on his hands, which were highly likely even if he was doing any serious punching. It takes a lot of time and effort to train and condition yourself to throw a serious punch (to a non soft target) without also hurting your hand to some degree (bruises, lacerations, broken bones, sprained wrists, etc).
He could have been using and/or connecting with the butt of his palms. Really an irrelevant detail.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:42 PM   #137
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Another problem is that the medical examiners testimony goes against Zimmerman story. The MEs testimony is going to carry more weight than any witness.
No it doesn't, and maybe or maybe not.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:44 PM   #138
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The medical examiner hurt the defense pretty good but the police didn't at all. But the defense will call their own medical experts. Remember to this point its all prosecution and its all on them to prove without any reasonable doubt Zimmerman profiled him, followed him, chased him, lied about the fight and shot him. i just don't think its going to happen. The prosecution probably almost done. Witnesses, cops, medical experts all testified. i haven't seen a witness list but maybe only a few more days for them.

Then we will see how good Zimmermans defense is.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:45 PM   #139
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Nah Bro. It was reported as such by the media over a year ago.
Then it shouldn't be difficult to provide a concrete example. Hell, there may be one, but I'm just pointing out that barryr (and oftentimes you) like to make claims without backing them up with verifiable examples.

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Old 07-02-2013, 01:50 PM   #140
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No it doesn't
Yes, it does. You either didn't understand the testimony or else you're just making **** up. Which is it?
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:52 PM   #141
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That's not true. All manner of things can happen.
Well considering the amt of blood on zimmermans face,which the defense made so abundantly clear in the pictures they showed the jury, and the presentation the prosecutor made with serinos help made zimmermans story suspect.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:57 PM   #142
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He could have been using and/or connecting with the butt of his palms. Really an irrelevant detail.
Keep to the facts, martin according Zimmerman was punching not using his palm.either way there would've been blood on martins hands.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:08 PM   #143
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You can always count on barryr to not give any examples to back up his accusations. Making **** up, as always. Care to give us an example of the bolded?
Always can count on you to defend the liberal media while pretending you aren't one and neither are they. The liberals in the media tried to make this about race from the beginning, yet they did it with a latin guy killing a black one? Right. Keep hiding in your head in the sand or someplace else.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:09 PM   #144
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Always can count on you to defend the liberal media while pretending you aren't one and neither are they. The liberals in the media tried to make this about race from the beginning, yet they did it with a latin guy killing a black one? Right. Keep hiding in your head in the sand or someplace else.
Still nary an example. What a stunner

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Old 07-02-2013, 02:20 PM   #145
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Then it shouldn't be difficult to provide a concrete example. Hell, there may be one, but I'm just pointing out that barryr (and oftentimes you) like to make claims without backing them up with verifiable examples.
okay....lol.


http://news.yahoo.com/family-florida...044537742.html




ORLANDO, Florida (Reuters) - The family of a 17-year-old African-American boy shot to death last month in his gated Florida community by a white Neighborhood Watch captain wants to see the captain arrested, the family's lawyer said on Wednesday.

Trayvon Martin was shot dead after he took a break from watching NBA All-Star game television coverage to walk 10 minutes to a convenience store to buy snacks including Skittles candy requested by his 13-year-old brother, Chad, the family's lawyer Ben Crump said.

"He was a good kid," Crump said in an interview, adding that the family would issue a call for the Watch captain's arrest at a news conference on Thursday. "On his way home, a Neighborhood Watch loose cannon shot and killed him."

[Related: Fla. teen avoids deportation]

Trayvon, who lived in Miami with his mother, had been visiting his father and stepmother in a gated townhome community called The Retreat at Twin Lakes in Sanford, 20 miles north of Orlando.

As Trayvon returned to the townhome, Sanford police received a 911 call reporting a suspicious person.

Although names are blacked out on the police report, Crump and media reports at the time of the shooting identified the caller as George Zimmerman who is listed in the community's newsletter as the Neighborhood Watch captain.

Without waiting for police to arrive, Crump said, Zimmerman confronted Trayvon, who was on the sidewalk near his home. By the time police got there, Trayvon was dead of a single gunshot to the chest.

"What do the police find in his pocket? Skittles," Crump said. "A can of Arizona ice tea in his jacket pocket and Skittles in his front pocket for his brother Chad."

Zimmerman could not be reached for comment on Wednesday evening at a phone number listed for him on the community's newsletter.

Crump said the family was concerned that police might decide to consider the shooting as self defense, and that police have ignored the family's request for a copy of the original 911 call, which they think will shed light on the incidents.

"If the 911 protocol across the country held to form here, they told him not to get involved. He disobeyed that order," said Ryan Julison, a spokesman for the family.

"He (Zimmerman) didn't have to get out of his car," said Crump, who has prepared a public records lawsuit to file on Thursday if the family doesn't get the 911 tape. "If he never gets out of his car, there is no reason for self-defense. Trayvon only has skittles. He has the gun."

Since Trayvon, a high school junior who wanted to be a pilot, was black and Zimmerman is white, Crump said race is "the 600 pound elephant in the room."

"Why is this kid suspicious in the first place? I think a stereotype must have been placed on the kid," Crump said.

(Editing By Cynthia Johnston and Peter Bohan)
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:22 PM   #146
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^ Fair enough.

See how that works? Make a claim, back it up with actual evidence. Not a difficult concept.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:24 PM   #147
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Well considering the amt of blood on zimmermans face,which the defense made so abundantly clear in the pictures they showed the jury, and the presentation the prosecutor made with serinos help made zimmermans story suspect.
Nah...it's depends on when the blood bled, but again...irrelevant in the sense that Zimmerman though his life was in danger.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:29 PM   #148
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He could have been using and/or connecting with the butt of his palms. Really an irrelevant detail.
Striking someone with the palm (otherwise know as trying to push them away) is a defensive technique, and not all all consistent with the various claims of Zimmerman, et al.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:36 PM   #149
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There are a lot of "he could'ves" here.

This is where reasonable doubt comes in. The more instances the prosecution makes of "he could've" this or that, the easier they're making the jury's decision.
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Old 07-02-2013, 02:37 PM   #150
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He could have been using and/or connecting with the butt of his palms. Really an irrelevant detail.

It's relevant cause it contradicts zimmermans story.
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