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Old 03-10-2012, 07:41 AM   #1701
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Originally Posted by winstoncup bronco View Post
There you have it. I heard his parents said good things too.

I didn't see the video, and maybe he looked good throwing in a controlled environment without guys breathing down his neck, and without getting his bell rung on a hard sack or whatever. Maybe we can petition the league to ban all types of tackles and pressure on Manning, so this way all this worrying about his neck will be moot.
Never said it wasn't a concern, I just don't think it's the very high one you do.....every player in the nfl is one hit away from a wheelchair.

and I'm pretty sure the broncos will put him through a workout, and I'm pretty sure peyton would expect that because nobody's gonna pay him money without seeing him throw

and it's amazing how the tebow fans can pull out a video of him working out at ucla in a completely controlled environment with nobody running around trying to tackle tebow either, and it is considered etched in stone that he is taken quantum leaps of improvement....

bottom line is someone asked has anyone seen peyton throw the ball.... I provided proof that somebody has.
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Old 03-10-2012, 07:49 AM   #1702
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I agree, had Tebow started the whole year we might not have 1-4.....and I stand corrected on the seeding, but my point is still valid in that with Manning as our QB, our chances of success is greater. Like Papa Johns says "better ingredients, better pizza"
I don't think anyone is arguing that Manning isn't better than Tebow.

For me, the argument is, is Manning a better option.

Signing Manning is going for broke, period. You're signing splashy FA's to big contracts, just to build as fast as you can. Maybe even trading draft picks for other team's backups or disgruntled starters.

And then, assuming Manning plays 3 years, you better be able to look back and have something to show for it. Not, well, it was so exciting. Not, he sure threw for a lot of yards. Not, well we lost, but we sure lost pretty, didn't we? This move is to bring home the Lombardi(s). Anything less than a SB win makes this move an abject failure.

And I'm not saying Tebow would win a SB in that time, but at least we wouldn't be mortgaging the teams future either. If Tim doesn't show improvement, or the team just stops winning with him, then yeah, you're moving on, without aging FA vets taking up cap space because you thought they would fast track you to the SB.
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Old 03-10-2012, 08:02 AM   #1703
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I don't think anyone is arguing that Manning isn't better than Tebow.

For me, the argument is, is Manning a better option.

Signing Manning is going for broke, period. You're signing splashy FA's to big contracts, just to build as fast as you can. Maybe even trading draft picks for other team's backups or disgruntled starters.

And then, assuming Manning plays 3 years, you better be able to look back and have something to show for it. Not, well, it was so exciting. Not, he sure threw for a lot of yards. Not, well we lost, but we sure lost pretty, didn't we? This move is to bring home the Lombardi(s). Anything less than a SB win makes this move an abject failure.

And I'm not saying Tebow would win a SB in that time, but at least we wouldn't be mortgaging the teams future either. If Tim doesn't show improvement, or the team just stops winning with him, then yeah, you're moving on, without aging FA vets taking up cap space because you thought they would fast track you to the SB.
Really don't understand why more people don't get this.

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Old 03-10-2012, 08:22 AM   #1704
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Manning at 50% is a million times better then wonder boy is and might ever be. I'd take 1-3 years of real QB play again. I want this to happen to regain league rep for this org and myself too. At the present I don't think this FO can pull off a coup of landing any top player like we did in Elway era.

Be real Manning is not coming here anyways no worries we are back to avg qb play for next 5 yrs. Seriously I see concerns about signing Manning too and his neck issue.
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Old 03-10-2012, 08:36 AM   #1705
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Manning is just enjoying the wine and dine treatment. You rarely go to first team visited. I think EFX should of sent him on the town with the idiot K prater. He would of showed him a better time.
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Old 03-10-2012, 08:45 AM   #1706
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I really don't understand the argument though that a selling point the Broncos have is playing in a weak division and signing with Miami would be bad for him because they have tougher teams in their division. So we want to spend money on Manning who would really consider such a thing in his decision? Oh no, their division is too hard. And here I was told Tebow should be happy to compete for his job with Manning and be a pro, yet here is a veteran QB who would be scared to compete in a tougher division. Makes so much sense.
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Old 03-10-2012, 08:46 AM   #1707
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Originally Posted by winstoncup bronco View Post
I don't think anyone is arguing that Manning isn't better than Tebow.

For me, the argument is, is Manning a better option.

Signing Manning is going for broke, period. You're signing splashy FA's to big contracts, just to build as fast as you can. Maybe even trading draft picks for other team's backups or disgruntled starters.

And then, assuming Manning plays 3 years, you better be able to look back and have something to show for it. Not, well, it was so exciting. Not, he sure threw for a lot of yards. Not, well we lost, but we sure lost pretty, didn't we? This move is to bring home the Lombardi(s). Anything less than a SB win makes this move an abject failure.

And I'm not saying Tebow would win a SB in that time, but at least we wouldn't be mortgaging the teams future either. If Tim doesn't show improvement, or the team just stops winning with him, then yeah, you're moving on, without aging FA vets taking up cap space because you thought they would fast track you to the SB.
One could also make the argument that starting Tebow and grooming him will also mortgage the teams future.

You could play your what if game until you are blue in the face…

The bottom line is that Manning is a far better option than Tebow. He could also be a great source for Tebow to get better.

I hope Manning signs here. Denver makes a few playoff runs, Tebow is used in goal line and short yardage situations and becomes a better QB because Manning is here.

But hey, that's just me being optimistic…….feel free to go back to pissing and moaning about **** that hasn't happened yet.
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Old 03-10-2012, 08:47 AM   #1708
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I really don't understand the argument though that a selling point the Broncos have is playing in a weak division and signing with Miami would be bad for him because they have tougher teams in their division. So we want to spend money on Manning who would really consider such a thing in his decision? Oh no, their division is too hard. And here I was told Tebow should be happy to compete for his job with Manning and be a pro, yet here is a veteran QB who would be scared to compete in a tougher division. Makes so much sense.
I don't know. I mean his whole career has kind of been built on playing in a garbage division...
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:07 AM   #1709
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Come down off the ledge and start using some rational thinking skills. Give it a try. Nobody's saying we would've beat the Pats last year with Manning. But this year with Manning and the other improvements we make, if indeed this ends up happening, maybe we will.
Problem is (as we've all said over and over and over again) that signing all these Colts scraps is going to keep us from any big defensive signings.

As it is- Peyton's only beaten Tom once in the Playoffs. I doubt Frankenmanning will fare much better with a defense that spots Tom 40 plus per game.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:13 AM   #1710
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And so the Broncos would only do this for a Manning type of QB? Manning signs and Tebow is expected to believe that in a couple years or so, he is the starter now after already believing at least once if not twice he had the job? The bottom line is if the Broncos don't believe Tebow will develop into a QB, then there is no point of him being on the roster. Trade him and move on already.
That's not at all what I said. I'm talking about the scenario where we don't sign Manning.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:15 AM   #1711
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http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/bron...rumors-3-10-12
The guys over at itsalloverfatman are keeping track of todays tweets.

Sounds like he's still in Denver, and Bowlen really impressed him, heh.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:17 AM   #1712
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http://www.itsalloverfatman.com/bron...rumors-3-10-12
The guys over at itsalloverfatman are keeping track of todays tweets.

Sounds like he's still in Denver, and Bowlen really impressed him, heh.
Translation: Bowlen and Elway promised that they would let him do whatever he wants and will go out and get whatever players he desires.

Oh joy...
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:19 AM   #1713
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Problem is (as we've all said over and over and over again) that signing all these Colts scraps is going to keep us from any big defensive signings.

As it is- Peyton's only beaten Tom once in the Playoffs. I doubt Frankenmanning will fare much better with a defense that spots Tom 40 plus per game.
You're wasting your breath. These people really can't see the disaster looming over this franchise. They've been blinded by the glitter of having pretty passing in Denver again.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:19 AM   #1714
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One could also make the argument that starting Tebow and grooming him will also mortgage the teams future.
Not really. If Tebow gets all the reps in practice and plays a full season, we'll know, fairly definitively, by the end of 2012 whether he's the future. If not we move on, and we'll have been able to invest more in the supporting cast for whoever they bring in to replace Tebow.

That's not the case with Manning. Not only will Peyton be a huge investment that will draw resources, but with Manning we're far more likely to invest in older veterans who offer short term impact. If that fails, in three years we'll have an aging roster and undeveloped young players. Just like we always did with Shanny.

With Tebow you take a building approach. With Manning the approach has to be to win immediately.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:23 AM   #1715
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Problem is (as we've all said over and over and over again) that signing all these Colts scraps is going to keep us from any big defensive signings.

As it is- Peyton's only beaten Tom once in the Playoffs. I doubt Frankenmanning will fare much better with a defense that spots Tom 40 plus per game.
Well that assumes we sign all those "Colts scraps" and do nothing else.

As far as Peyton vs. Tom, if Manning didn't have the Brady/Belichick to contend with his career numbers would be even more impressive. The Pats have just generally been a better all around team, and Brady was sometimes the better QB. No shame in that.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:23 AM   #1716
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With Tebow you take a building approach. With Manning the approach has to be to win immediately.
And this is why the majority of people on this board are liking the idea of bringing Manning in. They're just looking for immediate gratification rather than long-term success. They just don't have the patience for the latter.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:25 AM   #1717
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With Tebow you take a building approach. With Manning the approach has to be to win immediately.
Agree, but it's problematic that building around Tebow requires building more towards a less traditional offense than you'd put around Manning. And if Tebow doesn't work out you have to completely shift gears again.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:25 AM   #1718
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As far as Peyton vs. Tom, if Manning didn't have the Brady/Belichick to contend with his career numbers would be even more impressive. The Pats have just generally been a better all around team, and Brady was sometimes the better QB. No shame in that.
And yet you fail to see why transplanting Manning to Denver will utterly fail to result in anything meaningful. Amazing...
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:29 AM   #1719
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Agree, but it's problematic that building around Tebow requires building more towards a less traditional offense than you'd put around Manning. And if Tebow doesn't work out you have to completely shift gears again.
Please tell me how building an offense more akin to what he played with in college would hurt this team. That offense had players at every position that translated easily to pro-style offenses when they got to the NFL. Virtually everything you ever say about Tebow makes no sense. It's amazing.

Besides, they've already made it pretty clear they don't plan on customizing the offense to Tebow. Tebow was going to be forced to fit their scheme, and if he failed they were going to move on. This seemed pretty clear from what they had said. Not that we can believe anything they say...
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:38 AM   #1720
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Agree, but it's problematic that building around Tebow requires building more towards a less traditional offense than you'd put around Manning. And if Tebow doesn't work out you have to completely shift gears again.
Nothing to see here but fallacy.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:40 AM   #1721
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Yes, let's run urban meyer's offense in the nlf. why not? And no brady is not running it.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:43 AM   #1722
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Winning immediately would be so hard to take.

Once again, the NFL is year to year. Five year or even three year plans are so much crap.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:47 AM   #1723
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Winning immediately would be so hard to take.

Once again, the NFL is year to year. Five year or even three year plans are so much crap.
Well, considering Doom was out all of 2010, the defense last year had two new starters at dline, a new Will and Mike (still needs upgrade) and one full time safety starter and a couple of guys filling in at corner. I think that today, you can turn over a roster fully in three years.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:50 AM   #1724
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And this is why the majority of people on this board are liking the idea of bringing Manning in. They're just looking for immediate gratification rather than long-term success. They just don't have the patience for the latter.
Sorry dude I don't see Tebows development vs Mannings decline, making Tebow a better. QB then Manning in the next four years.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:53 AM   #1725
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Please tell me how building an offense more akin to what he played with in college would hurt this team.
Yes, that style has been a smashing success in the NFL...
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