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Old 11-25-2011, 12:33 PM   #1
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As I was thinking about this weekend's game extra the time off for the broncos, I was trying to guess what "wrinkles" our coaches will come up with this week for the offense. So, I took a look down memory lane to watch Tebow's 2009 year when he broke the SEC TD record. I thought it might do some good to see why they were so potent.

I found myself asking. Is Tebow really such a bad passer? Are we using him properly? Why do they call so many quick passes and fake run plays to trick the defense? Why don't we do any of this?

I absolutely love the run game we are establishing, but I kept asking - are we really using this kid properly? It seems that there is a lot of this "read option" offense that is much more passing based. And, if he could make all those throws 2 years ago, why am I supposed to believe he can't do that now?

Anyway, i'm not trying to stir the pot, but I think the video shows that Tebow has a lot more skill (and potential) in a pseudo west-coast read option offense.

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Old 11-25-2011, 12:34 PM   #2
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Answer: No they are not using him properly, but at the same time he still needs to do better when asked to pass. He should be passing predominantly out of empty backfield spread formations. But that doesn't seem to happen until late in games we are trailing in.
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Old 11-25-2011, 12:50 PM   #3
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Bayless says no as well. Tebow likes to throw from empty backfield sets with 4 or 5 receivers. He likes to roll out to his left. And he likes an up tempo pace.

Our coaches don't do any of this until we're already in desperation mode.
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Old 11-25-2011, 12:59 PM   #4
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We talked about this on the podcast. It's combination of things.

1. Tebow. He reads the defense too slowly and is inaccurate, mostly due to poor mechanics. He didn't get many of the reps in preseason with the starters with the exception of the run plays out of the "Tebow" package that they worked on each practice. The lack of the offseason exacerbated some of Tim's problems.

2. The receivers are young and inexperienced. As such they fail to adjust their routes properly in blitz situations and have shown a propensity to drop the ball.

3. Because of the above, the coaching staff watches the passing fail in practice and elect to not make it a key point of the gameplan in order to prevent turnovers and protect the defense. This means fewer reps and fewer passes. Some of it is dictated by the teams they play too. For example Kansas City has two good corners and the only games they have won were games they got interceptions. Rather than give them that, I'm convinced the staff elected to not run.

4. The wind has been bad in two of the last three games we played. This was a factor in how the passing game looked.

The bottom line is while Tebow does need to throw better, the passing game has several issues beyond just Tim and so the staff isn't featuring that aspect as prominently. They certainly aren't going to try and throw more just so the Teboners' ego's can be sated.
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:00 PM   #5
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I wish they'd let him throw more on first down. If they get a running game going and it's working the opportunities are there for him to make some throws on 1st down. Tebow hasn't had many good chances to make throws because he hasn't had the time or protection.

I know many would disagree but I think if he gets a little more time and the O becomes less predictable I see him becoming a better pocket passer. It won't happen overnight but I see it happening.
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:08 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaylore View Post
We talked about this on the podcast. It's combination of things.

1. Tebow. He reads the defense too slowly and is inaccurate, mostly due to poor mechanics. He didn't get many of the reps in preseason with the starters with the exception of the run plays out of the "Tebow" package that they worked on each practice. The lack of the offseason exacerbated some of Tim's problems.

2. The receivers are young and inexperienced. As such they fail to adjust their routes properly in blitz situations and have shown a propensity to drop the ball.

3. Because of the above, the coaching staff watches the passing fail in practice and elect to not make it a key point of the gameplan in order to prevent turnovers and protect the defense. This means fewer reps and fewer passes. Some of it is dictated by the teams they play too. For example Kansas City has two good corners and the only games they have won were games they got interceptions. Rather than give them that, I'm convinced the staff elected to not run.

4. The wind has been bad in two of the last three games we played. This was a factor in how the passing game looked.

The bottom line is while Tebow does need to throw better, the passing game has several issues beyond just Tim and so the staff isn't featuring that aspect as prominently. They certainly aren't going to try and throw more just so the Teboners' ego's can be sated.
Like the post all the way up until the last sentence when you had to throw the Teboners slam in. Iíve always respected your football opinions in the past but now you're joined this crowd who thinks it's wrong to support our team and our current QB despite all of his imperfections. He has them but damn the team has won 4 out of 5 games. All the spin aside, all the bigotry and hate aside isn't that enough? He didnít do it by himself but his passion with the help of Millerís has lead the resurgence wouldnít you agree?

I saw the wafers comment you made in another thread, no one here least of all me has ever attacked you for what you believed have they?

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Old 11-25-2011, 01:11 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaylore View Post
We talked about this on the podcast. It's combination of things.

1. Tebow. He reads the defense too slowly and is inaccurate, mostly due to poor mechanics. He didn't get many of the reps in preseason with the starters with the exception of the run plays out of the "Tebow" package that they worked on each practice. The lack of the offseason exacerbated some of Tim's problems.......


The bottom line is while Tebow does need to throw better, the passing game has several issues beyond just Tim and so the staff isn't featuring that aspect as prominently. They certainly aren't going to try and throw more just so the Teboners' ego's can be sated.
blastphomy ...maybe tebow forgive ya man
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:11 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaylore View Post
The bottom line is while Tebow does need to throw better, the passing game has several issues beyond just Tim and so the staff isn't featuring that aspect as prominently. They certainly aren't going to try and throw more just so the Teboners' ego's can be sated.
Thats a childish and unprofessional opinion.
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:13 PM   #9
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May Tebow have mercy on Kaylors soul ........... Kaylor Bro you done ****ed the pooch on this one ............ the teboners will bring the wrath of Tebow upon you .......
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:13 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mile High Mojoe View Post
Like the post all the way up until the last sentence when you had to throw the Teboners slam in. Iíve always respected your football opinions in the past but now you're joined this crowd who thinks it's wrong to support our team and our current QB despite all of his imperfections. He has them but damn the team has won 4 out of 5 games. All the spin aside, all the bigotry and hate aside isn't that enough? He didnít do it by himself but his passion with the help of Millerís has lead the resurgence wouldnít you agree?

I saw the wafers comment you made in another thread, no one here least of all me has even attacked you for what you believed have they?
Oh you mean the same group that bashed posters that wanted Orton to win? Yeah you poor posters.
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:18 PM   #11
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Oh you mean the same group that bashed posters that wanted Orton to win? Yeah you poor posters.
rep ....... I know these Teboners have gone off the deep end .....
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:19 PM   #12
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Oh you mean the same group that bashed posters that wanted Orton to win? Yeah you poor posters.
I wanted Orton and the Broncos to win ever time but he didn't win, since the 6 game winning streak he's been the worst starting QB in the NFL. He had 2 1/2 years to get his game on and he's been an epic failure. You didn't see me posting on the OM saying I wanted the Broncos to ever lose and roll over for any game, I'm a bigger fan that the ones who were cheering for losses and sucking for Luck BS.

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Old 11-25-2011, 01:24 PM   #13
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Denver's front office/coaching staff is trying its best to ruin Tim Tebow, for what reason, that is beyond me.

Tim's last game in collage went like this:

Completed 31 of 35 passes, Tebow threw for a career-high and Sugar Bowl-record 482 yards and three touchdowns while running for 51 yards another score. Yeah I know, the ignorant and uninformed at the mane only repeat what they hear on the radio, TV or read on the internet, But they failed to watch every game he played in collage.
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:26 PM   #14
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In Tebow's five starts, the Broncos have combined to score 40 points in the first three quarters, but have put up 53 points in the fourth quarter and overtime.
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:29 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mile High Mojoe View Post
I wanted Orton and the Broncos to win ever time but he didn't win, since the6 game winning streak he's been the worst stating QB in the NFL. He had 2 1/2 years to get his game on and he's been an epic failure. You didn't see me posting on the OM saying I wanted the Broncos to ever lose and roll over for any game, I'm a bigger fan that the ones who were cheering for losses and sucking for Luck BS.
I'm not lumping you into that group. I made a blanket statement that fits both sides of this argument.
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:29 PM   #16
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No, we aren't. This is what happens when you take a horrible offense, fire the play caller, and keep his assistant to run it all. This is also what happens when you give away your top two receivers without even trying to replace them. The young line doesn't help either. This team would struggle to pass consistently with Manning (although he may be the one guy that could offset McCoy).
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Old 11-25-2011, 01:48 PM   #17
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Need to pass it more on first downs...

Need to pass it more often, rather than waiting for Tebow to regain the lead when he is finally set free in the passing game, because the ultra conservative scheme of playing not to lose has us losing.

HE COULD USE MORE WEAPONS...

With Orton gone there appears to be no sense of urgency to sign anyone.

A few practice squad players of interest.

Brett Brackett TE, Penn State 6-6 246 ~ Eagle Practice Squad

Matt Kroul, DT 6-3 300 Jet's PC

Kevin Brock, TE Rutgers 6-5 260 Raiders

Jamie Cumbie, DT Clemson 6-7 290 Raiders

Chris DeGeare, G 6-4 335 Wake Forest Vikings
Caleb King RB Georgia Vikings

DuJuan Harris, RB, Troy 4.4 40 ~ Jags Practice Squad
Dre Moore, DT 6-4 307 Jags
Darius Hill, TE Jags

Ian Johnson, RB 5-11 212 Boise State 49ers
Keon Lattimore, RB 5-11 222 Maryland 49ers

Chris Campbell, Eastern Illinois T 6-5 327 Packers

Rob Callaway, DT Saginaw Valley State 6-5 312 Cowbows
Shaun Chapas, RB Georgia 6-2 247 Cowboys

Daniel Hardy, Idaho TE 6-4 249 Saints
Phil Trautwein, Florida T 6-6 310 Saints
Fenuki Tupou, Oregon T 6-5 323 Saints
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Old 11-25-2011, 02:00 PM   #18
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I think they could do more to get him going in the passing game but it actually seems like they're perfectly content to run the clock and limit the # of possessions in the game while relying on the defense.

I think they could do more short stuff that plays off what they do in the running game.

I also agree though that they shouldnt go exclusively to the spread. They need to keep elements of I and One back formations. The spread needs to be an aspect of the offense, not THE OFFENSE.
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Old 11-25-2011, 02:03 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mile High Mojoe View Post
Like the post all the way up until the last sentence when you had to throw the Teboners slam in. Iíve always respected your football opinions in the past but now you're joined this crowd who thinks it's wrong to support our team and our current QB despite all of his imperfections. He has them but damn the team has won 4 out of 5 games. All the spin aside, all the bigotry and hate aside isn't that enough? He didnít do it by himself but his passion with the help of Millerís has lead the resurgence wouldnít you agree?

I saw the wafers comment you made in another thread, no one here least of all me has ever attacked you for what you believed have they?
Honestly I have no idea what you're talking about. How does anything I said = not supporting Tebow? I root for Tebow every snap. I look forward to watching him play and was an advocate for him playing instead of Orton, particularly after the Raider game. For you supporting your QB = never saying anything bad about him even if its true. For me, supporting and rooting for a player doesn't mean ignoring their shortcomings.

Here's my point. Tebow fans want him to pass. Not because they think it will help the team win, but because they want to prove he can just so they can keep worshiping him. They want him to do well only so long as it makes Tebow look good. I want Tebow to keep doing the things he's been doing to win games and do not want him to pass just to prove a point. If we need to pass, and if he's progressed to where it makes sense to do so, then I hope he does. If running 50 times and passing 6 = a win, I will applaud that mindset and cheer Tebow as he hands off the ball and runs.

Tebow is raw, and pushing him to do too much, too soon, especially before he and the rest of the offense are in sync could cause more problems than it solves. We're in a playoff race and airing out just to get him reps doesn't make any sense.

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Old 11-25-2011, 02:05 PM   #20
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Thats a childish and unprofessional opinion.
But if I someone slams Elway and I complain, I'm "Emo" right?
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Old 11-25-2011, 02:05 PM   #21
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Just left complex, TT signing for everyone.
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Old 11-25-2011, 02:07 PM   #22
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They certainly aren't going to try and throw more just so the Teboners' ego's can be sated.
You make solid post then throw in this kind of comment? You are better than this.
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Old 11-25-2011, 02:08 PM   #23
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Tim's last game in collage went like this:

Completed 31 of 35 passes, Tebow threw for a career-high and Sugar Bowl-record 482 yards and three touchdowns while running for 51 yards another score.
I've used this very game as evidence that the 'he's inaccurate and can never improve' argument doesn't hold water.
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Old 11-25-2011, 02:09 PM   #24
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Honestly I have no idea what you're talking about. How does anything I said = not supporting Tebow. I root for Tebow every snap. I look forward to watching him play and was an advocate for him playing instead of Orton, particularly after the Raider game. For you supporting your QB = never saying anything bad about him even if its true.

Here's my point. Tebow fans want him to pass. Not because they think it will help the team win, but because they want to prove he can just so they can keep worshiping him. They want him to do well only so long as it makes Tebow look good. I want Tebow to keep doing the things he's been doing to win games and do not want him to pass just to prove a point. If we need to pass, and if he's progressed to where it makes sense to do so, then I hope he does. If running 50 times and passing 6 = a win, I will applaud that mindset and cheer Tebow as he hands off the ball and runs.

Tebow is raw, and pushing him to do too much, too soon, especially before he and the rest of the offense are in sync could cause more problems than it solves. We're in a playoff race and airing out just to get him reps doesn't make any sense.
You don't need anyomre proof in what you are saying then this thread. Denver is 4-1 while running this system. What more can the team do to win?
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Old 11-25-2011, 02:13 PM   #25
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I've used this very game as evidence that the 'he's inaccurate and can never improve' argument doesn't hold water.
Dude. It was Cincinnati.
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