How is This a Fact Check?

[manchambo]

So I was just reading the AP fact check of Clinton's speech and came across this:

CLINTON: "Their campaign pollster said, 'We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact checkers.' Now that is true. I couldn't have said it better myself—I just hope you remember that every time you see the ad."
THE FACTS: Clinton, who famously finger-wagged a denial on national television about his sexual relationship with intern Monica Lewinsky and was subsequently impeached in the House on a perjury charge, has had his own uncomfortable moments over telling the truth. "I did not have sexual relations with that woman, Miss Lewinsky," Clinton told television viewers. Later, after he was forced to testify to a grand jury, Clinton said his statements were "legally accurate" but also allowed that he "misled people, including even my wife."


We've actually come to a point where fact checkers are unaware of the definition of "fact." A fact, like the one Clinton was addressing in the comment above, is something capable of independent verification. Thus, fact checkers have confirmed that the claim that Obama has gutted welfare to work requirements is untrue because the document that allegedly did the "gutting" explicitly required increased return to work performance. Anyone can read the document and confirm this. That's why it's a "fact."

These purported fact checkers eschew such silly factual verification, and instead use exactly the type of ad hominem reasoning that has allowed politicians to impose a complete state of factual relativism on politics in the first place. The truth doesn't matter if it is spoken by a liberal. The response to Clinton pointing out that the "gutting" claim is a lie: Clinton lied once before so, apparently, the actual truth of the matter he's addressing doesn't matter.

[TonyR]

Originally Posted by manchambo

Clinton lied once before so, apparently, the actual truth of the matter he's addressing doesn't matter.

Yup. And this from the supposedly liberally biased media! This is an example of how in reality the media often bends over backwards to cater to the right in an effort to avoid the "liberal bias" label.

[barryr]

Maybe because Bill Clinton has no credibility other than to his fans when it comes to talking about facts and lies.

[manchambo]

Originally Posted by barryr

Maybe because Bill Clinton has no credibility other than to his fans when it comes to talking about facts and lies.

I don't think you could miss the point more completely if you were trying to (are you trying to?).

The point is that, when we're talking about a fact, it doesn't matter who says it. We can tell if it's true or false because it is an objectively verifiable phenomenon. Clinton may be the biggest liar in the world, but that doesn't alter the fact that the "gutting" letter requires increased return to work performance.

Romney's campaign is relying on the fact that people like you don't care about the truth, because you will dismiss anything said by a liberal. That's why they aren't worried about fact checkers.

[peacepipe]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...cs&ir=Politics

Former U.S. President Bill Clinton highlighted a stunning fact during his speech at the Democratic National Convention on Wednesday: Democratic presidents have overseen the creation of nearly twice as many jobs as Republican presidents since 1961.

"What's the job score? Republicans, 24 million; Democrats, 42 [million]," Clinton said to cheers and applause.

Bloomberg Government first reported these figures in May, after analyzing growth in private-sector jobs since 1961.

On Wednesday, Clinton used the figure to justify Democratic policies.

"It turns out that advancing equal opportunity and economic empowerment is both morally right and good economics," Clinton said. "Why? Because poverty, discrimination and ignorance restrict growth. When you stifle human potential, when you don’t invest in new ideas, it doesn't just cut off the people who are affected; it hurts us all."

FWIW

[Jetmeck]

Originally Posted by barryr

Maybe because Bill Clinton has no credibility other than to his fans when it comes to talking about facts and lies.

yah, he has no economic creds or creds on dealing with republicans retards....except for that he has no creds whatsoever but you keep believing that while we steam roll right over ya.

[Jetmeck]

Romney's campaign is relying on the fact that people like you don't care about the truth, because you will dismiss anything said by a liberal. That's why they aren't worried about fact checkers.

well said...............

[L.A. BRONCOS FAN]

Originally Posted by barryr

Maybe because Bill Clinton has no credibility other than to his fans when it comes to talking about facts and lies.

Who are you going to believe, folks?

Dinglebarry or all the public opinion polls + Clinton's approval numbers?

[Play2win]

To me, the main theme in Clinton's speech was: Invest in our own country, and when you do, you'll get good to great returns and growth that will help benefit us all, now and into the future.

[Blart]

Good point, and I can't believe that was written for AP.

CLINTON: "Their campaign pollster said, 'We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact checkers.' Now that is true. I couldn't have said it better myself—I just hope you remember that every time you see the ad."

The bolded text above is stated as fact by Clinton. A fact checker should be telling us if Clinton's purported fact is true or false. Did their pollster say that? Which one? Is there any evidence?

[houghtam]

Originally Posted by Blart

Good point, and I can't believe that was written for AP.

CLINTON: "Their campaign pollster said, 'We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact checkers.' Now that is true. I couldn't have said it better myself—I just hope you remember that every time you see the ad."

The bolded text above is stated as fact by Clinton. A fact checker should be telling us if said fact is true or false.

Read the entire article, there are two other "facts" that are not "checked".

At first I thought this was a Yahoo! article, but nope. Shame on the AP.

[manchambo]

Originally Posted by Blart

Good point, and I can't believe that was written for AP.

CLINTON: "Their campaign pollster said, 'We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact checkers.' Now that is true. I couldn't have said it better myself—I just hope you remember that every time you see the ad."

The bolded text above is stated as fact by Clinton. A fact checker should be telling us if Clinton's purported fact is true or false. Did their pollster say that? Which one? Is there any evidence?

He absolutely said it. It has been widely reported and not disputed.

[frerottenextelway]

It's ridiculous, but them bringing up Clinton's affair is positive numbers for D's now, so whatever!