Draft Grades

[Bacchus]

I thought it would be cool if people could post draft grades...... maybe not.
Denver Broncos (Last Year: 13-3)

2013 NFL Draft Individual Grades:

28. Sylvester Williams, DT, North Carolina: A Grade
It was either Sylvester Williams or Tank Carradine here for the Broncos, and you can't argue either choice. Help was needed all over on the defensive line for the Broncos, and Williams was discussed as highly as No. 18 to the Cowboys. Denver didn't have an interior pass rush, so Williams definitely helps in that area.
Follow @walterfootball for updates.

58. Montee Ball, RB, Wisconsin: C Grade
This is too early for Montee Ball. He's a Big Ten plodder with tons of wear and tear on his body already. He fills a need, but the Broncos should have waited until later to pick a running back if they were just willing to settle for Ball.

90. Kayvon Webster, CB, South Florida: D Grade
This is the reach of Day 2. Kayvon Webster was widely considered a sixth-round prospect at best. If the Broncos loved Webster enough, that's fine, but he doesn't fill any sort of immediate need. I can't support this pick.

146. Quanterus Smith, DE, Western Kentucky: B Grade
This is a bit later than I thought the Broncos would wait to find a potential replacement for Elvis Dumervil, but Quanterus Smith is a solid pick. He fits the range and fills a need.


161. Tavarres King, WR, Georgia: A- Grade
Tavarres King doesn't fill a need at all, but there's no denying his value near the bottom of the fifth round. Why not go with one of the top players available? King will definitely be useful if one of Peyton Manning's receivers goes down with an injury.


173. Vinston Painter, OT, Virginia Tech: A- Grade
The Broncos didn't really have a quality third tackle prior to the 2013 NFL Draft, so Vinston Painter makes sense. I had Painter pegged as a Round 4-5 prospect, so this is nice value.

324. Zac Dysert, QB, Miami of Ohio: B+ Grade

This is great value for Zac Dysert, who was seen as a Round 3-5 prospect. I'm concerned about the reports that say Dysert doesn't love football, but if those turn out to be bogus, he'll compete with Brock Osweiler to be Peyton Manning's successor.

http://walterfootball.com/offseason2013den.php

[Bacchus]

Denver Broncos: John Elway, Matt Russell



Rob Carr/Getty Images
The Denver Broncos' draft war room is commanded by two men—executive vice president of football operations John Elway and player personnel director Matt Russell. Their goal for this year: get stronger, not weaker, by adding depth and youth to the roster. They accomplished it.
The Broncos addressed a number of positions—defensive tackle in Round 1 with Sylvester Williams, running back in Round 2 with Montee Ball, the secondary in Round 3 with Kayvon Webster among them—without the added pressure of needing too many immediate home runs.
Needs Met: Running back, well-rounded depth.
Value and Depth: Western Kentucky defensive end Quanterus Smith in Round 5.
Boom/Bust Potential: None particularly, though running backs in general are always a risk.

Grade: A-

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...32-gms/page/14

[Bacchus]

2013 NFL Draft Grades: Broncos Grades for Montee Ball, Kayvon Webster

New! Posted on: 04/26/2013 - 10:00 PM Source: Kyle Montgomery [permalink]

Start us off Bronco Mike!

Bronco Mike: C+
Board fell horrible and Broncos didn’t feel need to move up like other teams did. It cost them a shot at players like Le’Veon Bell, Sio Moore, and Demontre Moore. Monte Ball is a lunch-pail runner that can carry the workload and move the chains. Kayvon Webster, well honestly don’t know who he is so I’ll reserve judgement. Don’t see how he fits in with our current players, the question is depth at CB or tweener S in that mythical TE slayer role we all spoke about leading up to the draft? If it is the latter, this pick and this day will look a lot better in the future. Elway has built one hell of a roster so I will trust his judgement on these guys.

Big Pete: A
Denver Broncos 2013 Draft Picks and Results

Meet Big Man Sylvester Williams
Introducing Montee Ball
Film Room: Kayvon Webster
Solid A, borderline A+. Montee Ball is our Austin Martin, Webster is the brand of tires on your new ride. Whether or not they are Bridgestones or Michelines is inconsequential because the fact remains that you are the proud owner of a sexy new DB-9. Because of that, the Broncos get an A. If, upon further review, Webster looks a lot better than I think he is, or if he’s going to be a special purpose CB (such as only covering the Gronkowski’s of the world), then this round is an A+. However, the fact remains that the Broncos got my #1 wishlist player in Ball, so regardless of who else they selected, this day of the draft was going to get at a minimum an A. Montee Ball grew up a Broncos fan and tailored his game after Terrell Davis. That’s good enough for me! It took Davis to get Elway his 2 rings; it’s going to take a Terrell Davis clone to get Peyton 2 more!

Ian Henson: A-
If there is one thing this regime has proven it is that they can’t draft stud cornerbacks or running backs… Actually, that’s not fair. Omar Bolden and Ronnie Hillman haven’t been given a proper chance to show what they are worth, outside of spot opportunities. The highlight is that the Broncos will keep pitting young talent versus young talent and ultimately it will be the fans and the team that will win. Earlier this offseason I was crossing my fingers for Denver to pick up Ahmad Bradshaw, well there is no need for that now. The team has the guy that will keep Matt Prater and Britton Colquitt off the field (and possibly fudge those percentages John Fox is always debating about). Now with Kayvon Webster, who does he remind you of? If you said Chris Harris then you would be correct and for the life of me I cannot think of a bad thing to say about a guy that compares to Chris Harris.

Tim Lynch: A
A. Montee Ball is the real deal. The Wisconsin label is going to cause people to overreact, but they have to remember that the Denver Broncos are not building a team around Ball. They just need him to provide some balance when John Fox gets all crazy with the urge to pound the rock. Crazy because pounding the rock when Peyton Manning is your quarterback is like an oxymoron or something.
If he turns out to be a stud corner, who cares if the Broncos reached to get him.
In-Com-Plete! I know next to nothing about Kayvon Webster, but the interviews and highlights make me feel like maybe John Elway and company really liked what they saw in studying this kid. Perhaps well enough to grade him much higher than everyone else. If he turns out to be a stud corner, who cares if the Broncos reached to get him. I can’t grade this pick, because I am highly skeptical, but trust the leadership enough to withhold ultimate judgement for at least one pre-season game.

Scotty Payne: B+
I love everything about Montee Ball. Yes he does have a lot of carries in his college career, but we can worry about that in the future. Ball will be a great addition to this offense. He’s a patient runner, who has great vision and has a nice jump cut. The Broncos will have DT and Decker on the outside, Welker in the slot, Manning at QB with a back like Ball in the backfield. Sign me up for that!
I honestly never heard of Webster before today. I have liked what i have read about him. He’s a fast/athletic corner who’s very aggressive. You can never have enough cornerbacks either. I’m excited to see what this guy can do.

Brian Shrout: B
I don’t know either of these players, but I’m inclined to give the Broncos a “B” for addressing depth at two important positions — McGahee and Moreno have struggled with injuries so depth is needed while Bailey and Rodgers-Cromartie are older vets so some youth at CB is a good thing.

Topher Doll: C+
Grading Broncos first round choice DT Sylvester Williams
Was Day One any better?
Overall I’d give it a C+. Ball is a solid pickup, I’d rather have traded back and gotten him, but he’ll make for good competition as a solid rotational back who is experienced. Webster is a decent developmental corner, I just think he was overdrafted. Not much the Broncos could have done with how the board played out, but the picks just seem average, which is a C.

Monty: C-Recall what I said after Day One: C is an average grade. This is below average for me. I can’t get on board with these picks. I would love to be proven wrong, but both feel like reach picks for me. I give Ball a C and Webster a D.
The Broncos decided they needed a running back, so they reached a little bit for Ball, who has a healthier toe than Eddie Lacy and that’s about it. The Broncos decided they needed a cornerback, so they reeeeeaacched for Kayvon Webster (John Fox basically said it outright), a small school prospect with potential. I was almost ready to grade this a D- or even an F, but I like the tape on both of these guys so I’ll give it just below average. Note I liked the tape on Eddie Lacy, Damontre Moore, and Alex Okafor a bit more though.

http://oneclicksportsnow.com/2013-nf...ayvon-webster/

[Agamemnon]

A C grade for Ball? Oh that's right, you think he plays like Emmitt Smith.

[Bacchus]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

A C grade for Ball? Oh that's right, you think he plays like Emmitt Smith.

What are you talking about?

These aren't my grades.

Elway thinks he plays like Terrell Davis. Is that funny to you as well?

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by Bacchus

What are you talking about?

These aren't my grades.

Elway thinks he plays like Terrell Davis. Is that funny to you as well?

Thought the first post was yours. Meh...nvm.

Oh and no, because he actually does play like Terrell Davis.

[Lestat]

i really don't see the Ball pick as anything less than a B to B+

[Bacchus]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Thought the first post was yours. Meh...nvm.

Oh and no, because he actually does play like Terrell Davis.

Nah, I am a copy and paste guy. Anything that takes too much typing or thought I stay away from.

[cutthemdown]

You couldnt trade back for Ball. The guy who said that stupid. Green Bay loved Ball, lacey, Franklin and RB they could get. For sure they would have Grabbed Ball had he been there.

I bet Elway fielded many offers to move down or up and just didn't pull the trigger. We just have to trust he couldn't get a better deal then to stay put. You don't to ever give more then you think you should have to move up or down.

We want Elway to be a GM other agents and Gms feel isn't ****ing around when he says no I have to have this to get this deal done, then sticks to it.

[Bacchus]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

You couldnt trade back for Ball. The guy who said that stupid. Green Bay loved Ball, lacey, Franklin and RB they could get. For sure they would have Grabbed Ball had he been there.

I bet Elway fielded many offers to move down or up and just didn't pull the trigger. We just have to trust he couldn't get a better deal then to stay put. You don't to ever give more then you think you should have to move up or down.

We want Elway to be a GM other agents and Gms feel isn't ****ing around when he says no I have to have this to get this deal done, then sticks to it.

The thing is if Denver would have traded down the you know for a fact GB is taking Lacy or Ball. Then there would be a huge opportunity for someone to trade in front of Denver and get the other RB.

If you like a player and want to draft that player it is very dangerous trading down and then hoping he'll be there. If you like the guy and feel he is worth a 2nd rounder than draft him otherwise you might get burned.

[cutthemdown]

Originally Posted by Lestat

i really don't see the Ball pick as anything less than a B to B+

If he can run tough inside with vision to get us first downs and some tds in the redzone its a great pick.

We just need a tough runner that gets us 3-4 yrds on first down carries. Has a knack for picking up 3-1 even when blocking breaks down. Then icing on the cake a rb who can run hard inside the redzone and score a td every other game or so. We don't really need an Adrian Peterson, A Foster, J. Charles, C. Johnson that can go for 200 yrds any game type. It would be exciting I was sort of hoping Chris Johnson would have gotten cut because of his salary.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

You couldnt trade back for Ball. The guy who said that stupid. Green Bay loved Ball, lacey, Franklin and RB they could get. For sure they would have Grabbed Ball had he been there.

Every year you hear people say this about certain picks. "You could've traded back and got him anyway." But that's a fantasy. You could try, but ultimately it's a gamble. So if there's a guy you really want at your pick and you aren't absolutely sure he'll be available later, you've got to pull the trigger. The way Elway was talking about Ball they just weren't going to risk it. He was their guy.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

If he can run tough inside with vision to get us first downs and some tds in the redzone its a great pick.

We just need a tough runner that gets us 3-4 yrds on first down carries. Has a knack for picking up 3-1 even when blocking breaks down. Then icing on the cake a rb who can run hard inside the redzone and score a td every other game or so. We don't really need an Adrian Peterson, A Foster, J. Charles, C. Johnson that can go for 200 yrds any game type. It would be exciting I was sort of hoping Chris Johnson would have gotten cut because of his salary.

Montee Ball could definitely be a guy thatcan get you 200 yards in a game. It will probably take 30-40 carries, but he definitely looks like that kind of guy to me. That's pretty much exactly what he was in college.

[cutthemdown]

Originally Posted by Bacchus

The thing is if Denver would have traded down the you know for a fact GB is taking Lacy or Ball. Then there would be a huge opportunity for someone to trade in front of Denver and get the other RB.

If you like a player and want to draft that player it is very dangerous trading down and then hoping he'll be there. If you like the guy and feel he is worth a 2nd rounder than draft him otherwise you might get burned.

Yep. And Broncos probably knew Webster wasn't rated that high but they wanted him. They looked at it and said we probably cant get him bottom of the 4th. If you want him take him, if not you have to pass. I would have liked to see the center Schwenke who went to Tenn at that spot. But maybe Broncos like what they see from Philip Blake or have some sneaky plan to ask Kuper to learn to play center.

[cutthemdown]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Montee Ball could definitely be a guy that will get you 200 yards in a game. It will probably take 30-40 carries, but he definitely looks like that kind of guy to me. That's pretty much exactly what he was in college.

Yeah i don't see him being that in the NFL without better speed. You need a few big runs to get 200 yrd games.

I bet you won't find a 200 game without some 30-40 yrd runs in it.

[cutthemdown]

4.6 speed you get caught from behind at about 25-30 yrds in the NFL. Dbacks just too fast.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

Yeah i don't see him being that in the NFL without better speed. You need a few big runs to get 200 yrd games.

I bet you won't find a 200 game without some 30-40 yrd runs in it.

He isn't that slow. He ran a 4.5 40 at his pro day. And getting 200 yards on 30-40 carries isn't about being fast anyway. It's about be able to consistently produce yards and move the chains. Terrell Davis is the perfect example, and Ball is definitely a step faster than TD. Oh and one of your examples, Arian Foster, is well documented as actually being slower than Ball.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

4.6 speed you get caught from behind at about 25-30 yrds in the NFL. Dbacks just too fast.

Backs like Ball live off 5-15 yard runs, not big gainers. You did watch TD play right? Same deal with Ball. This is a death by slow attrition, not the erratic production of big play backs like Chris Johnson or Barry Sanders.

Oh and Alfred Morris, the guy who ran for more than 1600 yards as a rookie last year only ran a 4.67 last year. You are putting way too much stock into 40 times. I would think a Bronco fan would know better.

[Agamemnon]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

Yeah i don't see him being that in the NFL without better speed. You need a few big runs to get 200 yrd games.

I bet you won't find a 200 game without some 30-40 yrd runs in it.

30-40 yards is actually about where lack of long speed gets you, not really before. TD produced them all the time. Arian Foster produces them all the time. Alfred Morris produced his share last year. I think you have been watching Moreno and think all backs who run 4.6 40s play as slow as him. Trust me, they don't.

[Drek]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

Yeah i don't see him being that in the NFL without better speed. You need a few big runs to get 200 yrd games.

I bet you won't find a 200 game without some 30-40 yrd runs in it.

He has comparable speed to Doug Martin from last year if you look at their splits and Ball's pro day.

Ball claims a sinus infection slowed him at the combine. Normally I'm pretty dismissive of excuses like that, but if you check his splits from those 40 times he ran the following (official times from NFL I believe, using NFL Draft Scout):
10 yard - 1.61
20 yard - 2.59
40 yard - 4.59

Compare that to Doug Martin's combine 40 yard splits:
10 yard - 1.60
20 yard - 2.59
40 yard - 4.46

So the thought here is "well, maybe he just lacks the top end speed and his pro day is the usual pro day padding".

Well, the scout sourced by NFL Draft Scout had Ball timed at the following splits for his pro day:
10 yard - 1.56
20 yard - 2.57
40 yard - 4.51

His 10 is perceptibly better, his 20 is about equal, and his 40 his significantly improved. This is the slow end of what scouts timed him at his pro day by the way, with the range actually being 4.46-4.51.

So we can assume he got a better start in his dash to figure the .05 improvement in his 10 yard, and it makes sense that much of that superior jump off the line disappeared by the time he got to his 20 yard time (where he was only .02 head of his and Martin's pace). But yet his 40 yard dash time comes in .08 better than his combine time, by even the most conservative timings. The only way that happens is if he was tangibly faster in his final 20 at his pro day than at the combine and faster in a way that didn't benefit his first 20 in a 1:1 fashion.

That means a tail wind, better running surface, etc. can't be the source. Those are more or less constants when running a 40 yard dash, not something that weights to the back 20 yards only.

You break it down like that and the combine time starts to seem more like the outlier, with the rest of his numbers looking pretty comparable with Doug Martin, who was quite productive for Tampa Bay last season.

[JCMElway]

Wow. Imagine the Broncos' luck if they nabbed a guy compareable to Doug Martin becasue he had an off day during the combine. If the pro day numbers are closer to true, Ball could have gone end of first, top of second.

I am not fapping yet, but I am liking this pick more and more.

[barryr]

Too much stock is put into 40 times. Jerry Rice can a slow time too, but put pads on him and guys chasing him, how many ever caught him from behind in his prime? Same with TD. Besides, any long runs are gravy considering the Broncos wanted a bigger type back to get the first downs in short yardage, which has been a weakness for years(since TD). If they want long runs, then give it to Hillman on sweeps.

[errand]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

You couldnt trade back for Ball. The guy who said that stupid. Green Bay loved Ball, lacey, Franklin and RB they could get. For sure they would have Grabbed Ball had he been there.

I was thinking the same thing..big time Wisconsin player playing in Green Bay, Wisconsin. big boost to the local economy.

[errand]

Originally Posted by cutthemdown

4.6 speed you get caught from behind at about 25-30 yrds in the NFL. Dbacks just too fast.

Jerry Rice (4.71) and Terrell Davis (4.7) wanted to say hello, and remind you that they rarely were ever caught from behind by anyone....including DB's....

[errand]

Louie Kelcher said it best about 40 yard times -

"If I have to chase a guy 40 yards, I'm not gonna catch him anyways..."