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Old 12-30-2012, 08:27 AM   #76
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Originally Posted by baja View Post
Many think McCoy is one.

The point of my first post that you quoted was is it time to consider offering McCoy the top spot as a way to not lose him.
Many thought McDaniels was one; me included. I don't see anything at all special about McCoy.

The answer to your point is a resounding no, IMO. I don't think this team misses a beat without McCoy. I don't think the same can be said of JDR or Fox.
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:31 AM   #77
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Screw giving McCoy the HC job let him walk. JDR is really the one we need to keep. Open up the coffers and pay the man 1$ less then Fox makes with the "promise" once fox goes it his job. After that ask Manning who he wants for and OC and tell them "hey PFM wants you to be his OC." IF the guy has a clue he will be on the next flight to Den. and we will be on our way next year without missing a beat. Here is the way I see it. We have a 3 or so year window with PFM. We need to do anything we can to push now to win SB's. Once PFM is gone then all deals with coaches can get reevaluated and move on to the next era of Broncos football. But as of right now we need to sell out and pay JDR to stay and do everything we can to keep him for the next two or 3 years. After that we will just have to see.
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:33 AM   #78
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Fox isn't going anywhere any time soon. Maybe after Manning retires Fox may go but that is a few years away. I love it how many posters here poo-poo the Fox hire when he's proven to be one of the better HCs over the last 10-15 years. He got to the SB with Jake Delhomme as his QB and only lost by a field goal to a team that video taped the Panther's walk thru before the game.

I've supported the Fox hire from day 1, and he's not dissappointed me. I think Elway also know's Fox's value to this franchise and he will not look to replace Fox until the Broncos either have a few bad seasons in a row or Fox retires.

I like Fox too and you are probably right saying he is not going anywhere. He has done and is doing a great job.

Now that the team has been brought together and the crisis put to rest is he the best choice going forward? I don't know. Needs do change.
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:36 AM   #79
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I like Fox too and you are probably right saying he is not going anywhere. He has done and is doing a great job.

Now that the team has been brought together and the crisis put to rest is he the best choice going forward? I don't know. Needs do change.
I'm not sure what your point is other than you have no point.
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:39 AM   #80
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Many thought McDaniels was one; me included. I don't see anything at all special about McCoy.

The answer to your point is a resounding no, IMO. I don't think this team misses a beat without McCoy. I don't think the same can be said of JDR or Fox.
Actually I agree. I am just putting forward a talking point. We might have a different position if we were privy to the information available to Elway. I do know this McCoy is highly respected around the league and will be highly sought after.
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:45 AM   #81
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I like Fox too and you are probably right saying he is not going anywhere. He has done and is doing a great job.

Now that the team has been brought together and the crisis put to rest is he the best choice going forward? I don't know. Needs do change.
It sounds like you're advocating change for change's sake, and your premise doesn't make any sense.

Here are the HCs going to the playoffs;

John Fox
Bill Belichick
Gary Kubiak
Mike McCarthy
Marvin Lewis
Leslie Frasier*
Mike Smith
Tom Coughlin*
John Harbaugh
Jim Harbaugh
Mike Shanahan*
Chuck Pagano**
Pete Carroll
Lovie Smith*

From that list I see no sense in going with a "new blood" young coach, they aren't represented here at all.

Last edited by Dedhed; 12-30-2012 at 08:49 AM..
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:47 AM   #82
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I'm not sure what your point is other than you have no point.
His point is that sometimes a team's needs change and they no longer require a coach who can get them to 12-3 and in Super Bowl contention. He's saying he'd like us to hire Norv Turner, I think.
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:47 AM   #83
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It sounds like you're advocating change for change's sake, and your premise doesn't make any sense.

Here are the HCs going to the playoffs;

John Fox
Bill Belichick
Gary Kubiak
Mike McCarthy
Marvin Lewis
Leslie Frasier*
This whole conversation started as a way to keep McCoy in Denver. Either you missed that or I am missing your point.
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:54 AM   #84
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His point is that sometimes a team's needs change and they no longer require a coach who can get them to 12-3 and in Super Bowl contention. He's saying he'd like us to hire Norv Turner, I think.
Actually I am wondering who is more valuable to the Denver Broncos John Fox or Mike McCoy. If it is McCoy than one way to keep him is give him the HC job.

I really isn't that hard to understand is it?

Do you guys ever have stradigy meetings where all scenarios are discussed? Seems like the concept is foreign to some of you.
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:55 AM   #85
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Losing JDR would suck, but my guess is after testing the waters that we retain his services for one more year. I don't think he's going to bolt for the first traditional dumpster fire team NFL coaching gig that pops up. However if a higher profile team (Philly, Jets, Chargers, Cowboys etc.) wants him, he's probably gone.

McCoy I think is gone if he gets offered any NFL head coaching gig. I'm not terribly sad about that. We have Peyton. Have fun overseeing the Blane Suckbert/Tebow circus in Jacksonville or dealing with crazy ass Bud Adams.

Last edited by razorwire77; 12-30-2012 at 09:02 AM..
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Old 12-30-2012, 09:06 AM   #86
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Actually I am wondering who is more valuable to the Denver Broncos John Fox or Mike McCoy.
To me that's like asking whether Manning or Prater is more valuable to the Broncos.

Manning= Fox
McCoy= Prater
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Old 12-30-2012, 09:09 AM   #87
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To me that's like asking whether Manning or Prater is more valuable to the Broncos.

Manning= Fox
McCoy= Prater

I am sure you are right to date. My question is it true going forward?
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Old 12-30-2012, 09:14 AM   #88
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I am sure you are right to date. My question is it true going forward?
My answer is provided in information already given.
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Old 12-30-2012, 09:34 AM   #89
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I hope that we don't pass up on another JDR....say Turner for offense, or Ryan for defense...because we try to get cute and promote from within.

Offense: Studs or Gase
Defense: Smith or Rodgers

Sure, that may be what a guy like Gase or Studs is looking for...but, that doesn't make them a better Coordinater than a guy like Turner. Just saying.
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Old 12-30-2012, 10:17 AM   #90
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This whole conversation started as a way to keep McCoy in Denver. Either you missed that or I am missing your point.
I get your point about keeping McCoy and your thought of giving him the top spot as he may be more innovative than Fox. However, who can really say what Fox is or isn't as a HC? He effectively had his balls chopped off in Carolina and wasn't running HIS team, he was like a baby-sitter to Richardson's team.
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Old 12-30-2012, 10:21 AM   #91
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I hope that we don't pass up on another JDR....say Turner for offense, or Ryan for defense...because we try to get cute and promote from within.

Offense: Studs or Gase
Defense: Smith or Rodgers

Sure, that may be what a guy like Gase or Studs is looking for...but, that doesn't make them a better Coordinater than a guy like Turner. Just saying.
Considering we went out and brought in JDR after Allen left says Elway and Fox want the best for the job not a random fill in guy from within
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Old 12-30-2012, 10:24 AM   #92
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I get your point about keeping McCoy and your thought of giving him the top spot as he may be more innovative than Fox. However, who can really say what Fox is or isn't as a HC? He effectively had his balls chopped off in Carolina and wasn't running HIS team, he was like a baby-sitter to Richardson's team.
We can never really know but that can be said about most topics discussed on a message board.

Does Fox strike an a guy that thinks on his feet on gameday like Shanny for example or does he strike you more as an old school conservative coach?
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Old 12-30-2012, 10:25 AM   #93
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I get your point about keeping McCoy and your thought of giving him the top spot as he may be more innovative than Fox. However, who can really say what Fox is or isn't as a HC? He effectively had his balls chopped off in Carolina and wasn't running HIS team, he was like a baby-sitter to Richardson's team.
We can never really know but that can be said about most topics discussed on a message board.

Does Fox strike an a guy that thinks on his feet on gameday like Shanny for example or does he strike you more as an old school conservative coach?
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Old 12-30-2012, 11:05 AM   #94
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We can never really know but that can be said about most topics discussed on a message board.

Does Fox strike an a guy that thinks on his feet on gameday like Shanny for example or does he strike you more as an old school conservative coach?
Fox strikes me as a leader who knows how to delegate to his assistants and get the respect, admiration and best from those he leads. He doesn't have the genius of a Shanahan, but he is a better leader, and realistically there aren't that many guys with a mind like Mike has.
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Old 12-30-2012, 11:12 AM   #95
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Fox strikes me as a leader who knows how to delegate to his assistants and get the respect, admiration and best from those he leads. He doesn't have the genius of a Shanahan, but he is a better leader, and realistically there aren't that many guys with a mind like Mike has.
I agree with everything you said. Good response.
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Old 12-30-2012, 11:50 AM   #96
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Considering we went out and brought in JDR after Allen left says Elway and Fox want the best for the job not a random fill in guy from within
Just because they did it last year, doesn't mean that will be the blueprint this year. It's a concern to me, until I see what happens.
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:13 PM   #97
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I like Fox too and you are probably right saying he is not going anywhere. He has done and is doing a great job.

Now that the team has been brought together and the crisis put to rest is he the best choice going forward? I don't know. Needs do change.
Manning came to Denver in part because of Fox. He'll be here AT LEAST as long as Manning.
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:16 PM   #98
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Manning came to Denver in part because of Fox. He'll be here AT LEAST as long as Manning.
Probably right.
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Old 12-30-2012, 12:26 PM   #99
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Manning came to Denver in part because of Fox. He'll be here AT LEAST as long as Manning.
And hopefully *ONLY* as long as Manning.

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Old 12-30-2012, 01:10 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by BroncoMan4ever View Post
Fox strikes me as a leader who knows how to delegate to his assistants and get the respect, admiration and best from those he leads. He doesn't have the ego of a Shanahan, but he is a better leader, and realistically there aren't that many guys with a BIG HEAD like Mike has.


Fixed that for you.
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