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Old 03-22-2013, 01:03 PM   #301
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The Germans never had it in the first place. And how would it have been more disastrous if Germany would have got it? The Arabs would have done the same thing they did to Britain and what they did with us. The situation probably remains the same.
There's no way to say what would've happened. What the impacts on the war itself might've been. But there's no way to think that a German/Arabic dream team of anti-semitism would've produced peace in the region. At least not in terms that didn't involve wholesale extermination of the you-know-who's.


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I don't think anyone drew that conclusion, but considering that Eurasia and the Middle East has been the crossroad of humanitarian conflict since before Christ had a crew-cut, it's quite easy to see why the region is in perpetual conflict. The list of reasons goes on forever, but the fact that outside countries have always pissed and meddled in their affairs DOES NOT help.
I agree with that statement. But my point was there's no sane argument to be made that anything Americans did with oil in the region for a decade or two has anything to do with how effed up that part of the world is. The problem is much much larger than that.
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:05 PM   #302
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Lolz. I guess when you said "The 30's" you really only meant 1939. BTW, oil wasn't even really discovered in Saudi Arabia until 1938. There was no meaningful production there in "The 30's" But more importantly, Arabs aren't confined to Saudi Arabia. Middle Eastern Oil was first brought online around the Persian gulf.

As for the rest of your "history" lesson, you need to go back and read up. The German/Ottoman alliance was more one of convenience than anything. But your real problem is that that was World War I era, as was the Arab Revolt... and again you're talking about the 1930's. The Ottoman Empire no longer existed by then.

The idea that Arab's wouldn't have tolerated German masters just as happily (if not more so) than Anglo-American ones is laughable. To a rational person, we were the far lesser of two evils.

Be careful when quoting "history". Depending on your age, you may not have been "educated" in what really happened. Anyone under 30 has been taught the re-education the liberals have forced into the system. There are serious falsehoods being drilled into young minds.
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:07 PM   #303
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Be careful when quoting "history". Depending on your age, you may not have been "educated" in what really happened. Anyone under 30 has been taught the re-education the liberals have forced into the system. There are serious falsehoods being drilled into young minds.
You wouldn't have a ****ing clue.
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:14 PM   #304
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Be careful when quoting "history". Depending on your age, you may not have been "educated" in what really happened. Anyone under 30 has been taught the re-education the liberals have forced into the system. There are serious falsehoods being drilled into young minds.
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:15 PM   #305
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You wouldn't have a ****ing clue.
Wanna bet?
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:17 PM   #306
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Wanna bet?
Yep, because I highly doubt that you have spent any time recently in post-secondary education. I'm glad you could parrot a right-wing punchline. Just goes to show you what kind of demographic they target: willfully ignorant and uneducated.

But go on, continue to think you have a clue about what is being taught in classrooms across the nation.

"Dem derpity derpin' librul institutions! A herp a derp."
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:21 PM   #307
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Yep, because I highly doubt that you have spent any time recently in post-secondary education. I'm glad you could parrot a right-wing punchline though. Just goes to show you what kind of demographic they target: willfully ignorant and uneducated.
You make some serious assumptions about me. Why do you think you know about me? Is it because you spew the usual liberal-commie crap coming from the media and school system and entertainment industry these past 2 decades and I do not? You wanna talk about targeted people?
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:26 PM   #308
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You make some serious assumptions about me. Why do you think you know about me? Is it because you spew the usual liberal-commie crap coming from the media and school system and entertainment industry these past 2 decades and I do not? You wanna talk about targeted people?
What sound does a sheep make, Jersey?
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:33 PM   #309
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What sound does a sheep make, Jersey?
A sheep makes the sound of "yes nobama you are the answer". It sounds like a shrill; like when billary used to scream like a wounded beaver at Bush, and now when anyone questions her she cries foul.

Go ahead and keep being happy seeing your tax money go to the arabb league (had to add second g because it always capitalizes the a in harab but interestingly enough does not do the same for the C in catholic ) to enable them to buy means to kill us. Good one there pal.
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:38 PM   #310
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Yep, because I highly doubt that you have spent any time recently in post-secondary education. I'm glad you could parrot a right-wing punchline. Just goes to show you what kind of demographic they target: willfully ignorant and uneducated.

But go on, continue to think you have a clue about what is being taught in classrooms across the nation.

"Dem derpity derpin' librul institutions! A herp a derp."
Dude, you don't honestly think that secondary education outside of some small conservative colleges is really an open market place for ideas? The tendency of these institutions not only to mock and disdain conservative viewpoints, but to actually villify them is rampant.

Now, that being said, everyone has to know the landscape of the university or college they are going to and adjust their mindset and be prepared, especially if you come from a "conservative" or religious background.

I'm not saying history is be re-written by the liberal agenda, but what I am saying is that it is very hostile to opinions that do not line up and march to their drum beat.
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Old 03-22-2013, 01:49 PM   #311
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Dude, you don't honestly think that secondary education outside of some small conservative colleges is really an open market place for ideas? The tendency of these institutions not only to mock and disdain conservative viewpoints, but to actually villify them is rampant.

Now, that being said, everyone has to know the landscape of the university or college they are going to and adjust their mindset and be prepared, especially if you come from a "conservative" or religious background.

I'm not saying history is be re-written by the liberal agenda, but what I am saying is that it is very hostile to opinions that do not line up and march to their drum beat.

Truer words have not been written or spoken on this day. It has completely amazed me to see the pure persecution of any "non-liberal agenda" over the past two decades. Especially because these people constantly claim that freedom of beliefs and speech are crucial components to the human race, yet they only tolerate beliefs that match their own to the letter. And the media has really ruined things.
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Old 03-22-2013, 02:23 PM   #312
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Politarding itt
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Old 03-22-2013, 02:30 PM   #313
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Dude, you don't honestly think that secondary education outside of some small conservative colleges is really an open market place for ideas? The tendency of these institutions not only to mock and disdain conservative viewpoints, but to actually villify them is rampant.

Now, that being said, everyone has to know the landscape of the university or college they are going to and adjust their mindset and be prepared, especially if you come from a "conservative" or religious background.

I'm not saying history is be re-written by the liberal agenda, but what I am saying is that it is very hostile to opinions that do not line up and march to their drum beat.
Like I asked Jersey, how much time have you spent in a post-secondary setting over the last 20 years to make these claims? My guess is not much.

I've spent time in conferences, meetings and various hearings regarding higher education in schools all over the Midwest (easily over a dozen in more than four states), from small towns to big cities and I have yet to see this be the case.

You are parroting a talking point that is regurgitated consistently by the right-wing media. What you should be stating is the fact that people who continue their education and obtain post-secondary degrees tend to be more liberal in their attitudes and beliefs. That is more in line with how reality actually works.

If what you profess is true: What disciplines are people being liberally brainwashed? Mathematics? Business? Physics? Anatomy? Engineering? Give me a break. No professor I had in my two degree fields (which were social sciences) ever professed their beliefs openly or pushed them on students. They sat back and encourage conversation amongst their students and stepped in if things crossed the line and got personal. I had no experiences EVER where I came across a professor who gave their personal spin on any course matter being discussed.

In fact, the only way I was ever able to get where they stood politically was in conversations at adviser meetings outside the classroom or if I caught up with them somewhere elsewhere.

"The media has really muddled things up." is what jerseyshore or whatever his name keeps saying. Yet, without any objective first-hand experience on the matter, that is exactly where he is getting his opinion from.

Sounds legit. . . NOT.
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Old 03-22-2013, 02:43 PM   #314
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Like I asked Jersey, how much time have you spent in a post-secondary setting over the last 20 years to make these claims? My guess is not much.

I've spent time in conferences, meetings and various hearings regarding higher education in schools all over the Midwest (easily over a dozen in more than four states), from small towns to big cities and I have yet to see this be the case.

You are parroting a talking point that is regurgitated consistently by the right-wing media. What you should be stating is the fact that people who continue their education and obtain post-secondary degrees tend to be more liberal in their attitudes and beliefs. That is more in line with how reality actually works.

If what you profess is true: What disciplines are people being liberally brainwashed? Mathematics? Business? Physics? Anatomy? Engineering? Give me a break. No professor I had in my two degree fields (which were social sciences) ever professed their beliefs openly or pushed them on students. They sat back and encourage conversation amongst their students and stepped in if things crossed the line and got personal. I had no experiences EVER where I came across a professor who gave their personal spin on any course matter being discussed.

In fact, the only way I was ever able to get where they stood politically was in conversations at adviser meetings outside the classroom or if I caught up with them somewhere elsewhere.

"The media has really muddled things up." is what jerseyshore or whatever his name keeps saying. Yet, without any objective first-hand experience on the matter, that is exactly where he is getting his opinion from.

Sounds legit. . . NOT.
In the sciences, not so much. But in the arts, yes, very much so there's a tendency to descriminate hard against conservative values.

Anyone getting a BS is not going to encounter the angst of someone getting a BA at the college level.

I know you've spent too much time in secondary education but I've also spent time there too my friend. I'm not talking out of my ass... lol.
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Old 03-22-2013, 03:02 PM   #315
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You make some serious assumptions about me. Why do you think you know about me? Is it because you spew the usual liberal-commie crap coming from the media and school system and entertainment industry these past 2 decades and I do not? You wanna talk about targeted people?
You just "assumed" I support Obama. Explain.

"Liberal-commie crap?" How many Archie Bunkers are on this site anyway?
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Old 03-22-2013, 05:36 PM   #316
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Dude, you don't honestly think that secondary education outside of some small conservative colleges is really an open market place for ideas? The tendency of these institutions not only to mock and disdain conservative viewpoints, but to actually villify them is rampant.

Now, that being said, everyone has to know the landscape of the university or college they are going to and adjust their mindset and be prepared, especially if you come from a "conservative" or religious background.

I'm not saying history is be re-written by the liberal agenda, but what I am saying is that it is very hostile to opinions that do not line up and march to their drum beat.
Personally, I received my degree from the University Of Louisville waaayyyy back in 1978 - (BA communications minor political science) and my Wife received her MSN from Ohio State in 1981 and her PhD from KU in 1986.

Let me be clear here. ANYONE who believes that institutions of "higher learning" are not liberal encampments that breed radical thought have (apparently) never attended University. The amount of Che' Gueverra berets at College is staggering.....

It wasn't necessarily a big deal to me, I was already a young liberal, so I bought into the nonsense (only to realize what a complete FOOL I was a few years later) and, I suppose that is the point; as Winston Churchill once said "If you're in your twenty's and you're not a liberal you have no heart. If you're in your forty's and you're not a conservative, you have no brain"

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Old 03-22-2013, 08:22 PM   #317
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Everyone should own an assault rifle or two. You could use them for, like, fishing and stuff.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:13 PM   #318
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Yes because we're paying more in taxes and "fees" to support "the society".
I see you are not good at interpreting charts. Wage growth hasn't kept pace with GDP growth in recent history. Changes in marginal tax rates are unrelated to this.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:20 PM   #319
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Everyone should own an assault rifle or two. You could use them for, like, fishing and stuff.
Actually you are wrong. Bullets, and especially bullets with a lot of velocity disintegrate upon impact with the water. The more powerful the bullet, the more likely it will be completely harmless if shot at anything below the water line. It will make a big splash but that's because it's breaking apart.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:22 PM   #320
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Dude, you don't honestly think that secondary education outside of some small conservative colleges is really an open market place for ideas? The tendency of these institutions not only to mock and disdain conservative viewpoints, but to actually villify them is rampant.

Now, that being said, everyone has to know the landscape of the university or college they are going to and adjust their mindset and be prepared, especially if you come from a "conservative" or religious background.

I'm not saying history is be re-written by the liberal agenda, but what I am saying is that it is very hostile to opinions that do not line up and march to their drum beat.
This is particularly true for science based disciplines. Mathematics and other hard sciences dont have time for ideas originated by 3000 year old goat herders.
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:24 PM   #321
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Truer words have not been written or spoken on this day. It has completely amazed me to see the pure persecution of any "non-liberal agenda" over the past two decades. Especially because these people constantly claim that freedom of beliefs and speech are crucial components to the human race, yet they only tolerate beliefs that match their own to the letter. And the media has really ruined things.

I'm curious about the ways in which you've been 'purely persecuted' over the past few decades. That's a long time, and persecution is a very bad thing. Impermissable, I would think.

Would you mind explaining what has been done to you?
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Old 03-22-2013, 09:33 PM   #322
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This is particularly true for science based disciplines. Mathematics and other hard sciences dont have time for ideas originated by 3000 year old goat herders.
Actually, I've heard that in secondary educational system, that is, the colleges and universities that people of faith actually are much more respected because many of these scientists and mathematicians in the colleges and universities are belivers too. Of course these scientists and mathematicians don't say anything about their faith because they know the environment in which they work would not like it, at all.

this is just what I've heard from people I trust. They don't have any reason to make this stuff up.
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Old 03-23-2013, 06:14 AM   #323
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Actually, I've heard that in secondary educational system, that is, the colleges and universities that people of faith actually are much more respected because many of these scientists and mathematicians in the colleges and universities are belivers too. Of course these scientists and mathematicians don't say anything about their faith because they know the environment in which they work would not like it, at all.

this is just what I've heard from people I trust. They don't have any reason to make this stuff up.
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Old 03-23-2013, 07:11 AM   #324
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yes, serious again, I don't know if it's true or not, just what I've been told from people who work in places like engineering... but who knows? I was suprised too.
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Old 03-23-2013, 08:24 AM   #325
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yes, serious again, I don't know if it's true or not, just what I've been told from people who work in places like engineering... but who knows? I was suprised too.
Speaking from experience on the educational side of it, its absolutely not true in the hard sciences. That are not very many people of faith on the instructor side. The ones that are, simply believe more along the lines that religion is nothing more than a social institution. And certainly you wont find any fundamentalists (ie literalists) in any sort of well respected institution. And no, Colorado Christian Bible College and its peers are not well respected institutions.

There is this funny idea floating around that there are all these numerous religious people working in fields like genetics for example who don't believe in evolution or folks in physics who don't believe in in the big bang or others working in geology and archeology who are young earth creationists. Are there zero of these? No. But they are very very very few and far between. And in the community that publishes research they are practically non-existent. To suggest otherwise is intellectually dishonest at best.

You should think a little harder about your notion that they dont have any reason to make this stuff up. They have every reason to pat themselves on the back when they are in an environment where all the data is contrary to what they taught to be believe by their parents or read out of a book that contains mostly borrowed stories from neighboring cultures. Denial is a funny thing.
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