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Old 05-04-2013, 06:46 PM   #176
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You could have the rape gene but also not act on it under your theory. Sorry but everything in life is a choice when it comes to your behavoir. Sexual preference is a choice and its our environment and personal experiences that make someone gay or that make someone a rapist.
And this is why something like a sports athlete coming out is still relevant. It's because there are people, such as yourself, who still feel this way. That being gay is equivalent to being a rapist, or anything that might be considered negative because you acquaint it with a behavior that is foreign to you.. A person is good regardless of his/her sexual orientation. Just like person can be bad regardless of that orientation.
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Old 05-04-2013, 06:48 PM   #177
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Homosexuality has been prevalent in the animal kingdom since forever. Nothing new here. Good for Collins. Considering the climate of the NBA and generally the African-American communities negative views on homosexuals, this was a very hard thing to do for him. It is great to see people being proactive and forward about it.

I'm sure the same people laughing at those calling him "brave" would have said the same thing about Rosa Parks when she stood up not only for her rights, but for all those who would follow in her footsteps when she refused to move on that bus.
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Old 05-04-2013, 06:53 PM   #178
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I agree with everything you said. But I want to add that even in nature, there are gay animals. So it is actually natural
you can argue genetic defects are a natural thing and will always occur to some %. I totally agree with that. i will also say just because your have the defect doesn't make you a bad person and you still should have all the chances in life a normal person has. Still though being gay will never be normal because it will always be a small % of the population.
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Old 05-04-2013, 07:03 PM   #179
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you can argue genetic defects are a natural thing and will always occur to some %. I totally agree with that. i will also say just because your have the defect doesn't make you a bad person and you still should have all the chances in life a normal person has. Still though being gay will never be normal because it will always be a small % of the population.
Gene mutation is extremely common and constantly occurring. Some mutations are beneficial, most are not. In the case of genetics/homosexuality, I think it would be hard to come up with good evidence citing homosexuality as a mutation of a gene and furthermore using that in a negative light trying to say it is a bad hting. On the other hand, it could be plausible that it is a unique "expression" of things linked to sexual orientation that obviously have root in genetics.
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Old 05-04-2013, 08:35 PM   #180
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1. you can argue genetic defects are a natural thing and will always occur to some %. I totally agree with that. i will also say just because your have the defect doesn't make you a bad person and you still should have all the chances in life a normal person has. 2. Still though being gay will never be normal because it will always be a small % of the population.

1. Genetic defects...like MS or hemophilia or brittle bone disease?

2. What is normal?

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Old 05-04-2013, 08:38 PM   #181
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2. What is normal?

curiously, it turns out that it is whatever those in power would like it to be.
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Old 05-04-2013, 08:39 PM   #182
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you can argue genetic defects are a natural thing and will always occur to some %. I totally agree with that. i will also say just because your have the defect doesn't make you a bad person and you still should have all the chances in life a normal person has. Still though being gay will never be normal because it will always be a small % of the population.
Like I mentioned earlier, I would argue that it's not a genetic defect. The main benefit is that it's a form of population control. Unless they go the invitro route, a gay couple will never have kids. And if they wanted kids, they can go the previously mentioned route or adopt. The latter in particular would be a great benefit since there are so many kids without parents in this country as well other places in the world. Unfortunately, not everyone can afford to adopt a million kids like Angelina.
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Old 05-04-2013, 08:40 PM   #183
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Being gay is not genetic. That is ridiculous. That would be the same as saying being a criminal is genetic, or being a rapist is genetic, or being a great person is genetic. No! things like that are environmental and social brought on by how you grow up and personal experiences. That doesn't make being gay something society should worry about though. No way any significant portion of us ever will be homosexual. Why? Because that sort of genetic defect could lead to diminshing births which runs counter to a species survival. Also if it is genetic, which I don't believe it is, then its a genetic defect. Being color blind is genetic also but it doesn't mean its normal to be colorblind. That would only mean that a certain % of genetic defects are normal in a species do to nature not always working 100%

So what environmental or experimental factors go into making someone gay?


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Old 05-04-2013, 08:41 PM   #184
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curiously, it turns out that it is whatever those in power would like it to be.

Seems to be the case.


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Old 05-04-2013, 08:41 PM   #185
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curiously, it turns out that it is whatever those in power would like it to be.
Or more accurately, whatever society decides to eventually accept and adapt into its culture. Then it's no longer progressive but the status quo. Interracial marriage being a relatively recent phenomenon. I say relatively since there's still some resistance to this in certain cultures and places around the world.
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Old 05-04-2013, 09:00 PM   #186
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So what environmental or experimental factors go into making someone gay?


Being a Chiefs' fan is obviously one possible match.

And sorry but if you can't figure out that you being guy is not normal, I don't know what to tell you. I am left handed and I know that isn't normal as we lefties are a small percentage compared to those weirdos that call themselves righties. It is all in percentages.
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Old 05-04-2013, 09:03 PM   #187
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Being a Chiefs' fan is obviously one possible match.

And sorry but if you can't figure out that you being guy is not normal, I don't know what to tell you. I am left handed and I know that isn't normal as we lefties are a small percentage compared to those weirdos that call themselves righties. It is all in percentages.

Normal is the ability to write, not the hand you write with.


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Old 05-04-2013, 09:16 PM   #188
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Normal is the ability to write, not the hand you write with.


I disagree. Here is the definitions:

Adjective
Conforming to a standard; usual, typical, or expected.
Noun
The usual, average, or typical state or condition.
Synonyms
adjective. regular - standard - ordinary - common - usual
noun. normality - normalcy - perpendicular


When I see someone writing or throwing left handed, it looks different. It is not normal to what I will normally see on a field or in a classroom. We are not commenting if it is wrong or right but if it is normal or abnormal. It is not normal to be gay. No one cares if someone comes out as a straight guy because we would assume someone is straight until told otherwise.

We can argue about it being being gay is wrong or right but one thing I would easily say is that it isn't normal behavior. Too small of a percentage of humans are gay.
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Old 05-04-2013, 09:41 PM   #189
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I disagree. Here is the definitions:

Adjective
Conforming to a standard; usual, typical, or expected.
Noun
The usual, average, or typical state or condition.
Synonyms
adjective. regular - standard - ordinary - common - usual
noun. normality - normalcy - perpendicular


When I see someone writing or throwing left handed, it looks different. It is not normal to what I will normally see on a field or in a classroom. We are not commenting if it is wrong or right but if it is normal or abnormal. It is not normal to be gay. No one cares if someone comes out as a straight guy because we would assume someone is straight until told otherwise.

We can argue about it being being gay is wrong or right but one thing I would easily say is that it isn't normal behavior. Too small of a percentage of humans are gay.
You have to ask yourself why you think that way. Homosexuality is not a new thing. It has existed forever and has been present throughout human history, so clearly its a norm for some people to be gay. Which then makes this "discussion" one of a societal influence. You feel it is abnormal because the people who raised you, who you hang out with and what you have been taught has told you it is abnormal to be left handed. Or gay. Or asexual.

Culturally we look to things that are the same as we are. Anything outside that comfort zone makes us ostracize it. Homosexuality is not outside the human range of sexual behavior, so it cannot be abnormal, no matter the size of the population that engages in it.

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Old 05-04-2013, 09:56 PM   #190
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I don't believe it to be choice,I have yet to meet any gay person that turned 18 & all of the sudden decided to be gay. All the friends I have that are gay say they've been gay for as long as they can remember.
so please explain this Jason Collins guy who obviously was attracted to women, and had sex with women...was even engaged to a woman....then he decided he was gay.
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Old 05-04-2013, 09:58 PM   #191
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there is quite a bit of a difference between "majority" and "normal." being left handed is a minority trait, but it is not an abnormal one. it was once considered to be abnormal. people attributed negative personality traits to lefties. they tried to tie lefthandedness to childhood trauma or abuse. people would try to correct left handed children.

I'm not making that up.

Eventually they stopped.
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Old 05-04-2013, 09:59 PM   #192
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so please explain this Jason Collins guy who obviously was attracted to women, and had sex with women...was even engaged to a woman....then he decided he was gay.
is it inconceivable to you that he hid his homosexuality from morons like you? or (even more likely) from himself?
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:01 PM   #193
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Tebow would be better off saying he is gay then that he loves god and is religious. The media scorches Tebow but if you suck some dick they love you.

.....yeah but like they say, you can paint a thousand pictures and never be called an artist, but you suck one dick, you're a f-aggo-t for life.
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:03 PM   #194
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so please explain this Jason Collins guy who obviously was attracted to women, and had sex with women...was even engaged to a woman....then he decided he was gay.
That's actually quite easy. It's the same reason why someone married to a woman turns out to be gay years down the line. They were living a lie and trying to be "normal" so society would accept them.

I'm pretty sure that this is true for a lot of people in the closet, especially those from strict religious backgrounds. You pretend and force yourself to be straight, hoping that by doing so you will turn out to be straight. But it's never as simple as that because that implies that someone can turn his/her sexual orientation on or off.
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:06 PM   #195
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is it inconceivable to you that he hid his homosexuality from morons like you? or (even more likely) from himself?
He doesn't need to hide his homosexuality from me...I've never once beat up or killed a homosexual. And how could he hide it from himself?

I don't agree with their lifestyle, but I also don't "hate" them. I don't care if he's gay.....I think it's a lifestyle choice....and lifestyle choice I disagree with.

But, keep trying to paint others into your template...
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:11 PM   #196
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He doesn't need to hide his homosexuality from me...I've never once beat up or killed a homosexual. And how could he hide it from himself?

I don't agree with their lifestyle, but I also don't "hate" them. I don't care if he's gay.....I think it's a lifestyle choice....and lifestyle choice I disagree with.

But, keep trying to paint others into your template...
You don't "hate" them, that's true. You just say things about them that come off ignorant and misguided especially with the use of the words like lifestyle and choice. No one likes to be treated with disdain or contempt because of a lack of understanding on certain people's part. But you're entitled to your opinions and beliefs just like that ESPN guy is entitled to his. It doesn't mean that what you both believe isn't wrong.
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:14 PM   #197
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Why would someone choose to be gay, especially someone who is married with kids?

It is beyond ridiculous to think that a straight man could get married, have some kids, then one day just starting thinking "this is boring, I think I will start sucking *****"

No one would ever do that
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:14 PM   #198
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That's actually quite easy. It's the same reason why someone married to a woman turns out to be gay years down the line. They were living a lie and trying to be "normal" so society would accept them.

I'm pretty sure that this is true for a lot of people in the closet, especially those from strict religious backgrounds. You pretend and force yourself to be straight, hoping that by doing so you will turn out to be straight. But it's never as simple as that because that implies that someone can turn his/her sexual orientation on or off.
So are people born to kill? and if they are born killers, then do they too fall under your "normal" theory?

It's been well documented that many serial killers held jobs, and blended in socially, some were respected members of their communities and kept their "secret" for long periods of time, basically until they got caught.
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:18 PM   #199
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Why would someone choose to be gay, especially someone who is married with kids?

It is beyond ridiculous to think that a straight man could get married, have some kids, then one day just starting thinking "this is boring, I think I will start sucking *****"

No one would ever do that
I dunno...I've met several lesbians who said they decided to be with women because they were "tired of men and their bull****"......which is puzzling because they dated pretty manly looking (butch) women.

If you're a woman who likes women, why would you be with a woman who looked and acted like a man?
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Old 05-04-2013, 10:21 PM   #200
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You don't "hate" them, that's true. You just say things about them that come off ignorant and misguided especially with the use of the words like lifestyle and choice. No one likes to be treated with disdain or contempt because of a lack of understanding on certain people's part. But you're entitled to your opinions and beliefs just like that ESPN guy is entitled to his. It doesn't mean that what you both believe isn't wrong.
It also doesn't mean we're wrong either......

Like I've said, I've known lesbian women who were married with children who after getting divorced decided they have had enough of men's "bull****" and decided to date women......and I can't recall any of them claiming they had always felt that way.
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