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Old 04-14-2013, 10:58 PM   #76
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I beg to differ.

Doh!
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Old 04-15-2013, 01:08 AM   #77
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Maybe it's just me, but if I am gambling millions on a player, I don't "trade up" for a player with significant question marks. Moore's stock has fallen because of his interview process, and that should raise some warning flags right there.

If you want a pass rusher and he falls to #28, so be it, but don't trade up in the first round when a player's intelligence or ethic is in question. There should be at least 2-3 players available to us at "positions of need" with pick #28 - no need to gamble with other needed picks.
Damontre Moore was arrested for marijuana possesion in 2011, and he had a pretty bad combine, but bounced back well at his Pro Day. I can live with that. He's still the most productive DE in this draft class (at only 20 years old). I would give up a 4th, because I don't anticipate that there are any players who could get anywhere close to Dumervil's production at DE after the late 1st round in the draft. That doesn't mean that an All Pro DE isn't out there after the 1st round, but none of the other guys (except maybe Carradine) has shown that type of potential in college.

Drafting a guy like Lemonier (34 tackles, 5.5 sacks) in the 2nd or 3rd round wouldn't excite me at all. I doubt he's an upgrade from Ayers.

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Old 04-15-2013, 01:12 AM   #78
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Damontre Moore was arrested for
So who are you going to draft to replace Dumervil on the Broncos Superbowl run?
Good question . . .
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Old 04-15-2013, 01:34 AM   #79
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I agree with most of what your post states...accept...I really think after about pick 7-8....it's pretty equal talent all the way through the 50's.

That's fantastic for us! For example...Floyd will probably go top 5...but, I'd rather have Hankins in our system. We might be able to trade out of the 1st and still get Hankins. Really, just about every position is stacked up that way this year...with the exception of G/C maybe.
The bad news a lot of teams could want to move down. Good news is broncos sit well for a team wanting a QB but thinks they can't get him top of the 2nd round.

In any event the Broncos should be able to pick looking for a players who can play a lot this yr. Be that at rush linebacker/DE MLB Safety Rb DT and even TE could all maybe find a role this yr if they were like Wolfe/Miller and ready to play quickly.
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Old 04-15-2013, 01:42 AM   #80
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Sure there are a lot of needs on the Broncos. Finding an impact player who can start immediately at RDE is numero uno on that long list. Time is of the essence.

Don't give me Ayers, broke-d*ck Freeney, or some mid-level 3rd round draft pick. Give me a real threat, an impact player with Pro Bowl capability, who can step in immediately and create havoc. Yes it sucks the Broncos have to waste a draft pick, while having so many holes. Reality is a mother****er.

Von Miller knows his buddy D. Moore real well. He knows exactly what he's capable of, and all about his issues. I would be real surprised if the Broncos didn't pull the trigger on a draft day trade to acquire him if he's still there in the 20's. I'd still be surprised if Moore is still on the board past #19, so it's probably just a pipe dream.

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Old 04-15-2013, 01:45 AM   #81
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Ya I know Price we disagree on Dooms impact but whatever we will find out soon enough. I'm looking forward to getting more physical.
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Old 04-15-2013, 06:42 AM   #82
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Sure there are a lot of needs on the Broncos. Finding an impact player who can start immediately at RDE is numero uno on that long list. Time is of the essence.

Don't give me Ayers, broke-d*ck Freeney, or some mid-level 3rd round draft pick. Give me a real threat, an impact player with Pro Bowl capability, who can step in immediately and create havoc. Yes it sucks the Broncos have to waste a draft pick, while having so many holes. Reality is a mother****er.

Von Miller knows his buddy D. Moore real well. He knows exactly what he's capable of, and all about his issues. I would be real surprised if the Broncos didn't pull the trigger on a draft day trade to acquire him if he's still there in the 20's. I'd still be surprised if Moore is still on the board past #19, so it's probably just a pipe dream.
Every team from 1-27 would want a DE impact player with Pro Bowl capability,
Odds are he's not going to be there at #10, #20 or #28 so I'm not sure why you assume #28 has to be a DE and Reality is a mother****er.

So many holes? child please we just went 13-3 and the #1 seed in the AFC and added Welker

This kid is the truth

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Old 04-15-2013, 08:20 AM   #83
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Sure there are a lot of needs on the Broncos. Finding an impact player who can start immediately at RDE is numero uno on that long list. Time is of the essence.

Don't give me Ayers, broke-d*ck Freeney, or some mid-level 3rd round draft pick. Give me a real threat, an impact player with Pro Bowl capability, who can step in immediately and create havoc. Yes it sucks the Broncos have to waste a draft pick, while having so many holes. Reality is a mother****er.

Von Miller knows his buddy D. Moore real well. He knows exactly what he's capable of, and all about his issues. I would be real surprised if the Broncos didn't pull the trigger on a draft day trade to acquire him if he's still there in the 20's. I'd still be surprised if Moore is still on the board past #19, so it's probably just a pipe dream.
Broncos have so many holes? Whaaaat? The offense, aside from maybe a RB and Center upgrade, is pretty well set.
Defensively, DL, MLB and Secondary depth. Most teams really only have 1 elite pass rusher, and you think we need to get a Pro Bowl on the DL just to be considered a Super Bowl contender.

Honestly, even if we kept Dumervil, we probably were looking at drafting a DE. Why? Because Doom is getting up in age, his salary is huge, and more likely to get a young DE, pay him fraction of the salary and probably get adequate production still.
Von's going to make an average DE look good, a good DE look great, etc. Which is why I am not overly worried about the DL.
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Old 04-15-2013, 11:11 AM   #84
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Broncos have so many holes? Whaaaat? The offense, aside from maybe a RB and Center upgrade, is pretty well set.
Defensively, DL, MLB and Secondary depth.
1. Offense needs an RB to replace McGahee, which would save $5M in cap space over 2 years. Moreno is hurt again. Can't afford to pay Lance Ball $1.3M.

2. Nate Irving is an enigma at MLB. A complete unknown manning the middle. Hope he pans out.

3. Champ needs to be replaced in the 2014 offseason. Would be nice to groom a draft pick for a year.

4. Mike Adams is not an impact SS and can't stop TE's. Rahim Moore is walking on thin ice. He has 2013 to prove he is the answer at FS, or they will need to move on.

5. Prater sucks and makes WAY too much money. Please cut him yesterday and save $5M in cap room over the next two years.

6. Already know about DE. That's 5 starters that should be replaced THIS offseason. Too many holes.


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Most teams really only have 1 elite pass rusher, and you think we need to get a Pro Bowl on the DL just to be considered a Super Bowl contender.
Most SB contenders have multiple-pass rush threats at the DE position:
Ravens - Suggs, Kruger
Patriots - Jones, Ninkovic
Giants - JPP, Tuck, Umenyiora
Steelers - Harrison, Woodley
49'ers - Aldon and Justin Smith
Texans - Watt, Mercilus

The only reason the Broncos Defense has been able to dominate, is because of their NFL best pass-rush. If you don't replace Dumervil's talent, a lot of things change.
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Old 04-15-2013, 02:13 PM   #85
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There's one position on offense to be addressed as immediate need.. RB

On defense DE, MLB, S, with a long term CB and DT needed.

Long term answers can be players who can be addressed later in the draft and can be groomed, especially if they are small school stud types, or had issues that made them drop (health related). Or you can take BPA and improve your team overall short and long term, especially earlier in the draft.

While Irving is an unknown at MLB, Jackson and Beal at DE, Bolden at CB, these players have at least acclimated themselves to the play book, an NFL offseason, an NFL season, the speed of the game and are further along than a rookie. By using Free Agency, we took a potential long term CB, NT, maybe MLB. This rules out our Brass reaching in the draft to fill these voids..

You are being very dramatic with how weak and exposed we are in areas that I frankly don't see it.. And even if a RB, DE, DT, MLB, CB, S are needed we have as of right now 6 picks to address the need as you put it. Gosh if we trade up for Moore how will we ever fill all these holes?
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Old 04-15-2013, 02:21 PM   #86
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Jeremy Beal is not NFL material.
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Old 04-15-2013, 02:52 PM   #87
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Price

There's one position on offense to be addressed as immediate need.. RB

On defense DE, MLB, S, with a long term CB and DT needed.

Long term answers can be players who can be addressed later in the draft and can be groomed, especially if they are small school stud types, or had issues that made them drop (health related). Or you can take BPA and improve your team overall short and long term, especially earlier in the draft.

While Irving is an unknown at MLB, Jackson and Beal at DE, Bolden at CB, these players have at least acclimated themselves to the play book, an NFL offseason, an NFL season, the speed of the game and are further along than a rookie. By using Free Agency, we took a potential long term CB, NT, maybe MLB. This rules out our Brass reaching in the draft to fill these voids..

You are being very dramatic with how weak and exposed we are in areas that I frankly don't see it.. And even if a RB, DE, DT, MLB, CB, S are needed we have as of right now 6 picks to address the need as you put it. Gosh if we trade up for Moore how will we ever fill all these holes?
I'm with you that RB is a pressing need, but if you want to rebuild the running success that we had in the late 90's, it all starts with the O-line.

I know this may sound controversial because you aways have to make choices about what holes you have filled and what holes are most important. However, if you want to really look at a run-blocking weakness on our line, look at Left Guard. Zane Beadles did make the pro-bowl this year, but that is most realistically an issue with our passing game and "Manning effect."

I watched a bit of the Ravens playoff game the other day and it amazed me how little push Beadles generates on run plays. Even a beat-to-hell Kuper managed to blast defenders straight up, but i'm not sure Beadles will ever be an "elite" Guard talent. Nice pass blocker, nice at pulling, nice at "open field" blocks on second level defenders. However, he doesn't do a good job of handling first-level run blocks.

You want to fix the run game? Pick Larry Warford in round 2 and don't look back. Especially if you trade down in round 1 and have two round 2 picks.
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Old 04-15-2013, 03:24 PM   #88
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Warford most likely wont be available when we select in the second, man
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:33 PM   #89
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Warford most likely wont be available when we select in the second, man
Winters might be though.
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Old 04-15-2013, 04:48 PM   #90
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Winters might be though.
And Barrett Jones. I'd rather have the upgrade at center and let Beadles and Kuper fight it out for LG.
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Old 04-15-2013, 05:10 PM   #91
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Current NFL agent Peter Schaffer is reviewing the Doom situaltion

According to Shafer , Denver allowed Doom and his agent a week to gauge the market after the combine and told his agent they would be willing to pay him $8MM but he was not valued by the team at $12 MM. The agent could not find another team even close to $8MM and Peter believes the agent played a game of chicken with the Broncos at the dealine


Believe who you want but this guy is in the NFL's inner circle without being in Doom's inner circle.

Not sure if the money is correct but Broncos offer before faxgate was 3 year 24. After the faxgate , 3 years 17MM in Balt. Denver offerred 3 years $18MM

In his opinion, a bad move by Doom. He would have made more money in Denver and a team leader
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Old 04-15-2013, 05:25 PM   #92
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Warford most likely wont be available when we select in the second, man
My last sentence references a trade down out of round one. Part of that assumption is that the new second rounder would be a higher pick than ours. Once again, i'm not saying that's our team goal, but it's definitely how I would go about establishing a "dominant" run game. It all starts with bad ass guards.
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Old 04-15-2013, 09:03 PM   #93
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1. Offense needs an RB to replace McGahee, which would save $5M in cap space over 2 years. Moreno is hurt again. Can't afford to pay Lance Ball $1.3M.
I don't know what you've heard, but actually finding a RB is incredibly easy these days. I think Hillman will end up being a solid 1B for us, and finding another RB to complement him if Moreno/McGahee can't go won't be hard.
Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me to see the team roll with McGahee/Moreno/Hillman this year and probably cut McGahee for next year.

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2. Nate Irving is an enigma at MLB. A complete unknown manning the middle. Hope he pans out.
Yes, he is an unknown, which is why it wouldn't surprise me to see us draft a MLB.

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3. Champ needs to be replaced in the 2014 offseason. Would be nice to groom a draft pick for a year.
Yes, Champ is getting up there and nearing the end of his amazing career. Each season I say he needs to move to FS, but it doesn't seem like that will happen. As for grooming his replacement, wouldn't hurt to see how Rodgers-Cromartie plays for us, how Bolden develops. Don't always have to look elsewhere when the answer could be right in front of you.

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4. Mike Adams is not an impact SS and can't stop TE's. Rahim Moore is walking on thin ice. He has 2013 to prove he is the answer at FS, or they will need to move on.
You don't need an impact player at every position. Honestly, I thought Adams performed okay last year, which is important. Is he great? No, its hard to have great players at each position though/

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5. Prater sucks and makes WAY too much money. Please cut him yesterday and save $5M in cap room over the next two years.
I am not as down on Prater as some people are. Also, you keep on bringing up cutting guys to save cap. It costs money to replace these guys you know.

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6. Already know about DE. That's 5 starters that should be replaced THIS offseason. Too many holes.
So in your world, we need to replace 5 starters on a team that just went 13-3, dominated opponents, lost on a "fluky" playoff game by 3 points in OT to the eventual Super Bowl Champs. Gotcha. Didn't know this was such a terrible team with so many sucky players.




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Most SB contenders have multiple-pass rush threats at the DE position:
Ravens - Suggs, Kruger
Patriots - Jones, Ninkovic
Giants - JPP, Tuck, Umenyiora
Steelers - Harrison, Woodley
49'ers - Aldon and Justin Smith
Texans - Watt, Mercilus

The only reason the Broncos Defense has been able to dominate, is because of their NFL best pass-rush. If you don't replace Dumervil's talent, a lot of things change.
The Ravens defense was terrible last year, and played okay enough at times to eventually win the Super Bowl. They almost blew what, a 20 something point lead in the Super Bowl?
If you have an ELITE pass rusher, you can easily devise a scheme to wreak havoc even if you don't have a true huge pass rushing threat elsewhere.
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Old 04-15-2013, 09:14 PM   #94
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My last sentence references a trade down out of round one. Part of that assumption is that the new second rounder would be a higher pick than ours. Once again, i'm not saying that's our team goal, but it's definitely how I would go about establishing a "dominant" run game. It all starts with bad ass guards.
I think Beadles is average myself, and instead of Warford, would prefer a healthy Kuper at Guard. Beadles would be a nice back-up guard. If Blake lived up to his potential I would love to see an OLine of Clady, Vasquez, Blake, Kuper, Franklin.
Walton, Beadles, Clark, and another Tackle through the draft would be ideal.

That's a power move right there. While Vasquez is a good run blocking guard, he's very good in pass protection, and is a little more athletic than Kuper. So leave Kuper at RG. That's a nasty OLine.
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Old 04-15-2013, 09:15 PM   #95
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Jeremy Beal is not NFL material.
Do you remember why he plummeted in the draft?
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Old 04-15-2013, 09:20 PM   #96
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Do you remember why he plummeted in the draft?
Pretty much all of this.....

Oklahoma's Jeremy Beal was the Big 12's defensive lineman of the year. He led the conference in tackles for loss with 19.5. He finished the season with nine sacks and had 29 for his career. He was the first player in OU history to accumulate at least 8.5 sacks in three different seasons. His list of accomplishments while playing for one of the best teams in the country goes on, and on, and on........

Jeremy_BealWith all the accolades, you would think he'd be a sure-fire first round pick in the upcoming NFL draft. But that appears to be anything but the case as his stock has continued to slide since the Sooners capped their Big 12 championship season with a victory in the Fiesta Bowl.

First there was the Senior Bowl

2011 SENIOR BOWL FALLER: Jeremy Beal, DE, Oklahoma: Lacking explosiveness off the snap and the strength to push tackles into the pocket, this Sooner superstar may have been exposed as a high-motor player with limited athleticism and upside. - NFLDraftScout.com

He was very productive in college, but that appears to have to do with going against weak tackles and his ability to anticipate the snap. - NFL Draft101

It wasn't all negative, however, as there were a few positive reports coming out of Mobile, as well.

When asked to pin his ears back and go get the QB, Beal can do just that with power, speed and a variety of moves off the edge. But what scouts undoubtedly liked the most from him Wednesday was the way he stayed disciplined and didn't over-pursue the ball, which allowed him to make a few tackles against the option-read plays the offense was throwing at him.- Scout.com

Beal followed up his Senior Bowl performance with a showing at the NFL combine that most believed was less than impressive.

Iíve received a lot of e-mails from readers asking why I have Oklahoma DE Jeremy Beal listed as a free agent on our rankings. Well, in my view heís simply not a very good athlete or natural pass rusher and Monday proved that. He posted a 5.0-plus 40 time, was stiff and tight hipped during linebacker drills and I just donít see him having the ability to consistently create pressure off the edge at the next level. - Wes Bunting, National Football Post

Well, that's not exactly a ringing endorsement for one of the Big 12's best defenders. Beal certainly wasn't helped by a 40 time that was in the 5.1 range, especially considering most experts believe that at 6'2" and 268 pounds he isn't big enough to play defensive end and will have to move to the outside linebacker position. NFLdraftscout.com even has him listed currently as an inside linebacker.

Beal is going to be an interesting case study on what a team considers to be the most important factor when drafting a player. Turn on the game tape and you will find at worst, a very productive player and at best, a dominate force who spent a lot of his time on the field tackling people behind the line of scrimmage. On the other hand, he just flat out didn't test very well when it came to the drills at the combine, leaving some to believe he won't even get drafted.

On Tuesday, Beal worked out again for the pro scouts at the Pro Day in Norman. He went through a few of the combine tests while also taking part in the position drills. After the workout, Beal probably said it best, "I'm a football player. Football is what I do." Now all he has to do it find a team that believes it. After all, it'll only take one team to see what he accomplished on the field means more than the 4.41 seconds it took him to run around three cones wearing no pads. I don't know, seems like he's worth the chance to me.

http://turfburner.com/the-feed/item/...-the-nfl-draft


Looking at his college stats, we should be fine with him replacing Doom.
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Old 04-15-2013, 11:40 PM   #97
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Price

There's one position on offense to be addressed as immediate need.. RB

On defense DE, MLB, S, with a long term CB and DT needed.

Long term answers can be players who can be addressed later in the draft and can be groomed, especially if they are small school stud types, or had issues that made them drop (health related). Or you can take BPA and improve your team overall short and long term, especially earlier in the draft.

While Irving is an unknown at MLB, Jackson and Beal at DE, Bolden at CB, these players have at least acclimated themselves to the play book, an NFL offseason, an NFL season, the speed of the game and are further along than a rookie. By using Free Agency, we took a potential long term CB, NT, maybe MLB. This rules out our Brass reaching in the draft to fill these voids..

You are being very dramatic with how weak and exposed we are in areas that I frankly don't see it.. And even if a RB, DE, DT, MLB, CB, S are needed we have as of right now 6 picks to address the need as you put it. Gosh if we trade up for Moore how will we ever fill all these holes?
It's not being "overly dramatic" to say the Broncos need several upgrades. Here's a plan (if they trade up for D. Moore).

1st round DE - Need the best pass-rusher we can find in the draft. Let's just say they trade their 4th to move up a few spaces to select Damontre Moore.

2nd round RB - Waiting until the end of the 3rd will get you Christine Micheal. I think Lacy will be gone at #26, and Franklin will be gone before #58. Let's say the Broncos use their 2nd rounder to draft Le'Veon Bell. Then they can cut McGahee, in order to keep all their internal FA's next year.

3rd round SS - Adams was solid in 2012, but he's not an impact player. I think D.J. Swearinger and Phillip Thomas will be drafted before #90, so let's say the Broncos draft an SS prototype, T.J. McDonald, and groom him for one year before replacing Adams in 2014.

4th round - Used in 1st round trade up (as a mental exercise).

5th round NT - The draft is deep in DT's, and the Broncos have met with Kwame Geathers, so let's say they spend a 5th on him to backup Vickerson.

7th round Kicker - Prater is one of the least accurate Kicker's in the NFL, and one of the top 5 highest paid. Cutting him would save $5M over two years, and get us one of the best college Kicker's. I don't trust Prater in crunch time anymore.

Re-sign Brooking if Irving isn't balling out in training camp, and the Broncos are looking decent. The only thing they would be missing is a replacement for Bailey, which they will have to address in the 2014 draft. Let Bolden and Carter have another year to develop.
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Old 04-16-2013, 12:00 AM   #98
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I don't know what you've heard, but actually finding a RB is incredibly easy these days. I think Hillman will end up being a solid 1B for us, and finding another RB to complement him if Moreno/McGahee can't go won't be hard.
Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me to see the team roll with McGahee/Moreno/Hillman this year and probably cut McGahee for next year.
I like Hillman too. I think they will draft either a 2nd or 3rd round RB and get rid of McGahee's salary. Most impact NFL RB's are picked before the 10th pick in the 3rd round. I like Sio Moore (a lot), but I think the Broncos will take a 2nd round RB (instead of settling on Christine Micheal in the 3rd).



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Yes, he is an unknown, which is why it wouldn't surprise me to see us draft a MLB.
This is where I have the Broncos with one draft pick short. Like I said, love Sio Moore, but luckily the Broncos have Brooking as an insurance policy in case Irving sucks. Hopefully he doesn't.



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Yes, Champ is getting up there and nearing the end of his amazing career. Each season I say he needs to move to FS, but it doesn't seem like that will happen. As for grooming his replacement, wouldn't hurt to see how Rodgers-Cromartie plays for us, how Bolden develops. Don't always have to look elsewhere when the answer could be right in front of you.
I think DRC is a good #2CB, and Harris may be the NFL's best Nickel CB (good thing he doesn't have to play against Welker anymore). Bolden doesn't have the skill/speed to be a #1CB. Too bad the Broncos can't afford the luxury of drafting a #1CB at #28 (like Hayden). Guess they'll have to wait until 2014, and possibly throw in a rookie starter to replace Champ (which isn't optimal).

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Originally Posted by TheChamp24 View Post
You don't need an impact player at every position. Honestly, I thought Adams performed okay last year, which is important. Is he great? No, its hard to have great players at each position though
Adams doesn't suck, but the Broncos need a Defensive leader at the Safety position who can guard TE's. I think Adams will start again in 2013, but will be gone after that.

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Originally Posted by TheChamp24 View Post
I am not as down on Prater as some people are. Also, you keep on bringing up cutting guys to save cap. It costs money to replace these guys you know.
Use a late draft pick and save a ton of scratch. Prater is a head-case, who has a tribal tat, get's DUI's with strippers., is way overpaid, and kicked the ground in the biggest game of the year, leading to a 10 point swing. He's the main reason the Broncos lost that game.

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So in your world, we need to replace 5 starters on a team that just went 13-3, dominated opponents, lost on a "fluky" playoff game by 3 points in OT to the eventual Super Bowl Champs. Gotcha. Didn't know this was such a terrible team with so many sucky players.

The Broncos lost 3 starters from 2012 who haven't even been replaced yet (McGahee, Dumervil, Brooking). I'd like to see Adams upgraded, and Prater should be cut ASAP. Nothing revolutionary here. That's 5 potential positions of need.




The Ravens defense was terrible last year, and played okay enough at times to eventually win the Super Bowl. They almost blew what, a 20 something point lead in the Super Bowl?
If you have an ELITE pass rusher, you can easily devise a scheme to wreak havoc even if you don't have a true huge pass rushing threat elsewhere.
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Old 04-16-2013, 07:02 AM   #99
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I think Beadles is average myself, and instead of Warford, would prefer a healthy Kuper at Guard. Beadles would be a nice back-up guard. If Blake lived up to his potential I would love to see an OLine of Clady, Vasquez, Blake, Kuper, Franklin.
Walton, Beadles, Clark, and another Tackle through the draft would be ideal.

That's a power move right there. While Vasquez is a good run blocking guard, he's very good in pass protection, and is a little more athletic than Kuper. So leave Kuper at RG. That's a nasty OLine.
The is no doubt that keeping or re-signing a healthy Kuper is in our best interests. I am 100% behind that idea. I'm just not sure if: a) he will be 100% healthy this next season, or 2) he is still in the Broncos long term plans.

Why are we working on terms of an "injury settlement" if we are planning on keeping him? I thought that was only if you were going to subsequently release the player. Maybe injury settlement, then re-sign him on a smaller incentive-laden contract?
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Old 04-16-2013, 07:46 AM   #100
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I finally played Madden 2013 last night. I love it. Updated all the rosters. Kicked Beadles inside to center. OL is nasty.
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