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Old 01-29-2012, 12:25 PM   #1
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Default Defensive Starters Coming Back from Injury Next Year

Vickerson
Warren
The Squid
Cassius

I really liked what I saw from Cassius before he went down this year, both defensively and on special teams, and syd'quan (imo) is pretty special.

We didn't even get to see what Warren was capable of in our system, and Vickerson (who was a great pickup and played well last year) got injured early.

Obviously, I'm not the most knowledgeable guy in terms of talent evaluation, but isn't there a little room for excitement next year? 4 Potential starters coming back, might take a little pressure off of the draft?

I know we HAVE to get some more D-line help, but after sitting back and looking at what we have coming back from injuries, it isn't AS dire a situation as I had initially thought.

Discuss.
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Old 01-29-2012, 12:29 PM   #2
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I'm pretty sure neither cb were, would have been, or will be in the near future, defensive starters, except due to injuries.
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Old 01-29-2012, 12:29 PM   #3
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1 potential starter coming back
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Old 01-29-2012, 12:31 PM   #4
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We only need one player. TEBOW!!!!
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Old 01-29-2012, 12:33 PM   #5
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What are your guy's thoughts on Vaughn and Thompson? They BOTH look better than Mr. Burnt Toast, but that isn't really saying too much. Not starter material in your opinions? What are they missing? And can they eventually turn the corner?
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Old 01-29-2012, 12:35 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Boobs McGee View Post
What are your guy's thoughts on Vaughn and Thompson? They BOTH look better than Mr. Burnt Toast, but that isn't really saying too much. Not starter material in your opinions? What are they missing? And can they eventually turn the corner?
If our second CB is on the team right now, we are going to be in trouble.
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Old 01-29-2012, 12:36 PM   #7
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Harris probably is going to play a bigger role than any of them, but I thought Thompson was on pace to be an excellent nickel corner. Basically it comes down to this:

Bailey, ________ (Replace Goodman with a #2), Harris, Thompson and Vaughn. Wouldn't want the latter three to start, but they are fine in those roles. Just need an heir to Champ and a replacement for toastie toasts.
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Old 01-29-2012, 12:44 PM   #8
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Squid is a good option at nickle, and vaughn is good for special teams and depth. Both the DT's are good depth, but no better or worse than thomas, Bunkley.
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Old 01-29-2012, 01:54 PM   #9
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I agree with you. I don't necessarily think DT is a huge need. I also think were pretty solid (just old) on the outside, Goodman isn't elite but he's not even close to as horrible as people think. The younger guys are serviceable, and Harris is a very very solid nickel.

If theres a need for DT then it has to be a first rounder, any middle rounder is just gonna be another of what we already have, average starters.
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Old 01-29-2012, 01:55 PM   #10
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Goodman isn't elite but he's not even close to as horrible as people think
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Old 01-29-2012, 01:56 PM   #11
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1 potential starter coming back
Vickerson or Warren? DT must be a priority in draft, eventually! We say it every year.
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Old 01-29-2012, 02:04 PM   #12
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I agree with you. I don't necessarily think DT is a huge need.
Ummmm, what?!?

Who do we have under contract at DT?

Ty Warren? That guy hasn't had a healthy, productive year since about 2007.

Vickerson? Coming off a leg injury and he's probably not even a league average player right now.

Anyone else that's not a FA?
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Old 01-29-2012, 02:17 PM   #13
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Warren and Vickerson are the only starter types on that list.
hopefully Warren comes back in a big way and does well for us. he'll be a big key in Del Rio's defense. he loves big DT's to clog the front.
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Old 01-29-2012, 02:37 PM   #14
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Hopefully we resign Bunkley and Thomas and they can form an effective rotation with Vickerson. I'm not expecting much from Warren after so much IR time over the past few years.

We can look at a DT later in the draft if we resign the above and focus on the back 7 on defense in the first two rounds.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:03 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Boobs McGee View Post
Vickerson
Warren
The Squid
Cassius
Discuss.
Not a starter in that list.

Vickerson - cut by the Titans when they were pulling solid DTs left and right. Cut by Seattle who didn't want him in their 4-3 either. Just because he was one of the least depressing players in a front seven that got sodomized weekly in 2010 doesn't mean ****. That was a position change, a scheme change, and 30 pounds ago, not to mention he wasn't even good then. If he's anything but a backup we've failed to address the biggest talent deficiency on this team for yet another year.

Warren - another year on the wrong side of 30. Two years of not playing football isn't real conducive to 300+ pounders being in good condition. Hasn't been healthy in literally two full seasons. Upside he's a solid run stuffer we need to spell OFTEN. Down side he doesn't play another game again. That down side is pretty damn likely too. I'd cut him and save the $4M. Spend it on someone who can suit up.

Squid - Too slow. Too small. Too weak. Tons of heart and great football IQ but he can't win the battle against 80% of the WRs in the NFL off the ball, he can't run with them down the field, and he can't out jump them for the ball. I like him as a special teams gunner and a dime corner that we can use almost entirely in zone, but he's too limited to see the number of snaps a nickel corner does on a quality D.

Vaughn - Really fast but he's a hot mess at actually playing corner. Makes a lot of bad decisions. Hell, he's a better returner and he makes a lot of bad decisions doing that too. As ST depth/5th corner he isn't horrible, but this guy is replaceable.

Neither corner is nearly as good as Harris, who actually has NFL level speed, strength, and good football IQ. I'm not sure if Harris can be more than a solid nickel corner, but he's at least got that going for him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iforgotmypassword View Post
Goodman isn't elite but he's not even close to as horrible as people think.
He's exactly as bad as people think. He used to have great speed and would be tight on his man even though he couldn't win jump balls. Now he can't even run with the vast majority of the league's WRs. He's never been a good tackler, he's never been good at helping in the run game. Where's the value here? If we go back to that well for another season we're going to look REAL bad.

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If theres a need for DT then it has to be a first rounder, any middle rounder is just gonna be another of what we already have, average starters.
I'd agree that we need to hit DT EARLY, but what we already have is not "average starters". This team hasn't seen an average starter in a very long time. I mean Trevor Pryce at DT long. Maybe Gerard Warren for a brief instant in 2005, but even that was borderline. We run a bunch of one dimensional journeymen out at DT and we get the kind of results you'd expect from that level of "investment". Bunkley is one of the best DTs we've seen in a long time here and he can't rush the passer at all. He's a run stuffer and he isn't Vince Wilfork. Hell, he's not even Red Bryant.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:15 PM   #16
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1 potential starter coming back
Two possibly. Squid, Vaughn and Vickerson are all good rotational players and offer good depth.

I know it's a popular theme every year to trade down in the draft, but the #25 spot is prime for trading down. Get a future first and a 2nd this year... Or a deal like what we gave for Tebow (2nd, 3rd, & 4th). Perhaps we can get a Lamar Miller & Spence combo package in the 2nd. Or Burfict who seems to be slipping pre draft.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:20 PM   #17
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Two possibly. Squid, Vaughn and Vickerson are all good rotational players and offer good depth.

I know it's a popular theme every year to trade down in the draft, but the #25 spot is prime for trading down. Get a future first and a 2nd this year... Or a deal like what we gave for Tebow (2nd, 3rd, & 4th). Perhaps we can get a Lamar Miller & Spence combo package in the 2nd. Or Burfict who seems to be slipping pre draft.
Burfict can't play with Von Miller. Spence doesn't upgrade anything either. And Squid and Vaughn are dramatically over-rated on this board for god knows what reason.
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:24 PM   #18
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I'd suggest who I'd like to see Denver pick up in FA for the defense but apparently I have to be smoking something first.

And if Warren and Vickerson are our starting DT's...ugh...


Last edited by Archer81; 01-29-2012 at 05:20 PM..
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Old 01-29-2012, 04:45 PM   #19
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The Broncos need more talent at CB, guys with speed and tackling ability. Other than Champ and Harris, who is not a starter IMO, the CB spot lacks talent and proven players. Goodman is old and only average at best and the others they have on the roster have not really proven anything. A free agent CB and one in the draft rather high would be nice.
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Old 01-29-2012, 05:08 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Beantown Bronco View Post
Ummmm, what?!?

Who do we have under contract at DT?

Ty Warren? That guy hasn't had a healthy, productive year since about 2007.

Vickerson? Coming off a leg injury and he's probably not even a league average player right now.

Anyone else that's not a FA?
Obviously im assuming we resign....
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Old 01-29-2012, 05:10 PM   #21
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Vickerson
Warren
The Squid
Cassius

I really liked what I saw from Cassius before he went down this year, both defensively and on special teams, and syd'quan (imo) is pretty special.

We didn't even get to see what Warren was capable of in our system, and Vickerson (who was a great pickup and played well last year) got injured early.

Obviously, I'm not the most knowledgeable guy in terms of talent evaluation, but isn't there a little room for excitement next year? 4 Potential starters coming back, might take a little pressure off of the draft?

I know we HAVE to get some more D-line help, but after sitting back and looking at what we have coming back from injuries, it isn't AS dire a situation as I had initially thought.

Discuss.
Where are the starters? Am I missing something?
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