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Old 05-08-2013, 08:21 PM   #476
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Originally Posted by Drunken.Broncoholic View Post
It was a dumbed down offense that produced nothing in games but 3 and outs.
Agreed, it was not good. Very predictable.

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Those QBs you mention don't run anything like that. Theirs are more complex and requires accurate passing. Alex smith lost his job cause he couldn't throw it accurately. Kaep can.
The concepts have more in common than you're allowing.

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The offense changed not because tebow can succeed in a certain offense, it changed cause he couldn't run even the basic one. You call it the option spread or whatever, I call it the lumberjack cloud of dust.
The Denver version was indeed pretty bad. I would like to have seen what they could have come up with with enough time and a full off season install. It was a little bit on-the-fly.

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If you're suggesting tebow should get credit for the pistol offense then that's laughable.
No, I think I've been about as clear as I can be about that. It was a trend that was coming one way or another. No need to rehash.
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Old 05-09-2013, 06:17 AM   #477
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Agreed, it was not good. Very predictable.



The concepts have more in common than you're allowing.



The Denver version was indeed pretty bad. I would like to have seen what they could have come up with with enough time and a full off season install. It was a little bit on-the-fly.




No, I think I've been about as clear as I can be about that. It was a trend that was coming one way or another. No need to rehash.
It wouldn't have made much of a difference,tebow can't throw the ball. Denver ran that offense with tebow because that was the best tebow could do.

Last edited by peacepipe; 05-09-2013 at 06:20 AM..
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Old 05-09-2013, 08:32 AM   #478
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It wouldn't have made much of a difference,tebow can't throw the ball. Denver ran that offense with tebow because that was the best tebow could do.
Yep when he tried a normal offense he was god awful and Detroit blew Broncos off their home field. It's quite obvious there isn't one NFL coach currently coaching thqt thinks he can be a QB in this league or they would pick him up.
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Old 05-09-2013, 09:23 AM   #479
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It wouldn't have made much of a difference,tebow can't throw the ball. Denver ran that offense with tebow because that was the best tebow could do.
Lolz, yeah. Take a guy who made a record-breaking college living in Shotgun 4-5 wide and throw him under center, bunched formation with 2 wide, half the time without even a real TE. Makes total sense.

Say "See, we made us some sort of adjustment! That was obviously the best he ever coulda' done."

Mike McCoy was a moron. That part is indisputable.
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Old 05-09-2013, 09:33 AM   #480
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Mike McCoy isn't a moron. It's not his fault Tebow couldn't see the field and process coverage's fast enough to execute. And it's not his fault he inherited a QB who couldn't play.

Tebow couldn't throw under center and he couldn't throw in the shotgun either. He'd freeze and spin around and then run.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:05 AM   #481
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Mike McCoy isn't a moron. It's not his fault Tebow couldn't see the field and process coverage's fast enough to execute. And it's not his fault he inherited a QB who couldn't play.

Tebow couldn't throw under center and he couldn't throw in the shotgun either. He'd freeze and spin around and then run.
He often could throw when he was in shotgun, which you usually only saw at the end of games in desperation mode.

Why did we only see the style of offense Tebow was most familar (and successful) with late in the 4th quarter? And why is that when he obviously saw the most success?

Why were almost half of Tim's attempts and MORE than half of his passing yards gained in the 4th quarter? After we abandoned Mastermind McCoy's "optimized" Tebow offense, and ran the closest thing we ever ran to what Tim was comfortable with?

Seriously, is it possible to design an offense more dissimilar to what Tebow was used to? Short of pulling every WR and putting him under center with some sort of field-goal front I can't think of a way.

Shanny said he planned to run a lot more shotgun for RG3 (another college spread master) to make him comfortable. I guess McCoy decided he'd draw on his only real prior playcalling experience, probably from when he was once allowed to call plays in the huddle as the QB for the San Marin High Mustangs or something.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:12 AM   #482
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Not to steal TonyR's thunder (I keed, I keed amigo) but this is why I generally dislike IAOFM:

http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/bron...tebow-petition

And I say this as someone that is glad Tebow is gone, but enjoyed watching the playoff season with him here. Why some people cannot seem to just let this whole thing go is a joke, but IAOFM takes it to another level with their childish crap.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:14 AM   #483
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Lolz, yeah. Take a guy who made a record-breaking college living in Shotgun 4-5 wide and throw him under center, bunched formation with 2 wide, half the time without even a real TE. Makes total sense.

Say "See, we made us some sort of adjustment! That was obviously the best he ever coulda' done."

Mike McCoy was a moron. That part is indisputable.
Wow I can't believe you still argue against this. Tebow can't throw in the NFL from shotgun or under center thus is unemployed. That is what is indisputable. McCoy did a fantastic job of getting the most out of him. The fact you think he is an idiot even though he just got a HC gig shows how clueless you are.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:18 AM   #484
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It's amazing to see the length some of you are going just so you don't have to admit you lost the argument. It's like you've attached your whole self worth to it. Tebow can't play. You were wrong the whole time. Even the best coach in the game (Belichick) hates his game.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:21 AM   #485
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It wouldn't have made much of a difference,tebow can't throw the ball. Denver ran that offense with tebow because that was the best tebow could do.
Bingo.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:22 AM   #486
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Wow I can't believe you still argue against this. Tebow can't throw in the NFL from shotgun or under center thus is unemployed. That is what is indisputable. McCoy did a fantastic job of getting the most out of him. The fact you think he is an idiot even though he just got a HC gig shows how clueless you are.
Meh. Run up the middle for 2 yards on 3rd and 18 McCoy...

Fantastic job. McCoy. Not in same sentence, plz.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:25 AM   #487
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Not to steal TonyR's thunder (I keed, I keed amigo) but this is why I generally dislike IAOFM:

http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/bron...tebow-petition

And I say this as someone that is glad Tebow is gone, but enjoyed watching the playoff season with him here. Why some people cannot seem to just let this whole thing go is a joke, but IAOFM takes it to another level with their childish crap.
I'm not big on IAOFM. For one, they mostly repost stuff they find online and and add a lot of political drum beating which many people simply aren't interested in, such as this.

They do on occasion have some great analyses of plays and formations, though, but that's about it.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:28 AM   #488
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Meh. Run up the middle for 2 yards on 3rd and 18 McCoy...

Fantastic job. McCoy. Not in same sentence, plz.
What is more likely completion for a first down or fumble/int? It's obvious the coaches played the percentages and you can't deny it didn't work.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:33 AM   #489
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Wow I can't believe you still argue against this. Tebow can't throw in the NFL from shotgun or under center thus is unemployed. That is what is indisputable. McCoy did a fantastic job of getting the most out of him. The fact you think he is an idiot even though he just got a HC gig shows how clueless you are.
Fun stat of the day.

In 12 4th quarters in 2011 (When Mastermind McCoy's scheme got tossed to the curb) Tim Tebow threw for more yards than RG3 and Russel Wilson did in a full season's worth of 4th quarters last year. And he was only 100 yards shy of Luck (who also had 16 games)

If Tim Tebow literally can't throw a football, how are these slugs considered promising NFL QB's?

Last edited by BroncoBeavis; 05-09-2013 at 10:35 AM..
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:34 AM   #490
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Fun stat of the day.

In 12 4th quarters in 2011 (When Mastermind McCoy's scheme got tossed to the curb) Tim Tebow threw for more yards than RG3 and Russel Wilson did in 16 4th quarters last year. And he was only 100 yards shy of Luck (who also had 16 games)

If Tim Tebow literally can't throw a football, how are these slugs considered promising NFL QB's?
How many 4th Q ints did each of those QB's throw? What was their comp %?

Last edited by Eldorado; 05-09-2013 at 10:37 AM..
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:36 AM   #491
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Originally Posted by BroncoBeavis View Post
Fun stat of the day.

In 12 4th quarters in 2011 (When Mastermind McCoy's scheme got tossed to the curb) Tim Tebow threw for more yards than RG3 and Russel Wilson did in a full season's worth of 4th quarters last year. And he was only 100 yards shy of Luck (who also had 16 games)

If Tim Tebow literally can't throw a football, how are these slugs considered promising NFL QB's?
Here is another fun stat of the off season. He's looking for his 3rd team...and the phone isn't broken.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:39 AM   #492
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How many 4th Q ints did each of those QB's throw? What was there comp %?
Let's play that game.

Tell me which 4Q stat line is from the worst QB to ever play the game and which is from one of the most promising young studs in the league?

QBR Comp Att Pct Yards TD INT

75.3 87 163 53.4 1165 7 6
81.3 69 133 51.9 1068 6 4
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:47 AM   #493
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Let's play that game.

Tell me which 4Q stat line is from the worst QB to ever play the game and which is from one of the most promising young studs in the league?

QBR Comp Att Pct Yards TD INT

75.3 87 163 53.4 1165 7 6
81.3 69 133 51.9 1068 6 4
I would need to know the year for each of those lines to get relevant info out of it.
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:49 AM   #494
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Wow I can't believe you still argue against this. Tebow can't throw in the NFL from shotgun or under center thus is unemployed. That is what is indisputable. McCoy did a fantastic job of getting the most out of him. The fact you think he is an idiot even though he just got a HC gig shows how clueless you are.
You didnt know? All of Tebows throws from shotgun are right on target. And his throws from under center are way off. It's the formations fault!

This 4th quarter arguement has less to do with tebow throwing and more to do with the defenses that were on the field. I watched opposing defenses hold strong all game then in the 4th move to soft prevents. Tebow can't read defenses and having one back peddling in the 4th made it easier for him to see what was going on.

Last edited by Drunken.Broncoholic; 05-09-2013 at 10:53 AM..
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:54 AM   #495
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I would need to know the year for each of those lines to get relevant info out of it.
Tebow's is from 2011. The other is from 2012.

You should be able to tell which is which just by looking at how terrible one is vs the other though (or so I've been told )
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Old 05-09-2013, 10:56 AM   #496
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You didnt know? All of Tebows throws from shotgun are right on target. And his throws from under center are way off. It's the formations fault!

This 4th quarter arguement has less to do with tebow throwing and more to do with the defenses that were on the field. I watched opposing defenses hold strong all game then in the 4th move to soft prevents. Tebow can't read defenses and having one back peddling in the 4th made it easier for him to see what was going on.
Did you watch our offense at all? Did it change?

In reality your argument is an extension of the ol' "Garbage Time" argument. Except by definition, garbage time is supposed to go along with losing the actual games. Otherwise it's called "playing well to win it" Tebow is the only known exception to that practice.

Last edited by BroncoBeavis; 05-09-2013 at 11:03 AM..
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:01 AM   #497
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Did you watch our offense at all? Did it change?
You asking did it change in the 4th or after tebow started. In the 4th it adapted to softer defenses. A couple games the offense ran stronger, like the Viking game, but overall it was the same 3 and out results much of the games.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:05 AM   #498
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Tebow's is from 2011. The other is from 2012.

You should be able to tell which is which just by looking at how terrible one is vs the other though (or so I've been told )
Interesting. Lets eliminate the prevent defense effect:

4th quarter with the score +/- 7 points:

CMP ATT YDS CMP% AVG LNG TD INT SACK RAT
16 33 326 48.5 9.88 56 1 1 3 81.1
51 89 687 57.3 7.72 70 4 1 3 92.3
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:06 AM   #499
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Lolz, yeah. Take a guy who made a record-breaking college living in Shotgun 4-5 wide and throw him under center, bunched formation with 2 wide, half the time without even a real TE. Makes total sense.

Say "See, we made us some sort of adjustment! That was obviously the best he ever coulda' done."

Mike McCoy was a moron. That part is indisputable.
What tebow did in college means nothing except for where you get drafted,the NFL is a completely different animal.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:09 AM   #500
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You asking did it change in the 4th or after tebow started. In the 4th it adapted to softer defenses. A couple games the offense ran stronger, like the Viking game, but overall it was the same 3 and out results much of the games.
3 and outs under a decrepit remedial-high-school McCoy offense.

Another exercise. In 2011 44% of Tim's passing attempts came in the 4th quarter or OT. Can you find any QB in the league with anywhere near that kind of late game attempts ratio?

Just as a for instance, Luck threw a pretty proportional 26% of his passes in the 4th/OT.
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