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Old 02-03-2012, 07:58 AM   #551
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It's funny, as much as you hate Orton one would think you'd be smart enough to understand why some people were upset after Orton outplayed Tebow in a late season game and the Broncos lost to the Chiefs. Remember that game, jhns? It was particularly upsetting after Tebow looked so awful in the prior week embarassment in Buffalo as well. But clearly you like getting embarassed...
How dare we think that you like Orton more than the winning QB!



Way to prove what an idiot you are, again.
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:03 AM   #552
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Harder schedule + more wins = worse team. You argue this as you call others stupid...

You are too stupid for message boards.

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You're too caught up in W/L. Go check out Peyton's Manning's W/L his rookie year. I bet some other rookies outperformed him in W/L that year, and certainly other years. So I guess that makes them superior to Manning in your world. Good to know.

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What does Manning, or any QB, have to do with what I said? You are proving to be far too stupid for message boards again.

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You really can't figure this out on your own? And I'm the one who's too stupid?
So, you claim I just spin conversations. Here is one that you still won't explain to me. This was the conversation. There is no possible way for me to spin it. Now explain what QBs have to do with what I said.

Yes, you are the one that is stupid.
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:29 AM   #553
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Come on, Rabb. You're better than this. Don't resort to jhns/Dedhed crap.
Oh I am not resorting to that tactic, I was being serious though...you and I have generally seen eye to eye so I don't have a personal dog in the argument here.

I am just saying, we had a guy that seemed to be a prototypical QB and we actually regressed, we now have a guy that I look at as having a TON of potential, someone like the NFL doesn't have right now and I just cannot see not being excited about it.

That is my point really, I don't see how any fan can look at this last season and not be optimistic. Will he work out? I have no idea, this season will be a major test and put to bed any argument for or against the guy since he will have an entire off season to work with coaches and presumably a team built around him. It's just impossible for me to look past the end result, we won games including a playoff game where we were told we had no chance and he played like a complete QB in.
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:29 AM   #554
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So, you claim I just spin conversations.
Sigh. jhns, you and others are either explicitly or implicitly suggesting that Tebow > Newton because of W/L. You use this argument all the time. The whole "he took a 1-4 team and went 7-4" point. Sound familiar? I brought up Peyton Manning because he went 3-13 his rookie year. So clearly W/L isn't the best way to evaluate a rookie QB. You can obfuscate all you want to avoid this point but it isn't going away.
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:33 AM   #555
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Sigh. jhns, you and others are either explicitly or implicitly suggesting that Tebow > Newton because of W/L. You use this argument all the time. The whole "he took a 1-4 team and went 7-4" point. Sound familiar? I brought up Peyton Manning because he went 3-13 his rookie year. So clearly W/L isn't the best way to evaluate a rookie QB. You can obfuscate all you want to avoid this point but it isn't going away.
Now explain what any of this has to do with what I posted. That first quote is what you responded to. I am not an idiot like you. I know what point you are trying to make. That isn't what I asked... You continually prove you can't keep up with simple conversations. You are an idiot.

You tell me the QBs w/l record doesn't mean anything in a post were I attributed the record to the team... How do you not see how retarded this is? You are the one that saw wins and put it all on the QB...
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:41 AM   #556
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I am not an idiot like you.
you have way to high of an opinion of yourself
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:44 AM   #557
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you have way to high of an opinion of yourself
Yeah right. I was being pretty modest in that post.
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:45 AM   #558
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Yeah right. I was being pretty modest in that post.
I know I am right , you are a legend in your own mind
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:48 AM   #559
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I know I am right , you are a legend in your own mind
Well, yeah. I am a legend in everyones mind.
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:49 AM   #560
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That's a fair point. Eli was pretty bad early in his career. I think one of many differences is that Eli showed more ability and potential as a passer. Didn't have the mechanical flaws and limitations that Tebow does.
Always have a reason to look at the downside where Tebow is concerned, don't you?
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:50 AM   #561
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Well, yeah. I am a legend in everyones mind.
if you say so
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:53 AM   #562
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I am just saying...
Fair points. Hard not to be happy with the season overall, and hard not to like Tebow. I understand the optimism even if I don't fully agree with it. I am concerned with his ability to become the more "prototypical" QB that he's going to have to become. Elway has commented numerous times that he wants, and the team needs, someone who can stand in the pocket and make throws. And the fact that he keeps making those comments, and just made one again recently, suggests that he knows Tebow isn't there yet and may not get there. I think I'm being rational and realistic, some others think I'm being a hater and a pessimist. That's fine, I understand that to a degree. But clearly some people are a little bit too emotionally wrapped up in a player when they go so far to bash people who criticize a player. Particularly hypocrites like jhns who go out of there way to bash players and coaches but for some reason Tebow is off limits...
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:56 AM   #563
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Who do I go out of my way to bash? McDaniels? Great point. He really didn't deserve it. Unwarranted!

Tony is too stupid for message boards. He is also a liar. You are not rational with Tebow. I can easily prove this.

I can show you saying that we shouldn't compare a young Newton to Orton. I can show you complaining about people not holding Tebow to the same standards as Orton(even though he was ten times better). I can show you saying Tebow shouldn't play another game. I can show you saying the 9-7 Tebow is a complete failure because you want a winner.

Do.you really want me to start posting this stuff again, liar?

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Old 02-03-2012, 08:57 AM   #564
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Always have a reason to look at the downside where Tebow is concerned, don't you?
Maybe. But what you call "downside" I call reality.
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:59 AM   #565
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Fair points. Hard not to be happy with the season overall, and hard not to like Tebow. I understand the optimism even if I don't fully agree with it. I am concerned with his ability to become the more "prototypical" QB that he's going to have to become. Elway has commented numerous times that he wants, and the team needs, someone who can stand in the pocket and make throws. And the fact that he keeps making those comments, and just made one again recently, suggests that he knows Tebow isn't there yet and may not get there. I think I'm being rational and realistic, some others think I'm being a hater and a pessimist. That's fine, I understand that to a degree. But clearly some people are a little bit too emotionally wrapped up in a player when they go so far to bash people who criticize a player. Particularly hypocrites like jhns who go out of there way to bash players and coaches but for some reason Tebow is off limits...
well reasoned post. I almost believed it until I remembered you gave up on the Tebow experriment after 6 bad quarters.


quitting in a young player who turned the team around and saved the season after 6 bad wuarters not only makes you a hater, but a fag too.

So own up to it or get the **** out of here.
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Old 02-03-2012, 08:59 AM   #566
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Maybe. But what you call "downside" I call reality.
The downside is reality, so is the upside. Choosing to only look at one makes you look stupid.
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Old 02-03-2012, 09:02 AM   #567
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Fair points. Hard not to be happy with the season overall, and hard not to like Tebow. I understand the optimism even if I don't fully agree with it. I am concerned with his ability to become the more "prototypical" QB that he's going to have to become. Elway has commented numerous times that he wants, and the team needs, someone who can stand in the pocket and make throws. And the fact that he keeps making those comments, and just made one again recently, suggests that he knows Tebow isn't there yet and may not get there. I think I'm being rational and realistic, some others think I'm being a hater and a pessimist. That's fine, I understand that to a degree. But clearly some people are a little bit too emotionally wrapped up in a player when they go so far to bash people who criticize a player. Particularly hypocrites like jhns who go out of there way to bash players and coaches but for some reason Tebow is off limits...
No, you're are just being your usual self is all, which is as big a hypocrite as anyone around here.
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Old 02-03-2012, 09:03 AM   #568
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The downside is reality, so is the upside. Choosing to only look at one makes you look stupid.
Agreed
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Old 02-03-2012, 09:14 AM   #569
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I hate losing which is why I'm done with the Tebow experiment. He failed miserably the last two weeks. He came up really small on Sunday and got outplayed by Kyle Orton. Winning 7 of 8 got a lot of people thinking that Tebow played well but the reality is he never really played all that well other than some bursts here and there. That's not going to get it done in the NFL. You need your QB to be consistently good. I don't see any evidence that Tebow can be that guy. I was rooting for the kid too but reality has set in. You keep clinging to the mirage.
Rational. The QB that is 7-4 at this point, is a failure because you like winning. Very, very rational.

That same thread also contains many posts were you claim Tebow sucked so bad in the first NE game, that you just can't understand how peoples eyes weren't opened. A game were he went for 300 yards, 2 TDs, and 1 fumble. You are rational and the rest of us are hypocrites though...

Too funny.
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Old 02-03-2012, 09:22 AM   #570
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Old 02-03-2012, 09:25 AM   #571
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well reasoned post. I almost believed it until I remembered you gave up on the Tebow experriment after 6 bad quarters...
I think some of you forget, or mis-remember, the overall circumstances:

>We had the great 7-1 run. I was cautious about Tebow but slowly started to come around as the run continued.
>The run came to a screeching halt when we got killed by NE. Although Tebow isn't to blame for the loss there was no "Tebow magic" in that one.
>Needing a bounce back the following week Tebow played horribly and we got blown out by Buffalo.
>If reality hadn't already settled in it did the following week when we got beat at home by Orton and the Chiefs and Tebow again played poorly.

So I concluded, perhaps rashly, perhaps incorrectly, that the success was more of a mirage than reality. Tebow played poorly in large parts of some of those wins. There were a lot of circumstances (mediocre to poor opponents, injured key opponents players, miracle plays, opponent mistakes, etc.) that supported the feeling that the reality wasn't as pretty as the 7-1 run. Roll this up with another late season collapse and the need to back into the playoffs and I was an unhappy Broncos fan.

What's odd to me is that while I can understand the optimism and admiration many have for Tebow, some of you can't seem to understand those that have doubts. Even here, where I think I've been perfectly reasonable, people have to continue to play the "hater" card just because they don't agree with my opinion.
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Old 02-03-2012, 09:27 AM   #572
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I think some of you forget, or mis-remember, the overall circumstances:

>We had the great 7-1 run. I was cautious about Tebow but slowly started to come around as the run continued.
>The run came to a screeching halt when we got killed by NE. Although Tebow isn't to blame for the loss there was no "Tebow magic" in that one.
>Needing a bounce back the following week Tebow played horribly and we got blown out by Buffalo.
>If reality hadn't already settled in it did the following week when we got beat at home by Orton and the Chiefs and Tebow again played poorly.

So I concluded, perhaps rashly, perhaps incorrectly, that the success was more of a mirage than reality. Tebow played poorly in large parts of some of those wins. There were a lot of circumstances (mediocre to poor opponents, injured key opponents players, miracle plays, opponent mistakes, etc.) that supported the feeling that the reality wasn't as pretty as the 7-1 run. Roll this up with another late season collapse and the need to back into the playoffs and I was an unhappy Broncos fan.

What's odd to me is that while I can understand the optimism and admiration many have for Tebow, some of you can't seem to understand those that have doubts. Even here, where I think I've been perfectly reasonable, people have to continue to play the "hater" card just because they don't agree with my opinion.
They play the hater card because you aren't at all reasonable. You are an idiot.
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Old 02-03-2012, 10:04 AM   #573
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I think some of you forget, or mis-remember, the overall circumstances:
I think that you are the one who mis-remembers (derp) the overall circumstances.

This team went 4-12 a year ago, largely led by an accomplished passer, who because of his passing prowess was again given the reins to the team to start this season. Promptly falling on his face and leading the team into a 1-4 hole, and the franchise to the lowest point, perhaps, in it's history.

The reins of the mostly dead franchise were given to Tebow and in the course of two months changed the entire direction of the ship, and the culture within the locker room. Leading a team that had no right to be there based on their talent level, not only to a playoff appearance, but to a victory over the best passing defense in football.

You can continue to question Tebow and his future all you want, but he has already done what none of the "pure passers" could do in Denver for the last 6 years. There is very obviously something about the guy that is special, and to deny that, and what he accomplished this year, because you can't look outside of the "prototype" box is absurd to me.

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Old 02-03-2012, 10:05 AM   #574
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The funniest part...
Sorry, Rev, but nothing is funnier than this (to the question of how many FO's would take Tebow over Newton):

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Answer: The majority of them, if not all.
Sad that you're so upset because somebody dares to disagree with you about something. I'm not taking this personally, but clearly you are.
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Old 02-03-2012, 10:10 AM   #575
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Sorry, Rev, but nothing is funnier than this (to the question of how many FO's would take Tebow over Newton):



Sad that you're so upset because somebody dares to disagree with you about something. I'm not taking this personally, but clearly you are.
No, the funny part is that you're so utterly reliant on an idea that is pure fantasy; You have absolutely no idea how many GMs would take Tebow. None. Not even the shred of an idea, but you speak as though it's the golden fact that supports all you say.
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