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Old 03-11-2012, 05:17 AM   #1
Hartley
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Default Why does everyone think Tebow will gleam globs of gratuitous knowledge behind Manning?

Because playing backup to Manning has been a very effective strategy for Curtis Painter's career...


And didn't Jim Sorgi's team just win the Superbowl last month? Oh wait, he was only there as a back up too.

I can see the conventional knowledge is that Tebow will develop by mere association, i get it, i wish it were just that easy. However, i just don't see where that has been evidenced in the past 14 years of Peyton's career.

Sure Aaron Rodgers learned to play under ole' #4, but Brian Griese didn't learn a thing under Elway.

The best thing for Tebow is playing time, but what is the best thing for the Denver Broncos? Personally, i feel like the Broncos are taking a bigger organizational gamble signing him than the Colts are cutting him.

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Old 03-11-2012, 05:31 AM   #2
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Because playing backup to Manning has been a very effective strategy for Curtis Painter's career...


And didn't Jim Sorgi's team just win the Superbowl last month? Oh wait, he was only there as a back up too.

I can see the conventional knowledge is that Tebow will develop by mere association, i get it, i wish it were just that easy. However, i just don't see where that has been evidenced in the past 14 years of Peyton's career.

Sure Aaron Rodgers learned to play under ole' #4, but Brian Griese didn't learn a thing under Elway.

The best thing for Tebow is playing time, but what is the best thing for the Denver Broncos? Personally, i feel like the Broncos are taking a bigger organizational gamble signing him than the Colts are cutting him.
It buys Tim time to work and develop his mind as a QB. Not only develop his mind develop his mechanics most importantly his footwork without there being a huge spotlight on him. If Manning is our QB Tebow can work behind the scenes less pressure being on him to change instantly overnight. Sure Tebow won't get many reps at all but he can work on the things that he can actually fix over time without playing in a game.

Tebow has to become a student of the game like Manning he needs to learn how to run a traditional offense. Being behind Manning will give him that and it will also give him time. Tebow can just take notes listen and as Manning is exiting the game I am sure he wouldn't mind schooling the kid up a bit.

It doesn't hurt being behind a HOF QB ask Steve Young and Aaron Rogers.

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Old 03-11-2012, 05:49 AM   #3
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Or Curtis Painter...oh maybe Manning isn't a teacher?
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Old 03-11-2012, 05:56 AM   #4
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Jim Sorgi & Curtis Painter were nobodies they wouldn't learn anything behind any starting QB in the NFL....
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Old 03-11-2012, 06:02 AM   #5
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Or Curtis Painter...oh maybe Manning isn't a teacher?
...or perhaps Painter just isn't too bright? I mean hell, Dan Orlovsky came in and played much better than Painter did. Not to mention peyton was always near QB's guiding them during games.
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Old 03-11-2012, 06:02 AM   #6
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Oh I agree that Tim's work ethic and drive greatly exceeds that of those two, but that's assuming we have Tim as a number 2 and not another painter, sorji, quinn, or some other under motivated career backup.
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Old 03-11-2012, 06:05 AM   #7
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Oh I agree that Tim's work ethic and drive greatly exceeds that of those two, but that's assuming we have Tim as a number 2 and not another painter, sorji, quinn, or some other under motivated career backup.
We draft Russell Wilson in round 5 boom. Smart kid, great work ethic, long shot in the NFL. Kinda like Tebow. If we miss Tebow that bad when hes gone lol.

Now I am not saying thats who we should draft to be QBOTF but I am not stressing I am sure we will find a true QBOTF.
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Old 03-11-2012, 06:06 AM   #8
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Jim Sorgi & Curtis Painter were nobodies they wouldn't learn anything behind any starting QB in the NFL....
Sorgi knows his station in life....and it means carrying a clipboard, while wearing a ball cap, making more coin than the average slob does....and he's fine with being his generations Don Strock
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Old 03-11-2012, 06:26 AM   #9
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Jim Sorgi & Curtis Painter were nobodies they wouldn't learn anything behind any starting QB in the NFL....
I agree with that.

What makes me wonder though how the Colts are so easily ready to let Manning go. Sure it saves them 28mil or what not, but are first round picks really that expensive these days? What was Newtons contract like 25mil or something? Regardless going by your logic it would be the optimal situation for Luck to learn a season or two under Manning, then tear it up as Manning 2.0 in 2014 or whatever.

If anyone has seen the true extent of Peyton's injury its the Colts, yet they don't want to cut the fat anywhere else on their team to keep both the GOAT Manning and his new apprentice at the same time.

It just feels like a huge expensive signing risk right now, considering that essentially Manning is to some extent an unknown quantity with a very short lifespan. I really hope i am wrong, but regardless even if we get a few wins out of it were are we in 2 years? Worse off than we are now, especially if we chose to cut ties with Tebow.
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Old 03-11-2012, 06:31 AM   #10
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I agree with that.

What makes me wonder though how the Colts are so easily ready to let Manning go. Sure it saves them 28mil or what not, but are first round picks really that expensive these days? What was Newtons contract like 25mil or something? Regardless going by your logic it would be the optimal situation for Luck to learn a season or two under Manning, then tear it up as Manning 2.0 in 2014 or whatever.

If anyone has seen the true extent of Peyton's injury its the Colts, yet they don't want to cut the fat anywhere else on their team to keep both the GOAT Manning and his new apprentice at the same time.

It just feels like a huge expensive signing risk right now, considering that essentially Manning is to some extent an unknown quantity with a very short lifespan. I really hope i am wrong, but regardless even if we get a few wins out of it were are we in 2 years? Worse off than we are now, especially if we chose to cut ties with Tebow.
No, they all think the best part of this is cutting ties with Tebow. It's 80% why they're so excited to sign a 36yo who just missed his 14th season with a serious neck injury.

But they're the best Broncos fans. Just ask them.

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Old 03-11-2012, 06:33 AM   #11
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I agree with that.

What makes me wonder though how the Colts are so easily ready to let Manning go. Sure it saves them 28mil or what not, but are first round picks really that expensive these days? What was Newtons contract like 25mil or something? Regardless going by your logic it would be the optimal situation for Luck to learn a season or two under Manning, then tear it up as Manning 2.0 in 2014 or whatever.

If anyone has seen the true extent of Peyton's injury its the Colts, yet they don't want to cut the fat anywhere else on their team to keep both the GOAT Manning and his new apprentice at the same time.

It just feels like a huge expensive signing risk right now, considering that essentially Manning is to some extent an unknown quantity with a very short lifespan. I really hope i am wrong, but regardless even if we get a few wins out of it were are we in 2 years? Worse off than we are now, especially if we chose to cut ties with Tebow.
Not many times are you in position to grab an Andrew Luck, they were thinking long term I doubt Manning or Luck would want to be there if both were to be on the roster. To me the Colt's had to make this move and start rebuilding.

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No, they all think the best part of this is cutting ties with Tebow. It's 80% why they're so excited to sign a 36yo who just missed his 14th season with a serious neck injury.
Your MacGruber aren't you admit it.....
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Old 03-11-2012, 06:34 AM   #12
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Manning did things with the Colts other QB's don't do and probably would not get trusted to do, so how much Tebow could really learn beyond maybe reading defenses seems minimal. I just don't see how the Broncos can promise their young QB he is their starter going into training camp and then loses the job even before the draft assuming Manning signs and he will laugh that off. One would think Tebow thought at the very least he might get competition and have to win the job, but that has been taken away because only ther real fools around here believe Manning would agree to sign but oh, the Broncos wouldn't be sure if he is the starter, so he has to battle in camp to win the job. Yeah, I'm sure one of the Cards' selling points is Manning, you need to beat out Kolb and their other QB's first in camp to be our QB. Tebow's future here is done and I think even if Manning doesn't come.

The Colts are in rebuild mode and did not want a controversy with 2 QB's, if the team, struggled, which is likely, some would want the young kid to get his chance and what to do with Manning then. Another reason I don't see Tebow being around if Manning signed in case the same thing happens here.

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Old 03-11-2012, 06:34 AM   #13
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Curtis Painter: you cannot teach talent. Either you have it or you don't.
Painter showed he's got zero talent. Throw him in the pile of lousy QB's.
There's a reason the Colts let him loose, cut him, or whatever term you want to use...

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Old 03-11-2012, 06:41 AM   #14
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Not many times are you in position to grab an Andrew Luck, they were thinking long term I doubt Manning or Luck would want to be there if both were to be on the roster. To me the Colt's had to make this move and start rebuilding.



..
Yeah, but we don't need any of that rebuild crap. We're on the Vikings/Al Davis Memorial senior citizen all star plan. Just win baby.
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Old 03-11-2012, 07:00 AM   #15
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Not many times are you in position to grab an Andrew Luck, they were thinking long term I doubt Manning or Luck would want to be there if both were to be on the roster. To me the Colt's had to make this move and start rebuilding.

Yes the Colts need to rebuild, but why cut Manning? Luck has zero leverage, he can be drafted 1st and still sit on the bench a year or two, just ask Aaron Rodgers or Rivers. What is so rough about Manning having to stay around as well? Worst case for Manning in that scenario is that he plays two more years at status quo, and retires when he starts to stink.

You don't think Manning would not be wiling to play on a team with a potential QB controversy? Then why is he willing to play again at all? There will be controversy where ever he goes because he has 2-3 years at best and are teams just expected to draft a QBOTF the April after he retires? Unless he can convince teams to create a Manning clause in the contract that states "no potential QB shall be sought after until i retire" there will be a media circus around any team he plays for.

Believe me, this is the beginning of the end for Manning, any incomplete pass from here on out will be talked about on sports center with the headline "is Manning done?" or "has he lost a step".
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Old 03-11-2012, 07:07 AM   #16
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Tebow would gain knowledge working with Manning, but it's the reps thing that would stunt Tebow's growth.

Some vets, ie Favre, take a few reps in practice just to keep loose and maintain rhtyhm, and then the #2 gets a fairly hefty amount of work with the first unit.

Manning isn't like that. He's got that obsessive personality (a good thing) that makes him want to do 1,000 repetitions. Tebow would see some stuff, but he's not going to get to do a lot. I'm a big believer that you can't really think your way to improvement in this league. It takes getting out there and doing it.

If we sign Manning it makes sense to move Tebow and draft a developmental QB to groom either this year or next.
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Old 03-11-2012, 07:22 AM   #17
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Tebow would gain knowledge working with Manning, but it's the reps thing that would stunt Tebow's growth.

Some vets, ie Favre, take a few reps in practice just to keep loose and maintain rhtyhm, and then the #2 gets a fairly hefty amount of work with the first unit.

Manning isn't like that. He's got that obsessive personality (a good thing) that makes him want to do 1,000 repetitions. Tebow would see some stuff, but he's not going to get to do a lot. I'm a big believer that you can't really think your way to improvement in this league. It takes getting out there and doing it.

If we sign Manning it makes sense to move Tebow and draft a developmental QB to groom either this year or next.
Yeah lets draft another new QB who can't develop because Manning doesn't help young QB's (ask Archie and the Colts)

That way the day Manning retires (or gets hurt behind one of the worst pass blocking lines in football) we're ****ed. With a bunch of decrepid old discarded Colts on the payroll.
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Old 03-11-2012, 07:23 AM   #18
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Tebow would gain knowledge working with Manning, but it's the reps thing that would stunt Tebow's growth.

Some vets, ie Favre, take a few reps in practice just to keep loose and maintain rhtyhm, and then the #2 gets a fairly hefty amount of work with the first unit.

Manning isn't like that. He's got that obsessive personality (a good thing) that makes him want to do 1,000 repetitions. Tebow would see some stuff, but he's not going to get to do a lot. I'm a big believer that you can't really think your way to improvement in this league. It takes getting out there and doing it.

If we sign Manning it makes sense to move Tebow and draft a developmental QB to groom either this year or next.
Yep, i think you are right on the money here.

There is no way Tebow and Manning can coexist, at least not in any constructive manner for Tebow. If we take Manning, we have no choice but to sever ties with Timmy.

Tebow and Manning are to fundamentally different...

The foundation of our team changed last year to support and find reasonable success with Tebow. Enter Peyton, and the team must change again to support Manning as at prototypical pocket passer, 2-3 years of this and the team will look drastically different in 2015. Even if Tebow learned the ropes under #18, we would have to under go another drastic change back to the Tebow methodology. Essentially back to square one again with Tebow, does not make sense to keep them both... left or right, elway must choose only one, you can't have your cake and eat it too.
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Old 03-11-2012, 07:34 AM   #19
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Yep, i think you are right on the money here.

There is no way Tebow and Manning can coexist, at least not in any constructive manner for Tebow. If we take Manning, we have no choice but to sever ties with Timmy.

Tebow and Manning are to fundamentally different...

The foundation of our team changed last year to support and find reasonable success with Tebow. Enter Peyton, and the team must change again to support Manning as at prototypical pocket passer, 2-3 years of this and the team will look drastically different in 2015. Even if Tebow learned the ropes under #18, we would have to under go another drastic change back to the Tebow methodology. Essentially back to square one again with Tebow, does not make sense to keep them both... left or right, elway must choose only one, you can't have your cake and eat it too.
Dude the foundation of the team didn't change for Tebow. He was forced to make due with what we had. He was given lemons and made lemonade. Peyton's team was built around him for YEARS before he got anywhere.

We played a spread option QB on a team that could barely field 4 WRs. And we actually shipped our best one right before Tebow played. Tim was dealt a **** hand. And he worked his ass off and got through it.

But who wants another 15 years of that when you can have 2 years of Peyton exiting rhe playoffs early (if he can stay on the field)
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Old 03-11-2012, 07:46 AM   #20
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The topic is moot because they are going to trade Tebow away if they get Manning. Period.
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Old 03-11-2012, 08:33 AM   #21
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In the Colts' system Peyton's backups did hours and hours of film study each week to help create the game plan for each game. They were judge on and kept around based upon their ability to do that and not to back up Peyton who until this year was incredibly durable.

Tebow could excel in that role, but he's apparently already a film room all-star so I doubt it would help him that much.
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Old 03-11-2012, 08:41 AM   #22
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In the Colts' system Peyton's backups did hours and hours of film study each week to help create the game plan for each game. They were judge on and kept around based upon their ability to do that and not to back up Peyton who until this year was incredibly durable.

Tebow could excel in that role, but he's apparently already a film room all-star so I doubt it would help him that much.
I like Tebow, but do you really get the impression he's bright?
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Old 03-11-2012, 08:41 AM   #23
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I think signing PM will mean the end of Tebow in Denver. Elway's done with all the drama. If Peyton comes in, Tebow goes out.
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Old 03-11-2012, 08:43 AM   #24
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I like Tebow, but do you really get the impression he's bright?
I've seen numerous college and pro coaches/scouts praise both his dedication to film study and knowledge of offenses.
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Old 03-11-2012, 08:43 AM   #25
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I think signing PM will mean the end of Tebow in Denver. Elway's done with all the drama. If Peyton comes in, Tebow goes out.
But if he's not in the AFC championship next year, the drama has only just begun.
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