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Old 10-08-2011, 01:55 AM   #1
epicSocialism4tw
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Default Tim Tebow Will Start For the Denver Broncos Next Season

John Fox:

"During his conference call with San Diego media this week, in response to a question about the Broncos' quarterback controversy, Fox replied: "We've got a first-round draft pick in Tim Tebow that was a Heisman Trophy winner. Very popular. An outstanding young man. (He's) going to be a heck of a quarterback in time, and is getting better every day."

http://www.denverpost.com/paige/ci_1...#ixzz1aB67lOyP

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That's a meaty bit of info there.

Fox explicitly stated that he believes in Tebow, and that he specifically believes that Tebow is going to be an excellent QB.

He also said that Tebow is getting better.

So if Fox believes that Tebow will be an excellent QB, and that he is getting better by the day, then the obvious conclusion is that Fox believes that the QB position is locked up long term with Tebow.

I think that we all can use this quote to take it easier on Orton. Its becoming apparent that the Broncos are protecting Tebow. They believe that they have the luxury of developing Tebow in a way that makes him more efficient in the offense in the long term.

I'd love to see the Broncos get a compensatory pick for Orton.

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Old 10-08-2011, 02:06 AM   #2
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Most long time fans saw the writing on the wall. Fox will play Orton until its shown he is a bottom tier QB and not capable of big plays in the clutch. Once enough vets believe its time for Tebow, and Orton is say 1-4 1-6 something like that, he will make the move.

Why its smart.

1- you get enough vets behind you to quiet a few like Lloyd
2- you get a throw away yr where you can say you were evaluating qbs
3- you still have enough games top see if Tebow a gamer, and decide what type off guys he needs, what type off offense he could run

in the meantime you have scored on von miller and the defense overall seems a little better.

Tebow will start by week 8 at the latest IMO.
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:13 AM   #3
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If only we could take them at their word...

What is Fox going to say?



"I suck as a coach and have no idea how to craft a good offense let alone one around one of the most revolutionary unique QBs in NFL history? One in which I would actually have to use my brain constantly rather than just do what I have been doing for decades?"

"Let's face it.. I'm an old dog and can't and won't do new tricks"

"Tebow has to adapt to me.. because I can't and won't adapt to him.. that's his problem not mine.. no matter how successful he might be if I actually knew what I was doing"

"Sure.. I could let McCoy run McD's system.. but that will make my defense look bad. Then I am in jeopardy of being fired if things go bad"

Is Elway going to say this?



"I'm like Fox.. I have ZERO experience. It's tough enough for me to just a build a team in a style I am accustomed to.. let alone trying to adapt to what McD was going to do with Tebow. And besides... if I do that then I am wasting the very thing that makes me an asset to this organization"

"So the best bet would be to trade Tebow since I am unwilling to adapt to him.. but what if he goes somewhere where the new organization can adapt to him and he dominates? And what if the Broncos still suck then? Then we all get fired and my career is over"

"It's much safer to just ignore the whole TEBOW THING and let him rot on the bench and hope the whole problem just goes away."

Last edited by MacGruder; 10-08-2011 at 02:16 AM..
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:19 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by cutthemdown View Post
Most long time fans saw the writing on the wall. Fox will play Orton until its shown he is a bottom tier QB and not capable of big plays in the clutch. Once enough vets believe its time for Tebow, and Orton is say 1-4 1-6 something like that, he will make the move.

Why its smart.

1- you get enough vets behind you to quiet a few like Lloyd
2- you get a throw away yr where you can say you were evaluating qbs
3- you still have enough games top see if Tebow a gamer, and decide what type off guys he needs, what type off offense he could run

in the meantime you have scored on von miller and the defense overall seems a little better.

Tebow will start by week 8 at the latest IMO.
I think that's possible.

I'm starting to come around on the way that these guys are handling the team though.

I have been watching every snap of the OL on DVR every week. They are starting to become a competitive unit who gets alot of stuff accomplished in the trenches. The running game is actually starting to get revved up. We forget that these guys didnt have an offseason with this new coach and this new system with a new focus on the run game. The OL and the run game are getting better every week. Pass blocking is already fantastic...even with a rookie RT who is trying to improve pass blocking.

The draft was a complete success and was the type of draft that we had in 2006...the kind of draft that can change a franchise for 10 years. Von Miller is already arguably the best SLB in the game, and is being used in a way that rookies are rarely used...he gets moved all around the field to present matchup problems. Franklin and Moore are already above-average rookie starters. Thomas and Virgil Green are both surprisingly good. Quentin Carter is getting some minutes.

Bunkley was a score. McGahee is an improvement over Moreno (though not a long-term solution as a primary back).

The wins arent coming yet, but I'm starting to get a little more comfortable with the way they are going about developing the franchise.

With a good draft next season addressing a couple or a few of MLB, CB, RB, DT, and/or DE, the Broncos are well on their way to being competitive for a long time.
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:21 AM   #5
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If only we could take them at their word...
I think that its looking more and more like Elway doesn't want to throw Tebow to the dogs and have the kind of experience he did as a rookie when there is another alternative route to take.
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:25 AM   #6
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We've got a first-round draft pick in Tim Tebow
This is an interesting quote, the emphasis being on "first round". Sounds like he is trying to ward off the QB-talk for the QB-heavy draft coming up. I really would prefer Denver to draft a lot of defense in the coming draft, early and often, but it's hard to shake the feeling that Tebow will be dumped in the QB bonanza come April no matter what they say (right now).
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:29 AM   #7
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I think that its looking more and more like Elway doesn't want to throw Tebow to the dogs and have the kind of experience he did as a rookie when there is another alternative route to take.
Why would they let negative things be said about TT though? Why would they say he was going to be the starter then let it be said he is fourth string?

I don't even see them making any effort to develop TT. If there is some effort to do this why don't they let this be known.. this would quiet the demand to let him play.

Instead we just hear really ugly rumors.. even claiming TT hasn't worked hard enough.. which is just preposterous.
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:30 AM   #8
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This is an interesting quote, the emphasis being on "first round". Sounds like he is trying to ward off the QB-talk for the QB-heavy draft coming up. I really would prefer Denver to draft a lot of defense in the coming draft, early and often, but it's hard to shake the feeling that Tebow will be dumped in the QB bonanza come April no matter what they say (right now).
There really isn't a QB bonanza. Its Luck and then not a whole lot.

The only other guy I see getting possibly picked up around where Denver will have a pick is Robert Griffin, and I just dont see Denver trading what is schematically Tim Tebow for Tim Tebow and then committing time to developing that Tim Tebow.

As a huge OU fan, I can tell you that Landry Jones will probably not be as high as he is rated right now the closer that we get to the draft. Robert Griffin will rise.

Denver has too many needs to waste their biggest asset for next season on a player that they will have to sit on the bench to develop just like they are doing with Tebow.
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:31 AM   #9
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Why would they let negative things be said about TT though? Why would they say he was going to be the starter then let it be said he is fourth string?
To take pressure off.

The same kind of pressure that bothered Elway early on.
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:35 AM   #10
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To take pressure off.

The same kind of pressure that bothered Elway early on.
This completely contradicts what Elway said about damaging his confidence though. Elway said when your confidence is damaged it can be impossible to get it back.. putting him at 4th string does exactly that.. Playing him for one down and not again does the same thing..

I don't see how saying he stinks takes pressure off him.. if anything it puts MORE pressure on him. People had been saying Tebow stunk ever since he left college. That is why he had so much pressure coming out of college to prove himself.

All of this damages his ability to lead as well.. which was his greatest attribute..
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:40 AM   #11
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This completely contradicts what Elway said about damaging his confidence though. Elway said when your confidence is damaged it can be impossible to get it back.. putting him at 4th string does exactly that.. Playing him for one down and not again does the same thing..

I don't see how saying he stinks takes pressure off him.. if anything it puts MORE pressure on him. People had been saying Tebow stunk ever since he left college. That is why he had so much pressure coming out of college to prove himself.

All of this damages his ability to lead as well.. which was his greatest attribute..
Elway never said that "Tebow stinks". People can be clumsy with public statements and manipulating the press to communicate what they intend to to a larger audience. Elway could have just been trying to get them to focus their attention on other parts of the team as much as he could.

Elway tried to trade Orton. That says all you need to know about which QB that he wanted.
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Old 10-08-2011, 03:42 AM   #12
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I like the thread and the positivity (if you ignore MacG). I absolutely hope and pray Tebow starts next year because it means we can focus ALL on D, maybe a RB somewhere like the 4th. MLB, DT, secondary.

I agree with cut though, the winds keep blowing towards a change at QB, the city is gnashing it's teeth at Orton and EFX and if he doesn't play a perfect game, if he makes any mistakes the calls will be louder and louder and louder, eventually they'll have to be addressed in a serious way.
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Old 10-08-2011, 03:52 AM   #13
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Why would they let negative things be said about TT though? Why would they say he was going to be the starter then let it be said he is fourth string?

I don't even see them making any effort to develop TT. If there is some effort to do this why don't they let this be known.. this would quiet the demand to let him play.

Instead we just hear really ugly rumors.. even claiming TT hasn't worked hard enough.. which is just preposterous.
It is quite obvious that this Broncos FO above all else is incredibly bad at PR management. They do not control the dialogue in the media like they should. They likely did not realize what they were doing up to this point.

That is my one problem with John Fox's statement. This should have been told to the Denver media repeatedly from day one of camp. Make it clear to everyone that they see Tebow as the future, but just not the now. It doesn't matter from a fan and media perspective if Elway and Fox do buy into Tebow, they need to make it a clear, public statement to that effect otherwise you get a **** storm.

If fans knew that Tebow was going to get a legit shot and that right now Fox is just trying to represent as strongly as he can out of the gate he and Elway would get FAR more leverage with the fans.

They need to take a lesson from the previous guy. He failed to control the media discourse with this team and never gave the fans anything more than played out football cliches for why things happened. How quickly did the fans turn on him and play a key role in ousting him?
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Old 10-08-2011, 04:26 AM   #14
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It is quite obvious that this Broncos FO above all else is incredibly bad at PR management. They do not control the dialogue in the media like they should. They likely did not realize what they were doing up to this point.
The thing that worries me is that we have been hearing negative rumors coming from the Broncos brain trust from day one when Elway took over. He says TT isn't a QB.. Peter King says Elway isn't high on Tebow... says they don't have TT in their future plans.. Elway says they need to look at other QBs in the draft.. says they are "going forward with TT" when they can't find a better QB. Then TT is supposedly fourth string after one bad day of practice to start training camp. The guy who broke the news about TT being 4th string is supposedly a journalist who has ties to Elway from the old days. Elway says "I'd never give up on Tebow"

I just find it hard to believe they could handle the situation this poorly on accident.. Is it tough love for TT's sake? Is it trying to stop locker room drama and help Orton be successful now?

I honestly can't see Fox letting Orton go. I think if Fox had his way Orton would be his guy for several years and he'd have 5 or 6 years to develop Tebow into Orton 2.0. I think Elway would choose the same.. that is just my read.

IF they were serious about Tebow I think they would be doing things to develop and hype him the way Carolina did with Cam this off season.

Last edited by MacGruder; 10-08-2011 at 04:39 AM..
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Old 10-08-2011, 04:34 AM   #15
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"We had an open competition."

"Also, this isn't me pissing on your leg. It's just raining."
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Old 10-08-2011, 04:50 AM   #16
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"My job on Sunday is to manage the game as the head coach. The coordinators will be in charge of offense, defense, special teams. It's fair to say that during the week, I will be fully involved in the game-planning, and the majority of time I will be working with the defense on what my defenses have been (many similarities to the old Buddy Ryan '46' defense) and the creative defenses Dennis brings."

Fox announced he will be switching the defense back to a 4-3, but it will have several variations, and he will be returning to Mike Shanahan​'s zone- blocking schemes, with several power- blocking variations — because of the bigger, stronger offensive linemen the Broncos now possess.

And, in regard to the starting quarterback, Fox said he will "get input" from McCoy, quarterbacks coach Adam Gaze and executive vice president John Elway​, but, ultimately, "the final decision is the head coach's."


Read more: Paige: Broncos coach John Fox wants "gamer" as his quarterback - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci...#ixzz1aBqgzafp
Read The Denver Post's Terms of Use of its content: http://www.denverpost.com/termsofuse
Like I've been saying, it's not as easy as saying Fox is a stubborn or incompetent coach. He's defense first and foremost and I think it's up to Gase/McCoy to put in the work with Tebow to get it done.
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Old 10-08-2011, 04:56 AM   #17
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Like I've been saying, it's not as easy as saying Fox is a stubborn or incompetent coach. He's defense first and foremost and I think it's up to Gase/McCoy to put in the work with Tebow to get it done.
True.. but McCoy has to work only within the constraints Fox has created for the offense. To Fox, the only purpose of the offense is to work in a supportive fashion for the defense.. and to not lose the game rather that trying to win it.

It seems to me Elway chose Fox exactly because he knew Orton would be so ideal in Fox's system..

Elway got a coach tailor made for Orton's abilities and style (Quinn's too) and HORRIBLY suited to Tebow's style.
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Old 10-08-2011, 05:00 AM   #18
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There was no competition. Why does he use this line? Why doesn't someone in the media call him out on this? I can live with "Orton's the starter because I said so." I might even be able to live with "Orton's the starter because we were clowned by Miami and Orton's existing contract." But this notion of an open competition is just an outright lie.
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Old 10-08-2011, 05:25 AM   #19
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There was no competition. Why does he use this line? Why doesn't someone in the media call him out on this? I can live with "Orton's the starter because I said so." I might even be able to live with "Orton's the starter because we were clowned by Miami and Orton's existing contract." But this notion of an open competition is just an outright lie.
It's easy to rationalize that there was an open competition though because Fox can always say he was looking for skills Tebow doesn't possess..

fox and Elway both want a guy who plays in the pocket.. Fox wants someone great with the play action run game.

To Fox it's an open compeition but it's Tebow's fault becasue he has no chance competing in Fox's offense. There was an article where McCoy laid out how the Qbs were supposed to play and Tebow's strengths and weaknesses were the complete opposite.

What I wonder is why the media never brings up the fact that Fox has no chance of adapting to Tebow's style of play. Most NFL coaches don't and Fox is probably the worst.

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Old 10-08-2011, 05:59 AM   #20
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If only we could take them at their word...

What is Fox going to say?
Yup, exactly. Foolish too read much into what he said.
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Old 10-08-2011, 06:11 AM   #21
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Old 10-08-2011, 06:34 AM   #22
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There was no competition. Why does he use this line? Why doesn't someone in the media call him out on this? I can live with "Orton's the starter because I said so." I might even be able to live with "Orton's the starter because we were clowned by Miami and Orton's existing contract." But this notion of an open competition is just an outright lie.
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Old 10-08-2011, 06:43 AM   #23
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If only we could take them at their word...

What is Fox going to say?



"I suck as a coach and have no idea how to craft a good offense let alone one around one of the most revolutionary unique QBs in NFL history? One in which I would actually have to use my brain constantly rather than just do what I have been doing for decades?"

"Let's face it.. I'm an old dog and can't and won't do new tricks"

"Tebow has to adapt to me.. because I can't and won't adapt to him.. that's his problem not mine.. no matter how successful he might be if I actually knew what I was doing"

"Sure.. I could let McCoy run McD's system.. but that will make my defense look bad. Then I am in jeopardy of being fired if things go bad"

Is Elway going to say this?



"I'm like Fox.. I have ZERO experience. It's tough enough for me to just a build a team in a style I am accustomed to.. let alone trying to adapt to what McD was going to do with Tebow. And besides... if I do that then I am wasting the very thing that makes me an asset to this organization"

"So the best bet would be to trade Tebow since I am unwilling to adapt to him.. but what if he goes somewhere where the new organization can adapt to him and he dominates? And what if the Broncos still suck then? Then we all get fired and my career is over"

"It's much safer to just ignore the whole TEBOW THING and let him rot on the bench and hope the whole problem just goes away."

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Old 10-08-2011, 06:48 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epicSocialism4tw View Post
John Fox:

"During his conference call with San Diego media this week, in response to a question about the Broncos' quarterback controversy, Fox replied: "We've got a first-round draft pick in Tim Tebow that was a Heisman Trophy winner. Very popular. An outstanding young man. (He's) going to be a heck of a quarterback in time, and is getting better every day."

http://www.denverpost.com/paige/ci_1...#ixzz1aB67lOyP

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

That's a meaty bit of info there.

Fox explicitly stated that he believes in Tebow, and that he specifically believes that Tebow is going to be an excellent QB.

He also said that Tebow is getting better.

So if Fox believes that Tebow will be an excellent QB, and that he is getting better by the day, then the obvious conclusion is that Fox believes that the QB position is locked up long term with Tebow.

I think that we all can use this quote to take it easier on Orton. Its becoming apparent that the Broncos are protecting Tebow. They believe that they have the luxury of developing Tebow in a way that makes him more efficient in the offense in the long term.

I'd love to see the Broncos get a compensatory pick for Orton.
Where does it say that Tebow starts next year?
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Old 10-08-2011, 06:48 AM   #25
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I can't believe anyone would be dumb enough to believe this. You have to be in the bottom 1 percent of all humans to conclude after hearing this that Tebow would be our starter and the FO is behind him.
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