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#301 | |
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 27,899
Adopt-a-Bronco: None |
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House or Obamacare.... House or Obamacare.... It's clear you don't understand how this is really going to shake out. |
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#302 | |
Franchise Poster
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Posts: 32,137
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![]() Perspective from Jonathan Gruber, the guy behind Romneycare:
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#303 | |
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 27,899
Adopt-a-Bronco: None |
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#304 | |
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 27,899
Adopt-a-Bronco: None |
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According to the Berkely calculator, if that family of 4 makes $94,200 per year, they get a $700 per month credit ($8,400 per year). If they make $94,250, they get zero. God help them if that's accurate. |
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#305 |
Franchise Poster
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Posts: 32,137
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#306 | |
Franchise Poster
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Posts: 32,137
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http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2013/...age-party-ctd/ |
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#307 |
"Whoa Nellie"
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 10,222
Adopt-a-Bronco: mellon head |
![]() The penality for not signing up for Obamacare for the remainder of this year is $29.00.
Last edited by Pony Boy; 11-02-2013 at 05:26 PM.. |
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#308 | |
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 27,899
Adopt-a-Bronco: None |
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#309 | |
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,323
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Baldwin (D-WI) Baucus (D-MT) Begich (D-AK) Bennet (D-CO) Blumenthal (D-CT) Boxer (D-CA) Brown (D-OH) Cantwell (D-WA) Cardin (D-MD) Carper (D-DE) Casey (D-PA) Coons (D-DE) Donnelly (D-IN) Durbin (D-IL) Feinstein (D-CA) Franken (D-MN) Gillibrand (D-NY) Hagan (D-NC) Harkin (D-IA) Heinrich (D-NM) Heitkamp (D-ND) Hirono (D-HI) Johnson (D-SD) Kaine (D-VA) King (I-ME) Klobuchar (D-MN) Landrieu (D-LA) Leahy (D-VT) Levin (D-MI) Manchin (D-WV) Markey (D-MA) McCaskill (D-MO) Menendez (D-NJ) Merkley (D-OR) Mikulski (D-MD) Murphy (D-CT) Murray (D-WA) Nelson (D-FL) Pryor (D-AR) Reed (D-RI) Reid (D-NV) Rockefeller (D-WV) Sanders (I-VT) Schatz (D-HI) Schumer (D-NY) Shaheen (D-NH) Stabenow (D-MI) Tester (D-MT) Udall (D-CO) Udall (D-NM) Warner (D-VA) Warren (D-MA) Whitehouse (D-RI) Wyden (D-OR) You're welcome. |
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#310 |
Just hanging out.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 15,125
Adopt-a-Bronco: The Team |
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#311 | ||
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 27,899
Adopt-a-Bronco: None |
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#312 | |
.
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 19,701
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It's gotten so over bloated now that we couldn't just change things immediately even if we did had a magic answer book with all the answers in it. We'd tank the economy if we changed things too quickly now. We in essence traded our Manufacturing industry in for a Medical Services Industry. And that's how many want it. All that waste and corruption is now factored in as 'trickle-down' for our economy. American Medicine Morphed from a humanitarian discipline that paid well into a ravenous revenue stream for health care professionals, drug and medical device companies, hospitals, and insurance companies. Then we went one step further (because as Americans we gotta super size everything... go big or go home) by feeding the greedy malpractice lawyers, drug companies, health care insurance companies and doctors who over treat patients by practicing defensive or wasteful medicine ordering unnecessary tests and unneeded operations. I've know dumb blonds with great push-up bra's and zero education raking in good six figures pushing pharma drugs from office to office. Now how crazy is that. Forget about pushing on the street corner when you can buy a nice suite and do it legally with a big-pharma name badge. My wife use to own and operate a small medical billing service in Southern California. She sold to her partner. You couldn't stay in business & keep clients unless you over billed for everything and worse. She refused to do it. There are countries that spend on tenth (as a percentage) what we do here in the states and still manage to have the same if not better outcomes. We no longer make anything to sell so we're now left to eat each other for profit. |
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#313 | |
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 27,899
Adopt-a-Bronco: None |
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But I'll disagree on the outcomes. They're pretty good for people who can afford the bill. Maybe not so good for those who can't. Or who don't have access because of Medicare/Medicaid/HMO related access restrictions. And the other thing is that the upside to all that profit-taking is that the US drives the bulk of the world's medical innovation. If we ever enact any kind of price controls, it should be to enforce international pricing parity to take the rest of the socialized industrialized world off of their free-innovation ride. |
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#314 | |
24/7 Broncos
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 52,995
Adopt-a-Bronco: Peyton Manning |
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#315 |
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,323
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#316 | |
Just hanging out.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 15,125
Adopt-a-Bronco: The Team |
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Not even close. Sullivan is exactly right when he wrote: "Instead, what we have here today is a new concept that a rump minority – using pure obstruction alone – can force enactment of its own agenda through a threat of catastrophic economic retaliation. Also, with a $16 trillion debt, this would be an annual extortion threat that far surpasses the value of majority electoral success. As Matt Yglesias aptly puts it: “Republicans are essentially asking for an end to constitutional government in the United States and its replacement by a wholly novel system." ”We have never before seen a minority party openly and aggressively threatening to destroy the full faith and credit of the U.S. unless its agenda was enacted – much less right after that specific agenda was defeated in a national election." |
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#317 |
jungle
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 21,688
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![]() Your "projections" aren't even close.
"The CBO reported that in addition to a $146 billion deficit in August, the Treasury also ran a $98 billion deficit in July, and that in the first eleven months of fiscal 2013 (October through August) the federal government has run a cumulative $753 billion deficit (through 11 months of FY2013)." Like I said, Obama is on pace for the 8 largest deficits in American history, and he's on pace to add more debt than all the other Presidents combined. http://cnsnews.com/news/article/tere...ficit-was-146b Once again, please do some research before you post. |
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#318 |
jungle
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 21,688
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#319 |
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 12,499
Adopt-a-Bronco: None |
![]() this is no better than the tebow threads. at the end of the day obamacare isn't getting defunded.
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#320 | |
Ring of Famer
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 6,323
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Good news is you can make up to 400% of poverty level in my state and still receive decent money, so... Cha-ching! ![]() |
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#321 |
jungle
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 21,688
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#322 | |
Bleeding Orange and Blue
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Denver
Posts: 1,210
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"California hospitals–including Cedars Sinai, Kaiser Permanente and Stanford University--dwarf the level of charity care provided. Overall, the 196 hospitals surveyed received $3.3 billion in 2010 state and federal tax exemptions and spent only $1.4 billion on charity care--a gap of $1.8 billion. Three-quarters of the hospitals got more dollars in tax breaks than they spent on charity care. Half spent less than 2.46 percent of their operating expenses on charity care." Healthcare for the poor becomes pretty damn reasonable when the $13,000 MRI is given as charity care by an institution receiving massive tax breaks, and not charging Medicare for it, or hounding the poor guy who cant pay it. People that can afford to pay for things are not going to go to the nearest, competent hospital for care, and they will pay a pretty penny for it. I find it laughable that "progressives" rail all day against corporations getting tax breaks, but don't say a single damn word about non-profits robbing people blind. BTW, a non-profit only means that they don't have investors, but they can still pay employees as much as they want. |
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#323 |
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 19,701
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![]() A healthy country is a more productive country.
This could really be a good thing for small businesses. It separates health care from employer like the Repubs have pushed for before. Now small businesses can dump their employee's into the open exchanges thus leveling the playing field. Older workers over 55 (who have a wealth of knowledge but are sicker) will now become more attractive to employers because their employer won't be penalized. I can totally see where the very young would have trepidation. But don't worry, you'll get old and sickly like everyone else sooner than you may think. THEN you'll understand. |
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#324 |
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 19,701
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#325 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 17,400
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We are printing $85 billion a month. Hell why not just cut a deal with all the YMCA's in the country and make it free to the public? Or at least make it almost free. Why not really make a dent in school nutrition? Offer programs or incentives for back yard gardens? Most people have no clue on how to garden. I know because I've been researching it. The government will hand you a block of cheese or food stamps but why not give people the ability to raise a little bit of organic fresh food? Even poor people are within walking distances of urban gardens popping up everywhere. Let's face it obesity is a huge problem in the country. Health insurance will certainly help but does it really nip the real problem. People just don't eat healthy foods and or work out enough. The current admin has nearly doubled the national debt and what has been the result? A sluggish economy and their plan to help people become healthy is cheaper drugs? The reality is I think the government should stay out of people's personal lives but if they are going to tinker and play GOD why not really solve the underlying issues of American health. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. I'm not sure people would take advantage of free recreation opportunities and free garden space/free healthy food if it involved work. *shrug* Does our government really want us healthy/and to be independent or do they really want us to be reliant on the welfare system? In simple terms. If we want a healthier America and to help those who cannot afford a healthy lifestyle why not help those that can't afford it. Afford it? Last edited by Meck77; 09-29-2013 at 12:20 PM.. |
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